Am I ungrateful or actually underpaid?

RainyDay

Senna wrote: »

Spoilage could account for some, but what actually happens is a kg of a food type does not equate to a set sales amount.
Take a hotel, chicken breast in a curry in the bar, €11.00. Chicken breast in restaurant €18.00, chicken breast at a wedding €27.50.

Revenue cannot possibly know, even the head chef has a hard time working out food percentages never mind a third party.

They don't look at a unit level, they look at the business level. They have built excellent data analysis systems to allow them to do sectoral analysis, and see which businesses are the odd ones out.

davo10

RainyDay wrote: »

They don't look at a unit level, they look at the business level. They have built excellent data analysis systems to allow them to do sectoral analysis, and see which businesses are the odd ones out.

What are the chances of that company being audited and as Revenue don't usually go back more than one year, what are the chances of the op being caught?

Avatar MIA

Senna wrote: »

Revenue cannot possibly know, even the head chef has a hard time working ouood percentages never mind a third party.

Very few public sector agencies are efficient. Revenue are, relatively so at least. They apply ratios (gathereed from a vast array of tax returns) to ascertain if everything seems ligit.

My money is on Revenue. The company has to be lucky every year, whereas Revenue only have to be lucky once.

davo10

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Very few public sector agencies are efficient. Revenue are, relatively so at least. They apply ratios (gathereed from a vast array of tax returns) to ascertain if everything seems ligit.

My money is on Revenue. The company has to be lucky every year, whereas Revenue only have to be lucky once.

Let's say for argument sake this is the food industry, considering the tens of thousands of eateries and suppliers plus the employers ability to hide money off the books, my money is on the op, big time.

Senna

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Very few public sector agencies are efficient. Revenue are, relatively so at least. They apply ratios (gathereed from a vast array of tax returns) to ascertain if everything seems ligit.

My money is on Revenue. The company has to be lucky every year, whereas Revenue only have to be lucky once.

And I have the upmost respect for revenue and they perform unlike all other public sectors. But when talking about the service industry, they actually cannot compare like for like. I have first hand experience over 20 years and I know many many business that offer large cash payment to management off the books, it's the only reason I stayed in the industry for so long (thankfully out now). None have been caught for bonus payments.
You might not like it, but it happens.

I think what the OP has posted on a public forum especially the huge amount of cash bonus he claims to have receive from his employer will definitely have the tax revenue people talking if they read his post, maybe OP has other reasons but if all what he says is true, really silly of him to post the amount of cash bonus he has receive.

And now he has others coming on board agreeing, tax revenue investigators are going to love you OP.

Senna

A bit of reality is needed. Revenue know it goes on, they also know which industries it happens in. The problem is, it happens in business that know they can hide it, the nature of the business dictates that.

Senna

Senna wrote: »

A bit of reality is needed. Revenue know it goes on, they also know which industries it happens in. The problem is, it happens in business that know they can hide it, the nature of the business dictates that.

True a bit or lot of reality is needed but like you we're all responding to OP post, do you want us all to ignore certain parts of OP post.

RainyDay

Senna wrote: »

And I have the upmost respect for revenue and they perform unlike all other public sectors. But when talking about the service industry, they actually cannot compare like for like. I have first hand experience over 20 years and I know many many business that offer large cash payment to management off the books, it's the only reason I stayed in the industry for so long (thankfully out now). None have been caught for bonus payments.
You might not like it, but it happens.

Plenty of take-aways on the Revenue defaulter list from over the years.

https://www.google.ie/search?q=site:revenue.ie+take-away#q=site:revenue.ie+defaulter+take-away+

The idea that service industries in general and take-aways/food services in particular have some magic exemption to tax audits is slightly flawed. It's just a question of how long Revenue will take to get round to catching them.

And if they have trouble auditing the business, they will audit the person. It's not that difficult to compare declared income to house/car/holidays and highlight any discrepancies.

yourpics

I think OP is trolling, he is probably getting 2K cash bonus not 20K!

Whyohwhy?

I'm sure the revenue are reasonably on the ball, but the service(food or otherwise) industry is ripe for fiddles, always has been and always will be. Same with tradesmen and many others.

To think they are an all seeing organisation, that'll catch you at some stage is a little naive imo.

I must add, I only speculated that the op was in the food service industry, I don't think it was confirmed. I was offering my opinion on what industry they may have been in(based on my experience in an industry that is well known for cash payment/top ups, along with tradesmen...)

Stheno

Whyohwhy? wrote: »

I'm sure the revenue are reasonably on the ball, but the service(food or otherwise) industry is ripe for fiddles, always has been and always will be. Same with tradesmen and many others.

To think they are an all seeing organisation, that'll catch you at some stage is a little naive imo.

I must add, I only speculated that the op was in the food service industry, I don't think it was confirmed. I was offering my opinion on what industry they may have been in(based on my experience in an industry that is well known for cash payment/top ups, along with tradesmen...)

You are aware that a. banks are obliged to report transactions above 10k, b. Revenue have been given specific powers in recent years to enforce getting information from banks on levels of transactions in cash businesses etc?

Senna

Stheno wrote: »

You are aware that a. banks are obliged to report transactions above 10k, b. Revenue have been given specific powers in recent years to enforce getting information from banks on levels of transactions in cash businesses etc?

Love the clutching at straws to burst his bubble.

Considering the banks actually ask you where you got the money from and explain why they need that information I'm guessing the OP knows, that is, if he did try to lodge a large amount.
Anyone getting cash bonuses knows you don't lodge it.

Stheno

Senna wrote: »

Love the clutching at straws to burst his bubble.

Considering the banks actually ask you where you got the money from and explain why they need that information I'm guessing the OP knows, that is, if he did try to lodge a large amount.
Anyone getting cash bonuses knows you don't lodge it.

My OH lodged over 40k via cheque a couple of years ago.

No questions asked at all.

Reporting still required.

RainyDay

Senna wrote: »

Love the clutching at straws to burst his bubble.

Considering the banks actually ask you where you got the money from and explain why they need that information I'm guessing the OP knows, that is, if he did try to lodge a large amount.
Anyone getting cash bonuses knows you don't lodge it.

'not lodging it' is not a magic bullet to hide money from Revenue. All they need to do is look at declared income vs lifestyle (house/car/holiday/assets) and any significant cash income suddenly becomes clear.

Senna

RainyDay wrote: »

'not lodging it' is not a magic bullet to hide money from Revenue. All they need to do is look at declared income vs lifestyle (house/car/holiday/assets) and any significant cash income suddenly becomes clear.

Yes any why would they be looking at the OP 's lifestyle vs income, he's a PRSI worker not a contender for a CAB investigation. Straws and clutching comes to mind again.

Anyway, OP, you're not underpaid and best of luck.

Tell me how

Senna wrote:

Yes any why would they be looking at the OP 's lifestyle vs income, he's a PRSI worker not a contender for a CAB investigation. Straws and clutching comes to mind again.

Why would you feel that people here have an agenda against the OP?
Your "clutching at straws" statement is off the mark. People are giving their views on the thread taking everything into consideration.

What the OP is doing is morally wrong and outright illegal, just because they may get away with it doesn't change that. I suspect that you might use the argument that some bankers, politicians etc do similar but so what, it's still wrong. And it is difficult to swallow that if you're a fully divulged PAYE worker. More so if you're struggling financially.

I think that attitudes such as yours is why we end up with tales of massive corruption and so on from time to time. The only difference between those and what you are advocating in this case is the scale of the opportunity to defraud. The mentality is the same.

Finally, CAB obviously wouldn't be involved. They wouldn't need to be, Revenue are more than capable of fighting their own battles and if they get an inkling of something amiss, they'll take their time and get to the bottom of it. There is no statute of limitations when the suspect illegal behaviour. They could look at the OP for a number of reasons, as have been mentioned, just because they might not isn't a justification in itself.

Nody

//MOD

People while I understand the discussion on the money under the table is a hot topic please return to the topic at hand as per OPs first post.

//MOD

RainyDay

Senna wrote: »

Yes any why would they be looking at the OP 's lifestyle vs income, he's a PRSI worker not a contender for a CAB investigation. Straws and clutching comes to mind again.

Revenue are not CAB. CAB are not Revenue.

Auditing individuals is just another tool in the Revenue toolbox to use if they suspect cash transactions that they are having difficulty finding.

cowboyBuilder

You seem overpaid, 20k CASH bonus, is like ~40K for PAYE workers as mentioned, yes you work hard, but you make very nice money - so don't complain.

Angry bird

Make hay while the sun shines OP. When your personal or family life needs more of your time then look to cut hours or have an exit lined up to a Job where hours suit better.

screamer

OP I think you are very well paid for what you do and you've risen up the pay ranks quickly. I know people who work highly pressurised jobs for far more hours then you work who don't get any bonuses or company cars. I don't think you realise how lucky you are TBH.

FrStone

screamer wrote: »

OP I think you are very well paid for what you do and you've risen up the pay ranks quickly. I know people who work highly pressurised jobs for far more hours then you work who don't get any bonuses or company cars. I don't think you realise how lucky you are TBH.

On for heavens sake. He is obviously a very good sales man. He works hard and is rewarded appropriately.

Don't be jealous, be good at what you do and work for an employer who appreciates you. Y you will have no problem earning this to poke of money then. Luck has nothing to do with it...

RainyDay

FrStone wrote: »

Don't be jealous, be good at what you do and work for an employer who appreciates you.

I'd have thought that an employer who actually appreciated you wouldn't use illegal methods that expose you to future tax audits, interest and penalties.