55 Students suspended in Moate Community School

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 3:49pm #1

I am shocked to find 55 students suspended in Moate Community School as a result of them peacefully protesting for what they believed. What sort of a message does this set for them when they are older?

munchkin_utd · 13-05-2016 3:52pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

I am shocked to find 55 students suspended in Moate Community School as a result of them peacefully protesting for what they believed. What sort of a message does this set for them when they are older?

no idea of what youre on about, but "believeing" something does not automatically give you a ticket to break the law, or rules or cause damage or in general just decide that you can do whatever you feel like.

when you grow up you'll see this is called living in the real world

livedadream · 13-05-2016 3:54pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

I am shocked to find 55 students suspended in Moate Community School as a result of them peacefully protesting for what they believed. What sort of a message does this set for them when they are older?

do you feel like elaborating at all...

your definition of peacefully protesting would be a good start

and what they believed as well would be great...

and one would hope that it set a message of stop ****ing around and do what your told or something along those lines...

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 3:56pm

No and that's not what these students done. The only school rule they broke was mitching 3 classes in order to sit silently, a common rule broken in that school which is punished with a warning or cleanup duty. These students were punished for having different views than the school.

Stheno · 13-05-2016 3:58pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

No and that's not what these students done. The only school rule they broke was mitching 3 classes in order to sit silently, a common rule broken in that school which is punished with a warning or cleanup duty. These students were punished for having different views than the school.

So they skipped three classes and sat silently where, in protest at what?

stoplooklisten · 13-05-2016 3:59pm

What was their demands?

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 4:00pm

Ok so basically there had been a soccer tournament at the end of each school year going back at least 14 years when I was in 6th year. Their principle in school called off the tournament this year and students sat down on the courts for 3 classes.

stoplooklisten · 13-05-2016 4:04pm

Did he give reason for cancelling the tournament?

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 4:09pm

He wanted them to focus on their leaving cert, which is ironic given the number of people suspended.

stoplooklisten · 13-05-2016 4:12pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

He wanted them to focus on their leaving cert, which is ironic given the number of people suspended.

Seems a reasonable demand from the principal. Imagine, in a few weeks, they'll be joining us in the real world.

munchkin_utd · 13-05-2016 4:14pm

stoplooklisten wrote: »

Seems a reasonable demand from the principal. Imagine, in a few weeks, they'll be joining us in the real world.

... or planning to repeat the leaving .

Teyla Emmagan · 13-05-2016 4:16pm

Good enough for them. A soccer tournament is a discretionary activity the school can cancel whenever they want. They're not there to accede to the demands of students in relation to recreational activities. If the students had been protesting about a valid issue relating to their education I would support them but not in relation to this idiocy. They should have found something more worthy to "believe in".

stoplooklisten · 13-05-2016 4:16pm

How did you get on with your legal challenge to wear jewelry OP?

readytosnap · 13-05-2016 4:16pm

Soccer? SOCCER?? you mean they play that foreign sport in the country? thought they were all gaa heads in that neck of the woods. they have been watching the Luas strikers on the telly I bet.

12Phase · 13-05-2016 4:16pm

stoplooklisten wrote: »

Seems a reasonable demand from the principal. Imagine, in a few weeks, they'll be joining us in the real world.

They could be going for jobs as Luas drivers though. In which case it's good preparation.

stoplooklisten · 13-05-2016 4:18pm

12Phase wrote: »

They could be going for jobs as Luas drivers though. In which case it's good preparation.

It'll be a while yet before the luas gets extended to moate.

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 4:23pm

I personality don't care to much for soccer but I do know protesting is Irish, look at the 1913 lockout etc. The right to Protest is in our constitution, and Many of the students involved had never been in trouble in the school before, many had there awards stripped from them the awards night that evening. What I am saying is isn't that a bit harsh of a punishment for having different views than the principle.

Lady is a tramp · 13-05-2016 4:27pm

Why didn't they just organise their own soccer tournament, outside of school hours?

Carlos Orange · 13-05-2016 4:28pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

for having different views than the principle.

It sounds like nobody is being punished for having a different point of view.

h2005 · 13-05-2016 4:36pm

Punished for mitching 3 classes seems pretty fair to me. Secondary school isn't a democracy.

13-05-2016 4:38pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

I am shocked to find 55 students suspended in Moate Community School as a result of them peacefully protesting for what they believed. What sort of a message does this set for them when they are older?

The message that rules are there for a reason and that breaking them will have serious consequences.

Choochtown · 13-05-2016 4:44pm

Imagine no punishment was seen to be dished out ...

A load of younger students decide next week that because there's no ice cream van at sports day they'll "strike" for an afternoon.

Wouldn't take long for discipline to break down altogether.

I would imagine the principal went out to reason with them, and found him/herself with no option in the end after they refused to come in.

Angron · 13-05-2016 4:45pm

I've edited two posts in this thread. TriangularGuy, you can't make unsubstantiated claims against the principal just because you don't agree with what they've done.

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 4:46pm

Well people have been caught mitching 3 classes to 3 days in a row and have not been suspended for mitching.. they were suspended for protesting.

jaykay74 · 13-05-2016 4:46pm

Lady is a tramp wrote:

Why didn't they just organise their own soccer tournament, outside of school hours?

Certainly sounds like a constructive proposal.

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 4:49pm

definitely what they should have done. @Angron The principle is question received his free education from pretending he was going to be a priest.

jaykay74 · 13-05-2016 4:51pm

TriangularGuy wrote:

definitely what they should have done. @Angron The principle is question received his free education from pretending he was going to be a priest.

Sounds like he should be tackled on issues like that then. Not some non mandatory football tournament.

Cool_CM · 13-05-2016 4:53pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

What sort of a message does this set for them when they are older?

A pretty good one: that no means no. What were they expecting to happen?

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 4:55pm

Yes true but in the same way the principle has the right to call it off, don't the student have the right to protest that decision despite it having no affect. "Cool_CM" it has become clear from protests throughout our democracy Ireland that if one man says no that doesnt mean no. Enda Kenny

EagererBeaver · 13-05-2016 4:57pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

Yes true but in the same way the principle has the right to call it off, don't the student have the right to protest that decision despite it having no affect. "Cool_CM" it has become clear from protests throughout our democracy Ireland that if one man says no that doesnt mean no. Enda Kenny

No, they don't. As somebody helpfully pointed out, school isn't a democracy.

As for attempting to compare this incident with the lockout...

Jayop · 13-05-2016 4:59pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The message that rules are there for a reason and that breaking them will have serious consequences.

So we should discourage independent thought and principles and try everything to have schools produce obedient little drones.

I know that's exactly what a certain section of our society would like but it's not what I like.

These kids had something taken from them, probably with no justification and no real reason. Extra-circular activities, especially sport are a great pressure release for kids coming up to their leaving and I would support their right to protest. If the teacher's only justification for this was to have them concentrate on the exams then suspend them is a farcical punishment.

Cool_CM · 13-05-2016 4:59pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

Yes true but in the same way the principle has the right to call it off, don't the student have the right to protest that decision despite it having no affect. "Cool_CM" it has become clear from protests throughout our democracy Ireland that if one man says no that doesnt mean no. Enda Kenny

Ah Jesus...

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 4:59pm

I haven't taken the time to describe the circumstances but the majority of teachers, parents and students have taken the view that it was a very harsh resolution from the principle.

Jayop · 13-05-2016 5:00pm

EagererBeaver wrote: »

No, they don't. As somebody helpfully pointed out, school isn't a democracy.

As for attempting to compare this incident with the lockout...

School isn't a democracy, but as hard as this may be to believe this is still a free country.

I'm delighted these 17/18 year old kids aren't little mindless drones.

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 5:02pm

Exactly, the way the education system encourages student not to think but to learn off. I think its a life lesson for these students whatever that may be.

Angron · 13-05-2016 5:04pm

Once more TriangularGuy, you cannot make that claim because "it's well known". We all do not know that, and it cannot be taken at your word. Boards would be held responsible, not you for what could be potentially libellous statements.

Furthermore, no more comments along the lines of "pussy ass parents". They don't add anything to a discussion.

DK man · 13-05-2016 5:04pm

If these pupils are sons and daughters of socialist workers party members they'll probably have a claim in for grinds and soccer tickets against the school

Jayop · 13-05-2016 5:07pm

DK man wrote: »

If these pupils are sons and daughters of socialist workers party members they'll probably have a claim in for grinds and soccer tickets against the school

And if they have parents that are FG/FF party members they'll not have to worry about the results because they'll have a nice handy job lined up for them. :rolleyes:

13-05-2016 5:12pm

Jayop wrote: »

So we should discourage independent thought and principles and try everything to have schools produce obedient little drones.

I know that's exactly what a certain section of our society would like but it's not what I like.

These kids had something taken from them, probably with no justification and no real reason. Extra-circular activities, especially sport are a great pressure release for kids coming up to their leaving and I would support their right to protest. If the teacher's only justification for this was to have them concentrate on the exams then suspend them is a farcical punishment.

Debate and questioning are always welcome from our young people.
However, we are not getting the full story here. Is it possible that there was an Insurance or Health & Safety issue?
Being denied something and throwing a strop doesn't bode well for their future. Imagine taking the law into ones own hands in the workplace?
I hope they learn from this and move on to a bright, mature future.

TriangularGuy · 13-05-2016 5:18pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Debate and questioning are always welcome from our young people.
However, we are not getting the full story here. Is it possible that there was an Insurance or Health & Safety issue?
Being denied something and throwing a strop doesn't bode well for their future. Imagine taking the law into ones own hands in the workplace?
I hope they learn from this and move on to a bright, mature future.

Yes, sorry but I only have a half story I heard from my friend whos brother attends the school. I will see if I can find more information on the matter for you.

Jayop · 13-05-2016 5:22pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Debate and questioning are always welcome from our young people.
However, we are not getting the full story here. Is it possible that there was an Insurance or Health & Safety issue?
Being denied something and throwing a strop doesn't bode well for their future. Imagine taking the law into ones own hands in the workplace?
I hope they learn from this and move on to a bright, mature future.

See you're assuming they threw a strop and acted like babies. Perhaps they had a reasoned and thought out discussion among themselves as young adults. Perhaps they decided after careful consideration that they didn't want to lose something that they had been looking forward to all year. Perhaps these are the kind of kids that our school system should be trying to produce rather than quashing any sign of resistance in them and having them be nothing more than worker bees for the system.

I can only make some assumptions here but they seem reasonable to me to counter your H&S and Insurance worries.

1) If they were the reasons then surely the head teacher would have said that and not what they did say which was the kids should focus on exams.
2) If the comp was run during school time in their own field then there would be insurance in place the same way there is for all other PE/Sport activities.

Jayop · 13-05-2016 5:25pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Debate and questioning are always welcome from our young people.
However, we are not getting the full story here. Is it possible that there was an Insurance or Health & Safety issue?
Being denied something and throwing a strop doesn't bode well for their future. Imagine taking the law into ones own hands in the workplace?
I hope they learn from this and move on to a bright, mature future.

You mean like collective bargaining? Yeah imagine the horrors of that and where we'd be now if that was to have been something that had happened.

13-05-2016 5:28pm

Jayop wrote: »

You mean like collective bargaining? Yeah imagine the horrors of that and where we'd be now if that was to have been something that had happened.

So collective bargaining is the same as taking the Law into ones own hands?

# OP. You might let us have the whole story some time. The real one, not a second hand version.

Jayop · 13-05-2016 5:31pm

Deleted User wrote: »

So collective bargaining is the same as taking the Law into ones own hands?

What exactly do you mean by that?

Surely that's exactly what it means if you are put in a situation where strike/protest is the last option for you.

Firstly, why you're bringing the law into it when it's a matter of school rules and not the law. Are the Tesco workers taking "the law" into their own hands on Monday when they're striking because they are having something they have (existing contracts) taken off them for pretty rubbish reasons?

mirrorwall14 · 13-05-2016 5:31pm

This thread is honestly seriously lacking in information, here's just a few questions:

1. Who organised this tournament in the past? Staff or students? If it is a staff member then it would be voluntary coordination on their part and they could have decided to step down. Or even have left the school

2. Is there a background here?
Has there been issues with the year group? was this tournament cancelled due to behaviour issues? Is the school out of supervision hours? Have there been accidents in the past at the event?

Extra curricular activities in Ireland are generally organised completely on the goodwill of staff (unless I'm a private school) so to be honest this feels like complete entitlement on the students part to 'demand' something like this.

13-05-2016 5:34pm

Jayop wrote: »

What exactly do you mean by that?

Surely that's exactly what it means if you are put in a situation where strike/protest is the last option for you.

Firstly, why you're bringing the law into it when it's a matter of school rules and not the law. Are the Tesco workers taking "the law" into their own hands on Monday when they're striking because they are having something they have (existing contracts) taken off them for pretty rubbish reasons?

I don't recall Tesco workers throwing a strop when it was first mooted that their work contracts were to be altered? They entered negotiations and the strike is the next step.

VincePP · 13-05-2016 5:42pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

Yes, sorry but I only have a half story I heard from my friend whos brother attends the school. I will see if I can find more information on the matter for you.

Oh, all your posts are based on a friend of a friend of a friend said.
And even at that only half the story.

Christ!

Dave0301 · 13-05-2016 5:47pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

Yes, sorry but I only have a half story I heard from my friend whos brother attends the school. I will see if I can find more information on the matter for you.

For someone that only has half a story you have been pretty quick to cast judgement on the principal.

endacl · 13-05-2016 5:58pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

Ok so basically there had been a soccer tournament at the end of each school year going back at least 14 years when I was in 6th year. Their principle in school called off the tournament this year and students sat down on the courts for 3 classes.

That's not basically. That's concisely. Or succinctly. Briefly, even. If you're into brevity. Which I'm not. Obviously.

LionelNashe · 13-05-2016 6:04pm

TriangularGuy wrote: »

Ok so basically there had been a soccer tournament at the end of each school year going back at least 14 years when I was in 6th year. Their principle in school called off the tournament this year and students sat down on the courts for 3 classes.

I'd have some respect for them if they had used the 3 hours to have a soccer tournament as opposed to having a sit-down.

Jayop · 13-05-2016 6:07pm

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't recall Tesco workers throwing a strop when it was first mooted that their work contracts were to be altered? They entered negotiations and the strike is the next step.

You see everyone of the assumptions and speculations you have made have been pro-authority. You speculated that it could be insurance, could be H&S. You assume the students didn't attempt to negotiate before taking action.

Everything about your postings from your justifications for one sides actions to your language (strop) and quickness to judge the other sides tells me all I need to know.

55 Students suspended in Moate Community School

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