Automatic transmission at traffic lights

breadmonkey

I've been driving for 10 years but recently bought my first automatic. With an automatic transmission, should I shift into neutral when stopped at traffic lights? I've googled around but there seems to be a lot of conflicting advice.

Thanks

shietpilot

No, you can leave it in drive.

cantdecide

I'd consider requesting to move this to the main forum as I believe there are for and against reasons and lots to debate. I looked into this when I had automatic cars a few years ago and from what I could determine, for mechanical reasons that I can no longer recall, it's better to leave the car in drive.

breadmonkey

Would it be possible to move it to the main forum as suggested, just to get a but more feedback?

marmurr1916

Neutral, handbrake on.

shietpilot

cantdecide wrote: »

I'd consider requesting to move this to the main forum as I believe there are for and against reasons and lots to debate. I looked into this when I had automatic cars a few years ago and from what I could determine, for mechanical reasons that I can no longer recall, it's better to leave the car in drive.

There is no difference. You can leave the car in park, neutral or drive when you are stopped.

The reason why you leave it in drive is for convenience. If you were REALLY trying to preserve the mechanics you would take it out of drive and leave it it neutral or park because in drive the engine is partly engaged with the drive train and is trying to make the car roll slowly. In the end the mechanical wear is negligible.

It's the same argument as "should I stay in first gear with the clutch in OR should I put it into neutral". Some would say the release bearing for the clutch can get worn if you stay in first gear but AGAIN, the mechanical wear is so low that it's completely negligible.

OP, do what works best for you. There is no right or wrong. You could easily put it into park instead of keeping your foot on the brake or using the handbrake. In my opinion it makes most sense staying in drive and leaving your foot on the brake pedal for convenience and easy driving, exactly what an automatic gearbox was designed for.

Alanstrainor

Moved.

I'd leave it in drive.

jca

I leave mine in drive.

biko

I leave it in Drive and just press brake.

I suppose OP is worried it'll wear the engine down, or the brakes.
It does not.

Senecio

Leave it drive so you have the option to take off quickly in case of emergency.

Toyotafanboi

If it's automated manual car, it will wear the clutch though.

I would never hold my car on the clutch while at traffic lights, that's fierce bad practise.

WacoKid

Keep in Neutral with handbrake on.

IMO saves on brake lights, brake pads, and no strain on auto box if its in D with brake pedal pressed.

Special Circumstances

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

If it's automated manual car, it will wear the clutch though.

yeah toyota multimode, the ford fusions box etc....

Leaving it in drive only for sludgepump boxes

Senecio

OSI wrote: »

Always leave mine in drive. Makes a big difference getting away from the lights to, often a good 20-30 metres down the road before the car behind has even started moving.

+1,000

This is the only country where a 30sec green light means only 4 cars get through. Everyone seems to be starting from neutral letting the car in front get 30-40m ahead before they start to move.

ION08

shietpilot wrote: »

There is no difference. You can leave the car in park, neutral or drive when you are stopped.

The reason why you leave it in drive is for convenience. If you were REALLY trying to preserve the mechanics you would take it out of drive and leave it it neutral or park because in drive the engine is partly engaged with the drive train and is trying to make the car roll slowly. In the end the mechanical wear is negligible.

It's the same argument as "should I stay in first gear with the clutch in OR should I put it into neutral". Some would say the release bearing for the clutch can get worn if you stay in first gear but AGAIN, the mechanical wear is so low that it's completely negligible.

OP, do what works best for you. There is no right or wrong. You could easily put it into park instead of keeping your foot on the brake or using the handbrake. In my opinion it makes most sense staying in drive and leaving your foot on the brake pedal for convenience and easy driving, exactly what an automatic gearbox was designed for.

Wouldn't it be more akin to being in 1st gear with the clutch halfway up (as opposed to "clutch in") so the car is moving while at the sametime forcefully preventing movement by having your other foot on the brake??


.... doesn't sound mechanically sympathetic to me tbh.

WacoKid

Senecio wrote: »

+1,000

This is the only country where a 30sec green light means only 4 cars get through. Everyone seems to be starting from neutral letting the car in front get 30-40m ahead before they start to move.

Regardless of Drive or Neutral every driver should be watching the lights and be ready to go. For a 30 sec wait I'll be 27 secs in Neutral and then 3 secs in Drive!

Chris_Heilong

Leave in drive with your foot on the brake, if you are going to be stopped for longer than a few minutes then neutral and handbrake on. Automatic cars dont like gear changes so the few the better for the transmission.

WacoKid

Put the automatic transmission into ‘Neutral’ when you’re stationary…

When stopped at traffic lights, if your vehicle has an automatic transmission, putting it into ‘Neutral’ will take the pressure off it until the traffic lights turn green, when you can put it back into ‘Drive’. When the automatic transmission is in ‘Drive’, it’s still driving the wheels even if you have your foot on the brake to keep the vehicle stationary at traffic lights, for example. If you were to take your foot off the brake, the vehicle would drive forward under power without you even pushing the accelerator since the engine is running at idle speed and is therefore driving the automatic transmission.

Considering how much time the vehicle spends at traffic lights at a standstill, it’s best for the automatic transmission to be in ‘Neutral’ while stationary. Automatic transmissions are highly complicated, sensitive pieces of machinery. Relieving the tension in it by putting it into ‘Neutral’ when you’re stationary and waiting around will go a long way to keeping it in the best possible condition and avoiding unnecessary wear and tear.

irishgrover

I put mine in neutral with handbrake if necessary. The only reason for this is to make the life of the person sitting behind me a little less painful.
'cause if there are at all like me they ****ing hate sitting (especially in wet dark conditions) inches from a set of active bright break lights at eye level.....

Toyotafanboi

OSI wrote: »

Specifically states in the Owners Manual of my own to leave it drive with foot on the brakes when stopped at traffic lights, unless stopped for an extended period of time.

Your's is DSG?

If we are discussing the merits of staying in drive versus shifting to neutral, we should specify what kind of auto transmission we are talking about.

Will save a few rows :P

Nate--IRL--

Everybody hates ******* who stand on their brakes for 5 minutes at a long set of lights, at night. Blinding.

Into Neutral and handbrake on, if there for more than 20-30 seconds.

Nate

goz83

I leave mine in Drive and press the brake hold (E200), so my feet can rest flat on the floor, rather than manually pressing the brake. If I am going to be at the lights for more than a minute, I will put in neutral and still have the brake hold on. I never use the parking brake (not really a hand brake in many autos) unless I am parking on an uneven surface (hill etc). Twice in recent times, I have heard of parking brake release failures, leaving the cars effectively broken down. On one occasion, my own parking brake was still semi engaged after I had released it and it took a couple of pulls to get it to disengage. IMO, the parking brake should only be used on a hill and only if driving a manual transmission. Otherwise, it should only be used when parking.

goz83

Nate--IRL-- wrote: »

Everybody hates ******* who stand on their brakes for 5 minutes at a long set of lights, at night. Blinding.

Into Neutral and handbrake on, if there for more than 20-30 seconds.

Nate

Everyone must hate over 90% of other road users then

Chris_Heilong

You would fail your driving test if you switch to neutral at lights, my sister done her test in an automatic and failed one test because of this, the tester asked why she did this and she said her instructor told her to, the tester recommended finding someone else who actually knew what they were talking about, she passed you next test by not putting car into neutral at lights.

You should rarely if ever have to put you car into neutral.

vintagevrs

The best thing is use your left foot to brake, and keep revs at around 3k rpm with your right foot. This will ensure that engine doesn't get too cold and sounds really cool to any passers by. Keep an eye on the other set of lights that are green and wait for them to change to red. This is time to increase revs to 4.5k rpm as your light is about to change. As soon as the red light goes out, release your left foot from the brake and away you go.

*I am not a mechanic, and have no qualification in the internal mechanics of gearboxes.

franer1970

The stop/start system in my VW Golf DSG only works if the selector is in drive, so I leave it in drive.
But then again if the engine's not turning I guess it can't do any harm.

koutoubia

goz83 wrote:

I leave mine in Drive and press the brake hold (E200), so my feet can rest flat on the floor, rather than manually pressing the brake. If I am going to be at the lights for more than a minute, I will put in neutral and still have the brake hold on. I never use the parking brake (not really a hand brake in many autos) unless I am parking on an uneven surface (hill etc). Twice in recent times, I have heard of parking brake release failures, leaving the cars effectively broken down. On one occasion, my own parking brake was still semi engaged after I had released it and it took a couple of pulls to get it to disengage. IMO, the parking brake should only be used on a hill and only if driving a manual transmission. Otherwise, it should only be used when parking.

If it's the W211 model I would be worried about the lifespan of your SBC module as it has a limited life before shutting down.
Also when your Parking hold is on your brake lights are lit up.

Frynge

goz83 wrote: »

Everyone must hate over 90% of other road users then

I think I speak for everyone when I tell you they do.

Del2005

WacoKid wrote: »

Put the automatic transmission into ‘Neutral’ when you’re stationary…

When stopped at traffic lights, if your vehicle has an automatic transmission, putting it into ‘Neutral’ will take the pressure off it until the traffic lights turn green, when you can put it back into ‘Drive’. When the automatic transmission is in ‘Drive’, it’s still driving the wheels even if you have your foot on the brake to keep the vehicle stationary at traffic lights, for example. If you were to take your foot off the brake, the vehicle would drive forward under power without you even pushing the accelerator since the engine is running at idle speed and is therefore driving the automatic transmission.

Considering how much time the vehicle spends at traffic lights at a standstill, it’s best for the automatic transmission to be in ‘Neutral’ while stationary. Automatic transmissions are highly complicated, sensitive pieces of machinery. Relieving the tension in it by putting it into ‘Neutral’ when you’re stationary and waiting around will go a long way to keeping it in the best possible condition and avoiding unnecessary wear and tear.

That's not what my last , Accord, and current ,GS450h, owners manual tell me to do. Both say stick it in drive and take it out when parking.

ION08

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

You would fail your driving test if you switch to neutral at lights, my sister done her test in an automatic and failed one test because of this, the tester asked why she did this and she said her instructor told her to, the tester recommended finding someone else who actually knew what they were talking about, she passed you next test by not putting car into neutral at lights.

You should rarely if ever have to put you car into neutral.

In fairness, an Irish driving test isn't exactly the barometer when it comes to what is right.

If it was we'd all be in neutral yanking up the handbrake (aka PARKING brake / Emergency brake) the moment a car becomes stationary, like those old biddies in their Micras.

hi5

A traditional auto transmission (torque converter) will not wear when held in drive, all that's happening is the fluid being slushed around inside and that's about it, there is no solid friction.
But changing from d to n creates friction in the selector and the valve body.

The brakes won't wear unless the car is moving, which it won't be at the lights.

bazz26

Always leave it in Drive, have an electronic parking brake with auto hold so it doesn't move until I touch the accelerator again. Almost never use Neutral.

_Kaiser_

I always leave mine (and I've had several automatics now both DSG-style and traditional) in D with ny foot on the brake.. or if I'll be there a few mins I might put on the parking brake (in my current and last 2 cars this is electronic and automatically releases when the accelerator is pressed)

Causes no issues that I've seen and the advantage is you are usually halfway through the junction when other cars are only starting to roll.

JBokeh

Leave it in drive, or stick it in park if you want to frighten the people behind you when your reverse lights flash on.

Theres a function in my brothers car just for traffic lights, it is called launch control, not to be used when you're second in the queue

Stephenc66

32yrs years of driving automatics and I don't think I have put one in neutral when stopped at lights and never had a problem

Melodeon

vintagevrs wrote: »

The best thing is use your left foot to brake, and keep revs at around 3k rpm with your right foot. This will ensure that engine doesn't get too cold and sounds really cool to any passers by. Keep an eye on the other set of lights that are green and wait for them to change to red. This is time to increase revs to 4.5k rpm as your light is about to change. As soon as the red light goes out, release your left foot from the brake and away you go.

*I am not a mechanic, and have no qualification in the internal mechanics of gearboxes.

Just in case anyone might take this seriously, this technique might be better employed at these sort of traffic lights :

frozenfrozen

I would have always thought that it would be better to go into neutral rather than staying in drive but it makes sense now when it's put that way. I've never owned an automatic so I haven't done any damage with my other thinking anyway.
I have no issue with staying in first gear with the clutch all the way in at lights either, unless I know I'll be stopped for longer than 10 or so seconds. So there's no way the wear would be worse than that in an auto with torque converter.

What about CVT or DCT? I presume it's the exact same deal?

I was watching a guy doing a long term review of his porsche gt3 and he had to pull both of the gear paddles in and hold them when coming up to a full stop, so the car would drop into neutral. No way could I deal with something as clunky as that especially in such an expensive car.

freddieot

I keep mine in drive with my foot on the brake. If I know I'll be stopped for a very long time then I press the Hill Stop switch which allows me to take my foot off the brake. Those situations are usually rare.

If there was an accident ahead or something like that and I expected a very long delay then I'd use park and the handbrake. Don't see much real need for Neutral except to go through an automatic car wash with the engine running.

Boskowski

marmurr1916 wrote: »

Neutral, handbrake on.

lol, is that the same logic people apply when driving at dusk with parking lights on, to save electricity?

Mycroft H

First car at the lights? D with the footbrake. Anywhere else? N with handbrake.

vintagevrs

I am astounded at the amount of people that put their auto into N when stopping for a light. A DCT/DSG style box will have the clutch disengaged so no issue as far as I am aware. Can't see any issue on a torque converter auto either.

It would be a pain in the ass doing that all the time.

goz83

koutoubia wrote: »

If it's the W211 model I would be worried about the lifespan of your SBC module as it has a limited life before shutting down.
Also when your Parking hold is on your brake lights are lit up.

This is true....the brake is applied after all.

Mycroft H wrote: »

First car at the lights? D with the footbrake. Anywhere else? N with handbrake.

I hate when the hand brake is down beside the foot brake. It's so awkward squeezing into the foot-well to get my hand to it.



parking brake

alwald

I always keep mine on Drive, I never used neutral in all the automatics that I drove/owned...having said that there is a risk in case the car behind you will hit you and you are injured or under shock then what will happen? most likely your car will hit the car in front of you because the gearbox in on D and there is no handbrake and then if the insurance will find out that you were at a traffic light and that you didn't use N and handbrake what will happen?? well I am unsure about this to be honest.

For convenience I leave it on drive but that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.

shietpilot

alwald wrote: »

and then if the insurance will find out that you were at a traffic light and that you didn't use N and handbrake what will happen?? well I am unsure about this to be honest.

Hardly now.

If you can pass a driving test while keeping the car in drive then is no way in hell an insurance company won't pay out because you were in drive :pac:

That's like saying the insurance company won't pay out because your radio is on and distracted you :rolleyes:

Falcon L

My current and last cars both kicked out the drive when stopped in D. Taking the foot off the brake brings it back in.

hoodie6029

The most important reason for applying the handbrake or putting the car in park when stopped is being missed here.
If you are hit from behind your handbrake stops you from rolling out of the junction or into other cars. If you are in drive and you are hit you foot will come off the brake and you will roll forward, possibly hitting cars/people and causing more damage.

alwald

shietpilot wrote: »

Hardly now.

If you can pass a driving test while keeping the car in drive then is no way in hell an insurance company won't pay out because you were in drive :pac:

That's like saying the insurance company won't pay out because your radio is on and distracted you :rolleyes:

Well I read about situations where they calculate the distance between 2 cars and the speed to understand why the accident happened, for instance if there is 2 meters between my car and the car in front of me then having the brake on and the gearbox on N would prevent my car from hitting the car in front me in case my car is hit from behind, same logic can be applied to leaving the gearbox on D and no handbrake. Some cars now are equipped with external cameras and as such distances can be calculated......yeah I know it's not easy but its possible and the insurance would do so if the bill is expensive.

JoeA3

Another DSG here and it's coupled with an auto handbrake. I've never put the car in neutral and I've never applied the handbrake

I pull up to lights and lightly press brake. I don't need to keep brake pressed. Auto hold kicks in (and rear brake lights stay lit, probably to the annoyance of some behind me).
Touch accelerator again and auto hold disengages and away I go.

bmwguy

I put mine over into sport setting if I am first at the lights for an even more impressive getaway 😂

Only messing I leave it in drive usually, sometimes I put it in neutral if I think I'll be there a while but never really thought about it that much.

gctest50

hoodie6029 wrote: »

,,,,,,,,
If you are hit from behind your handbrake stops you from rolling out of the junction or into other cars.

maybe

jca

alwald wrote: »

Well I read about situations where they calculate the distance between 2 cars and the speed to understand why the accident happened, for instance if there is 2 meters between my car and the car in front of me then having the brake on and the gearbox on N would prevent my car from hitting the car in front me in case my car is hit from behind, same logic can be applied to leaving the gearbox on D and no handbrake. Some cars now are equipped with external cameras and as such distances can be calculated......yeah I know it's not easy but its possible and the insurance would do so if the bill is expensive.

Wha?? The guy who hits the car in the back is wrong, simple.