GAA Congress

Mushy

This weekend sees the annual Congress, and with it a raft of Motions. What are peoples views on the motions and how would you like to see them go? (I'm not listing all motions, just selected ones on RTE site)

1) This opening motion seeks to retain the structure used for the All-Ireland Hurling Championship as passed by Congress in 2013. The current structure includes a Leinster 'round robin' qualifying group.

I'd agree, and can see it passing comfortably

2) The introduction of a 'B' Championship in football that would take place after the completion of the provincial championships. It would involve eight teams that would make up Division 4 of the following year's league.

A big one that I don't see passing. It's too segregated. Much prefer the Roscommon model at the bottom.

4) Proposes that the minor grade at inter-county level becomes Under-17.

Won't pass, don't see why it wants to be changed tbh.

5) Proposes the abolition of the U-21 grade at inter-county football level, to be replaced with an U-20 grade, with players eligible to be aged between 18 and 20.

Don't think it'll pass for reasons as above.

7) This proposes that the All-Ireland football final be played on the first Sunday in September (second Sunday if there are five Sundays in the month), with the hurling decider to be played two weeks earlier. If passed the date changes will come to effect in 2017, meaning that next year's finals finals will be played on 20 August for the hurling and 3 September for the football

Don't think it'll pass, but wouldn't mind if it did either. As much as I like the current way, its a bit too long for hurling.

8) Extra-time in all games except for provincial and All-Ireland finals.

Would like this to pass, and maybe even have provincials as extra time in the future.

11) This motion proposes that the All-Ireland Junior Football Championship be reconstituted on the following basis:
"The All-Ireland Junior Football Championship shall be organised on a knock-out/open draw basis and shall be confined to the second best teams of counties in Ireland that participated in the current year’s National Football League Division 4, to any county within Ireland graded Junior by the Central Council and to the winners of the All-Britain Junior Football Championship, who shall enter the All-Ireland Junior Football Championship at the quarter-final stage."

Bit of a mouthful, don't fully understand it, doubt it will pass (but could be way off)

41) This motion calls for the introduction of the mark in Gaelic football.

Can see it passing, would ideally not like it but would stop petty fouling after great fielding.

43) This motion proposes that all televised inter-county championship games be available on free-to-air TV.

Can see it passing, and is one of the bigger bones of contention over the weekend. I don't necessarily agree with it, but can see why people would be wary if, in future, only Sky had the games.

47) Proposes that the GAA can authorise the playing of non-GAA sports at all county grounds and not only Croke Park.

Can see it passing, but think it'll evolve into a better solution over the years too (as in, the county board will be given power under guidelines to approve)

50) Relates to age restrictions. Proposes that:
Players be 16 or over to play non-championship club games.
Players be 17 or over to play championship club games.
Players be 18 or over to play inter-county games.
It is proposed to become operative four weeks after the date of Annual Congress.

In that guise I can't see it passing. Don't fully agree either.

56) The Roscommon motion proposes that, after the provincial championships are finished (by the first weekend of July, the competition will divide into two separate competitions - a Tier 1 competition and a Tier 2 competition. In the first year of the new proposal, Tier 1 (Sam Maguire) will feature the eight provincial finalists and the eight highest ranked teams in that year's football league (not including provincial finalists where there is a crossover). From year two on, the winner of the previous year's Tier 2 competition will also be included in the Tier 1 competition, along with the seven highest ranked national league sides.
The format of the Tier 2 competition is proposed to feature the remaining 16 teams not eligible to compete or the Tier 1 competition.

I really agree with this. It's not perfect, but hopefully it'd be done in a manner where more teams get more games, and not just a second straight knockout. A much better format than just a B Championship for Division 4 teams.

Mehapoy

Congress is a bit of a law unto itself, who knows what way a roomfull of oaps will go! Certainly any radical change would be dead in the water, the hurling championship will be left as is, the central council football 'b' championship proposal hasn't a chance, I think the u17 and u20 proposals are sensible but couldn't see them passing...I think changing the time of the u21 to summer is a good idea and limiting it to non seniors, the football mark won't make it I'd say... Theres a Galway proposal to make a qualifying group in the minor hurling, consisting of teams beaten in Munster and Leinster, would be a good idea if they've consulted the other counties and fits in with the provincial competitions...

ProudDUB

Martin Brehenya article.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/martin-breheny-another-fine-football-mess-34480282.html

This is his 39th year attending Congress. 39 years. Wonder how many other attendees can say the same thing? The same old farts, set in their ways, resistant to any change...holding back progress. How big of a voice (if any) do the current players, the actual people at the coal face of the games, day in and day out, have at Congress?

Not having a go at the aul fella's, just for the sake of it. They are often the only ones able and willing to do all the thankless, behind the scenes work, that no one else will. But definitely think there should be more room at Congress, for fresh voices and new opinions.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Hopefully for the sake of the organisation as a whole the proposals surrounding free to air games fail.

The more competition for the broadcast rights the better as it gives the GAA a stronger bargaining position to get more more money out of RTE, now that will probably be gone you won't have the chance of the cost broadcast rights being pushed up which is what the threat of Sky could have provided.

It's actually embarrassing for the GAA that such a ridiculous rule is being considered and shows that large amount of the membership are still stuck in the dark ages.


People like to forget that RTE is a pay TV station as well, you have to pay a TV licence for the privilege of watching it.

We pay to attend games live so why do people think they should be solely available on a non subscription basis on TV? It's GAA hypocrisy at it's finest.

It's almost inevitable what will happen as with 2 off the biggest counties proposing to scrap the deal with subscription channels I can't see the proposal not passing and it will be very bad for the GAA if no more games allowed except on an exclusive basis on Sky or any other subscription TV channel like Setanta.

Frankly the membership as a whole shouldn't have any control over how broadcasting rights as they will pander to the demans of this fictional auld lad in Connemara who watched games at home all his life but can't afford to anymore and would have to suffer through the ordeal of missing a qualifier match on a Saturday.

Dirty Dingus McGee

ProudDUB wrote: »

Martin Brehenya article.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/martin-breheny-another-fine-football-mess-34480282.html

This is his 39th year attending Congress. 39 years. Wonder how many other attendees can say the same thing? The same old farts, set in their ways, resistant to any change...holding back progress. How big of a voice (if any) do the current players, the actual people at the coal face of the games, day in and day out, have at Congress?

Not having a go at the aul fella's, just for the sake of it. They are often the only ones able and willing to do all the thankless, behind the scenes work, that no one else will. But definitely think there should be more room at Congress, for fresh voices and new opinions.

Thats pretty much the problem right there.Nobody with any sort of interest in change and improving the GAA would want to be involved in congress or administration in the GAA in general as they would be drove demented but the lack of direct action that is allowed and so nobody who could possibly make positive change will ever get in a position where they can have a serious influence on things (unless they have unbelievable patience).

ProudDUB

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Thats pretty much the problem right there.Nobody with any sort of interest in change and improving the GAA would want to be involved in congress or administration in the GAA in general as they would be drove demented but the lack of direct action that is allowed and so nobody who could possibly make positive change will ever get in a position where they can have a serious influence on things (unless they have unbelievable patience).

It's a chicken and the egg situation imo. The way things are set up now, current players (both inter county and club) have very little voice at the top table. So their motivation to get involved in the day to day nitty gritty is nil. I know that the GPA have a voice, but they are a controversial enough body and I am not a fan of how they run their organization. They are far too busy with projects that are not play related - scholarship, mental health initiatives, counseling for gambling problems, junkets to the States) etc etc. They are all worthy causes, but they should be focused on in addition to the day to day issues that players face on the pitch. They shouldn't be the be all and end all of their existence, which seems to be the case now.

zetecescort

Motion to change minor to U17 from 2018 passed

zetecescort

Motion 1 and 3(all senior games to be 70min)passed, Motions 56 and 57(championship structures) defeated. Motion 2(B championship) withdrawn

Mushy

U21 football gone, replaced with U20

zetecescort

really kills off the dual player by moving the u20 to the summer

Any news on motion 8 (replays in the championship)?

Mehapoy

Wow, amazed the changes to minor to u17 and u21 to u20 have been passed... The u20 change is football only but is the change to u17 football only too?

joebloggs32

Moving minor to u17 will end the log jam that clogs up fixtures. For too long underage and adult fixtures were being compromised by a few talented minors in each club.
It will also reduce burnout as no minor will be pulled and dragged by the competing demands of playing with both their minor and adult club. This was particularly messy where you had amalgamation teams.
Finally and probably most important of all, it will mean lads doing their leaving will mostly be overage now for the co minor team, and so should be able to concentrate on their studies.
This step should have been taken years ago, but it's great to see the GAA finally taking a bold step like this.

zetecescort

Deleted User wrote: »

Any news on motion 8 (replays in the championship)?

congress finished for tonight

Dirty Dingus McGee

zetecescort wrote: »

Motion 1 and 3(all senior games to be 70min)passed, Motions 56 and 57(championship structures) defeated. Motion 2(B championship) withdrawn

Not a good move in my opinion.The extra ten minutes for club matches will result in coaches putting more emphasis on fitness training at a time when a lot of people consider there to be too much emphasis on fitness in the games.It was a completely unnecessary change that as far as I can see players didn't have any problems with the way things were, so why fix something that isn't broken.

Dirty Dingus McGee

joebloggs32 wrote: »

Moving minor to u17 will end the log jam that clogs up fixtures. For too long underage and adult fixtures were being compromised by a few talented minors in each club.
It will also reduce burnout as no minor will be pulled and dragged by the competing demands of playing with both their minor and adult club. This was particularly messy where you had amalgamation teams.
Finally and probably most important of all, it will mean lads doing their leaving will mostly be overage now for the co minor team, and so should be able to concentrate on their studies.
This step should have been taken years ago, but it's great to see the GAA finally taking a bold step like this.

Is this just at inter county level, because if it's at club level with will be a bit ridiculous having both an u-16 and u17 championship.

Torricelli

The U17 is just for inter-county games. Club games will remain as U18.

Actually happy to see club games extended to 70 minutes. Lads are a lot fitter these days, 60 minutes was just too short.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Torricelli

I'd love to see the pick-up abolished. It's not a skill. It slows down games an awful lot.

zetecescort

70 minute games applies to intercounty only. thought all were 70 min, maybe some preseason competitions aren't?

Torricelli

zetecescort wrote: »

70 minute games applies to intercounty only. thought all were 70 min, maybe some preseason competitions aren't?

I presume they mean U17 and U20 which are 60 minutes.

All IC senior games are 70 minutes.

PTH2009

Some county's like Waterford, leirtrim, carlow, wiclow will not win a prov or all Ireland football title so a b championship would give them a chance at success.

Dublin will win leinster for the next 10 years

Munster will be between cork/Kerry/tipp

Open draw (champions league style) with the prov championships played seperate to determine seedlings

Nidgeweasel

Think this is abit farcical myself.

Flukey

Mushy wrote: »

7) This proposes that the All-Ireland football final be played on the first Sunday in September (second Sunday if there are five Sundays in the month), with the hurling decider to be played two weeks earlier. If passed the date changes will come to effect in 2017, meaning that next year's finals finals will be played on 20 August for the hurling and 3 September for the football

It should be left as it is. At that stage of the year, with all but two counties out, there shouldn't be much inconvenience for club games. Then there is the tradition. For any GAA person, September means All-Ireland finals. You'd miss out on the little things, like all the school kids out supporting their county in the build-up, if the Hurling final was moved back. August is holiday time for some, though no good GAA fan should take their summer holidays during the championship . Imagine if your guaranteed contact for All-Ireland final tickets was off in Majorca and you were left without tickets, all because some idiots have moved the finals back 2 weeks! Leave them as they are.

41) This motion calls for the introduction of the mark in Gaelic football.

Can see it passing, would ideally not like it but would stop petty fouling after great fielding.

Often discussed here before and as I've always said, it would be a disaster for the game. It would add nothing and take away a lot. It slows the game down and makes into a stop-start affair. In the International Rules matches, the Irish, and even the Australians, play best when they ignore the mark and keep the game going. There are other ways of dealing with the fouls after fielding rather than bringing in the mark. It should never be brought into Gaelic Football and I think it should be immediately removed from Australian Rules and Rugby too. People will still be physically able to jump spectacularly high into the air and catch a ball if they are not getting a free for doing so. The mark is not the high catch, it is the free. So removing the free does not remove the high catching, as those in favour of the mark often like to portray. Anyway, let's hope that motion is defeated and none looking for the mark is ever brought to Congress again.

43) This motion proposes that all televised inter-county championship games be available on free-to-air TV.

The games should of course be on free to air. If other channels want to show them too, then by all means allow them to buy rights, but not exclusive rights. You can't spread the games by restricting who can watch them. It's better to have less income and more people being able to see the games, than having more income and less people seeing the games.

Torricelli wrote: »

I'd love to see the pick-up abolished. It's not a skill. It slows down games an awful lot.

It is a very simple thing to do and when done properly it does not slow down the game. It is easily coached. It should be retained and it should be in the Ladies game too.

PTH2009 wrote: »

Dublin will win leinster for the next 10 years

They will only do that if the other counties let them. If they get their acts together the other counties can beat Dublin, just like they have always done.

PTH2009

Flukey wrote: »

They will only do that if the other counties let them. If they get their acts together the other counties can beat Dublin, just like they have always done.

I remember watching the dublin 2005 season fotw documentery that was on rte when they won the leinster title for the first time in a few years and they celebrated as much as they did winning the all ireland . nowadays when them or Kilkenny in the hurling win leinster they dont celebrate much and put the cup in the booth and move on.

take westmeaths 2004 leinster title win, the place went mental add to that Galways 2012 leinster hurling win the team loved winning that. love if times of prov glory meant something happend again

Fr Tod Umptious

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Congress continues today.
I think those motions are up for debate today.

zetecescort

Motion to move forward the All Ireland finals defeated.

Mehapoy

They made some moves to tackle burnout last night but held back today when opposing moving the all Ireland finals and ending provincial replays...these would have made a big difference to club's...obviously the provincial replays decision was made with the coffers in mind...short sighted in my view...

Dirty Dingus McGee

zetecescort wrote: »

Motion to move forward the All Ireland finals defeated.

Good decision in my opinion.

It only affects a few counties and still results in loads of counties having club championships that finish way too late so the All Ireland finals clearly have no influence on club fixtures.

May to September is GAA's peak time and having the finals on then extends the coverage the sports get for an extra month of the year.

More club games being played throughout the championship period is what needs to happens and less bowing to county managers demands.

Gael85

PTH2009 wrote: »

Some county's like Waterford, leirtrim, carlow, wiclow will not win a prov or all Ireland football title so a b championship would give them a chance at success.

Dublin will win leinster for the next 10 years

Munster will be between cork/Kerry/tipp

Open draw (champions league style) with the prov championships played seperate to determine seedlings

Kildare are catching up with Dublin at underage. Dublin wont have it all easy.

Tipp have no chance catching Kerry/Cork in footballers. The best players will play hurling. Tipp footballers are in same scenario as Dublin hurlers who lost number of successful underage players to football.

PTH2009

zetecescort wrote: »

Motion to move forward the All Ireland finals defeated.

Glad it would not be the same and its messing with tradition

Is the thing with the all Ireland club finals being played in December going through ???

Fr Tod Umptious

The motion to allow extra time in all games except for All Ireland and provincial finals has also been defeated

nice_guy80

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

The motion to allow extra time in all games except for All Ireland and provincial finals has also been defeated

screwing the club player again

nice_guy80

Hold on, when is the county minor changing to U17?

Nidgeweasel

The Mark was passed.

For. F*ck. Sake.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

The Mark was passed.

For. F*ck. Sake.

The rule is written badly.


If a player takes more than 5 seconds then the ball will be thrown up, when what should happen is a free is awarded in the opposite direction.We'll now how buckets loads of throw ups in the middle of the field.

And also it does not specify if the ball should be played forward when taking the kick.In my opinion it should.

If it was up to me I'd introduce a rule at intercounty level that all kickouts must goo beyond the 45 metre line.I'm sick of these 10 yard kickouts which add nothing to the game but are a fairly sensible approach.

Don't really have much of a problem with the mark as long as it is only from kickouts as it gives teams who have high fielders and advantage and high fielding is one of the best aspects of the game.

cms88

The minor and Under 21 changes i can't figure out. First off why is it just football that's being changed? Whats the idea behind it? Surely teams and players are being put at a disadvantage by it?

zetecescort

free to air motion heavily defeated

zetecescort

motion 47 (playing of other sports in grounds outside of Croke Park)defeated. did this need to pass for the Rugby world cup?

zetecescort

defeated

Motion 48 (Armagh): Proposes the deletion and abolition of the rule that allows players to play inter-county hurling for the county of their parents or for their county of residence, where that county is not competing for the Liam MacCarthy Cup in the All-Ireland Senior Hurling Championship. (Example: A player from Cork living in Monaghan can play for Monaghan. A player from Cork living in Kilkenny cannot play for them).

Flukey

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

The rule is written badly.


If a player takes more than 5 seconds then the ball will be thrown up, when what should happen is a free is awarded in the opposite direction.We'll now how buckets loads of throw ups in the middle of the field.

And also it does not specify if the ball should be played forward when taking the kick.In my opinion it should.

If it was up to me I'd introduce a rule at intercounty level that all kickouts must goo beyond the 45 metre line.I'm sick of these 10 yard kickouts which add nothing to the game but are a fairly sensible approach.

Don't really have much of a problem with the mark as long as it is only from kickouts as it gives teams who have high fielders and advantage and high fielding is one of the best aspects of the game.

The rule is badly written. It should say: "If you catch the ball, you don't get a free."

Fielding is a great aspect of the game. We don't need an absolutely ridiculous rule to know that. High catchers already have a major advantage: Possession! You could have a rule that restricts how many players can surround him to get rid of the nonsense that happens when he lands back on the ground. You don't give a free for carrying out a basic skill. If you can get a free for catching a ball, then you should get one if you kick, pass, solo-run, tip up or do any other standard thing. In fact, it would be tough to decide which is more ridiculous: Getting a free if you catch the ball or getting a free if you farted.

zetecescort

defeated by the burn out brigade.

Motion 50 (Cork): Relates to age restrictions. Proposes that:

1) Players be 16 or over to play non-championship club games
2) Players be 17 or over to play championship club games
3) Players be 18 or over to play inter-county games.

It is proposed to become operative four weeks after the date of Annual Congress.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Flukey wrote: »

The rule is badly written. It should say: "If you catch the ball, you don't get a free."

Fielding is a great aspect of the game. We don't need an absolutely ridiculous rule to know that. High catchers already have a major advantage: Possession! You could have a rule that restricts how many players can surround him to get rid of the nonsense that happens when he lands back on the ground. You don't give a free for carrying out a basic skill. If you can get a free for catching a ball, then you should get one if you kick, pass, solo-run, tip up or do any other standard thing. In fact, it would be tough to decide which is more ridiculous: Getting a free if you catch the ball or getting a free if you farted.

It's trying to reward the skill and make sure it gets rewarded and not left to the referees interpretation.

It won't make a huge difference either way but it at least offers a reward for high fielding and makes sure that it will always be rewarded.

Flukey

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

It's trying to reward the skill and make sure it gets rewarded and not left to the referees interpretation.

It won't make a huge difference either way but it at least offers a reward for high fielding and makes sure that it will always be rewarded.

The skill is rewarded, they've got the ball. What happens after that is separate. If they are restricted in some way, then give them a free. Make it an infringement of the rules if too many players surround him, and that will at least reduce the instances of that situation we all hate: a player surrounded after catching and then penalised for not realising the ball, when it is almost impossible to do so. If we are going to reward the skill of catching with a free, then we should do it for all other skills too. A ridiculous concept: yes; so why are we doing it for catching the ball?

Ok, my idea of getting frees for farting might be a bit hard to do, as referees would have to go around sniffing players arses to see if there was still evidence of an aroma, so maybe I should modify the rule to the player having to take a dump. Giving a player a free for taking a dump is stupid, but no more stupid than giving one for catching a ball.

bruschi

Flukey wrote: »

The skill is rewarded, they've got the ball. What happens after that is separate. If they are restricted in some way, then give them a free. Make it an infringement of the rules if too many players surround him, and that will at least reduce the instances of that situation we all hate: a player surrounded after catching and then penalised for not realising the ball, when it is almost impossible to do so. If we are going to reward the skill of catching with a free, then we should do it for all other skills too. A ridiculous concept: yes; so why are we doing it for catching the ball?

Ok, my idea of getting frees for farting might be a bit hard to do, as referees would have to go around sniffing players arses to see if there was still evidence of an aroma, so maybe I should modify the rule to the player having to take a dump. Giving a player a free for taking a dump is stupid, but no more stupid than giving one for catching a ball.

I disagree that it's an award for skill, would agree with your thoughts that it is to stop the ball catcher being clogged up. As it stands, there is little or no advantage to being able to cleanly catch a kick out, and that does need to be addressed. Will this solve it? Not sure.

CrabRevolution

Those motions trying to allow 16/17 year olds to play non championship games managed to really miss the point by a phenomenal degree. I don't know how they thought that was a reasonable compromise.

The point of barring 16/17 year olds from senior wasn't to shield them from the harshness of a championship match. It was to stop them having to train for months and months for those senior teams. If a lad was allowed play league football, his manager would want him to train senior, he might be in demand for minor training too, add on possibly county minor, hurling etc. and it all piles up. Removing these lads from adult for another year takes the pressure off them from having to choose what to do.

CrabRevolution

I see Antrim's motion to allow the Christy Ring winner to take part in the Leinster quarter final of the same year's championship passed. Surprised that it passed, and also how little talk there has been of it.

A motion to bring back the qualifier format with 2 groups of 4 is also voted in, but I've a feeling that will be discarded. There's a reason it didn't last long about 10 years ago.

Strange one about the CR, means that the likes of Carlow (for example) can spend year after year in the provincial qualifer group and while not getting relegated, they won't make it into L MacCarthy proper. But at the same time a team winning the CR beneath them will get a go at Leinster and the qualifiers.

nice_guy80

Congress is a mess this year

Antrim wouldn't have had that motion in if they weren't in the Christy ring this year

Mehapoy

CrabRevolution wrote: »

I see Antrim's motion to allow the Christy Ring winner to take part in the Leinster quarter final of the same year's championship passed. Surprised that it passed, and also how little talk there has been of it.

A motion to bring back the qualifier format with 2 groups of 4 is also voted in, but I've a feeling that will be discarded. There's a reason it didn't last long about 10 years ago.

Strange one about the CR, means that the likes of Carlow (for example) can spend year after year in the provincial qualifer group and while not getting relegated, they won't make it into L MacCarthy proper. But at the same time a team winning the CR beneath them will get a go at Leinster and the qualifiers.

Just shows that Congress is not the place to make these changes... Farcical outcome that they obviously hadn't thought about, surely the qualifier group is the place to qualify for the next stage...in this situation its better for antrim than Kerry, and next year its better for a team to be relegated to the Christy ring to get into the quarter finals...its so amateur its funny...

CrabRevolution

Congress is always a mess. It's a bit of a ridiculous way of governing things. A club can send any proposal they want forward and if enough people agree that's simply it, it's in. There's no need for suitability checks, risk analysis, trials, research, reports into any proposal change whatsoever. Just send it on and if enough people vote yes then it's now the law. Little justification is needed, some might think their motion will genuinely benefit the game, but others are just looking after themselves and want the rules changed to accommodate them like the Antrim example above.