Comedian to be prosecuted for insulting Turkey's president.

ancapailldorcha

German satirist and television presenter Jan Boehmermann is to be prosecuted for insulting the president of Turkey, Recep Tayyip Erdogan. Angela Merkel has upheld the complaint which will now go to the courts. Boehmermann is currently under police protection following threats and could face up to 5 years in prison if convicted.

I can't believe that this is happening, least of all in a country like Germany. I see no reason why foriegn leaders' feelings should be allowed to dictate free speech like this.

Anyway, here is a link:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/german-comedian-jan-b-hmermann-could-face-prison-for-insulting-smear-poem-against-turkish-president-a6972356.html

A German comedian could face prosecution in his own country for "insulting" Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan.

Jan Böhmermann, a satirical comedian, is being investigated by German authorities under defamation laws for a poem in which he calls the Turkish premier a "goat f*****" and other insults.

He could face up to five years in prison if Turkey's foreign ministers, who were reportedly angered by the programme, decide to press charges and he is convicted, according to Der Tagesspiegel.

gramar

Ah...good old 'goat ****er'...that classic of insults.

SEPT 23 1989

German comedian?

maudgonner

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

German comedian?

Never seen Henning Wehn? He's one of my favourites, brilliant on panel shows.

wilhelm roentgen

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

German comedian?

The Wurst kind

karma_

Unbelievable, this is insane.

The Backwards Man

Well, he started it.

drunkmonkey

Someone should sue on behalf of the goat I'd say he's just as offended.

riffmongous

Europe needs Turkey now for the refugee crisis, so we have to follow their demands. Note also the deafening silence from europe about the repression of kurds

timmyntc

riffmongous wrote: »

Europe Germany needs Turkey now for the refugee crisis, so we have to follow their demands. Note also the deafening silence from europe about the repression of kurds

FYP

dinorebel

Joke was a bit of a Turkey to be fair.

Boskowski

timmyntc wrote: »

FYP

Actually, no. Germany's admittedly debatable position on the refugee crisis has simply mitigated the problem for other European countries for the moment. The refugees are marching towards Europe, Germany or not.

As for the subject. It was a bit of a stupid move on your man's behalf. There was a satirical comedy which was rather harmless just prior to the airing of this so-called satirical poem. It was directed at Erdogan and Turkey's officials took offence but like I said it was pretty harmless and I guess all sides would have eventually laughed it off. Then your man Böhmermann decided well I'll show you what an insult is and aired this 'satirical poem' where he basically brought things to a head by deliberately calling Erdogan the worst names he could think of. Well, he certainly brought things to a head.

One could argue the free press thing and all that but it was rather stupid all the same. Imagine on an RTE program someone sang a song where they called say for example David Cameron a kiddy fiddler, goat shagger and whatnot. I doubt very much it would be laughed off from all sides.

I can see where Böhmermann is coming from but he brought himself and the German government deliberately into a very awkward position. It was a political decision to allow proceedings to go ahead but it doesn't mean he's actually going to be convicted. Its a farce really. Erdogan is a dangerous man but he's elected and he's the head of state of a NATO partner. Merkel was put in a very very awkward position and I saw this decision coming all the way.

Alf Stewart.

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

German comedian?

He tells loads of Stan Boardman jokes.

A_Sober_Paddy

The Turkey situation is weird, Europe needs them to keep the refugees, but turkey are funding ISIS and causing the refugee situation

Boskowski

I know most German comedians have a bad rep and tbh for the most part deservedly so. But let's be honest to have an informed opinion you would actually have to understand the language pretty well. Translated, dubbed or subtitled comedy never works. So we like to slag German comedy but I dare say most people wouldn't actually know.

riffmongous

Boskowski wrote: »

I know most German comedians have a bad rep and tbh for the most part deservedly so. But let's be honest to have an informed opinion you would actually have to understand the language pretty well. Translated, dubbed or subtitled comedy never works. So we like to slag German comedy but I dare say most people wouldn't actually know.

A lot of comedy is pretty cultural, everyone I show Father Ted to over here thinks it's pretty stupid

And I mean, does it really need to be pointed out that if you watched Irish tv you would not get a very good impression of irish comedians (how many funny shows has RTE actually made)

The_Valeyard

riffmongous wrote: »

A lot of comedy is pretty cultural, everyone I show Father Ted to over here thinks it's pretty stupid

And I mean, does it really need to be pointed out that if you watched Irish tv you would not get a very good impression of irish comedians (how many funny shows has RTE actually made)

Down with this sort of thing

riffmongous

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Down with this sort of thing

Even the eurovision episode was panned by an austrian friend who is a big eurovision fan, that's when I gave up showing it to people

The_Valeyard

riffmongous wrote: »

Even the eurovision episode was panned by an austrian friend who is a big eurovision fan, that's when I gave up showing it to people

That would be an ecumenical matter

suicide_circus

Ironically, by actually making the complaint, Turkish authorities confirm themselves to be absolute fascist fücktards who have no place in a union of liberal democracies such as the EU.

DEFTLEFTHAND

Scary stuff. So many people out there cannot not distinguish satire from real sentiment.

It's not a good time to be a comedian.

buried

Je Suis Turkey

mikeym

Whatever happened to free speech?

Iwasfrozen

If Mr. Boehmermann can't prove Mr. Erdogan has sexual intercourse with goats then he shouldn't have made the remarks.

stoplooklisten

Should we all **** a goat in celebration, or what is the protocol ?

The_Valeyard

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

If Mr. Boehmermann can't prove Mr. Erdogan has sexual intercourse with goats then he shouldn't have made the remarks.

What?????

It's a comedy. A joke is a joke and all comedians should worldwide focus on Mr. Erdogan as the butt of jokes. I for one look forward to the PC response by Frankie Boyle and Bill Maher

Samaris

Wait, calling someone a goat-shagger is now satire? That's..not so much satire as "random insult is kinda dumb".

testaccount123

Samaris wrote: »

Wait, calling someone a goat-shagger is now satire? That's..not so much satire as "random insult is kinda dumb".

You are fond of a bit of goat ****ing yourself are you?

Alf Stewart.

Samaris wrote: »

Wait, calling someone a goat-shagger is now satire? That's..not so much satire as "random insult is kinda dumb".

Depends if its a he or a she goat I suppose mate.

🐐 🐐 🐐

munster87

Why do turkeys even need a president

Samaris

testaccount123 wrote: »

You are fond of a bit of goat ****ing yourself are you?

Ah well, living out in the far wesht of the country, there's not a great deal to do...DON'T JUDGE ME!

jcdf

So can I take it that no German public figure like this Jan Boehmermann has ridiculed or insulted any foreign leader and not been prosecuted!

The Randy Riverbeast

While calling someone a goat ****er could be defamation I think a court should be able to tell the difference between a person making serious claims that a person has sex with goats and using it as an insult.

mikeym wrote: »

Whatever happened to free speech?

Germany has never really had it, its illegal to deny the holocaust happened, or at least something along those lines.

Samaris

I'm not actually commenting on whether or not Turkey should get all up in arms about this idiot, more just that calling "goat-shagger" satire demeans the whole concept of satire.

Also, let's get it straight here. Teh Internetz concept of "free speech" is generally bollocks. What do you mean by "free speech"? Can you quote the IRISH concept of free speech (or, indeed, Germany or Turkey's?). If it's pseudo-American bull****, it's got no place in the debate over here.

Not least since even the AMERICANS don't understand the American concept of free speech.

Irish "free speech" - explicitly does not cover "blasphemous, seditious, or indecent matter" (until new law had to be passed in 2008 covering blasphemy), and may not even cover normal communication but rather written opinions (closer to freedom of the press). Also it cannot be used to undermine "public order or morality or the authority of the State".

Germany - Is quite restrictive on the concept - insult is actually punishable, satire is not unless it is contrary to human dignity. How does "goat-shagger" work in there? Also covers other things like holocaust denial and, interestingly, public assemblies.

Turkey - outlaws snarking about the Turkish state, but otherwise doesn't have a great deal to say about it, at least nothing helpful to this specific case. Also, I'm kinda losing interest in this branch of research, so feel free to hunt more rather than take my word for it!

My overall point is that a) direct and entirely unprovable insult isn't really satire and this case -so far as I've seen- doesn't really deserve the label of "attack on satire and free speech" and b) I (yes, ironically indeed) would quite like to see the words "free speech" eliminated from teh interwebs unless the speaker can prove they have half an idea of what the term actually means. (This is why it's a good thing that I'm not in charge of aforesaid interwebs, of course.)

Iwasfrozen

The_Valeyard wrote: »

What?????

It's a comedy. A joke is a joke and all comedians should worldwide focus on Mr. Erdogan as the butt of jokes. I for one look forward to the PC response by Frankie Boyle and Bill Maher

It's not satire though, it's defamation.

Free speech needs to be balanced against anti defamation laws. If I accused you of beastiality you could rightly sue me.

Erdogan might be a primier but the law should be blind to a persons position in these matters.

Samaris

And comedians used to have to have more of a repertoire than what amounts to "you are a big poopy-head".

Cienciano

Samaris wrote: »

Wait, calling someone a goat-shagger is now satire? That's..not so much satire as "random insult is kinda dumb".

It depends on the context.

Samaris

Cienciano wrote: »

It depends on the context.

Can you give me an example of context involving the president of Turkey and goat-shagger where it's satire?

Kristopherus

Samaris wrote: »

Can you give me an example of context involving the president of Turkey and goat-shagger where it's satire?

But sure said president is the biggest bollox east of Berlin. He rules with an iron fist and is trying to engineer laws that allow him to remain as president ad infinitum:mad::mad::mad: