Ryback's contract dispute

Angron

Ryback has been dropped from WWE programming, apparently due to contract disputes. He was supposed to be in the battle royal to pick the new US title #1 contender on Raw, but didn't appear.

http://www.wrestlezone.com/news/704795-ryback-wwe-contract-dispute

Loughc

Every part of me wants this to be how that went down, they offer Ryback a new contract, he looks at it, shakes his head and says "Feed Me More".

beakerjoe

Ryback really is over-estimating his own worth here. Hes easily replaceable and I can't see him going anywhere else for better or career choices.

Bad move by the big guy IMO

sky88

beakerjoe wrote: »

Ryback really is over-estimating his own worth here. Hes easily replaceable and I can't see him going anywhere else for better or career choices.

Bad move by the big guy IMO

Didnt he say on austins podcast that he should be the guy to be cenas replacement or something like that. so he clearly believes hes a top guy so being on the pre show wont please him i would guess.

LeeJM

Ryback knows his value. He would walk right into the New Japan upper midcard as the new no 2 gaijin behind Kenny Omega.

Bounty Hunter

sky88 wrote: »

Didnt he say on austins podcast that he should be the guy to be cenas replacement or something like that. so he clearly believes hes a top guy so being on the pre show wont please him i would guess.

this interview is about as clear as possible what his feelings are. Very openly disgruntled about his position on the card.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3x8WgSHDpnU

I would not imagine this is a contract dispute about money unless it's money to placate him re not being where he thinks he should be on the card.


Personally I think he could have been used a bit better but I would not be putting him anywhere near the main event picture myself and think his value is dropping year on year. For example there actually could have been money in a Goldberg vs Ryback feud or mania match a few years back but now it's laughable to think they would put him in such a position. His rep for injuring people will no doubt hold the company back when thinking about how to push him also.

Monokne

Does he have a rep for injuring people? For some reason that's not ringing a bell. Can only think of Punk saying that. Can't remember seeing it in the Torch or the Observer. Who did he hurt?

Xenji

Monokne wrote: »

Does he have a rep for injuring people? For some reason that's not ringing a bell. Can only think of Punk saying that. Can't remember seeing it in the Torch or the Observer. Who did he hurt?

Kofi, Ziggler and Ricardo, I think maybe Swagger as well.

Furious-Red

Xenji wrote: »

Kofi, Ziggler and Ricardo, I think maybe Swagger as well.

Punk as well? Or i could be wrong

LeeJM

Xenji wrote: »

Kofi, Ziggler and Ricardo, I think maybe Swagger as well.

What injuries did he give them?

Mr.Nice Guy

Didn't he show up on Sunday with the words 'pre-show stopper' written on his tights? Sounds like he doesn't care if he's future endeavoured.

Xenji

LeeJM wrote: »

What injuries did he give them?

Kofi needed elbow surgery, Ziggler suffered a concussion, Ricardo had a neck injury, he has also dropped Swagger on his head along with CM Punk and Daniel Bryan.

Xenji

Furious-Red wrote: »

Punk as well? Or i could be wrong

Dropped Punk on his head.

beakerjoe

Monokne wrote: »

Does he have a rep for injuring people? For some reason that's not ringing a bell. Can only think of Punk saying that. Can't remember seeing it in the Torch or the Observer. Who did he hurt?

I remember Meltzer saying on one of the Observer radio shows that when he was initially feed jobbers longer than expected in the beginning of his streak run because he had a rep for hurting people. His source said guys in the locker room didn't want to face him because he was careless

ricero

Ryback rulez !

DM_7

I remember a weird match Ryback had on RAW with Cesaro, and its when I realised he would never make it big. It was before Survivor Series, Team Cena v Team Authority

Ryabck is having one of his re-pushes where he faced Cesaro but Cesaro wasn't getting anywhere himself. Instead of a squash it was an unusually long Ryback tv match.

He was bloated as **** and gassed EARLY, like three minutes in. Cesaro has to go into rest hold early. Most of the match is Ryback resting, a small burst of life then Cesaro having to slow it down again. Cesaro even starts throwing Ryback around as if he was pissed off with Ryback (and his own booking).

Always though it was an odd match in the context of where they both were at the time (Cesaro followed it up losing to Ryback in about 4 minutes and Swagger in 5)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INxVL2Ma4Mc

Chain Smoker

If rybacks unbeaten run had been pushed another few months, he could've been pretty big.

Would've still died down in a huge way when he eventually lost, mind. It's impossible to deny that he wasn't getting seriously over at that time though (pretty sure the numbers backed it up too).

He's deluded to think he has much value now, I'd also wager he's perhaps too associated with WWE to have much value to njpw and the like. Everything about him feels like a wwe construct.

Itssoeasy

The Daniel Bryan injury got him heat with trips as he made a compete **** up. He didn't protect Daniel Bryan and could have hurt him.

Monokne

http://thebigguyryback22.tumblr.com/post/143803724226/feed-me-more

Seems reasonable enough to me. Probably best for both sides that they part ways.

Chain Smoker

Monokne wrote: »

http://thebigguyryback22.tumblr.com/post/143803724226/feed-me-more

Seems reasonable enough to me. Probably best for both sides that they part ways.

Gonna quote that post so I can read it without the horrible red background

Today I sit and fly home and for the first time in years feel absolutely free. I will start by saying I did request to be taken off of WWE television until myself and Vince could get a yes or no on a new deal. This has been going on since my IC Title run and had been nothing but a major strain on my life as all I ever wanted to do was work for WWE. I was told to head home until we agree or not agree to specific terms and contrary to reports it isn’t over money or a bus that stuff was settled a while ago. It comes down to a major problem I have with not only WWE but wrestling in general. Wrestling is pre determined, we as performers know before we go out to that ring or perform a backstage scene who is winning and losing etc or have a general idea of what we are going to say. It blows my mind how in a sport which is pre determined from a company standpoint winners are paid so much more than the losers. Every single person who works for WWE from top to bottom is absolutely just as valuable as the next. The winners cannot win unless the losers go out there and agree to lose to them.

It blows my mind that in this day and age though we still adhere to this formula. Obviously things have always been this way, but does that make them right? Times have changed and our goal as humans should be to evolve and learn from our past and the past of others so we could make this world a better place. Why is it a guy who is told he is going to go out and lose and does everything he is told be paid not only less, but much less than said winner over a period of time. Every single performer for WWE sacrifices the same amount of time from home and their families and every single man or women goes out and does what they are told. Looking at this formula though losers turn into what fans like to call jobbers and their value decreases in the companies eyes and before you know it they get released. For what? For doing exactly as they are told!

Why not pay the talent equally? The winners have more MERCH as it is or are supposed to anyways so they get that extra perk, but why make the guy who is told to and agrees to lose earn less and sacrifice spots in big pay per view match ups etc. This is one of the major problems with wrestling and WWE today. Most guys take great satisfaction in helping making other talent, the bitching and the moaning we always hear about stems from the fact they know they are ultimately over time going to make less and live in fear of being released.

I am proud to say I have never gone to change a finish and have gladly took pride in helping put over other talent. Hell look at my pay per view record of 12-26 and you will see that has been the pattern of my career. I have always been confident in my ability and work ethic to being my best every day and ultimately always felt that by doing good it was the right thing to do. Personally seeing my money go down over the years though even though I was working as much as ever and being denied magazine covers and other projects as well as watching my role diminish no matter what I did or how hard I tried takes its toll on a human. Being told no matter how hard I work or how good I get doesn’t always pay off is something I ****ing refuse to ever believe in my life. I am a creative being and to be restricted time and time again is no way to live life. There is nothing I cannot do and I know no matter what comes of this situation I am going to be just fine. It isn’t soley about money, it is about commitment. Commitment to a guy who ****ing cares and who loves this more than anything in the world and wants to know that his passion his efforts and his determination to constantly improve is going to be recognized and taken care of.

WWE may very well release me, which if it is the case so be it. If we can work things out a lot needs to change as I am not living in fear and creatively cannot continue to live a life that limits me creatively. I have many other interests and passions and have been very smart with my finances over the years. I thank every WWE superstar from top to bottom for their sacrifices and for working with me. The world is an amazing place and there is more than just a WWE universe there is The Universe and I will prove one way or another over time I am the greatest big guy in the universe!

I'd say Vince loves the left leaning stuff in that argument there...

I'd need to hear him argue it more thoroughly to be sure, but I think he's got a few gaping holes in his logic. Am happy that in recent years guys seem to have become more willing to speak up for themselves though, the WWE lifestyle seems fairly **** for most and its good to see most of them don't feel trapped.

the groutch

they made a big mistake throwing him straight from steamrolling jobbers into challenging Punk for the title, and have him expect too much of a continued push beyond that feud.

Moneymaker

What's Ryebread doing in the Impact Zone?!

leggo

Ryback never, ever got over properly. After they gave him a catchphrase and pushed him, he could get over mildly with creative behind him, but it ALWAYS went the same way. And it's not creative's fault either. Talented guys manage to cling to relevance even when creative has forgotten them - look at Owens or Cesaro for example.

His argument sounds good on paper but is ridiculously flawed too. It doesn't stand up to any scrutiny. For a start, I'd say he doesn't even know how many extra hours the likes of Cena has to put in than him because he's never been in Cena's shoes. He can be willing to do all the extra work all he likes, **** I'd be willing to do it myself if it was handed to me, but the cold reality of it all is that the likes of ESPN aren't clamouring to have him on for interviews because he hasn't forced them to with the performances and opportunities he's gotten.

Secondly, amount of hours worked and 'time spent away from family' don't translate to value. Your value is how much someone is willing to pay you versus being willing to not do business with you. Simple as that. If WWE aren't willing to pay him it and would let him walk, he's gone.

Thirdly, this isn't like an actor's situation where they're given a script that could've been written for any other actor and the salary is based on amount of days on set, name value he'd bring to the production etc, so whether the character he plays lives or dies is irrelevant. There IS a competitive element to wrestling. Yes, it is a subjective matter at the mercy of a promoter/booker who may not see all you have to offer. And yes, that isn't 100% fair and can be quite frustrating to deal with. But that's the game. You knew the rules when you got into this. If you wanted to be judged and paid based on hard work and caster-iron merit, don't get into the 'fake' sport, get into something competitive! So, while he might think he's making a salient point and reinventing the wheel with his argument, to me he comes across as a bit of a dunce, complaining about pro-wrestling having never truly understood what it took to make it in the business he was so 'dedicated' to.

The funny thing is, though, I don't know if this will be the end of him. I remember Triple H talking before about how Vince likes to give guys rope to hang themselves if they put their neck out and look for opportunities, and the highest profile example of this in recent times is (ironically) Punk. So I could see Vince giving him some kind of extension and opportunity after this outburst, just to see if he sinks or swims.

LeeJM

Moneymaker wrote: »

What's Ryebread doing in the Impact Zone?!

I prefer Ryberg. Or if he goes to New Japan he can be "The Silverback" Ryan Berg and lead the Guerillas of Destiny (Tama Tonga & Tonga Roa)

BMMachine

Ryback has always been pretty awful and if he leaves it will make absolutely no difference. Harsh but true

Mr.Nice Guy

I would say he was over. If I'm not mistaken when he was put into the Cell match with Punk it did a very good buyrate. The problem was always going to be what do with him when he suffered his first loss. They had no plan for him and it wasn't long before he was doing jobs left and right having been protected prior to that.

I think he does have a charisma for the type of role he's asked to do. When he returned as a babyface, I think it was against Bo Dallas, he got a great reaction. He has something. He's not good in the ring but then again neither were Warrior or Goldberg and they were successful.

I also think it's not a bad idea for him to let it be known that he doesn't need them. They crush into the ground those who are desperate to stay there.

Chain Smoker

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I would say he was over. If I'm not mistaken when he was put into the Cell match with Punk it did a very good buyrate.

iirc the show done something like 130k buys at a time when EVERY B-tier PPV was doing around 90k (including hell in a cell). There was absolutely no other reason for a bump of that size and it has been shown time and time again how hard it was to bump any ppv other than Summerslam and Mania (see the relatively ****ty buyrate for MITB2011, one of the most well booked PPVs ever, for proof).
The consensus was very much "well, we made a mistake pulling the trigger that early" at the time.
Of course, the Rock hogging the Mania main event those two years meant his opportunities were limited regardless.

Monokne

leggo wrote: »

Ryback never, ever got over properly. After they gave him a catchphrase and pushed him, he could get over mildly with creative behind him, but it ALWAYS went the same way. And it's not creative's fault either. Talented guys manage to cling to relevance even when creative has forgotten them - look at Owens or Cesaro for example.

The numbers speak for themselves. I don't advocate him as a talent at ALL but his number with Punk for that Hell in a Cell were bigger than Punk did for his famous pipebomb. He was genuinely on the verge of being a new star, had they pulled the trigger on him. I mean for all you'd say Ryback wasn't over and people would claim Bryan was, Ryback moved the needle on PPV and Bryan never did.

Also, I think you've missed the point of his statement. He's said he feels he's worth more than the company are willing to pay him and disagrees with the payment structure, and if they can't find a middle ground, he'll leave. This isn't Conor V the UFC where he's planting a flag in the ground and trying to argue his corner. He's stating his position & his reasoning and making it clear that wherever the chips may fall, he's fine with it.

I admire his balls.

leggo

Yeah, don't get me wrong like, I don't like or rate the guy, but what he's doing does take balls and I could see it paying off for him in the short-term.

Ryback did fine when the creative wheels were spinning for him. It's like I've said a million times before on here though: the real test is when you're left to sink or swim in no man's land without any creative, and if you force their hand. It's how WWE pushes everyone since Brock originally left - a big initial push, followed by a quick de-push, and then it's wrestling Darwinism as to who gets back up the card. And to me that's a damn fine system because it weeds out the crap immediately and even the most awkward fans who like to ironically like something that isn't working aren't immune to it. He's worked fine with the pushes then constantly fell into obscurity when they take their foot off the gas. He's sunk when he could've swam multiple times. That's on him. His look and this stunt will probably earn him yet another chance, but I'm calling it now: it's going exactly the same way.

Turtyturd

Fair play to Ryback. It's nice to see an attempt to change the business that doesn't involve 'All these part timers shouldn't be in the main event..........unless I'm the guy in the main event with them.'

Andersonisgod

leggo wrote: »

Yeah, don't get me wrong like, I don't like or rate the guy, but what he's doing does take balls and I could see it paying off for him in the short-term.

Ryback did fine when the creative wheels were spinning for him. It's like I've said a million times before on here though: the real test is when you're left to sink or swim in no man's land without any creative, and if you force their hand. It's how WWE pushes everyone since Brock originally left - a big initial push, followed by a quick de-push, and then it's wrestling Darwinism as to who gets back up the card. And to me that's a damn fine system because it weeds out the crap immediately and even the most awkward fans who like to ironically like something that isn't working aren't immune to it. He's worked fine with the pushes then constantly fell into obscurity when they take their foot off the gas. He's sunk when he could've swam multiple times. That's on him. His look and this stunt will probably earn him yet another chance, but I'm calling it now: it's going exactly the same way.

A damn fine system that has failed to create any superstar post Cena? I'm not sure in what world anyone could regard WWE's stop/start pushes and 50/50 booking as a damn fine system.

Loughc

BMMachine wrote: »

Ryback has always been pretty awful and if he leaves it will make absolutely no difference. Harsh but true

Yep. This is the truth. I think Ryback will realise lower/mid-card is much better than TNA, or scraping indie and convention appearances that will offer a lot less money the longer he remains off tv.

Chain Smoker

I think it'd be hugely wrong to say Ryback was /only/ over because of his push. He has an absolutely incredible look, right down to his weird dopey looking head. He looks a superhero from a kids cartoon.
He seems to have a somewhat unhinged sense of self-belief that really helps his feed me more taunts and whatnot too.

He ticks a lot more boxes than Reigns imo.

CSF

Ryback speaks well, and obviously him losing to Henry was a farce but he clearly oversimplifies matters. There is obviously a lot more to someone's earning power than whether WWE decide they win or lose. You try tell that to Dean Ambrose who made himself a main event player despite losing at 90% of the PPVs he's fought at.

Imnotthehulk

Andersonisgod wrote: »

A damn fine system that has failed to create any superstar post Cena? I'm not sure in what world anyone could regard WWE's stop/start pushes and 50/50 booking as a damn fine system.

Absolutely! I have found it very frustrating to watch the wasted potential of many many superstars who could have had long main event level careers if it wasn't for the weird stop/start pushes WWE gave them. The Miz, Sheamus, Jack Swagger, Dolph Ziggler, Alberto Del Rio, Ruzev to name a few off the top of my head.

And when something like the League of Nations, made up of wrestlers who are all damn good, but have had no momentum in years fails to generate any kind of heat, the creative wonders why. It's amazing to think that The Miz once headlined Wrestlemania. He is a modern day Ted Dibiase!

briany

Chain Smoker wrote: »

He seems to have a somewhat unhinged sense of self-belief that really helps his feed me more taunts and whatnot too.

The man is scarily positive. To be fair, positivity is a good thing, I just think people cock an eyebrow when someone comes along who is 100 percent about it. Like, it's a bit weird not to have at least some deeply ingrained cynicism. He mentioned reading The Secret on Jericho's podcast and about how much it helped him at times when his wrestling career wasn't going so well. What's sad about that is they say that hard work will beat talent, if you put enough in, but Ryback seems to have put in a 1000 percent into everything he does but doesn't seem destined to get into the very tip top of WWE, whereas much more laid-back seeming guys like Daniel Bryan have done.

Venom

briany wrote: »

The man is scarily positive. To be fair, positivity is a good thing, I just think people cock an eyebrow when someone comes along who is 100 percent about it. Like, it's a bit weird not to have at least some deeply ingrained cynicism. He mentioned reading The Secret on Jericho's podcast and about how much it helped him at times when his wrestling career wasn't going so well. What's sad about that is they say that hard work will beat talent, if you put enough in, but Ryback seems to have put in a 1000 percent into everything he does but doesn't seem destined to get into the very tip top of WWE, whereas much more laid-back seeming guys like Daniel Bryan have done.

Daniel Bryan might seem laid back but also came across as someone who gave 100% as well not to mention his ring and mic work was leagues ahead of Ryback's.

Chain Smoker

briany wrote: »

What's sad about that is they say that hard work will beat talent, if you put enough in

Meanwhile Reigns doesn't seem to have neither, unless hanging around the gym desperately fighting against his genetics counts.


Christ, I'm just endlessly taking jabs at Reigns in this forum...

Venom

Imnotthehulk wrote: »

It's amazing to think that The Miz once headlined Wrestlemania. He is a modern day Ted Dibiase!

Miz is an awesome heal heat wise as his mic skills are fantastic but he's only a so so wrestler at best.

leggo

Andersonisgod wrote: »

A damn fine system that has failed to create any superstar post Cena? I'm not sure in what world anyone could regard WWE's stop/start pushes and 50/50 booking as a damn fine system.

I hate how fans blame WWE for wrestlers' lack of drawing power. If they're gonna be a star, they're gonna be a star. Did it stop Bryan? Punk? Has it stopped KO's rise? Rollins? Ambrose? WWE don't actively want guys to fail, they just don't give them the sun, stars and moon from the get-go because that's bitten them in the arse before. Brock got the monster push and within two years had done all there is to do in wrestling and walked away to pursue other things, and as a result WWE missed out on him in his athletic and drawing peak as a full-time talent. Even Reigns has got several de-pushes.

Name me any wrestler who was a 'surefire superstar' that genuinely got 'held back' by creative and see if I can't give you a list of perfectly valid reasons why that didn't happen.

This notion that WWE deliberately hold back guys has caught on on the Internet, but it's total garbage and makes zero sense.

LeeJM

leggo wrote: »

I hate how fans blame WWE for wrestlers' lack of drawing power. If they're gonna be a star, they're gonna be a star. Did it stop Bryan? Punk? Has it stopped KO's rise? Rollins? Ambrose? WWE don't actively want guys to fail, they just don't give them the sun, stars and moon from the get-go because that's bitten them in the arse before. Brock got the monster push and within two years had done all there is to do in wrestling and walked away to pursue other things, and as a result WWE missed out on him in his athletic and drawing peak as a full-time talent. Even Reigns has got several de-pushes.

Name me any wrestler who was a 'surefire superstar' that genuinely got 'held back' by creative and see if I can't give you a list of perfectly valid reasons why that didn't happen.

This notion that WWE deliberately hold back guys has caught on on the Internet, but it's total garbage and makes zero sense.

Just on the bolded part Leggo is there a time frame on this list? Say from 96-present day or are you talking all the way back to the territory days? Im not gonna name anybody as I actually agree with you the cream always rises to the top.

leggo

LeeJM wrote: »

Just on the bolded part Leggo is there a time frame on this list? Say from 96-present day or are you talking all the way back to the territory days? Im not gonna name anybody as I actually agree with you the cream always rises to the top.

Go for it with anyone, I'm intrigued if there's someone big I'm forgetting now. I mean we're talking about Vince and WWE specifically so I guess that limits it a bit but sure why not broaden it up for the sake of interesting conversation!

ShagNastii

Mantaur.

*waits for Leggo's list*












The man/beast would have led the Attitude era if it wasn't for the likes of Austin, Taker, HBK being politicking A-holes.

Mick Murdock

I agree with him somewhat and he'd be one of my top 10 picks if I was starting a wrestling company but on the flip side somebody with his look - one of the best in the biz - it could be argued had way more of a shot (and push) at hitting the big time than most of the smaller guys on the roster who had to do it the hard way.

The way you are seen by people in power hugely influences the money you can make in wrestling but that's not really news to anybody. For the work they put in the money for the guys on the lower end of the card seems pretty atrocious when compared to other sports - especially when Kane and f"cking Big Show are still hoovering up the millions.

He'd be better off going elsewhere and hopefully one day coming back with a rep earned elsewhere.

Straight Edge Punk

The problem with Ryback, similar to many other guys in wwe, is that they simply cannot talk on the mic. If Big Cass didn't have Enzo with him, there's no way he would be on the main roster now. Ryback has the look, his ability in the ring has improved recently but he just cannot get himself over because he is awful on the mic.

riffmongous

leggo wrote: »

Go for it with anyone, I'm intrigued if there's someone big I'm forgetting now. I mean we're talking about Vince and WWE specifically so I guess that limits it a bit but sure why not broaden it up for the sake of interesting conversation!

Wade Barrett?

Mick Murdock

Straight Edge Punk wrote: »

The problem with Ryback, similar to many other guys in wwe, is that they simply cannot talk on the mic. If Big Cass didn't have Enzo with him, there's no way he would be on the main roster now. Ryback has the look, his ability in the ring has improved recently but he just cannot get himself over because he is awful on the mic.

I'd say he's fairly underrated. He's not the Rock by any stretch but there is just something about his mad head and gap teeth that I find great. Missed potential.

I also like Cass' delivery. He's shielded quite nicely at the moment but I see a lot of potential in him too.

Straight Edge Punk

Mick Murdock wrote: »

I'd say he's fairly underrated. He's not the Rock by any stretch but there is just something about his mad head and gap teeth that I find great. Missed potential.

I also like Cass' delivery. He's shielded quite nicely at the moment but I see a lot of potential in him too.

Ryback certainly has the look, I could definitely see him having a decent IC title reign and being in and around the main event but only if he was given a mouthpiece, dare I say, if he became a Paul Heyman guy.

Monokne

Imnotthehulk wrote: »

Absolutely! I have found it very frustrating to watch the wasted potential of many many superstars who could have had long main event level careers if it wasn't for the weird stop/start pushes WWE gave them. The Miz, Sheamus, Jack Swagger, Dolph Ziggler, Alberto Del Rio, Ruzev to name a few off the top of my head.

And when something like the League of Nations, made up of wrestlers who are all damn good, but have had no momentum in years fails to generate any kind of heat, the creative wonders why. It's amazing to think that The Miz once headlined Wrestlemania. He is a modern day Ted Dibiase!

The League of Nations is not really indicative of this problem though. Rusev, Barrett and Del Rio were all better acts outside the group then in it, but being associated with a group led by Sheamus, himself blessed with all the charisma of a wet mop, took them down a notch, and there was just no chemistry between them to compensate. Honestly that group is up there with the Corre and the Union for all time worst.

LeeJM

Straight Edge Punk wrote: »

Ryback certainly has the look, I could definitely see him having a decent IC title reign and being in and around the main event but only if he was given a mouthpiece, dare I say, if he became a Paul Heyman guy.

Ryback was a Paul Heyman Guy and it f'n sucked! And having a decent IC title reign (hes been IC champ before) means very little right now.

Monokne wrote: »

The League of Nations is not really indicative of this problem though. Rusev, Barrett and Del Rio were all better acts outside the group then in it, but being associated with a group led by Sheamus, himself blessed with all the charisma of a wet mop, took them down a notch, and there was just no chemistry between them to compensate. Honestly that group is up there with the Corre and the Union for all time worst.

Say what you want about LoN and Sheamus but I can not and will not allow you to sully the good name of The Union. What a time to be alive that was

Monokne

leggo wrote: »

I hate how fans blame WWE for wrestlers' lack of drawing power. If they're gonna be a star, they're gonna be a star. Did it stop Bryan? Punk? Has it stopped KO's rise? Rollins? Ambrose? WWE don't actively want guys to fail, they just don't give them the sun, stars and moon from the get-go because that's bitten them in the arse before. Brock got the monster push and within two years had done all there is to do in wrestling and walked away to pursue other things, and as a result WWE missed out on him in his athletic and drawing peak as a full-time talent. Even Reigns has got several de-pushes.

Name me any wrestler who was a 'surefire superstar' that genuinely got 'held back' by creative and see if I can't give you a list of perfectly valid reasons why that didn't happen.

This notion that WWE deliberately hold back guys has caught on on the Internet, but it's total garbage and makes zero sense.

The problem is that the company puts such a midcard stink on all these guys that even if they break through the system and get some main events, they are never PPV or live gate difference makers. Owens is the perfect example of this. When he beat Cena last summer, it would have been so simple to just keep him super hot, never have him lose, rarely have him sell and feed him to Lesnar or Taker or Reigns or whoever at Wrestlemania. He could have been an actual draw.

Instead he was running out on matches within weeks, he put Cena over twice and he's won and lost the intercontinental title just often enough that he's at the Miz's level.

Vince McMahon absolutely holds back talent that was made before they got to him. History is littered with talent who were ready made but Vince wouldn't protect them like his own guys because they were made elsewhere. Vader, Punk, Bryan...hell even Zack Ryder got over huge on his own but because Vince didn't create him he refused to capitalise. I don't think it's specifically because they got over with the internet audience, but there's no denying it happens.

Also, applying the logic that it can't happen because it makes zero sense is a curious line of thinking considering this is a promotion where the majority of the paying fanbase greets the top babyface with either hatred or apathy but he's on top anyway because management just refuses to admit that it's wrong in spite of ratings being at a two decade low, and that performers matches usually being in the lowest rated hour. Ego > Sense when it comes to Vince.