BOOK - Winds of Winter... When?

Savage Tyrant

So what's people's guesses on when we'll finally see the next book?

I have a strong feeling we will get it this year. Before next season at least.
It will obviously contain a lot of what we watched this season but I think also enough content for the final 2 seasons of the show.
I don't think much, if any "A Dream of Spring" will make it to the show... Assuming it's going to be at least 5/6 years away it may well be treated like a huge epilogue, tying up loose ends, who loves who, who controls and has power in what lands.
I think the "Winds of Winter" will finish up the lions share of the story and enough for the show writers to finish up.

So am I being too hopeful?

Sleepy

I think you're expecting to see far too much covered in Winds of Winter tbh though I'd share your hope that we'll see the book before Season 7 airs.

eeguy

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

So what's people's guesses on when we'll finally see the next book?

I have a strong feeling we will get it this year. Before next season at least.
It will obviously contain a lot of what we watched this season but I think also enough content for the final 2 seasons of the show.
I don't think much, if any "A Dream of Spring" will make it to the show... Assuming it's going to be at least 5/6 years away it may well be treated like a huge epilogue, tying up loose ends, who loves who, who controls and has power in what lands.
I think the "Winds of Winter" will finish up the lions share of the story and enough for the show writers to finish up.

So am I being too hopeful?

There's no news of WoW release date although recently there's a rumour that it's done and is in editing.

Another 6 years would put GRRM at 73 years old. Personally, I'd say it might get ghost written based on his notes and edited and refined by him, unless he's made significant progress on it already.

Savage Tyrant

Sleepy wrote: »

I think you're expecting to see far too much covered in Winds of Winter tbh though I'd share your hope that we'll see the book before Season 7 airs.

Yeah maybe I'm being too optimistic.... I still hope though. The thoughts of waiting 6 years (minimum) for a Dream of Spring is a bit depressing.

eeguy wrote: »

There's no news of WoW release date although recently there's a rumour that it's done and is in editing.

Another 6 years would put GRRM at 73 years old. Personally, I'd say it might get ghost written based on his notes and edited and refined by him, unless he's made significant progress on it already.

I don't think age will be a factor as his writing seems to be at his own unhurried pace anyway.
If he doesn't complete it however, I do believe I've read somewhere that he has categorically said he won't allow another author to finish it.

podgemonster

When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, When the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves. When your womb quickens again, and you bear a living child. Then the Winds Of Winter will be released, and not before.

Falthyron

podgemonster wrote: »

When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, When the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves. When your womb quickens again, and you bear a living child. Then the Winds Of Winter will be released, and not before.

hoopla87

im keeping everything crossed that it will be in my hands by this winter. its gonna be an extremely long awaited christmas pressie

pinkypinky

I've actually given up hoping we'll ever get anything from him. In any other career, he'd have been fired by now for repeatedly missing deadlines. But that said, we're into the usual timeframe, i.e 5 years on from the last release.

valor rorghulis

Sadly after missing it this year I'd say before the next season is the new target

Like you know when you have an assignment due, and its possible to get it in, but stressing. Then you bite the bullet and ask for an extension, its granted and suddenly the idea of the initial target was laughable. That's whats happened here

Savage Tyrant

valor rorghulis wrote: »

Sadly after missing it this year I'd say before the next season is the new target

Like you know when you have an assignment due, and its possible to get it in, but stressing. Then you bite the bullet and ask for an extension, its granted and suddenly the idea of the initial target was laughable. That's whats happened here

That's a pretty amusing, yet pretty accurate analogy. 😂

paulbok

I wonder if HBO have paid GRR Martin not to release Winds of Winter until after the final series to keep the hype firmly on their story line, which he confirmed is a little different to his, albeit with the same ending?

Kirby

If they did then they wasted their money. There was no chance of him releasing the book in that timeframe anyway. He is a slow/lazy writer and that wasn't going to change despite the shows success bringing in more readers.

facehugger99

I'm hoping the NK/WW storyline is wrapped up better in the books.

Roll on 2031.

Shanotheslayer

facehugger99 wrote: »

I'm hoping the NK/WW storyline is wrapped up better in the books.

Roll on 2031.

Optimistic

pinkypinky

NK isn't even in the books so it'll definitely be wrapped up differently!

TheIrishGrover

I think about 3 months from now he's gonna officially abandon the series. He'll come out with a statement saying that he's gonna work on the "wonderful new spin-off" or something, release what he has written currently of the latest book(s) for free online to minimise the outrage and then sleep on top of a large pile of money surrounded by many beautiful women ala Ranier Wolfcastle. He'll say that the series is now the official ending and that readers are now free to make up their own ending.

Either that or they are gonna scrap a dream of Spring (Or whatever the last one was gonna be called) and do a butchers editing job of merging the last two books into one 1200 page book. Still follow the plan but in a very abbreviated (well, for GRRM) version. Put it this way, they will be very unsatisfying. We'll be lucky to get one book and will NOT get more than one.

tHE vAGGABOND

Agreed, now TV series will be over I would be shocked if we did ever see the last two books...

Nody

tHE vAGGABOND wrote: »

Agreed, now TV series will be over I would be shocked if we did ever see the last two books...

I'd expect we'll see them but the question would be rather who's the author (I know he's said he does not want anyone else to finish them but greed is strong and he'd be dead)...

TheIrishGrover

Nody wrote: »

I'd expect we'll see them but the question would be rather who's the author (I know he's said he does not want anyone else to finish them but greed is strong and he'd be dead)...

Well, that would be the hope..... As long as it's done right. Too many fantasy/sci-fi series have been offloaded to hack writers who basically just throw fan favourites on the page with little regard to what has happened before. There is no kick-back because the original author is usually dead by this time.

However I do believe that GRRM, for all his delaying faults, has a solid plan/notes for the rest of the books. So why not offload to a decent fantasy author with GRRM overseeing?

paulbok

Nody wrote: »

I'd expect we'll see them but the question would be rather who's the author (I know he's said he does not want anyone else to finish them but greed is strong and he'd be dead)...

Maybe. Maybe the Nightking will ressurect him to finish it

ixoy

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

However I do believe that GRRM, for all his delaying faults, has a solid plan/notes for the rest of the books. So why not offload to a decent fantasy author with GRRM overseeing?

What would make you think he's a solid plan? He's always said he only has an outline and that he's a "gardener" in terms of plotting (he begins writing and see where it takes him). That's how he ended getting stuck and probably why he's stuck now.
Other writers are meticulous planners so, if it gets farmed out, we'll need a Brandon Sanderson type.

Necro

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

I think about 3 months from now he's gonna officially abandon the series. He'll come out with a statement saying that he's gonna work on the "wonderful new spin-off" or something, release what he has written currently of the latest book(s) for free online to minimise the outrage and then sleep on top of a large pile of money surrounded by many beautiful women ala Ranier Wolfcastle. He'll say that the series is now the official ending and that readers are now free to make up their own ending.

Either that or they are gonna scrap a dream of Spring (Or whatever the last one was gonna be called) and do a butchers editing job of merging the last two books into one 1200 page book. Still follow the plan but in a very abbreviated (well, for GRRM) version. Put it this way, they will be very unsatisfying. We'll be lucky to get one book and will NOT get more than one.

I agree, I think he's literally wound himself into knots in the plotlines that he just has no clue how to unravel.

I don't think it ever gets finished by him, at least. Which is a shame, but not surprising given his disdain for those who follow his work.

TheIrishGrover

ixoy wrote: »

What would make you think he's a solid plan? He's always said he only has an outline and that he's a "gardener" in terms of plotting (he begins writing and see where it takes him). That's how he ended getting stuck and probably why he's stuck now.
Other writers are meticulous planners so, if it gets farmed out, we'll need a Brandon Sanderson type.

Well, you are absolutely correct. What I meant by "Plan" was that he knew who was gonna be dead by the end (Pretty much everyone), who was gonna be alive and where they should end up.

Either way. We ain't gettin' the last two books. Oh we'll get books. Plenty of books: History books, spinoff story collections, Egg books, f*ckin'''' pop-up books probably but not the finish.

So I say just offload to a decent author with whatever notes he has and let THEM finish it.... Or not. I'm over them at this stage to be honest. I bought all the rest as they came out from book 2 on but I'm prob not gonna bother if the others come out.

Duckworth_Luas

If anyone is worried that Martin is giving up on writing, never fear. He's just signed a deal to develop a new TV series for Hulu.

TheIrishGrover

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

If anyone is worried that Martin is giving up on writing, never fear. He's just signed a deal to develop a new TV series for Hulu.

judeboy101

I've avoided the last 2 seasons of tv show, am I fooling myself or should I remain spoiler free.

paulbok

judeboy101 wrote: »

I've avoided the last 2 seasons of tv show, am I fooling myself or should I remain spoiler free.

This must be your first day back on the internet so, you better catch up on the show," For the internet is dark and full of spoilers."

duffman13

judeboy101 wrote: »

I've avoided the last 2 seasons of tv show, am I fooling myself or should I remain spoiler free.

You are fooling yourself, I'd love the books or a book to be released but it's not happening. Give yourself some kind of closure even if it's never going to be as satisfying as a book, it'll give you an ending.

judeboy101

paulbok wrote: »

This must be your first day back on the internet so, you better catch up on the show," For the internet is dark and full of spoilers."

Pretty easy to avoid spoilers, havent seen last season of breaking bad, the leftovers or ds9 so parntu to look fwd to in my old age. If grrm does a robert jordar it might b completed. So id rather wait if possible.

Nody

judeboy101 wrote: »

I've avoided the last 2 seasons of tv show, am I fooling myself or should I remain spoiler free.

As a book reader who watched all episodes I think while the broad strokes may play out somewhat similar there are to many minor characters/plots that will keep the books different enough that it's not going to be a spoiler watching the TV show. With GRRM it's not the goal but the journey there that matters after all.

Roger Hassenforder

judeboy101 wrote: »

I've avoided the last 2 seasons of tv show, am I fooling myself or should I remain spoiler free.

Theyre so different now, work away

judeboy101

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Theyre so different now, work away

I've read gone with the wind and seen the movie, they are very different on a lot of the key parts of scarletts life but end the same way. I think ill give grrm another year or two and then look at season 7.

Fian

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeftoI3c81c&feature=youtu.be&t=1901

Barristan selmy actor claims that final 2 books are finished but publication is delayed until after show completes.

Fian

Fian wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeftoI3c81c&feature=youtu.be&t=1901

Barristan selmy actor claims that final 2 books are finished but publication is delayed until after show completes.

It might be a savvy move. There will probably be a good number of people dissatisfied with the ending of the tv series who are hoping the books will give them a more satisfying conclusion.

Mickeroo

Will he actually finish it in two books?

Unless they're absolutely huge I could see him taking similar short cuts to the show if that's the case.

Fian

Personally I don't believe it. I just don't think it is true that both final books are written.

Nor do i think that the series would have paid to contractually bind him from publishing, or tbh that he is money motivated enough to hacve agreed to such a term.

Mickeroo

Mickeroo wrote: »

I could see him taking similar short cuts to the show if that's the case.

That's a racing certainty.

awec

Mickeroo wrote: »

Will he actually finish it in two books?

Unless they're absolutely huge I could see him taking similar short cuts to the show if that's the case.

Given the mess the books are in and the sheer number of character arcs there are I don't believe he can tie them up in 2 books.

tHE vAGGABOND

they might be long books, books are kinda cool like that

facehugger99

awec wrote: »

Given the mess the books are in and the sheer number of character arcs there are I don't believe he can tie them up in 2 books.

ADWD was only a couple of hundred pages shorter than the entire LOTR trilogy - and Tolkien spent pages describing the vegetation and writing poems.

if 2 books of a similar length aren't enough to tie up the series, then Martin's doing something very wrong.

The only reason to believe they aren't written is that there hasn't been a release in like a decade. If the explanation for that is that he couldn't release, it is plausible that they're done. It would be pretty cool; Subverting the readers' expectations.

Roger Hassenforder

Considering where the books are at, how labouring some were, its hard to see him getting out the gap in two books.

pinkypinky

It's 8 years in July since Dance with Dragons. I'd love to believe this story but it's much more likely he's bogged down with writer's block, as evidenced by the working on literally anything else he can.

ixoy

Given the books really began to lose some focus with the last two instalments, I'm not holding out a huge hope here. Will though the fans savage it as much as some have this final season?

pinkypinky

Even if they do savage it, he'll still have their money...

pinkypinky

pinkypinky wrote: »

Even if they do savage it, he'll still have their money...

Given how old he is and how much he has made already it's unlikely to be a factor.

ixoy

pinkypinky wrote: »

Even if they do savage it, he'll still have their money...

He already does.. Did he sell off the rights to his books for one lump sum or does he get more for each extra season? Either way, he never needs to work again. Sure he was successful enough even before the show to have it handy. I remember being surprised just how long the signing queue was in Easons back before the show had even aired.

Fian

An interview of George RR martin in 1998 shortly before a clash of kings was published.

He had been writing the first three books "since 1971" at that stage - over 25 years. He felt he might still not be finished with the series, expected three more books at that point, 6 years later (in 2004). He was right!!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=11&v=FNzlJT0sG9k

TheIrishGrover

Having watched last night's episode (My review. Dopey fun but style over substance. SO different from first seasons). it just made me think: There is NO WAY that GRRM would have written the last books even remotely similar to the last seasons of the TV show. Which makes me sad.

Initially I was of the opinion "TBH, I'm so p1ssed with the pace of his writing that I'm not even interested. Sure, the show will be different from the books but not all that different. Not enough to be bothered. Life's too short for GRRM's books". But looking at how the show now is so wildly different from the books, it is obvious that the books would be considerably different from the series. I mean completely different.

But we'll never see them which is a pity. Ah well, onwards to better things.

TheIrishGrover

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

Having watched last night's episode (My review. Dopey fun but style over substance. SO different from first seasons). it just made me think: There is NO WAY that GRRM would have written the last books even remotely similar to the last seasons of the TV show. Which makes me sad.

Initially I was of the opinion "TBH, I'm so p1ssed with the pace of his writing that I'm not even interested. Sure, the show will be different from the books but not all that different. Not enough to be bothered. Life's too short for GRRM's books". But looking at how the show now is so wildly different from the books, it is obvious that the books would be considerably different from the series. I mean completely different.

But we'll never see them which is a pity. Ah well, onwards to better things.

Yeah, the books would be different and the end result may be the same or a different victor.

Once S8E6 is aired expect an announcement of the next book's release date within days. If not... breaths shouldn't be held.

Paddy Cow

TheIrishGrover wrote: »

Having watched last night's episode (My review. Dopey fun but style over substance. SO different from first seasons). it just made me think: There is NO WAY that GRRM would have written the last books even remotely similar to the last seasons of the TV show. Which makes me sad.

Initially I was of the opinion "TBH, I'm so p1ssed with the pace of his writing that I'm not even interested. Sure, the show will be different from the books but not all that different. Not enough to be bothered. Life's too short for GRRM's books". But looking at how the show now is so wildly different from the books, it is obvious that the books would be considerably different from the series. I mean completely different.

But we'll never see them which is a pity. Ah well, onwards to better things.

Will the end really be that different though? The North vs the WW. Dany vs Cersei. How the chess pieces move on the board might be different but the result will be much the same imo.