Controlling home heating from my phone !

sunny2004

OK, I know home automation has been mentioned, I went and searched before posting, the results showed quite an extensive range of comments and options but that was 6 months ago as far as I can see and this tech changes fast..

WHAT I WANT TO ACHIEVE...
Simple, control the on and off and timer of my oil central heating system, the reality, I want to switch it on from my phone on my way home...

I am asking 2 questions,
First, what are the options ?
Secondly, any ideas on installation, is there any companies installing this tech ?

Thanks..

tonc76

sunny2004 wrote: »

OK, I know home automation has been mentioned, I went and searched before posting, the results showed quite an extensive range of comments and options but that was 6 months ago as far as I can see and this tech changes fast..

WHAT I WANT TO ACHIEVE...
Simple, control the on and off and timer of my oil central heating system, the reality, I want to switch it on from my phone on my way home...

I am asking 2 questions,
First, what are the options ?
Secondly, any ideas on installation, is there any companies installing this tech ?

Thanks..

Climote available from electric Ireland for free if you switch to them on 2 year contract. Tado also has the remote functionality. Honeywell system can also do this but is €€€

Nest also available

https://www.electricireland.ie/residential/products/smarter-living

fred funk }{

What alarm system do you have at home?

sunny2004

fred funk }{ wrote: »

What alarm system do you have at home?

Why? are you intending on breaking in ? haha

I have a self monitored system, one that phones me...

fred funk }{

sunny2004 wrote: »

Why? are you intending on breaking in ? haha

I have a self monitored system, one that phones me...

Some systems can be controlled via an app. Your heating can be connected to your alarm system thus being able to switch heating via alarm app.

sunny2004

tonc76 wrote: »

Climote available from electric Ireland for free if you switch to them on 2 year contract. Tado also has the remote functionality. Honeywell system can also do this but is €€€

Nest also available

https://www.electricireland.ie/residential/products/smarter-living

I like the idea of nest, I don't really know how expensive the switch will be, and Im not happy with paying by direct debit, old school I suppose, I prefer if there is ever an issue with my bill, that the money isn't paid


So I guess Im looking to get whatever system will control the heating installed as a once off payment if possible....

sunny2004

fred funk }{ wrote: »

Some systems can be controlled via an app. Your heating can be connected to your alarm system thus being able to switch heating via alarm app.

Didn't know you could get app enabled alarms, but I guess it makes sense..

Wearb

I use a Wemo Insight and it does just what you requested. Wemo Switch will do almost the same and is cheaper.

Robbie.G

sunny2004 wrote: »

I like the idea of nest, I don't really know how expensive the switch will be, and Im not happy with paying by direct debit, old school I suppose, I prefer if there is ever an issue with my bill, that the money isn't paid


So I guess Im looking to get whatever system will control the heating installed as a once off payment if possible....

You can go with Climote directly contact them and they can arrange installation
Or as mentioned either electric Ireland and airtricity are offering them free of charge if you sign up

Bog Man 1

Get a Wi fi smart plug . My brother bought a few of them in Harveys Normans and uses them for turning on lights and heating .

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Remote-Control-Socket-Automation-Android-White/dp/B00N2YE02K

17larsson

Nest is probably the most expensive but by far the coolest. It learns your habits so it controls the heating for you. There is a list of local installers on their website

Low Energy Eng

Bog Man 1 wrote: »

Get a Wi fi smart plug . My brother bought a few of them in Harveys Normans and uses them for turning on lights and heating .

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Remote-Control-Socket-Automation-Android-White/dp/B00N2YE02K

How do you get it to control the boiler? Eg, does your bro kill the power to the boiler?

ninja 12

sunny2004 wrote: »

OK, I know home automation has been mentioned, I went and searched before posting, the results showed quite an extensive range of comments and options but that was 6 months ago as far as I can see and this tech changes fast..

WHAT I WANT TO ACHIEVE...
Simple, control the on and off and timer of my oil central heating system, the reality, I want to switch it on from my phone on my way home...

I am asking 2 questions,
First, what are the options ?
Secondly, any ideas on installation, is there any companies installing this tech ?

Thanks..

I'm replacing an APT time clock with a Heatmiser Smartstat next week .

https://www.heatmiser.com/smart-thermostat/

It's a thermostat / timer but also connects to Wi-Fi , and can be controlled by an app on a phone .

It's a standalone unit , no fees , subscriptions etc .



I'm just waiting on Amazon to ship it to me ( hopefully tomorrow)

HeidiHeidi

I had a Nest installed recently, by Electric Ireland. I was already with them so paid €99 for it but if you switch to them it's free - but you have to sign up for a two year contract at full price with no discounts. So it's not cheap.

It took a bit of head-wrecking getting-used-to to go from a clock timer to thermostatic control, and I'm still getting the hang of it. And its main selling point - that it learns your habits - is wasted on me as I don't have any habits, i do shift work and have a completely random lifestyle!

But I can switch the heating on an hour before I head home from work (which most days could be any time, I have no way of knowing when I'll finish a lot of the tiem) and this is what I was after. It's an absolute gift!

The Climote was also an option, but there's an ongoing SIM payment with that which put me off it. That seems to be more of a conventional switch-on/switch-off operation. The Nest works off your home wi-fi.

I'm sure there are many more options out there for those who are up on these things, but I have to say that so far (apart from initial software teething problems which the Nest support people were great to deal with about) I'm delighted with it.

sunny2004

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

I had a Nest installed recently, by Electric Ireland. I was already with them so paid €99 for it but if you switch to them it's free - but you have to sign up for a two year contract at full price with no discounts. So it's not cheap.

It took a bit of head-wrecking getting-used-to to go from a clock timer to thermostatic control, and I'm still getting the hang of it. And its main selling point - that it learns your habits - is wasted on me as I don't have any habits, i do shift work and have a completely random lifestyle!

But I can switch the heating on an hour before I head home from work (which most days could be any time, I have no way of knowing when I'll finish a lot of the tiem) and this is what I was after. It's an absolute gift!

The Climote was also an option, but there's an ongoing SIM payment with that which put me off it. That seems to be more of a conventional switch-on/switch-off operation. The Nest works off your home wi-fi.

I'm sure there are many more options out there for those who are up on these things, but I have to say that so far (apart from initial software teething problems which the Nest support people were great to deal with about) I'm delighted with it.

I would be interested to know exactly how much it actually costs over the 2 years.. thanks for the info

HeidiHeidi

sunny2004 wrote: »

I would be interested to know exactly how much it actually costs over the 2 years.. thanks for the info

It's €99 for the install, and then whatever EI charge without discounts for their electricity. If you leave before the two years are up you basically have to pay the full price of the device which is about €300/350 (can't remember exactly).

sunny2004

Time for a dumb question,

Exactly how can any of these options switch on the hot water, but not the heating ? say during the summer.. USING AN APP .....

Stoner

I'm using lightwave happy with it.

One of the lads here has set it up to deal with just hit water etc using electronic valves

tonc76

sunny2004 wrote: »

Time for a dumb question,

Exactly how can any of these options switch on the hot water, but not the heating ? say during the summer.. USING AN APP .....

Zoned heating system with a hot water only option. The boiler will fire but only to heat the water. The Climote which I'm considering installing can be controlled by an app, website or text message. http://www.climote.ie/products/at-home/

sunny2004

tonc76 wrote: »

Zoned heating system with a hot water only option. The boiler will fire but only to heat the water. The Climote which I'm considering installing can be controlled by an app, website or text message. http://www.climote.ie/products/at-home/

that system requires a subscription each year ?

Bruthal

Stoner wrote: »

I'm using lightwave happy with it.

One of the lads here has set it up to deal with just hit water etc using electronic valves

Yea I have that done as well, A motorised valve for cylinder, and one for rads. Control each with a lightwaverf relay, and the motorised valve contacts bring on the gas boiler.

Never had a bother with it. Some lights and sockets on it as well.

2011

sunny2004 wrote: »

that system requires a subscription each year ?

Yes it does.

It is worth noting that modern intruder alarms can be used to switch on/off multiple devices (via dry contacts) at no additional subscription cost. It is also possible to see the on/off status of various devices.

sunny2004

2011 wrote: »

Yes it does.

It is worth noting that modern intruder alarms can be used to switch on/off multiple devices (via dry contacts) at no additional subscription cost. It is also possible to see the on/off status of various devices.

Im only interested in a system that I pay for once, and that uses an app..
that still leaves me with the issue of installation.

2011

sunny2004 wrote: »

Im only interested in a system that I pay for once, and that uses an app..

An intruder alarm only has to be paid for once.
If the alarm is self monitored (rings the owner directly when activated) there is no recurring charge. Some of these alarm systems can be used to control heating via an app on a phone also free of charge.

that still leaves me with the issue of installation.

This applies to whatever system you choose.

2011

Nest sell a high quality standalone device that you only "have to pay for once" which can be used to control your heating from an app.

See link:

https://store.nest.com/ie/product/thermostat/?gclid=CjwKEAiAmNW2BRDL4KqS3vmqgUESJABiiwDTw_T1cOHzNsrkP0BiGaWC9HW3MROocaU4xMKB8TOWLhoCmubw_wcB

Stoner

The lightwave system bruthal and I use is once off, free app.

The timer is about 80 Euro as is the wireless stat . Then it's 80 for the head unit very easy to set up. Their other bits are very cheap

M5

The electric Ireland deal is far from free folks. You lose any other discounts and merely pay for it over 2 years. (if you compare with the cheapest plans)

I do use a nest thought and I am pretty happy with it. Very user friendly and easy to set up.

The wifi plug option also needs care as it may not be rated to the wattage of the boiler. Lightwaverf do a 3kw relay but it needs a Base station to function. The thermostat and boiler switch option with it is very expensive when compared to nest. It does have further expansion options though, unlike nest

Wearb

M5 wrote: »

The electric Ireland deal is far from free folks. You lose any other discounts and merely pay for it over 2 years. (if you compare with the cheapest plans)

I do use a nest thought and I am pretty happy with it. Very user friendly and easy to set up.

The wifi plug option also needs care as it may not be rated to the wattage of the boiler. Lightwaverf do a 3kw relay but it needs a Base station to function. The thermostat and boiler switch option with it is very expensive when compared to nest. It does have further expansion options though, unlike nest

The Wemo is rated at 13 amps. The heating system would require about a 1/10th of that.

M5

Wearb wrote: »

The Wemo is rated at 13 amps. The heating system would require about a 1/10th of that.

I want referring specifically to the wemo. There are hundreds of different wifi switchable sockets, some are well under 13 amps. Best to check before investing

Bruthal

M5 wrote: »

I want referring specifically to the wemo. There are hundreds of different wifi switchable sockets, some are well under 13 amps. Best to check before investing

It would want to be a seriously weak device to not be able to switch a gas or oil boiler.

2011

Bruthal wrote: »

It would want to be a seriously weak device to not be able to switch a gas or oil boiler.

Correct, besides if switching a larger load than the device is rated for is a requirement then installing a relay / contactor provides a simple solution.

M5

Bruthal wrote: »

It would want to be a seriously weak device to not be able to switch a gas or oil boiler.

Lightwaverf have a 250w relay... Can't understand why you have an issue with advising someone to make sure?

Some are designed for lighting also

veetwin

I've had a Climote installed for the last year or two and very happy with it. I'm not aware of any subscription or annual fee. It was certainly worth paying EI a little more over the last 18 months for the convenience alone. I don't know if there is any huge saving but it is very handy.

Bruthal

M5 wrote: »

Lightwaverf have a 250w relay... Can't understand why you have an issue with advising someone to make sure?

No issue at all, It just wouldnt have thought there would be too many remotely controlled relays that wouldnt have the capacity to directly switch a central heating boiler.

I would be interested in a link to that 250 watt relay all the same. I know they make a 500 watt one alright. Are you confusing it with the 250 watt inline dimmer?

M5

Bruthal wrote: »

No issue at all, It just wouldnt have thought there would be too many remotely controlled relays that wouldnt have the capacity to directly switch a central heating boiler.

I would be interested in a link to that 250 watt relay all the same. I know they make a 500 watt one alright. Are you confusing it with the 250 watt inline dimmer?

Sorry that's correct the relay is 500w. I was thinking about the plug in modules. They can be designed for lighting, as can relays like the one you mentioned. All I am saying is best to check the rating before shelling out or installing.

sunny2004

ok I am leaning towards the NEST system, now I have another question,
How do I control the HOT WATER only.... does this require additional hardware, and if so what would I need ?
Say during the summer I wanted to use the APP to switch on the hot water, what would I need to have installed ?

Thanks

M5

sunny2004 wrote: »

ok I am leaning towards the NEST system, now I have another question,
How do I control the HOT WATER only.... does this require additional hardware, and if so what would I need ?
Say during the summer I wanted to use the APP to switch on the hot water, what would I need to have installed ?

Thanks

Simple solution is to turn off all your rads and use nest as a switch

sunny2004

M5 wrote: »

Simple solution is to turn off all your rads and use nest as a switch

ahhh, its great when you get advice that you don't want to do but it sparks something.. there are too many rads, or I am too lazy.... BUT I do have manual electrical valves in the hot press for cutting off, either upstairs or downstairs rads during the winter... so for the summer I can just HIT both to off.. leaving only the option for water heating...

M5

sunny2004 wrote: »

ahhh, its great when you get advice that you don't want to do but it sparks something.. there are too many rads, or I am too lazy.... BUT I do have manual electrical valves in the hot press for cutting off, either upstairs or downstairs rads during the winter... so for the summer I can just HIT both to off.. leaving only the option for water heating...

You can actually get motorised valves along with the manual ones. Have 2 nests, one for each zone. That's a setup I am in the middle of here!

sunny2004

M5 wrote: »

You can actually get motorised valves along with the manual ones. Have 2 nests, one for each zone. That's a setup I am in the middle of here!

The two nests sounds interesting, I mislead you, I don't have manual valves, they are electrical connected to two standard light switches, each switch cuts off either upstairs or downstairs

M5

sunny2004 wrote: »

The two nests sounds interesting, I mislead you, I don't have manual valves, they are electrical connected to two standard light switches, each switch cuts off either upstairs or downstairs

stick nests on there and you have control of each!

You'd either have to leave the boiler on constantly on the hot water loop or add a control line from the valves down. I'm currently investigating the way to do that myself!

adding the nest to your current set-up would be a doddle if you are anywhere near handy! Get it checked though if you do it yourself as its all mains work!

sunny2004

Update, after speaking with NEXT direct and getting a list of possible installers I am getting quoted 150 euros upwards for installation.. In the UK the installation is £50... drop of rip off Ireland going on..

M5

sunny2004 wrote: »

Update, after speaking with NEXT direct and getting a list of possible installers I am getting quoted 150 euros upwards for installation.. In the UK the installation is £50... drop of rip off Ireland going on..

Yeah, its nuts, get any heating contractor to quote you. They dont have to be a specialist. The nest is only a relay anyway. There are two connections. Live and neutral to power it and live in and switched live out. Thats it!

Again, im not an electrician or a heating contractor so the above would need to be verified by a qualified person

kyomi

I've been trying to research the options for a smart heating controller. I've already used a Climote in a holiday home and found it great, but I can't get any clarity on whether there's an ongoing charge. The one I used was SMS-controlled so I understand it would need a SIM card, but surely if you're going to control it through the smartphone app this wouldn't be required?

HeidiHeidi

kyomi wrote: »

I've been trying to research the options for a smart heating controller. I've already used a Climote in a holiday home and found it great, but I can't get any clarity on whether there's an ongoing charge. The one I used was SMS-controlled so I understand it would need a SIM card, but surely if you're going to control it through the smartphone app this wouldn't be required?

When I was recently talking to EI about this, the advice was that the Climote was controlled via a SIM for which there is a monthly ongoing charge (I can't remember what it was), the Nest is controlled via your home wifi so there is a one-off payment for installation and no ongoing charges.

Dufftronic

M5 wrote: »

Yeah, its nuts, get any heating contractor to quote you. They dont have to be a specialist. The nest is only a relay anyway. There are two connections. Live and neutral to power it and live in and switched live out. Thats it!

Again, im not an electrician or a heating contractor so the above would need to be verified by a qualified person

i have a nest a couple of years now. To echo what others have said, i'm not sure of any savings but the handiness is hard to beat.

wiring it is a piece of piss and is how you have described. don't pay €150 for it. Also, the new nest (V3) does hot water as well.

kyomi

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

When I was recently talking to EI about this, the advice was that the Climote was controlled via a SIM for which there is a monthly ongoing charge (I can't remember what it was), the Nest is controlled via your home wifi so there is a one-off payment for installation and no ongoing charges.

That's useful to know. I did a bit of research about Nest this afternoon and it seems you have to buy a separate Nest for each zone (I have two - upstairs rads, downstairs UFH/hot water). Whereas with the Climote you can have one unit covering two heating zones plus hot water. This seems to make the price of the Nest way out of my reach, unless I'm missing something.

HeidiHeidi

kyomi wrote: »

That's useful to know. I did a bit of research about Nest this afternoon and it seems you have to buy a separate Nest for each zone (I have two - upstairs rads, downstairs UFH/hot water). Whereas with the Climote you can have one unit covering two heating zones plus hot water. This seems to make the price of the Nest way out of my reach, unless I'm missing something.

Can't help you there I'm afraid.

I just have the one Nest unit, and am investigating how I can set things up so it will heat water only - my hot water tank is on the same loop as all the rads (or I'm assuming it is anyway) so I think the solution will be a plumber and alterations to my piping

Mine is a small house, and the sitting room/dining room is where I need to be the warmest so that's where I have the Nest. I have a stove that I light in the evenings so the heating knocks itself off very early in the evening. If the bedrooms are colder later I don't really care.

kyomi

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

I just have the one Nest unit, and am investigating how I can set things up so it will heat water only - my hot water tank is on the same loop as all the rads (or I'm assuming it is anyway) so I think the solution will be a plumber and alterations to my piping

Mine is a small house, and the sitting room/dining room is where I need to be the warmest so that's where I have the Nest. I have a stove that I light in the evenings so the heating knocks itself off very early in the evening. If the bedrooms are colder later I don't really care.

I have the same problem - the hot water is tied to the underfloor heating, so I can't heat water, even in the middle of summer, without turning on the UFH. Luckily we can turn off the UFH in individual rooms through the thermostat, but there's no way to stop the pump coming on. Can't imagine why it would have been set up that way.

My house is quite big and the upstairs rooms get very cold, so I think I would definitely need two zones - which seems to mean two Nests. It's a shame as it looks like a very useable system that could save energy.

M5

V2 nest going for 130 stg on Amazon

sunny2004

M5 wrote: »

V2 nest going for 130 stg on Amazon

This is the old one right ? as in we are at V3 now ?
anyone know what the difference is ?

* edit, did my own research, which I should have done in the first place
Ok it would seem the main difference is the New version V3 has a bigger screen area, 40% and is clearer, also it has some technology to allow you to read the screen from a distance.. It also allows independent control of hot water only, with the required wiring..

not sure if I missed anything else ?