Setting up a mobile coffee business

sonikeee

Hello Everyone,

Could you please please advise me.

I'm thinking of setting up a mobile coffee business. I wish to trade coffees and snacks at a local parks,Sunday football matches/GAA etc in Dublin. I was wondering is anybody tried that type of business before and have their experiences was it profitable?

Is anybody in here knows what licences I need to buy,what paperwork is required and what standards I have to meet? I would be grateful for all useful information.

Axwell

Mod: Moved your post - dont go digging up old threads from 3 years ago and replying when you are starting a new topic.

Markcheese

Coffee is profitable enough ... if you have turnover and customer numbers...
You'll need places to set up..some will be by arrangement, some by brass neck.. get insurance (public liability and product liability).. the more often you have to move the less time you'll have to sell... hse cert should be easy enough for coffee... are you planning a stall,trailer or little van ... ?

DubTony

Heres a post from another thread from 2012

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=79708500&postcount=13

My wife had a mobile coffee van a few years ago. People loved it and the coffee but she found it hard to make money. The main problem, as others have alluded to, is that you can't just park up on public property and start trading - the local authority won't allow it.
Business parks seem to be quite accommodating and if you could be in several at the same time you could be onto a winner but, generally the business from one just isn't enough.
The pitches at street markets are expensive - clearly some stalls can still make money because you see the same ones popping up again and again but you'd want to do your sums.
Farmers market's are probably your best bet and there are loads to choose from but your stall will have to be able to do a bit of mileage.

I don't mean to discourage you as I love the idea of good street food but make sure you work out where you can trade at what cost and what kind of footfall you'll have before you invest your money and as Mark, says, talk to the HSE before they come to talk to you!!

You can't just pull up and start selling coffee anywhere. If you could the cities and big towns of Ireland would have great food trucks serving all sorts of amazing foods from them. Alas, in Ireland specific spaces are allocated, so the restriction is on where rather than what you sell. You need to contact the council in the area you wish to operate and find out all the restrictions rules from them.

sonikeee

thank you everybody.
really appreciate.
MOD????
WHAT YOU MEAN

Axwell

You posted a reply on a thread that no one had been active on in 3 years, its better to start a new thread on the topic than resurrect one that old.

Arsenal11

Hi lads, I am thinking of setting a mobile coffee shop, would buy a horse box and do it up, no expenses spared.

I am wondering what are the yearly costs ?

Stock
Insurance
Licence
Permit
Gas for the generator

What else?

How much is insurance?

How much is a licence and permit ?

And can you trade anywhere with a permit ? Or what's the story with them.

All help greatly appreciated

Markcheese

So is everyone else at the moment ...
Main thing is where are you going to trade ... Once you have your pitch sorted you can work out the rest ...
Insurance is relatively easy ( maabs ) , permit is from local authority and only if your on their land ... ( Usually easier to start trading and get permit later )

Arsenal11

Markcheese wrote: »

So is everyone else at the moment ...
Main thing is where are you going to trade ... Once you have your pitch sorted you can work out the rest ...
Insurance is relatively easy ( maabs ) , permit is from local authority and only if your on their land ... ( Usually easier to start trading and get permit later )

How much does it cost to trade / get a permit ? Like do I need a different permit for different locations? Obviously matches and stuff would cost extra?

I am from killarney, nothing like it here yet..
I would love to set up somewhere in the town and open 6 days a week

What would be the actual cost for a permit for a place like killarney ?

Am I missing any other costs ?

Any help atall is greatly appreciated

Tabnabs

Pub carparks are the latest place for mobile coffee shops like this. They are doing a roaring trade, plenty of space for social distancing, work with the pubowners to keep stock on premises etc. You may have missed the peak of the business now though as the lockdown has weeks instead of months left in it.

Del2005

Tabnabs wrote: »

Pub carparks are the latest place for mobile coffee shops like this. They are doing a roaring trade, plenty of space for social distancing, work with the pubowners to keep stock on premises etc. You may have missed the peak of the business now though as the lockdown has weeks instead of months left in it.

Level 5 has weeks, we'll be in level 3ish for a long time.

whippet

I was talking to a coffee shop owner a few years back and he did have a mobile coffee wagon - but it was purely for marketing purposes - he claimed that there was no way it would be a stand alone business for him. The costs were just bonkers. He tried the festival circuit and worked out that he’d physically couldn’t produce enough coffee to a proper standard to cover the costs of the pitch, insurance, fuel, stock and staff over a weekend.

newman10

Arsenal11 wrote: »

How much does it cost to trade / get a permit ? Like do I need a different permit for different locations? Obviously matches and stuff would cost extra?

I am from killarney, nothing like it here yet..
I would love to set up somewhere in the town and open 6 days a week

What would be the actual cost for a permit for a place like killarney ?

Am I missing any other costs ?

Any help atall is greatly appreciated

Where are you thinking of locating ?

Arsenal11

newman10 wrote: »

Where are you thinking of locating

Different areas in killarney and outskirts

Newtown90

Arsenal11 wrote: »

How much does it cost to trade / get a permit ? Like do I need a different permit for different locations? Obviously matches and stuff would cost extra?

I am from killarney, nothing like it here yet..
I would love to set up somewhere in the town and open 6 days a week

What would be the actual cost for a permit for a place like killarney ?

Am I missing any other costs ?

Any help atall is greatly appreciated

Not to pi#$ on your parade but one particular coffee shack in Killarney ( which serves great coffee) launched there mobile coffee vehicle at the Killarney Xmas fleamarkets in December and it was a good success by all accounts so you would have competition in your area.

With numerous decent coffee shops opening in the Killarney and Tralee location over the past 18 months I think you may have missed the boat.

Chiorino

Arsenal11 wrote: »

newman10 wrote: »

Where are you thinking of locating

Different areas in killarney and outskirts

Until you get either a casual trading licence from the council or do a deal with a property owner to trade from their site, your idea is going nowhere I'm afraid.

Scotty #

Arsenal11 wrote: »

Different areas in killarney and outskirts

You may need a licence for each location you intend trading.

Expect a backlash from anyone in the area already selling coffee.

You'll most likely need a tax clearance cert, HSE cert, proof of insurance, to accompany your application.

If it was easy, we'd all be doing it!

Markcheese

It's not all that hard ,hse cert for your trailer
And then individual councils have different requirements , a non council site means you don't need casual trading licence ,
If there's a good council owned site that you could use without annoying anyone try approaching who ever manages/ cares for it and get them on side, then apply , especially with covid things change ...

Chiorino

Markcheese wrote: »

It's not all that hard ,hse cert for your trailer
And then individual councils have different requirements , a non council site means you don't need casual trading licence ,
If there's a good council owned site that you could use without annoying anyone try approaching who ever manages/ cares for it and get them on side, then apply , especially with covid things change ...

It's not that easy either. Tax clearance cert, HSE licence, PL insurance all required. A non-council site can also be problematic depending on planning issues and complaints from existing neighbouring businesses. Once the property is council owned, unless there is an existing designated casual trading pitch on-site, extremely unlikely it's a runner.

Not trying to dissuade anyone from giving it a go but I've been involved in this type of business for 20 years and people need to be aware of the hurdles.

PickYourName

Arsenal11 wrote: »

I am wondering what are the yearly costs ?

Biggest costs will be capital costs of equipment and staff, followed by rent/licenses

Arsenal11 wrote: »

What else?

All help greatly appreciated

The good news is that coffee has a great margin.

The bad news is that it's a low value product, so you have to either sell a lot of it or sell something else in addition, to get the revenue figure up.

Everything else stems from that.

Selling coffee is one of the most competitive businesses there is: there is a **lot** of competition, much of it very good. You **must** have something to attract people to your offering in preference to others.

Since the pandemic, location has become far more important than it had been. Places that are close to where people live have done very well, due to people working from home. Places where they used to work or were tourist dependent are struggling (speaking from direct experience here).

In theory, a mobile unit is a good idea as you can respond to this and locate where there's demand. I would imagine the big issue though is getting the rights to set up in a particular location and potentially the rent you'll need to pay.

You will probably need at least two staff to get the throughput to where it needs to be.

The key thing is to work out what your numbers need to be and to work from them to figure out whether it is realistic to achieve them. Working out costs is easy enough, working out potential sales is harder: the best way to to stand outside someplace similar and count.

sysprogrammer

Having ran a coffee vending gig in the past I think the OP should buy a coffee & drink backpack, and strike a deal with the organisers of local events.
they do all the marketing for you and bring the footfall, and you get to sidestep most of the hassle of dealing with councils and existing premises.

The local park for matches on a Saturday and Sunday were fantastic , as well as local events (run by Fingal). I could operate where no van would drive.

A lot of these event providers will let you operate for free.
hope this helps.

edit: cost of equipment €600 , insurance with IOMST €90 , Haccp certificate, Coffee €6 , Water €0 , Mufins : €1

michdee

Hope you don't mind me jumping in on this. Currently thinking of something similar. Have location in mind, spoke to an old business in the area and they are happy for me to set up outside their premises, does this mean I wouldn't need to apply to the council for a license?
Sorry all new to this and just at the research stage. So trying to gather as much info as possible to hit the ground running with this if it works out.

Chiorino

michdee wrote: »

Hope you don't mind me jumping in on this. Currently thinking of something similar. Have location in mind, spoke to an old business in the area and they are happy for me to set up outside their premises, does this mean I wouldn't need to apply to the council for a license?
Sorry all new to this and just at the research stage. So trying to gather as much info as possible to hit the ground running with this if it works out.

Is it on their actual property or simply on the footpath/roadside outside their premises?

Scotty #

michdee wrote: »

Hope you don't mind me jumping in on this. Currently thinking of something similar. Have location in mind, spoke to an old business in the area and they are happy for me to set up outside their premises, does this mean I wouldn't need to apply to the council for a license?
Sorry all new to this and just at the research stage. So trying to gather as much info as possible to hit the ground running with this if it works out.

If you are on public/council property then you will need a trading licence. The criteria for this is very different from county to county, town council to town council.

If you are on private property you will not. Either way, you'll still need a health cert and insurance.

michdee

Chiorino wrote: »

Is it on their actual property or simply on the footpath/roadside outside their premises?

It's a gravel area outside their door, off the road.

Scotty thanks, yes health cert and insurance a must.
Thanks for the info. Mind field!!

Chiorino

michdee wrote: »

It's a gravel area outside their door, off the road.

Scotty thanks, yes health cert and insurance a must.
Thanks for the info. Mind field!!

Ok, so on their property. In this case, no casual trading licence is needed but as Scotty mentioned, insurance & HSE cert are needed. Keep the place tidy and, as much as possible, try to keep a reasonably low profile (taking into account you obviously need to attract customers).

Trading from private property does eliminate the casual trading issue but if you draw unwanted negative attention, the council still have other options they can use to shut you down.

discodiva92

You might need planning

Chiorino

discodiva92 wrote: »

You might need planning

Technically, he would (this is probably the main thing councils use to close down mobile units) but it's nigh on impossible to get. Any way you can avoid being drawn to the councils' attention is the road to take. Bear in mind, they only act on complaints from the public and don't generally have a roving team of inspectors out and about looking for problems.

discodiva92

Chiorino wrote: »

Technically, he would (this is probably the main thing councils use to close down mobile units) but it's nigh on impossible to get. Any way you can avoid being drawn to the councils' attention is the road to take. Bear in mind, they only act on complaints from the public and don't generally have a roving team of inspectors out and about looking for problems.

3 in Limerick shut down recently.Local cafes that pay rates etc complained

Chiorino

discodiva92 wrote: »

3 in Limerick shut down recently.Local cafes that pay rates etc complained

Exactly my point. Where you set up and the manner you operate will go a long way. Setting up in clear view of a local cafe is only going to end with one outcome. It's a crappy system in a lot of ways but the alternative is a free for all.

Markcheese

discodiva92 wrote: »

You might need planning

Not normally ... Especially if the stall is mobile ( and actually moved ) , and also if there isn't already planning on the ground you're using .. ( ie. It's part of a planning stipulation , eg , parking for a development or business ) that's unlikely if it's a just a gravel area ,
Find out who actually owns it ... That's who's consent you need ,

Chiorino

Markcheese wrote: »

Not normally ... Especially if the stall is mobile ( and actually moved ) , and also if there isn't already planning on the ground you're using .. ( ie. It's part of a planning stipulation , eg , parking for a development or business ) that's unlikely if it's a just a gravel area ,
Find out who actually owns it ... That's who's consent you need ,

If the gravel area is part of a business premises curtilage, the (granted) use of the business is what the planning is going to be relevant to. There's a world of difference from a coffee unit operating from a large pub car park vs outside an industrial unit on a busy roundabout and which one you are likely to get away with trading from.

michdee

Chiorino wrote: »

If the gravel area is part of a business premises curtilage, the (granted) use of the business is what the planning is going to be relevant to. There's a world of difference from a coffee unit operating from a large pub car park vs outside an industrial unit on a busy roundabout and which one you are likely to get away with trading from.

Thanks everybody. Its a gravel area outside an old pub that's not operating anymore. It's off the road. There is no other business operating in the coffee sector in the area. It is a hugely popular walking area.

discodiva92

michdee wrote: »

Thanks everybody. Its a gravel area outside an old pub that's not operating anymore. It's off the road. There is no other business operating in the coffee sector in the area. It is a hugely popular walking area.

Have you permission of the landowner?

michdee

discodiva92 wrote: »

Have you permission of the landowner?

Yes

PickYourName

michdee wrote: »

Thanks everybody. Its a gravel area outside an old pub that's not operating anymore. It's off the road. There is no other business operating in the coffee sector in the area. It is a hugely popular walking area.

You probably wouldn't need planning in that case, as there's no change in use: pubs can and do sell coffee. It might be worth getting confirmation of this from the local council of this (there is a formal name for this, which I can't recall). If you have that, it makes it a lot simpler if someone subsequently does complain.

michdee

Thanks very much. Awaiting a reply from them with info.

discodiva92

Would the landowner have to have insurance?Or could you be added

Chiorino

discodiva92 wrote: »

Would the landowner have to have insurance?Or could you be added

The landowner would/should have insurance appropriate to the liability associated with their own business. The OP's liability and the landowners is distinct and separate and it would be standard practice that each party would hold their own individual insurance.

Carodh

Best check if you can trade on private property first. It’s not as cut and dried as you think.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/mobile-coffee-truck-prosecution-healthcare-workers-5357808-Feb2021/%3famp=1

Chiorino

Carodh wrote: »

Best check if you can trade on private property first. It’s not as cut and dried as you think.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/mobile-coffee-truck-prosecution-healthcare-workers-5357808-Feb2021/%3famp=1

There's more to that story that isn't relevant to the OP's situation.

michdee

Thanks all, I've contacted the council and awaited their reply

anon41

Hi all,

just jumping onto this thread as I am also thinking of starting a coffee cart, it is an area beside a local shop, my family actually own the strip of land and it is zoned for mixed use. I was thinking of landscaping the stipi to include some pretty features/ seats as I thought it would add to the local area.

The landscaping would be expensive, do you think it is worth it?!. I have no experience in coffee/ hospitality so no clue if it would be profitiable or not. There is a housing estate across the road and an adjacent area that has already been landscaped where ppl often bring their toddlers to play

Darc19

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118176908#Comment_118176908

Do the landscaping and get someone else to operate it? - Once the local shop doesn't sell coffee or anyone else nearby, it probably won't be a big issue.

But the question is whether the business is there. So many coffee carts that have set up seem to have mysteriously disappeared as the number did not add up.

anon41

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118177267#Comment_118177267

yeah I was thinking of getting someone else to operate it, if I could do some of the landscaping at least it wouldn't be too much money lost if it didn't work out. I

Its funny how we day dream about this stuff in our office jobs and then when it comes down to it its hard to actually take the plunge

Darc19

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118177628#Comment_118177628

The dreams are always more positive than reality :)

I have chatted to the guys that have a kart in the pitch & putt carpark in athgarvan just outside Newbridge. They work/study during the week and only open at weekends. Its beside the curragh, so a lot of walkers and they are into their coffee.

Seems its worth their while as a weekend job, but would not work as a full time venture.

atrojan

Hi all...

like many others here, we are planning to open our coffee trailer.

We might get a spot to park and trade at the church's car parking.

I saw here that we will need an HSE permit and insurence.

Being a church, what else we will need? Any permission planning, or any other specific license?

Thanks for any advice =)

slystallone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/116066913#Comment_116066913

For the Casual Trading License - Are you only allowed operate in designated areas?

Chiorino

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119128444#Comment_119128444

Yes, a licence would be issued for a pre-designated trading pitch. They can often come with conditions such as the hours you are allowed to operate, specific goods you can sell etc.

slystallone

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119139432#Comment_119139432

Are you a trader?

Chiorino

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119141206#Comment_119141206

Yes, and have also been involved in various other things relate to market trading and event organising