Travellers in Knocknacarra

Pugzilla

A pile of caravans have moved into Knockanacarra beside Dunnes stores. A blight....

Mrs OBumble

Pugzilla wrote: »

A pile of caravans have moved into Knockanacarra beside Dunnes stores. A blight....

Interesting. The lads at City Hall are still there ad at a free minutes ago.

ronnie3585

I for one welcome our new traveller overlords.

Bullocks

ronnie3585 wrote: »

I for one welcome our new traveller overlords.

Bring them back an apple tart and cream

beardybrewer

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/traveller-families-moved-from-illegal-encampment-set-up-home-outside-galway-city-hall-34447378.html

Storm 10

Just been out in Dunnes Knocknacarra and there is not a caravan anywhere there or the surrounding area, perhaps OP you might be more specific as to where they are

Pugzilla

Turn left at the mini roundabout when coming out of Dunnes carpark, stay on that road with Zenimax on the left after the bend. You'll come to a T junction. They're lined up along the road on the right as of last wednesday. I don't know if they're related to those at city hall (probably are!).

Pugzilla

Having read the article, I presume they have left.

Storm 10

Your way behind the times so they left there last Thursday for the Airport and left there for City Hall where they are now

bobbyss

Passed by there today and no caravans at all. One or two rubbish sacks and what looked like some kind of an armchair left there on grass verge I think.

Tough as their lives are they have no right to mess up that area. They would be the first to say there is no evidence that they are responsible. Somebody else could have come along and thrown that stuff there. They would be right.

What's the situation at the city hall?

Gremlinertia

Now at ballyloughane beach according friends that live there - can't post links on phone.

afkasurfjunkie

Gremlinertia wrote: »

Now at ballyloughane beach according friends that live there - can't post links on phone.

Ya, spotted caravans there today passing by on the train.

bobbyss

Those Travellers have a tough life make no mistake about it. It must be very very difficult for them to have to keep moving around especially with kids involved and my heart goes out to them.

My understanding is that in general the city council has a (legal?) obligation to house them where they want to be housed ie together in sites with serviceable bays etc. The council has not done that ie the council has failed in its legal duty. Is this true? If it is true, why has the council failed in this regard?

I can never understand why some Travellers want to live together in sites?
I also do not understand how anybody would refuse social housing and choose to live on the side of the road especially when young children are involved. Why would a parent choose that for their children?

And I can never understand how Travellers can afford to keep horses given the fact that many Travellers are unemployed.

I would have thought horses were for the gentry set. Feeding, Vet expenses, Licencing or whatever must cost a fair bit. And if Travellers by and large do not own property, where are these horses kept?

xtradel

bobbyss wrote: »

Those Travellers have a tough life make no mistake about it. It must be very very difficult for them to have to keep moving around especially with kids involved and my heart goes out to them.

My understanding is that in general the city council has a (legal?) obligation to house them where they want to be housed ie together in sites with serviceable bays etc. The council has not done that ie the council has failed in its legal duty. Is this true? If it is true, why has the council failed in this regard?

I can never understand why some Travellers want to live together in sites?
I also do not understand how anybody would refuse social housing and choose to live on the side of the road especially when young children are involved. Why would a parent choose that for their children?

And I can never understand how Travellers can afford to keep horses given the fact that many Travellers are unemployed.

I would have thought horses were for the gentry set. Feeding, Vet expenses, Licencing or whatever must cost a fair bit. And if Travellers by and large do not own property, where are these horses kept?

Be gone kind sir with your logic & stuff...

flynnlives

no fixed abode means no letters which means no bills, no tax...

bobbyss

flynnlives wrote: »

no fixed abode means no letters which means no bills, no tax...

I don't know. Most Travellers I suspect do not live on the side of the road and I think that they get post delivered at sites. Could be wrong though.
And would they not have to have address to receive sw payments etc.
There is simply a lack of will by authorities to deal with Traveller accommodation. If Pavee Point could sue then they should.

2rkehij30qtza5

bobbyss wrote: »

There is simply a lack of will by authorities to deal with Traveller accommodation. If Pavee Point could sue then they should.

Seriously?! The halting site near my house is continuously being done up/repaired by the City Council. A short while later the travellers take the tiles/slates off the roofs of the toilet blocks yet again...and city council are back in replacing them time and time again. There's only so much the local authority can do!

If I decided to abandon my home and take off in a caravan (yes...I know...they don't have static homes to begin with and living in a caravan is their culture or whatnot) why should I expect to be allowed to pull up anywhere I choose, stay there and wreck the place? I saw them in Knocknacarra...took over the whole section of road..I could barely see pulling out from the road that leads towads the Aviva/Dunnes as they were blocking my sight line, rubbish thrown all over the place, cars abandoned precariously on the road...it was an accident scene waiting to happen.

I'm fed up with all these 'do-gooders' standing up for a minority of the population who clog A&E (disproportionally high number of travellers in A&E constantly), who have a disproportionate number of people on front of the courts, who don't abide by the laws of our land and who I, as a tax payer, pay their upkeep.

ronnie3585

Cecilia Wooden Terrapin wrote: »

Seriously?! The halting site near my house is continuously being done up/repaired by the City Council. A short while later the travellers take the tiles/slates off the roofs of the toilet blocks yet again...and city council are back in replacing them time and time again. There's only so much the local authority can do!

If I decided to abandon my home and take off in a caravan (yes...I know...they don't have static homes to begin with and living in a caravan is their culture or whatnot) why should I expect to be allowed to pull up anywhere I choose, stay there and wreck the place? I saw them in Knocknacarra...took over the whole section of road..I could barely see pulling out from the road that leads towads the Aviva/Dunnes as they were blocking my sight line, rubbish thrown all over the place, cars abandoned precariously on the road...it was an accident scene waiting to happen.

I'm fed up with all these 'do-gooders' standing up for a minority of the population who clog A&E (disproportionally high number of travellers in A&E constantly), who have a disproportionate number of people on front of the courts, who don't abide by the laws of our land and who I, as a tax payer, pay their upkeep.

Nail on the head.

the_syco

bobbyss wrote: »

There is simply a lack of will by authorities to deal with Traveller accommodation. If Pavee Point could sue then they should.

From http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/traveller-families-moved-from-illegal-encampment-set-up-home-outside-galway-city-hall-34447378.html

“We have offered emergency homeless services to these families over the last number of weeks but we have been informed the families want a site with sanitation provided immediately. It isn’t within our capability to deliver that,” he said.

Simply put, they don't want what other homeless people get, they want to be treated better than the homeless, they want this, that, and the other, because they were told to leave their last illegal halting site.

They had been living at an illegal site at the side of the road in Knocknacarra for the past few weeks after they had been evicted from private lands at Carrowbrowne where they had been living for six months.

Also, in the article, where it states that private lands at Carrowbrowne, am I to assume that it was some farmers land that they illegally trespassed onto for six months?

JillyQ

Cecilia Wooden Terrapin wrote: »

Seriously?! The halting site near my house is continuously being done up/repaired by the City Council. A short while later the travellers take the tiles/slates off the roofs of the toilet blocks yet again...and city council are back in replacing them time and time again. There's only so much the local authority can do!

If I decided to abandon my home and take off in a caravan (yes...I know...they don't have static homes to begin with and living in a caravan is their culture or whatnot) why should I expect to be allowed to pull up anywhere I choose, stay there and wreck the place? I saw them in Knocknacarra...took over the whole section of road..I could barely see pulling out from the road that leads towads the Aviva/Dunnes as they were blocking my sight line, rubbish thrown all over the place, cars abandoned precariously on the road...it was an accident scene waiting to happen.

I'm fed up with all these 'do-gooders' standing up for a minority of the population who clog A&E (disproportionally high number of travellers in A&E constantly), who have a disproportionate number of people on front of the courts, who don't abide by the laws of our land and who I, as a tax payer, pay their upkeep.

Totally agree with you. I'm completely fed up with these layabouts taking everything & contributing nothing.

Mrs OBumble

Cecilia Wooden Terrapin wrote: »

I'm fed up with all these 'do-gooders' standing up for a minority of the population who clog A&E (disproportionally high number of travellers in A&E constantly), who have a disproportionate number of people on front of the courts, who don't abide by the laws of our land and who I, as a tax payer, pay their upkeep.

Sounds like the descriptions applied to (settled) Irish immigrants in many countries.

I know that many of you cannot even spell "ethnicity", far less have any meaningful appreciation of the concepts of cultural difference, but really the level of sheer ignorance displayed in this thread is pretty mind boggling.

bobbyss

I have great sympathy with the Travellers on this one.

Being offered emergency housing and turning it down sounds crazy, esp when there are kids involved but has the City Council a legal obligation, for a number of years now, to provide Traveller specific accommodation and it has failed to do so?

thesandeman

the_syco wrote: »

Also, in the article, where it states that private lands at Carrowbrowne, am I to assume that it was some farmers land that they illegally trespassed onto for six months?

Assume away. Everybody is entitled to their assumption.
You have assumed wrongly though.
Assumably you will check the facts next time.

Whereisgalway

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Sounds like the descriptions applied to (settled) Irish immigrants in many countries.

I know that many of you cannot even spell "ethnicity", far less have any meaningful appreciation of the concepts of cultural difference, but really the level of sheer ignorance displayed in this thread is pretty mind boggling.

The level of hypocrisy on this thread is mind boggling

snubbleste

Now "gone to the beach"

MRnotlob606

Wonder will they start playing the whole persecution complex?

BunkMoreland

Hopefully there isn't a big storm and they all get washed out to sea, that'd be terrible.

Breaston Plants

http://connachttribune.ie/council-shut-travellers-diy-hardstand-139/

Anyone ever hear what happened in this case, the caravans are still there.

Arghus

BunkMoreland wrote: »

Hopefully there isn't a big storm and they all get washed out to sea, that'd be terrible.

Jesus...

That's nice. I wonder if mirthhful wishing of death on any other particular sub-section of society is tolerated on boards, or is it just travellers?

El_Dangeroso

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Sounds like the descriptions applied to (settled) Irish immigrants in many countries.

I have no issue with Travellers and I hate when people use de-humanising language. Travellers have hard lives and die a lot sooner than settled people and suffer discrimination constantly.

What I do take issue with is that somehow the same rules don't apply to a group that apply to the rest of us.

If Irish immigrants behaved illegally in another country would they be give special exemption based up ethnicity?

JillyQ

What I do take issue with is that somehow the same rules don't apply to a group that apply to the rest of us.

This is what the vast majority of people take issue with. None of us want to see people homeless, however the travellers don't do themselves any favours either by there behaviour, they appear to want to take, take and take without trying to make any viable contribution to society as a hole.

the_syco

thesandeman wrote: »

Assumably you will check the facts next time.

Hrm. Evicted from a halting site for wrecking it, it would seem. And now they want more free accommodation, but not what the homeless are offered, but better?

As for them camping on the beach, how they rent a skip and a portaloo, like the civilised travellers I've come across. And not like most of them, who make a large pile of rubbish, and destroy local facilities.

Ballyloughane Beach is a fairly popular beach, especially for residents for those on the east side of the city.

byhookorbycrook

bobbyss wrote: »

I would have thought horses were for the gentry set. Feeding, Vet expenses, Licencing or whatever must cost a fair bit. And if Travellers by and large do not own property, where are these horses kept?

:rolleyes::rolleyes:
Oh yeah, anyone with a horse is part of the "gentry" (Whatever that means today)

Mrs OBumble

the_syco wrote: »

Hrm. Evicted from a halting site for wrecking it, it would seem. And now they want more free accommodation, but not what the homeless are offered, but better?

....

Ballyloughane Beach is a fairly popular beach, especially for residents for those on the east side of the city.

Evicted because there's not planning permission for the way it was being used. Or because it's shortly before an election. One or the other, or maybe both.

As I've heard it, they want a serviced hard-stand. I would have thought that this was quite a lot less than what most homeless are offered.


And I've never visited Ballyloughane Beach in February - wouldn't have expected it to be overly popular at this time of year myself.

Gremlinertia

A lot of dog walkers this time of year because they are allowed on the beach during the day. I walk one for a friend couple of times a week..

2rkehij30qtza5

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

And I've never visited Ballyloughane Beach in February - wouldn't have expected it to be overly popular at this time of year myself.

It's very popular. Large number of families go there (myself included)..kids with wellies, buckets and spades...people walking dogs etc. It is a very well used beach.

galwaycyclist

Arghus wrote: »

Jesus...

That's nice. I wonder if mirthhful wishing of death on any other particular sub-section of society is tolerated on boards, or is it just travellers?

Try being a cyclist or pedestrian cue jokes about "organ donors" etc

BunkMoreland

I like a stroll on the down at the beach with my dog. The travellers are really lowering the tone down there.

You'd want to be careful what you leave in the car when you go for your walk.

BunkMoreland

The car park is locked with a big metal gate. How did they get in. When I see an area locked which is not my property I don't go trespassing and leaving a mess behind, but I guess that's just me.

Whereisgalway

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

.

I've never visited Ballyloughane Beach in February - wouldn't have expected it to be overly popular at this time of year myself.

How would you know if Uve never been there in February? It's actually quite busy with dog walkers, families and around 300-400 people using Liam meadows club every evening.

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

the level of sheer ignorance displayed in this thread is pretty mind boggling.

the_syco

BunkMoreland wrote: »

The car park is locked with a big metal gate. How did they get in. When I see an area locked which is not my property I don't go trespassing and leaving a mess behind, but I guess that's just me.

According to this

it was alleged that a bollard was cut down which had been stopping access by vehicles to a path there.

Also, at the end of the article it states

But she pointed out that as there are a large number of people on the housing waiting list people can not be moved up to the front of the list.

... so it'll be interesting to see what happens to "royalty" :pac:

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Evicted because there's not planning permission for the way it was being used. Or because it's shortly before an election. One or the other, or maybe both.

As per this;

An Bord Pleanála has decided to refuse an extension of planning permission for the 15 bay-halting site at the Headford Road.

The site was originally meant to be a temporary facility but extensions of planning permission were granted by the county council.

However, that planning permission has now ended and the site is effectively illegal.

Seems the extensions were refused because the travellers caused "significant damage to the site at Carrowbrowne".

Have seen "temporary" sites lasting nearly a decade, but it seems that unless their demands are met, they'll destroy what they are given. I'm surprised PP are keeping quite.

bobbyss

the_syco wrote: »

Hrm. Evicted from a halting site for wrecking it, it would seem. And now they want more free accommodation, but not what the homeless are offered, but better?

As for them camping on the beach, how they rent a skip and a portaloo, like the civilised travellers I've come across. And not like most of them, who make a large pile of rubbish, and destroy local facilities.

Ballyloughane Beach is a fairly popular beach, especially for residents for those on the east side of the city.

I think what many Travellers want is a place to live which suits their needs. I may be very wrong in this but I think the City Council basically agreed to this and that is why they, I think, have a legal obligation to service that need. Again, I may be wrong so please correct me if I am, this legal obligation has been with the council for a number of years now, so the reason they are on the beach is because of the council's failure to provide accommodation.
Just think of the babies and young children and what life they have now in the cold.
If you were a Traveller and the council reneged on its legal duty to provide you with Traveller specific accommodation how would you feel? What would you do?

the_syco

bobbyss wrote: »

I think what many Travellers want is a place to live which suits their needs.

They were given a site which suited their needs, and they wrecked it. The permission to use the site as a halting site got revoked because the site was destroyed, and they were told to move on. They then went to various locations to cause the most hassle to get what they want on their own terms.

bobbyss wrote: »

If you were a Traveller and the council reneged on its legal duty to provide you with Traveller specific accommodation how would you feel? What would you do?

If I had children, I'd take their offer of a roof over my head. However, the travellers in question want special treatment.

Jayop

bobbyss wrote: »

Just think of the babies and young children and what life they have now in the cold.
If you were a Traveller and the council reneged on its legal duty to provide you with Traveller specific accommodation how would you feel? What would you do?

Get a job, rent a house, look after my family.

But that's a crazy suggestion.

marklazarcovic

What groups of travellers like those want,is a nice sized bungalow,in a nice handy area to amenites ,but private at the same time, room at each house for one caravan minimum,oh and a place to keep horses, all great , except they want/expect you and me and thousands of others to fund it all,and its upkeep...

They will buy their own vehicles and animals mind you,tax vans as commercials and use as cars with 5 or 6 in the back .. (watch them arrive at a supermacs a few mins after schools out) .

And they want seperate rules for themselves than for 'settled folk' .

And if you dont provide it they claim discrimination,racism. Its all take,they give back nothing. I know many travellers,none of them could deny what ive just written with a straight face,a few are sound enough but they prefer to live to their own rules with our money.. and see no wrong in it.

fergiesfolly

I googled it, but couldn't find an answer, so some one here might know..
What infrastructures in place throughout the EU for the Travelling community?
Are there halting sites or Traveller specific accommodation in Holland, Spain or Germany for example?

bobbyss

What is a halting site anyway?
How many legal ones are in the city? What is the difference between a transient and temporary halting site?

I know there is a halting site on Rahoon Road, Lower Salthill and there is one at top of Tuam Road as you come from Bothar na Treabh? You never hear anything bad about those sites. Where else do Travellers live in the city in sites does anybody know?

I would like to know more about their lives. What life is like in a halting site?
Does the council do maintenance work in them?
Are they serviced by ESB? What about washing facilities inside a caravan?
I have heard sometimes they have their own generators but are these safe? Are they legal?
Do Travellers insure their caravans? Do they burn caravans when there has been a death in one and if they do, how can they afford that given high unemployment rates? Why couldn't one of the Traveller families on the beach move into an empty bay in Rahoon or Salthill for example? Would that not be an act of solidarity with each other?
I think we need a Traveller to answer these questions.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Take a skim back through this thread, imagine you're a traveller, and imagine how eager you'd be to come on here and be questioned/interrogated. Actually, over in the AMA forum there was a traveller woman on, thread got closed because all people were interested in asking her was where criminals got their money, even though she didn't know.

SpaceSasqwatch

Arghus wrote: »

I wonder if mirthhful wishing of death on any other particular sub-section of society is tolerated on boards, or is it just travellers?

Nope , not just just travellers...check out the anti immigration thread in the politics cafe.

Stay classy Boards.ie !!!!

Mrs OBumble

fergiesfolly wrote: »

What infrastructures in place throughout the EU for the Travelling community? Are there halting sites or Traveller specific accommodation in Holland, Spain or Germany for example?

Do those countries have Travellers as part of their indigenous population?

bobbyss wrote: »

What is a halting site anyway?
How many legal ones are in the city? What is the difference between a transient and temporary halting site?

Lots of questions there! I suspect the answer would be "none of your business" unless asked very sensitively.

As well as the sites you mentioned, I know of ones in Doughiska and Ballybane. Suspect there are others.

Travellers cannot be put into just any spare bay. As with many low-education / high-internal-relationships community, there are people who just don't get on. And while you'd rightly say that the rest of us don't get to choose our neighbours, the fact is that Traveller accommodation can either work well if the right people are there, or very badly if not. Hate it all you want, but there's no point looking for trouble.

SpaceSasqwatch wrote: »

Nope , not just just travellers...check out the anti immigration thread in the politics cafe.

Stay classy Boards.ie !!!!

Indeed.

There's a little bit of me that likes that stuff like this does get voiced, because it at least brings it into the open and shows up what people's values are. I'm the kind of foreign who people quickly forget is foreign, so have heard some very interesting conversations when people think that only Irish people are within earshot.

bobbyss

Nathalia Prickly Mouth wrote: »

Take a skim back through this thread, imagine you're a traveller, and imagine how eager you'd be to come on here and be questioned/interrogated. Actually, over in the AMA forum there was a traveller woman on, thread got closed because all people were interested in asking her was where criminals got their money, even though she didn't know.

You may be right. Still, a Traveller's view point would be interesting. As much as I sympathize with Travellers, I do have some issues with Traveler culture that I do not quite grasp.

For example, does the council have information about the specific numbers in each site and in each bay? How are bays allocated in each site?

Do the Travellers rent the bay from the council? How much? What happens the bay if they move away? Who decides who lives in each site? Take the Lower Salthill site. How many people live there? If there was, for arguments sake, one bay space vacant there (and who would have this information? Who knows? Does the council?) would not that be a spot to accommodate some of the Beach Travellers? Would the Council not investigate that?

That would fulfill the criteria for some Travellers, wouldn't it? Those that want to live in a halting site Traveller specific. At no real cost? Just move into an empty bay? Now, who would object to that? The local people? Hardly. But would the Travellers already in that site object? And on what basis?