Buy a Diesel they said

Avatar MIA

My car ('08 2.4 JTDM AR 159) was losing power and the yellow check engine light came on.

I took it into a main dealer thinking it was something to do with the injectors which caused a similar performance problem previously. No such luck.

Unfortunately I got the below response from a main dealer (not the one I originally bought from). Not sure the car is even worth that now considering Alfa depreciation...


"The E.G.R Valve has failed resulting in the Particle Filter getting blocked with carbon (Reading 100% ash content). Unfortunately what this means is that the Filter requires replacing as you cannot regenerate it when fully blocked.

I have listed the parts & fitting cost below:

Exchange EGR Valve €161.53

Particle Filter €2242.83

Gasket €8.33

Remove / Refit €295.00


Total Incl. VAT @ 13.5% €3073.23

Total at present for checking & diagnosing is €75.00 inclusive of VAT."


Any advice (apart from NEVER buy Diesel again)?

Atlantic Dawn

What was your reason to buy a diesel? Would getting the DPF removed be another option?

Avatar MIA

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

What was your reason to buy a diesel?

At the time I was commuting to Dublin. But for the last year the mileage dropped significantly, which may have caused the problems.

I would not go Diesel again no matter the mileage (this was my first and last).

Toyotafanboi

yeah, i'd be getting it removed. or gutted due to the thread of this new NCT check.

either way, you have lots of options, none of which will even cost a fraction of that price.

your biggest mistake (aside from buying a diesel, perhaps) was bringing an 8 year old Alfa to a main dealer for a repair. i'd just pay the diagnosis fee and take the car back, you'd probably get the DPF removed and the car remapped for under 5-600 at a guess.

boosabum

Try the DPF guy in shannon/newmarket on fergus. Will clean or recondition DPF for you. I know he does trade in's also on them also. I would imagine it will be a fraction of that quoted cost

MarkR

Check with an independent mechanic for a start, see if there are other options than replacing the particle filter. Previously the default would have been to remove it, but i've heard recently about issues with NCT and removed DPF's.

boosabum wrote: »

Try the DPF guy in shannon/newmarket on fergus. Will clean or recondition DPF for you. I know he does trade in's also on them also. I would imagine it will be a fraction of that quoted cost

Could you send me on the shannon guy's name. Just for future reference. :-)

jimgoose

I assume the EGR "failed open", thus dropping combustion temperatures and constantly re-running pure shít through the intake? Remove and blank the EGR, gut the DPF and re-map. Give it a good hiding on a motorway every now-and-then.

Avatar MIA

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

, you'd probably get the DPF removed and the car remapped for under 5-600 at a guess.

It's also due for NCT - would removing the DPF make it a fail?

Is the problem simply removing the infamous DPF?

I had a problem with the injectors about two years ago and was hoping it would be fixed under warranty.

splashthecash

Why not buy a KIA Diesel new, and have a 7 year warranty with it?

Avatar MIA

boosabum wrote: »

Try the DPF guy in shannon/newmarket on fergus. Will clean or recondition DPF for you. I know he does trade in's also on them also. I would imagine it will be a fraction of that quoted cost

My morning was absolutely ruined, but really glad I started this thread now. Didn't fancy explaining this expense to her indoors.

Any contact details for the Shannon/NOF guy?

Lellostag

Crikey, that's pricey!! Is the DPF really that expensive?!?!

Perhaps having the filter removed would be the way to go, unless you can find a cheaper one. Don't know if it's feasible at all, but would it be possible to pick up a second hand one and regenerate that instead?

boosabum

MarkR wrote: »

Check with an independent mechanic for a start, see if there are other options than replacing the particle filter. Previously the default would have been to remove it, but i've heard recently about issues with NCT and removed DPF's.



Could you send me on the shannon guy's name. Just for future reference. :-)

thedfpclinic.ie

Know someone who has an Accord dpf reconditioned with him, spoke highly of the service

Avatar MIA

splashthecash wrote: »

Why not buy a KIA Diesel new, and have a 7 year warranty with it?

Because of the word Diesel





















and the word Kia

boosabum

MarkR wrote: »

Check with an independent mechanic for a start, see if there are other options than replacing the particle filter. Previously the default would have been to remove it, but i've heard recently about issues with NCT and removed DPF's.



Could you send me on the shannon guy's name. Just for future reference. :-)

google dpf clinic dot ie
061 518325

Toyotafanboi

Avatar MIA wrote: »

It's also due for NCT - would removing the DPF make it a fail?

Is the problem simply removing the infamous DPF?

I had a problem with the injectors about two years ago and was hoping it would be fixed under warranty.

at present no, it's not an NCT fail. they are trying to bring it in that in future that fully removing the DPF is. but what they are trying to implement will only be a visual check for the presence of a DPF and not actually analyzing what comes out the exhaust. For this reason a lot of people seem to be gutting (removing the inner workings) of the DPF but leaving the unit itself of the car and adjusting the ECU settings so the car will still run ok without it.

this is probably your cheapest and best option. lots of places offer this service.

Atomic Pineapple

Avatar MIA wrote: »

It's also due for NCT - would removing the DPF make it a fail?

I think its been said that its a visual check for the DPF in the NCT or there is talk of it coming in, so gutting it on the inside is the option to go with. Doing this, getting the EGR valve error cleared and then blocking the EGR valve is likely to be your cheapest option.

Avatar MIA

jimgoose wrote: »

Give it a good hiding on a motorway every now-and-then.

That's key alright.

Would have changed to petrol, but anytime I looked into selling the likely sales price put me off.

Anyone want a top of the range 2.4 JTDM (sunroof included) with just a little work to do on the ingenious PDF :pac:

magentis

Whats the miles on it?

Avatar MIA

Atomic Pineapple wrote: »

I think its been said that its a visual check for the DPF in the NCT or there is talk of it coming in, so gutting it on the inside is the option to go with. Doing this, getting the EGR valve error cleared and then blocking the EGR valve is likely to be your cheapest option.

Gotcha! Thanks

Avatar MIA

magentis wrote: »

Whats the miles on it?

94k miles

bob11

Here's another company that should be able to help :

http://dpfdublin.ie/

Avatar MIA

bob11 wrote: »

Here's another company that should be able to help :

http://dpfdublin.ie/

Thanks, it'd not make Dublin from where I live.

boosabum

i'd say €500 would have you back to normal service, not a huge amount really when you have a good car

millington

splashthecash wrote: »

Why not buy a KIA Diesel new, and have a 7 year warranty with it?

Because it's a Kia and not an Alfa. Although, if reliability was a priority, I dunno why he went for an Alfa anyway :pac:

Get the DPF removed and the EGR mapped out of it. €450 or so. Once it's done right will pass NCT no problem.

Avatar MIA

boosabum wrote: »

i'd say €500 would have you back to normal service, not a huge amount really when you have a good car

This is great news really.

I do love the car, but would hate to put €3k into her at this stage.

Fatswaldo

DPF on an08 BMW 520d removed and ECU remap 2 years ago was €450. Great job! More power, better economy, no bother with NCT - till now anyway.

Avatar MIA

millington wrote: »

I dunno why he went for an Alfa anyway :pac:

Because you HAVE to own one alfa in your life time. It's a law or something.

Previous to the Alfa I owned a Saab 9-3, so yeah I like to live dangerously. :pac:

Avatar MIA

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

at present no, it's not an NCT fail. they are trying to bring it in that in future that fully removing the DPF is. but what they are trying to implement will only be a visual check for the presence of a DPF and not actually analyzing what comes out the exhaust. For this reason a lot of people seem to be gutting (removing the inner workings) of the DPF but leaving the unit itself of the car and adjusting the ECU settings so the car will still run ok without it.

this is probably your cheapest and best option. lots of places offer this service.

Missed this post. Thanks

Avatar MIA

Thanks for your advice so far. It's been a great help.

I plan to go with your advice and I'll let ye know how I got on.

Once that's sorted I'll put €50 into the Boards.ie Santa Strike Force and ye can all take the Cosmic Karma benefit.

StereoSound

Those 159s are stunning to look at. I briefly owned a 156 a few moons ago and it was a looker but not really a go'er. Let me down a lot. I believe the 159 to have a better reliability reputation.

MarkR

That http://www.thedpfclinic.ie/reconditioning-vs-removal/ section site was pretty informative actually

Avatar MIA

StereoSound wrote: »

Those 159s are stunning to look at. I briefly owned a 156 a few moons ago and it was a looker but not really a go'er. Let me down a lot. I believe the 159 to have a better reliability reputation.

Had a problem with the injectors €110 fix (no fun on the Dublin to Limerick motorway), the tyres are silly prices (cant bring myself to type the price in) and it does like to eat them. Other than that it's been good to me.

Avatar MIA

MarkR wrote: »

That http://www.thedpfclinic.ie/reconditioning-vs-removal/ section site was pretty informative actually

Food for thought! vested interest?

boosabum

Actually being informative, removal of DPF & associated remap adds maybe 50bhp to performance which is a modification. Be a bitch to get caught out on something like this if there ever was an accident or incident.

Avatar MIA

boosabum wrote: »

Actually being informative, removal of DPF & associated remap adds maybe 50bhp to performance which is a modification. Be a bitch to get caught out on something like this if there ever was an accident or incident.

Hmm - would possibly cause problems when selling.

Also didn't like the thought of the ECU reverting and the car thinking it had a DPF again.

Avatar MIA

boosabum wrote: »

Actually being informative, removal of DPF & associated remap adds maybe 50bhp to performance which is a modification. Be a bitch to get caught out on something like this if there ever was an accident or incident.

Just speculation. Would the insurance still pay out third party, just not comprehensive?

boosabum

i think insurance providers are obliged to pay out third party regardless, definitely not on comprehensive if it was modified and not declared.
best to have everything legit in case you ever decided to sell on in the future

PukkaStukka

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

at present no, it's not an NCT fail. they are trying to bring it in that in future that fully removing the DPF is. but what they are trying to implement will only be a visual check for the presence of a DPF and not actually analyzing what comes out the exhaust. For this reason a lot of people seem to be gutting (removing the inner workings) of the DPF but leaving the unit itself of the car and adjusting the ECU settings so the car will still run ok without it.

this is probably your cheapest and best option. lots of places offer this service.

NCT tester has told me that if they are aware a vehicle has had a previously fitted DPF removed then it is a fail as it is considered standard fitted emissions equipment. Now, if you got your DPF hollowed out and deleted, and all of the associated external plumbing and pipework was left in place, how is that tester to know if it has been removed or not....?

H3llR4iser

From personal experience, I would estimate that 2 out of 3 JTDm 159s sold and driving in Italy have the DPF gutted and the EGR removed (Italian regulations actually forbid ANY modification of the car period, but people still do it), and pump out about 240 hp.

If I was in your position, I wouldn't honestly think twice - it's a car that will be incredibly hard to sell anyway in the future (2.4 engine with big tax, Alfa and the Irish public and so on...), so you may as well enjoy it for a few more years without the hassle of the filters and the extra power

Tigger

PukkaStukka wrote: »

NCT tester has told me that if they are aware a vehicle has had a previously fitted DPF removed then it is a fail as it is considered standard fitted emissions equipment. Now, if you got your DPF hollowed out and deleted, and all of the associated external plumbing and pipework was left in place, how is that tester to know if it has been removed or not....?

soot coming out the back?

MarkR

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Food for thought! vested interest?

Only in that I drive a diesel (Ford focus 1.6) , and live in the area! I use the motorway most days to go to work, but I'd always be worried about big issues like that.

Pkiernan

Removing a DPF should be a criminal offence.

Diesel is filthy already without cnuts pulling the DPF's out.

Avatar MIA

MarkR wrote: »

Only in that I drive a diesel (Ford focus 1.6) , and live in the area! I use the motorway most days to go to work, but I'd always be worried about big issues like that.

Sorry, no. I didn't mean you having a vested interested. The DPF company in the link

bear1

splashthecash wrote: »

Why not buy a KIA Diesel new, and have a 7 year warranty with it?

You're telling someone who has a 200/210bhp car to go and buy a diesel KIA?
Riiight...

Avatar MIA

bear1 wrote: »

You're telling someone who has a 200/210bhp car to go and buy a diesel KIA?
Riiight...

210... or at least it was when it left the garage.

bear1

Avatar MIA wrote: »

210... or at least it was when it left the garage.

they are easily mappable to 250... just so you know

Avatar MIA

bear1 wrote: »

they are easily mappable to 250... just so you know

I do believe I have heard that before.

Usually it meant getting someone over from the UK to do it though. A proper remap that is

bear1

Nah, very easily done here too. As others have said, blank off the EGR, remove the DPF and have it switched off in the ECU and map will get you to the 250.

swarlb

Avatar MIA wrote: »

My car ('08 2.4 JTDM AR 159) was losing power and the yellow check engine light came on.

I took it into a main dealer thinking it was something to do with the injectors which caused a similar performance problem previously. No such luck.

Unfortunately I got the below response from a main dealer (not the one I originally bought from). Not sure the car is even worth that now considering Alfa depreciation...


"The E.G.R Valve has failed resulting in the Particle Filter getting blocked with carbon (Reading 100% ash content). Unfortunately what this means is that the Filter requires replacing as you cannot regenerate it when fully blocked.

I have listed the parts & fitting cost below:

Exchange EGR Valve €161.53

Particle Filter €2242.83

Gasket €8.33

Remove / Refit €295.00


Total Incl. VAT @ 13.5% €3073.23

Total at present for checking & diagnosing is €75.00 inclusive of VAT."


Any advice (apart from NEVER buy Diesel again)?

I'm not even going to read the following posts, but I will suggest that you simply blank off the EGR valve and run the car again. You will probably get some smoke from the exhaust as it clears.
See how that works out. The orange 'engine' light will stay on.
If you find the car runs ok, then simply fit a new EGR valve.
You may need to get the light turned off, or it may reset itself.
Either way, I'd be 99.99% certain all you need is an EGR valve.

Barring that... you can read the previous posts, and have you head melted with suggestions !

Avatar MIA

swarlb wrote: »

I'm not even going to read the following posts, but I will suggest that you simply blank off the EGR valve and run the car again. You will probably get some smoke from the exhaust as it clears.
See how that works out. The orange 'engine' light will stay on.
If you find the car runs ok, then simply fit a new EGR valve.
You may need to get the light turned off, or it may reset itself.
Either way, I'd be 99.99% certain all you need is an EGR valve.

Barring that... you can read the previous posts, and have you head melted with suggestions !

Blanking off the EGR, is that something that would have to be done at a garage?

Could a largely clueless 2 left handed office worker with the 159 manual do it?

MarkR

I think you need a custom plate to blank it. Not something they'd have.