Sharapova

colossus-x

I always found it amazing that some people look up to sports stars.

It's true that your common man looks at extremely fit sports people and think to themselves 'there's no way in a million years I could be that fit'. ...so I won't bother.

Why do people think that they can be either 'a fantastic fit sports person' or a complete slob.

Why do people think they have to be on 40% protein , lifting weights, to be fit. Of course lifting weights does f*ck all for you health. Cardio does.

I'm really bored about the way you have pseudo sports people participating in local sports events acting like they are doing the world a favour by being active and getting their pic in the local paper.

Couldn't care less to see someone buying a €5000 quid bike and spinning round to show off to the locals how fit you are, as if by doing so , your doing the locals a favour. Fitness show offs.

The whole drug taking in sport is a joke. But not only that the showing off of people in the gym or on the bike is a joke as well, whether drugs are taken or not.

It's no wonder your common man doesn't want to get fit when the fitness industry is so corrupt.

Brois

I should have stopped reading when you said: "Of course lifting weights does f*ck all for you health. Cardio does."

I'm not even sure what you are on about if I'm being honest, but the above shows you might need to do a little reading into the benefits of weightlifting before you blast it as just some form of purely aesthetic pursuit! I'm not even going to start listing the benefits as I could be here all day.

I find this kind of ill informed attitude to health and fitness as a fairly narrow minded viewpoint to be honest. 'Cardio' as you term it, is all well and good and has its place, but when we do cardio beyond a certain point its benefits can become negligible and counter productive in some instances, unless for the elite athlete in say a long distance event. Whereas "cardio" and "lifting weights" together can do wonderful things for your overall health.

I think the fact you said: "Why do people think that they can be either 'a fantastic fit sports person' or a complete slob." shows that you don't believe a middle ground can exist? Not all people train to become elite sports persons, some do it for the love of being fit and active, that endorphin rush it gives them, and the way it allows them to enjoy a well rounded lifestyle.

I opened the thread expecting there to be something about the current news around the tennis star, it seems you just wanted to vent against something else thats on your mind!?


Then you take a swipe at the "fitness industry", while yes, the industry has its flaws, it also contains some fantastic and enthusiastic people who love what they do and want to improve the lifestyles of their clients. Again, not really sure what that has to do with professional tennis? The two things aren't one in the same.
Every industry has bottom feeders and people in it for a quick buck, while it is disgusting this is just a fact of life. I believe people are smart enough to figure out who the con-men are in the fitness industry and avoid them, and if they don't at first, it becomes very clear, very quickly anyway.

Seems to me like you're a bit peeved about some neighbor of yours who has a nice shiny new bike and is out on it getting fit more so than Maria Sharapova taking some obscure drug!?

Who is your common man?...Of course everyone wants to improve their health, and 'getting fit' is a key component in this, most common men and women I know want to get fit. (As I said above, fitness is all relative, not everyone will/want to run a marathon or become a pro)

Back onto what the topic should have been I presume:

The news story around Sharapova has only just broke. Quite disappointing really if it turns out there was no medical reason for her taking Meldonium for ten years before it was put on the BSL in Jan.

colossus-x

I don't quite understand why you took such offence to my post.

Most people aren't fit. They look at it like it were some unattainable thing to do. When you see sports starts exposed it makes it look like an even more unattainable thing to do. As you rightly say, there is a middle ground. But who knows that unless your fit already.

My post was certainly a dig at sports stars and the fitness elite. Whether drug fuelled or not.

Cardio' as you term it, is all well and good and has its place, but when we do cardio beyond a certain point its benefits can become negligible and counter productive in some instances, unless for the elite athlete in say a long distance event.

I totally disagree with that. Cardio is of the utmost importance in comparison to you squat stats . I should have stopped reading there.
I didn't say there were no benefits to weightlifting but those benefits are utterly trivial in comparison to doing your cardio.

Yet again we have an athlete exposed for doing drugs. I don't see what else there is to discuss around it other than she was a cheat and even worse showed that she couldn't do what she did physically but for her drug taking.

Second Toughest in_the Freshers

She's still pretty fit though

Mellor

colossus-x wrote: »

It's true that your common man looks at extremely fit sports people and think to themselves 'there's no way in a million years I could be that fit'. ...so I won't bother.

Why do people think that they can be either 'a fantastic fit sports person' or a complete slob.

A lot of people are inherently lazy, even if all sports were just as clean, the same people would be just as lazy.

I imagine very people, in any people, think those two extremes are their only options.

The whole drug taking in sport is a joke. But not only that the showing off of people in the gym or on the bike is a joke as well, whether drugs are taken or not.

What showing off do you mean?

It's no wonder your common man doesn't want to get fit when the fitness industry is so corrupt.

I highly doubt the corrupt fitness injury has any significant impact on the common man. The guy sitting on the couching eating rubbish is there by his own choosing.

colossus-x wrote: »

Most people aren't fit. They look at it like it were some unattainable thing to do. When you see sports starts exposed it makes it look like an even more unattainable thing to do. As you rightly say, there is a middle ground. But who knows that unless your fit already.

A lot of overweight people view being a normal size as unattainable for them. Should normal everyday people be blamed for this?
If that my fault, and your fault?

I didn't say there were no benefits to weightlifting but those benefits are utterly trivial in comparison to doing your cardio.

What you said was weights does f*ck all for your health. It's fairly reasonable to read that as "no benefit". Which is obviously wrong.

Why does it have to be one or the other. Cardio only is a fairly poor approach in my eyes. I work with a few cardio junkies, and tbh the junkie moniker is apt. You'd be forgiven for thinking some were the other variety.

Yet again we have an athlete exposed for doing drugs. I don't see what else there is to discuss around it other than she was a cheat and even worse showed that she couldn't do what she did physically but for her drug taking.

I can't comment on the specifics on the Sharapova doping. As I don't know enough about the drug and what it is supposed to do, other than it was recently banned.
However, not denying the fact that she was technically doping, she was free to take it previous years. Had it not been banned, then she was free to keep taking it. I just don't see how whether or not a drug she had been taken gets added to the banned list impacts anyone other than other high level athletes.


The hardest part of your post to follow if your gripe with fit people who aren't taking drugs. On what planet is their fitness to blame for anyone elses issues?

SeantheMan

Mellor wrote: »

I can't comment on the specifics on the Sharapova doping. As I don't know enough about the drug and what it is supposed to do, other than it was recently banned.
However, not denying the fact that she was technically doping, she was free to take it previous years. Had it not been banned, then she was free to keep taking it. I just don't see how whether or not a drug she had been taken gets added to the banned list impacts anyone other than other high level athletes.

Exactly, she was free to take it along with EVERY other tennis player and athlete. And it's not like she denied taking it or anything, because she probably did have a medical condition and a legitimate reason to take it.

It doesn't detract from the fact that she is amazingly fit and an amazing tennis player.

Why is the thread title called 'Sharapova', you barely reference her in your rant/moan.

You sound like you had an argument with someone and lost, or couldn't get your non-point across to them, so came here to whine about it instead...where people are as equally confused about your non-points.

Hanley

WTF is going on here? It's professional sport.

Steroid use in sport is very similar to inside trading on wall street.

Both suck. But when there's THAT much money on the line and the top performers are so rewarded, people will do anything to get ahead.

Brois

Sorry everyone for taking the bait here! I really couldn't help myself trying to figure out what the initial post was about. Glad I'm not the only one who was confused.

Colossus, I didn't take offence, just was very confused by the post, and then read the "Lifting weights does F all for your health" bit and had to call you out on that patently wrong piece of info.


Agree Mellor, hard to comment on the specifics of the case at this stage but strange how her press conference today she said she "wasn't aware it had been placed on the list" I find that so hard to believe that the substance was not on the list Dec 31st and then BAM it's on the list. Surely there is a lead in time to these things? You'd imagine with all the medical staff she'd have they would have known? Anyways, early days and can only speculate and assume! Nike were very quick to the pull the plug anyway!

Like the Wall Street analogy Hanley, unfortunately there are bad eggs in all walks of life.

Alf Veedersane

Very disappointing thread.

Hadn't really anything to do with Sharapova. Not even so much as a token gif.

Transform

TIL - nothing

Mr. CooL ICE

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Hadn't really anything to do with Sharapova. Not even so much as a token gif.

Alright alright alright

JC01

Not much of a discussion on the tennis player, anybody else think she might be halfways innocent-ish? If her story's true it is a bit harsh, supposedly the stuff was for a magnesium deficiency, and is only now banned as it can be used for masking other actual PEDs.

Since the threads a tad messy anyways, what's the general consensus on steroids/PEDs in here? More so as OP is ranting about I.e use by the typical gym goer rather than the star who has millions riding on using/not using?

* I have read the charter, not looking for/giving advice etc etc just curious as to opinions on them as I see them becoming more common in the gym I'm in.

Alf Veedersane

JC01 wrote: »

Not much of a discussion on the tennis player, anybody else think she might be halfways innocent-ish? If her story's true it is a bit harsh, supposedly the stuff was for a magnesium deficiency, and is only now banned as it can be used for masking other actual PEDs.

The story that it was taken for a magnesium deficiency is far-fetched considering meldonium isn't approved by the FDA.

Its benefits for sport and the lack of credibility of her excuse make me doubt her alleged naivete.

jive

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

The story that it was taken for a magnesium deficiency is far-fetched considering meldonium isn't approved by the FDA.

Its benefits for sport and the lack of credibility of her excuse make me doubt her alleged naivete.

Yeah anyone who believes this was for medicinal purposes needs to have a long hard chat with Santa about reality. The number of elite athlethes who have suffered bilharzia, asthma, angina, etc. must be astronomically higher than the general population.

Also people excusing her usage of it because it wasn't on the banned substance list is nonsense as well, in my opinion. Living in the US and using a drug which isn't FDA approved... c'mon, if she living in a country where it had been approved by the regulator then you could argue grey area but not in this case.

Transform

another big one is increase in narcolepsy and the use of provigil

cc87

colossus-x wrote: »

I totally disagree with that. Cardio is of the utmost importance in comparison to you squat stats . I should have stopped reading there.

You know if you stick a heart rate monitor on someone for a cardio session and for a decent resistance based training session, there isn't much difference between the heart rate data from either?

What additional benefits does a "cardio" session have?

Mellor

JC01 wrote: »

supposedly the stuff was for a magnesium deficiency, and is only now banned as it can be used for masking other actual PEDs.

That's not what it's for and it's not why it's banned either.

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

The story that it was taken for a magnesium deficiency is far-fetched considering meldonium isn't approved by the FDA.

The media is hamming up the magnesium deficiency part (I'd have thought the best thing to take was magnesium :P) but it was also allegedly for a EKG results and a history of diabetes. Both of those conditions it does treat.

As for not having FDA approval. They haven't applied for it. IT's a costly process and the US pharma reps are unlikely to get on board with a drug produced in Lativa.

To be clear, I'm not saying I believe her, I'm saying that the Magnesium/FDA line of attack is also misleading.

Darkest Horse

Firstly I think the OP is trolling but in the unlikely case that he or she is not, I think the majority of the post can be forgiven for being an unconventional, poorly articulated and incoherent opinion. The part that grabs my attention is the comment about strength training being ineffective and/or inferior to doing "your cardio". Obviously we all know that to be factually incorrect so as somebody said earlier, there's no point in even beginning to list the scientifically proven effects for the benefit of a single ignoramus. OP, you do not understand that resistance training and cardio are just part of an exercise spectrum that, for the most part, cannot be defined. "Weights" can be "cardio" and "cardio" can be "weights" yet both can be utterly different from each other also. What if I ran a half marathon with a 20kg plate in a back pack? (Don't). On that basis, the irrefutable benefits also exist on a spectrum. Where you sit on that spectrum is roughly related to the parameters of the training that you are doing. If you aren't a troll, you seriously need to do yourself a favour (quite literally) and expand your knowledge.

Alf Veedersane

Mellor wrote: »

The media is hamming up the magnesium deficiency part (I'd have thought the best thing to take was magnesium :P) but it was also allegedly for a EKG results and a history of diabetes. Both of those conditions it does treat.

As for not having FDA approval. They haven't applied for it. IT's a costly process and the US pharma reps are unlikely to get on board with a drug produced in Lativa.

To be clear, I'm not saying I believe her, I'm saying that the Magnesium/FDA line of attack is also misleading.

I hadn't heard of the magnesium deficiency claim - it was just a response to a previous post - and while it's not beyond the realm of possibility that she may have used it, in theory, it seems unlikely that she'd be addressing those conditions and playing at the highest level at the same time.

The story isn't altogether credible. That's the bottom line.

Transform

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I hadn't heard of the magnesium deficiency claim - it was just a response to a previous post - and while it's not beyond the realm of possibility that she may have used it, in theory, it seems unlikely that she'd be addressing those conditions and playing at the highest level at the same time.

The story isn't altogether credible. That's the bottom line.

company that makes the drug have come out to say typically people use it for 4-8 weeks NOT 10 years

to be honest ive always been stunned that there have not been more drug busts in tennis as its crushingly hard on the body, semi final 5hr match, dude youve to get up and play the final tomorrow for at least 3hrs+ - good luck!!!

Alf Veedersane

Transform wrote: »

company that makes the drug have come out to say typically people use it for 4-8 weeks NOT 10 years

to be honest ive always been stunned that there have not been more drug busts in tennis as its crushingly hard on the body, semi final 5hr match, dude youve to get up and play the final tomorrow for at least 3hrs+ - good luck!!!

I saw that alright but I don't think she actually said that she had been using it consistently for 10 years so I gave the benefit of the doubt on the basis that she meant she had used it on and off since she first used it in '06.

But given the number of athletes that have tested positive for it since it went on the WADA list, you'd have to wonder about the levels of angina/diabetes/etc in top level sport...

And yer man, Fuentes, the doctor at the centre of Operacion Puerto suggested he'd been 'worked' with footballers and tennis players.

Transform

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I saw that alright but I don't think she actually said that she had been using it consistently for 10 years so I gave the benefit of the doubt on the basis that she meant she had used it on and off since she first used it in '06.

But given the number of athletes that have tested positive for it since it went on the WADA list, you'd have to wonder about the levels of angina/diabetes/etc in top level sport...

And yer man, Fuentes, the doctor at the centre of Operacion Puerto suggested he'd been 'worked' with footballers and tennis players.

tennis must have a ton of drug use but guessing those at the top wont expose those caught as bad for business.

Alf Veedersane

Transform wrote: »

tennis must have a ton of drug use but guessing those at the top wont expose those caught as bad for business.

There have been some at the top of the game who came to mind when I heard about Fuentes claim about tennis.

Success is gluten free apparently...

hidinginthebush

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKjxFJfcrcA

MD1990

Djokovic's special diet & stretching helped him become one of the best athletes tennis has even seen .:p

Hanley

Transform wrote: »

tennis must have a ton of drug use but guessing those at the top wont expose those caught as bad for business.

You spelled cycling wrong.

....wait, I mean you spelled CrossFit wrong.

...no damn, I meant you spelled UFC wrong :D:D:D

Transform

Hanley wrote: »

You spelled cycling wrong.

....wait, I mean you spelled CrossFit wrong.

...no damn, I meant you spelled UFC wrong :D:D:D

least we will still have bowls and curling

Alf Veedersane

Transform wrote: »

least we will still have bowls and curling

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/dailybrew/hack-canadian-curler-banned-using-banned-substance-200831075.html

Sorry dude

Mellor

Hanley wrote: »

You spelled cycling wrong.

....wait, I mean you spelled CrossFit wrong.

...no damn, I meant you spelled UFC wrong :D:D:D

I agree with the point you are making.
But also, the UFC voluntary went to USADA last year to deal with PEDs in the sport and it's drastically increased the number of tests, and busts. I'd assume this is an expense for them.

I can't see Crossfit doing something similar anytime soon. Still too much of a self contained entity. I've never heard of their own testing turning up anything (may have though) but random guys who placed no-where at the games have been popped when they turned up to weightlifting events.