Applying for jobs that you interviewed for last year!

keoclassic

Personally Im not going to bother! What are you going to do?

TheDriver

That's your choice. Assume its a year 2 advertisement

gaiscioch

I'm not going to even look at the jobs since this crowd, who run the educationposts website, expect me to search each of the 32 counties separately to find what jobs are available in Ireland for my subject (you used to be able to press 'ctrl', 'f' and type in your subject and every available job in the whole country would appear on a single page within two seconds).

Had I the patience, I'd certainly apply again for a job that I was interviewed for last year - providing, of course, I didn't leave the interview thinking I wouldn't actually like to work for those people (it's happened to me twice). That you were called for interview is a good sign, and it could have been close. (the HR section might have feedback about your interview on record still). As a general rule, interviews sharpen us much more and are good practice. The more doors you knock on, the more likely one is to open. I'd very strongly believe that. It could be a simple formality to reappoint the person who got it last year, so don't feel too down if you don't get it.

I wouldn't apply to the principal of that new secondary school in Greystones, Co. Wicklow, though, who in his wisdom decided that each candidate had nothing better to do with her/his time than fill out a school-unique ten-page questionnaire as part of the application process (a topic of "debate" in our staffroom, given that hundreds of people apply for most jobs). A decision like that doesn't augur well for respect.

icebergiceberg

gaiscioch wrote: »

I'm not going to even look at the jobs since this crowd, who run the educationposts website, expect me to search each of the 32 counties separately to find what jobs are available in Ireland for my subject (you used to be able to press 'ctrl', 'f' and type in your subject and every available job in the whole country would appear on a single page within two seconds).

Had I the patience, I'd certainly apply again for a job that I was interviewed for last year - providing, of course, I didn't leave the interview thinking I wouldn't actually like to work for those people (it's happened to me twice). That you were called for interview is a good sign, and it could have been close. (the HR section might have feedback about your interview on record still). As a general rule, interviews sharpen us much more and are good practice. The more doors you knock on, the more likely one is to open. I'd very strongly believe that. It could be a simple formality to reappoint the person who got it last year, so don't feel too down if you don't get it.

I wouldn't apply to the principal of that new secondary school in Greystones, Co. Wicklow, though, who in his wisdom decided that each candidate had nothing better to do with her/his time than fill out a school-unique ten-page questionnaire as part of the application process (a topic of "debate" in our staffroom, given that hundreds of people apply for most jobs). A decision like that doesn't augur well for respect.

That is probably one of the most frustrating things about applying for jobs, I have found. I don't know if I would apply for jobs which look for that. There was a time when I did apply for jobs with long, useless questions. I used to copy/paste all the answers: How would you teach X? What would you do if ...? Describe your strengths and so on.
All perfectly useless.

keoclassic

TheDriver wrote: »

That's your choice. Assume its a year 2 advertisement

Ya, all year 2 ads. I thought i would be cute last year by saving all of my applications, but a lot of them decided in their wisdom to change the format of said applications, what a load of cod****e! I see one school that i interviewed for twice last year has also done the same :rolleyes:

Gerry T

Reading those first posts makes me wonder, are employers to come to your house for interview so as your not put out?, so you have to search for jobs, fill our a form...too much work for you? What's a principal to do with a couple of hundred applicants? Well it's best to weed out the lazy ones by getting applicants to first search for the job and secondly complete a form. Then only the really interested people will apply.

keoclassic

Gerry T wrote: »

Reading those first posts makes me wonder, are employers to come to your house for interview so as your not put out?, so you have to search for jobs, fill our a form...too much work for you? What's a principal to do with a couple of hundred applicants? Well it's best to weed out the lazy ones by getting applicants to first search for the job and secondly complete a form. Then only the really interested people will apply.

Right on Gerry T.

Gerry T

keoclassic wrote:

Right on Gerry T.

Like you said yourself, your not going to bother, so one less interview.
I've had to sit through countless interviews and found it was the applicants that make that extra step to stand out would greatly improve their chances.

aunt aggie

Gerry T wrote: »

Like you said yourself, your not going to bother, so one less interview.
I've had to sit through countless interviews and found it was the applicants that make that extra step to stand out would greatly improve their chances.

They don't want candidates to stand out.

Schools get so many applications that they intentionally use long and utterly pointless essay style questions on application forms to discourage people from applying. They're missing out on the more experienced candidates as a result.

And 9 times out of 10, they will just look at the front page and disqualify people based on length of service or subject combination, so after putting in the time and effort your application will be just as likely to end up in the bin.

I would apply but I would be copying and pasting a lot of answers.

With applying for Year 2 posts, you never actually know if it's one or not. Yes you could have suspicions but I would always apply on the off chance. There could have been a second vacancy for whatever reason in the same subject. I would become wary of schools advertising the same subject combination every summer though. That's what I'll be looking out for next summer. If management just want a conveyor belt of teachers on one year contracts, I do not want to work there. I've heard of schools where no RPT teacher employed in the 2014 was back working in the school in 2015. Now I don't know the details, but hearing things like that makes me very suspicious.

Gerry T

If that's what some schools do it will work against them in the long run. It's hard to get good staff and even the first couple of years a new start takes time to grow into the position. A constant roll over is a nightmare to manage. So why is it schools do this? Is it that after a yr the new staff member can't be got rid of for poor performance. If that's the case the system needs an overhaul. Allow employers to sack poor performing teachers and employ and keep new-starts that do a good job. Or stick with the status quo and employers won't get trapped and will continue with yearly replacing.
But it must be demoralising for any young person in that trap. The symptom is employers resorting to this tactic, which in fairness must be making their lives difficult. The root cause is what needs changing, and I'm sure others here have opinions on why this happens.

keoclassic

I'm more interested in replies from teachers that know the system and how it works AND who are currently applying for jobs. I'm not looking for a discussion on what needs to be changed.We have a system in place that is currently being used and that is the one i want opinions on! No offence intended.

aunt aggie

Gerry T wrote: »

If that's the case the system needs an overhaul.

This is the overhaul. After one year a RPT teacher is reinterviewed and either keeps their job or it goes to someone else. Came in under the Ward Report two years ago.

But like Keo said, this is the system we have to work within. There is no point talking about change that we can't hugely influence or direct in a way that makes everyone happy.

Gerry T

keoclassic wrote:

I'm more interested in replies from teachers that know the system and how it works AND who are currently applying for jobs. I'm not looking for a discussion on what needs to be changed.We have a system in place that is currently being used and that is the one i want opinions on! No offence intended.

I'm giving what I think is good advise, I'm not a teacher, but I have sat on the other side of the table. You can choose to take on board people's comments or not, but to say only a teacher can offer advise, to me seems somewhat narrow minded.

keoclassic

I'm not looking for advice, I'm just looking to see what other people are doing and why. Ive already made up my own mind. Just curious is all,Thanks Gerry for your own insight.

Gerry T

keoclassic wrote:

I'm not looking for advice, I'm just looking to see what other people are doing and why. Ive already made up my own mind. Just curious is all,Thanks Gerry for your own insight.

Fair enough, I may have missed interpreted the first post. It's an unfortunate situation and one I'm happy I'm not in.

mtoutlemonde

keoclassic wrote: »

Personally Im not going to bother! What are you going to do?

I would apply unless it stated that it was in line with the Ward report. You may not be successful but you may something that a principal may remember and you could be called back in the future as this happened to me. I always learn something from interviews and I also know what schools I wouldn't like to work for. If you don't have a job for the summer - what else would you be doing? As a TV ad said a few years ago 'you never know unless you go'.

man_no_plan

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

I would apply unless it stated that it was in line with the Ward report. You may not be successful but you may something that a principal may remember and you could be called back in the future as this happened to me. I always learn something from interviews and I also know what schools I wouldn't like to work for. If you don't have a job for the summer - what else would you be doing? As a TV ad said a few years ago 'you never know unless you go'.

I'd be inclined to agree. Even people who are reappointed can change school if something comes up closer to home or whatever. Second isn't always a bad place to be.

The year two interview isn't necessarily a formality either, people have been let go for whatever reason.

icebergiceberg

Gerry T wrote: »

Reading those first posts makes me wonder, are employers to come to your house for interview so as your not put out?, so you have to search for jobs, fill our a form...too much work for you? What's a principal to do with a couple of hundred applicants? Well it's best to weed out the lazy ones by getting applicants to first search for the job and secondly complete a form. Then only the really interested people will apply.

I don't read CVs that are long. I don't have time to read them.
You ask applicants to fill in pages and pages of stuff and you get sh1t.

I have no end of respect for applicants who knock on the door and introduce themselves with a CV. I will talk to them, see what they are about and remember them.

tosh999

I would encourage you to re apply again this year.

I have seen cases where last years successful applicant may not have been successful in the position.

Gerry T

icebergiceberg wrote: »

I don't read CVs that are long. I don't have time to read them.
You ask applicants to fill in pages and pages of stuff and you get sh1t.

I have no end of respect for applicants who knock on the door and introduce themselves with a CV. I will talk to them, see what they are about and remember them.

I totally agree, a handwritten letter sent in the post is far better than an email, or cold calling etc.. I never suggested that a long form was a good way to go. But if an employer asks for it and you want the job you have no choice and no point moaning about it. I had bowed out of this thread as the OP is looking for only other teachers view points.

mtoutlemonde

Gerry T wrote: »

I totally agree, a handwritten letter sent in the post is far better than an email, or cold calling etc.. I never suggested that a long form was a good way to go. But if an employer asks for it and you want the job you have no choice and no point moaning about it. I had bowed out of this thread as the OP is looking for only other teachers view points.

I would not send a handwritten letter - it looks unprofessional and in the era of IT - outdated. I do totally agree that taking the time to visit schools with CV is very beneficial - have done it a few times and have been successful with day to day subbing / sick leaves. People remember a face more than a letter.

Gerry T

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

I would not send a handwritten letter - it looks unprofessional and in the era of IT - outdated. I do totally agree that taking the time to visit schools with CV is very beneficial - have done it a few times and have been successful with day to day subbing / sick leaves. People remember a face more than a letter.

Well I get probably 1 or 2 hand written letters a year, little post and thousands of emails. I find I drop what I'm doing to read a hand written letter. Far from unprofessional and never outdated but it always seperates you from the crowd.
I never said you couldn't attach a typed CV

mtoutlemonde

Gerry T wrote: »

Well I get probably 1 or 2 hand written letters a year, little post and thousands of emails. I find I drop what I'm doing to read a hand written letter. Far from unprofessional and never outdated but it always seperates you from the crowd.
I never said you couldn't attach a typed CV

I'm only speaking from my own experience and the principals I have worked for - a handwritten letter would go straight to the bin. I do see how it would make you stand out as you took the time to handwrite a letter as opposed to using a common letter with mail merge. I have a degree in IT so there would be question marks on my handwritten letter

TheDriver

Just don't call around looking for subbing work and a) have TC reg not current or b) and this one gets me-don't answer the phone because you don't answer private numbers.......

mtoutlemonde

TheDriver wrote: »

Just don't call around looking for subbing work and a) have TC reg not current or b) and this one gets me-don't answer the phone because you don't answer private numbers.......

I only do this at the beginning of the school year. As I said, it worked for me and I got lots of work from it which in my opinion wouldn't happen if I hadn't done it? How do you expect to be called for substitution without delivering your cv to the schools you would like to work for? Wait for educationposts for a vacancy - this will only happen with maternity leaves.

icebergiceberg

Gerry T wrote: »

I totally agree, a handwritten letter sent in the post is far better than an email, or cold calling etc.. I never suggested that a long form was a good way to go. But if an employer asks for it and you want the job you have no choice and no point moaning about it. I had bowed out of this thread as the OP is looking for only other teachers view points.

I didn't say, at all, that a handwritten letter sent in the post is better than email or cold calling.

I actually said turning up in person gains my admiration and respect.

aunt aggie

icebergiceberg wrote: »

I actually said turning up in person gains my admiration and respect.

I do this regularly but never get past the secretary.

The one time hand delivering CVs worked, the school in question called me about subbing the day I started a maternity leave contract in another school. They continued to call me for subbing a good few times over the next three months, even though I always made it clear that I was covering a maternity leave and wouldn't be available.

I felt horrible turning them down each time, but I had to wonder how up to date are schools sub lists? I live in an area where there isn't a large number of jobs advertised in summer and I always thought there'd be a lot of subs available.

Corkgirl18

I'm definitely going to apply for jobs I know I applied for previously. You never know. If you want a position badly enough, you'll take the time to fill in all the application forms. Eventually something will come your way.

mtoutlemonde

Corkgirl18 wrote: »

I'm definitely going to apply for jobs I know I applied for previously. You never know. If you want a position badly enough, you'll take the time to fill in all the application forms. Eventually something will come your way.

Completely agree. There is no point whinging here in September when you have no work. As I said earlier, interviews are learning experiences.

Starkystark

Hi everyone! I'm just wondering what everyone's advice would be on this. I've just completed a year full time teaching in a school. I had to reapply last month and I've got an interview for it tomorrow.

Whilst it's still in the hands of how I get on tomorrow- I'm not sure whether I really want to be living here for another year or even the future. As in I would preferably like to move to Kildare where my family and more of my friends are. I'm applying for jobs there too.

In worried that if I have a successful interview tomorrow and find myself getting a job in Kildare/Dublin during the summer - what do I do?

I hope this makes sense. It's just I've been expressing my thoughts with a few people and they're adamant that I won't get a job in Kildare and I should be grateful to have full time hours.

TheDriver

Take the job now and then resign and take job that suits you if you get it. Happens all the time

Starkystark

TheDriver wrote: »

Take the job now and then resign and take job that suits you if you get it. Happens all the time

Thanks Driver. 😊 Would you know roughly how much notice I would have to give?

man_no_plan

Starkystark wrote: »

Thanks Driver. 😊 Would you know roughly how much notice I would have to give?

As soon as you have the new job let the school know to give them a chance to get a replacement.

Starkystark

man_no_plan wrote: »

As soon as you have the new job let the school know to give them a chance to get a replacement.

Thank you! Hopefully I'll find myself in the position. Applying for every job going. Fingers crossed.

man_no_plan

Starkystark wrote: »

Thank you! Hopefully I'll find myself in the position. Applying for every job going. Fingers crossed.

You're dead right too ypu really have to make sure its the right job for you because if you're not happy in it it won't work in the long term.

There are risks of course that you need to think about too, but you don't need anyone on here to tell you that.

Eimee90

Hi guys quick question, I qualified two years ago secondary teaching. I've been lucky to be constantly working since I came out, but they have only been blocks of teaching, still haven't picked up a maternity contract or more. Am I doomed interview wise against teachers who have worked full years. I've a lot of multi school experiences, learning support and good references but I feel like a major under dog walking into interviews when someone with even a straight years experience walks in after or before me.

mtoutlemonde

elsa21 wrote: »

Hi guys quick question, I qualified two years ago secondary teaching. I've been lucky to be constantly working since I came out, but they have only been blocks of teaching, still haven't picked up a maternity contract or more. Am I doomed interview wise against teachers who have worked full years. I've a lot of multi school experiences, learning support and good references but I feel like a major under dog walking into interviews when someone with even a straight years experience walks in after or before me.

You have as much a chance as the other candidates. Don't let that put you off. Once you have a good interview and you have said that you have good interviews and have experience of different educational sectors - you may have more experience than the person who has worked maternity leaves / career breaks etc. It takes a while to get established and getting maternity leaves - you will get there. I always say 'Rome wasn't built in a day' and someday my day will come - and I honestly believe it.

Starkystark

Hey! I'm now in a situation where I got the job in the school I was in this year after re-applying and and re-interviewing.

No I've been called for an Interview for full time position in Dublin. Which I would only love. It's not the job or school I'm in at the moment - but it's where I'm living. I just don't like it at all, it's my home county and this was the first year I lived here after 7 years and find it rather dead. I've lived in cork and London so I'm use to the buzz.

I'm dreading asking my principal for the day off for it. As I fear firstly he won't let me go and secondly that if I don't get get it he'll hold it against me. He can be rather difficult.

I suppose I'm just looking towards anyone else that's been in in a similar situation or looking for advice.

TheDriver

Ring in sick

Redser87

I assume you are not in primary or you could use a course day. . . Could you arrange with colleagues to cover your classes and then ask for a personal day?

man_no_plan

TheDriver wrote: »

Ring in sick

Yea thats ok until you get a phone call looking for a reference!

aunt aggie

gaiscioch wrote: »

I'm not going to even look at the jobs since this crowd, who run the educationposts website, expect me to search each of the 32 counties separately to find what jobs are available in Ireland for my subject (you used to be able to press 'ctrl', 'f' and type in your subject and every available job in the whole country would appear on a single page within two seconds).

Some good news. Education posts seem to have fixed this and now I can see results for the whole country. They seem to be listed in the order they were uploaded by employers.

Now you can search by subject too, so no more ctrl f needed.

Starkystark

I was going to start a new thread - but said I would ask it under here. Has anyone been asked in an interview "Whether they have ever experienced an issue with another staff member and how they have dealt with it?". I was asked it yesterday in an interview and it completely put me off.

I think from my haze of being put off I answered no I haven't - I'm there to teach and work not get caught up in staff room politics. If there was an issue - I would talk to that person and nip in the bud. I don't know if that's what they were wanting but it's certainly the truth.

Has anyone else been asked something like this? How did you handle it?