Please can we have some driving manners?

Babooshka

This morning I allowed 3 cars to pull out of a side road to my left, which is always very busy. They were going left into the road I was driving on, and seeing as the traffic lights about 30m in front of me were red, I thought I would show some driving manners and let them out, after all, we're not going anywhere for a minute or two anyway, 3 more cars in front of us isn't going to stop anyone getting to where they need to go.

Cue the completely mannerless person behind me beep beeping at me and shaking his fist. FFS, are you going to perform heart surgery on someone this morning perhaps? Can people not show some common decent manners and have patience, we're all going to get through the next set of lights and letting a couple of cars out into a space where the lights are red anyway is not going to end the world. Just raise my blood pressure with your beepety f*cking beeping and fist shaking you mannerless ape. Now F*ck off.

Rant over

seamus

Well you see from his point of view, you're letting those cars in a space that you both could occupy, and increasing the liklihood that he won't get through the lights on the next change.

To be honest, letting one person out is considerate. Letting two out is generous. Any more than that and you're being inconsiderate to the traffic behind you.

You're right in that nobody has anywhere urgent to be, but that includes the traffic sitting in the side-road. They too can wait

SteM

I did a similar to thing last week only for the dope behind me - who could see exactly what I was doing - to take the opportunity to pull around me. By the time he gotten around me 2 cars had pulled out from our left and he ended up stuck in a box junction.

Babooshka

SteM wrote: »

I did a similar to thing last week only for the dope behind me - who could see exactly what I was doing - to take the opportunity to pull around me. By the time he gotten around me 2 cars had pulled out from our left and he ended up stuck in a box junction.

Why are people so "falling down" these days? :mad:

SteM

Babooshka wrote: »

Why are people so "falling down" these days? :mad:

I think that people are driven mad by the amount of traffic on the road to be honest. There's no way I'd be sane at the end of a working week if I commuted by car ever day.

Babooshka

seamus wrote: »

Well you see from his point of view, you're letting those cars in a space that you both could occupy, and increasing the liklihood that he won't get through the lights on the next change.

To be honest, letting one person out is considerate. Letting two out is generous. Any more than that and you're being inconsiderate to the traffic behind you.

You're right in that nobody has anywhere urgent to be, but that includes the traffic sitting in the side-road. They too can wait

Oh I totally agree and take this busy road every day, most days I'd only let one or two max out, it's just how the traffic ambles so slowly forward, no one moves fast so you don't know if you move if you're going to make it through enough to get out of the yellow junction box and block traffic to your right trying to turn right in front of you so you have to also allow for that, it's a fine balancing act, but like, one more car on a day when the traffic is crawling, if that's going to cause some nob to have a seizure then sorry but deal with it.

CiniO

Letting 3 cars is just rude to drivers behind you.
Generally best way to do is to use zip method so one from each side at a time if its busy.
One person stopping blocking traffic like you did OP to let whole bunch of cars from side road is not the right thing to do.
I'd never let in .more than one.

Letting 3 cars out is not on, you will cause people behind you to miss a sequence of the lights or even longer I'd be blowing the horn if I was behind you. I will let one car out in these situations and get tight behind them to prevent a second car coming out.

You are also holding yourself up too that's the stupid thing.

Babooshka

CiniO wrote: »

Letting 3 cars is just rude to drivers behind you.
Generally best way to do is to use zip method so one from each side at a time if its busy.
One person stopping blocking traffic like you did OP to let whole bunch of cars from side road is not the right thing to do.
I'd never let in .more than one.[/QUOTE

As I just tried to explain above above, I wasn't blocking any traffic, this all took two seconds, for the cars to go through and for us to begin moving before my laddo behind me had his mickey fit. "A whole bunch of cars" is 3 cars which isn't much in seconds to be honest. Yes normally I'd only let one or two but as I explained the traffic was crawling and a car to my right needed to come in front of me and was entitled to do so as there was a yellow junction box in front of me I was conscious not to block, if I had panic moved because of the nob behind me beeping at me I'd have blocked the car to my right. You sound exactly like the type of person who would beep your horn and wave your fist at someone for the sake of a couple of seconds. Both myself and the car behind me made it through the next green light so I didn't block anything.

Babooshka

Georgia Elegant Cocktail wrote: »

Letting 3 cars out is not on, you will cause people behind you to miss a sequence of the lights or even longer I'd be blowing the horn if I was behind you. I will let one car out in these situations and get tight behind them to prevent a second car coming out.

You are also holding yourself up too that's the stupid thing.

See my explanation to the poster above you. No one missed the next green light. You sound like an impatient bunch on here... or you're just lacking understanding of the situation, he didn't need to beep like that, we were all going to make the next green light. I let 3 cars who were quick out, when normally maybe I would only let one but bla bla see my other post.

Alun

Babooshka wrote: »

No one missed the next green light.

Maybe not in this particular instance, but I've had this happen on many occasions at a junction with a notoriously short green cycle near me.

It can sometimes take 4 or 5 green cycles when it's busy for me to get through, and when someone in front decides to let a car out from parking outside the shop just before the junction who's only just that second jumped into their car whereas I've been patiently waiting for 5-10 minutes, causing me to miss yet another green cycle, yes I'll get annoyed.

CiniO

Well OP rules of right of way are set by law, and its not your job to amend them.
Nothing wrong to show a bit of courtesy and let someone from the side, but stopping to let several car and blocking those from behind is not right thing to do

bucketybuck

Babooshka wrote: »

you're just lacking understanding of the situation

You lack understanding of the situation. The biggest problem on a lot of busy roads are the feeder roads, namely people trying to get onto a full road causing that same road to back up further and further.

Those three cars had minimal impact on you and the car behind you, instead the impact was felt about 10/20 cars back, as the tailback grew longer and longer with the resulting impact on other feeder roads and other drivers joining the queue further and further back. Its the same principle as the guy on a motorway hitting his brakes which ends up causing a traffic jam 20 minutes later. Wave dynamics and all that science stuff.

You think you are helping by sitting and letting a feeder road empty out onto the main road, but to help those three cars you adversely affected a lot more. That doesn't mean you shouldn't let people join the road, but no need to go overboard.

Alun

Whatever about letting people out when it's nose to tail traffic, what really grinds my gears is people stopping to let people out when it's only them and me on the road for miles either way. The person trying to get out would usually have got out all by themselves quicker if 'mister polite' in front had simply just carried on at his normal speed.

robbie99

Manners is everyone letting one car out at a time. If you did that during the driving test you'd fail for lack of progress.

Babooshka

Alun wrote: »

Whatever about letting people out when it's nose to tail traffic, what really grinds my gears is people stopping to let people out when it's only them and me on the road for miles either way. The person trying to get out would usually have got out all by themselves quicker if 'mister polite' in front had simply just carried on at his normal speed.

Well that's a totally different situation.

draiochtanois

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Babooshka

You're all very sarky and caustic this morning, did someone block you on the way into work? I must say I don't much care for the tone of the majority of you.

Probably would have failed the driving test indeed. But as mentioned ad nauseum - when the traffic is moving fluidly I'd keep going but it was backed up to the junction box and only moving intermittently as cars ambled up further towards the lights in first gear as the lights were red. It didn't hold the line up or cause a tailback that wasn't already there, there was a huge tailback anyway, and if I had gone ahead and moved there was a chance of being stuck in a yellow junction box, so I'd have failed in a driving test situation, anyway. Damned if you do and damned if you don't sometimes, so sometimes you just have to sit for a few seconds and see how much the traffic is going to move and if 3 cars decide they're going to move without assessing the situation themselves and they get out in front of you, I'd rather that than causing an obstruction.

A good day to all of you

This thread is seriously depressing.

Like you OP I would let a couple of cars out of a side road in that situation. As we all know about 99% of Irish drivers never even consider doing someone a favour in this way, so when the traffic is stopped and there's an opportunity for them to move in, you are quite right to let them do that.

Those criticising the OP's behaviour should be aware that if it wasn't for the (tiny minority) of drivers who let people out from side roads or let people turn right across continuous traffic, the city would come to a standstill.

The post immediately above me (edit - above but one!), for example, seems to be saying that anyone who lets anyone out of a side road is in the wrong, or shouldn't be 'directing traffic'. Jesus.

Alanstrainor

Alun wrote: »

Whatever about letting people out when it's nose to tail traffic, what really grinds my gears is people stopping to let people out when it's only them and me on the road for miles either way. The person trying to get out would usually have got out all by themselves quicker if 'mister polite' in front had simply just carried on at his normal speed.

Usually old dears who just want to get a chance to have someone wave a thanks at them after. This was my grandmother, she would come to a stop, from 50km/h on an empty road because someone was trying to join the road. Ugh...

robbie99 wrote: »

Manners is everyone letting one car out at a time. If you did that during the driving test you'd fail for lack of progress.

Beckoning anyone at all in the driving test is a grade 2 fault. You can't do it at all. However I guess if it happens naturally then that's fine.

draiochtanois

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Babooshka

draiochtanois wrote: »

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What? where did you get that from out of this?

bucketybuck

If everybody followed the rules of the road things would be a whole lot better. Instead we have thousands of people stepping outside of those rules with no understanding of the unintended consequences. Thats Ireland for you.

draiochtanois

draiochtanois wrote: »

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That's what they did - they let someone out. So what is your issue?

BTW those leaping to the defence of the scrote in the car behind - it's obviously not appropriate to use the horn in this situation so they are clearly in the wrong no matter how upset they might have been.

Alun

draiochtanois wrote: »

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There's a nice wide, open T junction near me where I regularly see people turning right from the main road stopping just short of the junction and waving on people waiting at the T junction to turn right in front of them. What's that all about?

Babooshka

Deleted User wrote: »

This thread is seriously depressing.

Like you OP I would let a couple of cars out of a side road in that situation. As we all know about 99% of Irish drivers never even consider doing someone a favour in this way, so when the traffic is stopped and there's an opportunity for them to move in, you are quite right to let them do that.

Those criticising the OP's behaviour should be aware that if it wasn't for the (tiny minority) of drivers who let people out from side roads or let people turn right across continuous traffic, the city would come to a standstill.

The post immediately above me (edit - above but one!), for example, seems to be saying that anyone who lets anyone out of a side road is in the wrong, or shouldn't be 'directing traffic'. Jesus.

Thanks I was beginning to think that no one has manners any more and everyone's a robot. Sure, every other morning I normally only let one car out maybe two - due to circumstances this morning, I hesitated to assess as I wasn't sure I could actually progress, and once you asess other drivers will just put their foot down. Instead of me accelerating and beeping them out of it, I let them ahead of me. That makes me an arsehole according to the majority. And I'm sure someone died as a result a little bit of manners never hurt anyone. All of the robots citing rules of the road...there is also a thing known as using your common sense, when you have to asess a situation. I have seen other cars full on accelerating in the position I was in, only to end up going nowhere, in the junction box and blocking the traffic turning right, because they were adamant they had right of way and weren't letting the cars to their left out no matter what. So they still end up blocking the road.

draiochtanois

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Babooshka

draiochtanois wrote: »

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Semantics for breakfast. I think you're in need of the ride myself. Morning to you anyway.

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

If everybody followed the rules of the road things would be a whole lot better. Instead we have thousands of people stepping outside of those rules with no understanding of the unintended consequences. Thats Ireland for you.

You are dead right.

I personally LOVE sitting in a huge line of traffic because EVERY member of a traffic jam coming in the opposite direction is refusing to make way and allow the car holding us all up to turn right.

I mean, it's not in the rules of the road, and there's no 'yield' sign, so they are dead right to slowly crawl forward to sit stationary whilst blocking the side road. And thank God they are not stupid enough to beckon anyone across. That's dangerous!

This is what you want - correct?

Squatman

Babooshka wrote: »

This morning I allowed 3 cars to pull out of a side road to my left, which is always very busy. They were going left into the road I was driving on, and seeing as the traffic lights about 30m in front of me were red, I thought I would show some driving manners and let them out, after all, we're not going anywhere for a minute or two anyway, 3 more cars in front of us isn't going to stop anyone getting to where they need to go.

Cue the completely mannerless person behind me beep beeping at me and shaking his fist. FFS, are you going to perform heart surgery on someone this morning perhaps? Can people not show some common decent manners and have patience, we're all going to get through the next set of lights and letting a couple of cars out into a space where the lights are red anyway is not going to end the world. Just raise my blood pressure with your beepety f*cking beeping and fist shaking you mannerless ape. Now F*ck off.

Rant over

I think the main problem people would have with you in this situation is that YOU decided that the people behind you should not progress. I would have been annoyed in this situation too. You personally decided that it was more important to let other people progress, whilst holding people who had the right of way to progress up. You have a duty to the cars driving behind you, and you failed in this . Stopping to let a car out could cause an accident behind you (although you claim you were stopped anyway).

if you think everyone else is wrong, then the problem lies with you.

Finally, a proposal, start a Poll, and see who thinks you were right. Its okay to let 1 out in stop start traffic, but stop being a gombeen letting more out.

draiochtanois

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Squatman

Squatman wrote: »

You have a duty to the cars driving behind you, and you failed in this .

Can you quote the relevant legislation and / or section of the rules of the road that talks about this 'duty', or are you just making it up?

This really is depressing, but on the plus side the appalling quality of driving in Dublin is beginning to make sense.

Babooshka

draiochtanois wrote: »

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Thank you so much for helping me see the light I am sure you're aware how helpful and not condescending your tone is. Your last post was just asking for it to be honest.

Babooshka

Deleted User wrote: »

Can you quote the relevant legislation and / or section of the rules of the road that talks about this 'duty', or are you just making it up?

This really is depressing, but on the plus side the appalling quality of driving in Dublin is beginning to make sense.

it is indeed - if the mannerless and condescending posting is also applied to their driving as well. You're right, it is depressing, I am out of here, thank you for a little understanding this morning.

bucketybuck

Deleted User wrote: »

You are dead right.

I personally LOVE sitting in a huge line of traffic because EVERY member of a traffic jam coming in the opposite direction is refusing to make way and allow the car holding us all up to turn right.

I mean, it's not in the rules of the road, and there's no 'yield' sign, so they are dead right to slowly crawl forward to sit stationary whilst blocking the side road. And thank God they are not stupid enough to beckon anyone across. That's dangerous!

This is what you want - correct?

You seem to have quite the chip on your shoulder.

Tarzana2

I was brought up in a household where blowing the horn was considered to be, except in extreme circumstances, pig ignorant. Letting a couple more cars than perhaps you should is not an extreme circumstance. Annoying, yes, but deal with it. Blowing the horn acheives precisely nothing, is just going to get people's backs up and is, quite frankly, boorish behaviour.

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

You seem to have quite the chip on your shoulder.

You seem to have no counter-argument whatsoever.

Your position is that everyone should simply follow the rules of the road and not use their judgement. Is that correct? That appears to be what you said.

Man I would love to sit next to you in a car whilst every single person in an oncoming traffic jam inched pointlessly into the space over a side road as you try to turn right.

Babooshka

bucketybuck wrote: »

You seem to have quite the chip on your shoulder.

Bit rich accusing one of the mannerly and rational people on this thread of having a chip on their shoulder. "That's driving in Ireland for you" really? Go to Mumbai and have a drive around, then tell me we have a problem.

curiosity

You're more right than wrong, OP (imho)

bucketybuck

Babooshka wrote: »

Bit rich accusing one of the mannerly and rational people on this thread of having a chip on their shoulder. "That's driving in Ireland for you" really? Go to Mumbai and have a drive around, then tell me we have a problem.

I'm sorry that you didn't get a load of replies patting you on the back for your graciousness on the road, truly we are a nation of oafs indeed. But still my point remains true, it would be better for all to consider the wider implications of your actions instead of only seeing the horn basher behind and the 3 wise men in front.

bucketybuck

Deleted User wrote: »

You seem to have no counter-argument whatsoever.

Your position is that everyone should simply follow the rules of the road and not use their judgement. Is that correct? That appears to be what you said.

Man I would love to sit next to you in a car whilst every single person in an oncoming traffic jam inched pointlessly into the space over a side road as you try to turn right.

And you appear to have no interest in what I said beyond using it as a base for a strawman. It all seems very personal for you, I hope we didn't stir up some bad memories.

Babooshka

bucketybuck wrote: »

I'm sorry that you didn't get a load of replies patting you on the back for your graciousness on the road, truly we are a nation of oafs indeed. But still my point remains true, it would be better for all to consider the wider implications of your actions instead of only seeing the horn basher behind and the 3 wise men in front.

No I don't need pats on the back, I was having a rant because of a bad mannered piggy person behind me beeping at me to move when there was nowhere to move forward to, as the cars in front were crawling - see previous posts of which there were many explaining why the cars got out in front of me. I am just surprised there are so many piggy types posting here too, but there seems to be a lot of it about. It explains why we have so many bad mannered drivers also though.

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

And you appear to have no interest in what I said beyond using it as a base for a strawman. It all seems very personal for you, I hope we didn't stir up some bad memories.

Do you think people should use their judgement and exercise courtesy or not?

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

And you appear to have no interest in what I said beyond using it as a base for a strawman. It all seems very personal for you, I hope we didn't stir up some bad memories.

"If everybody followed the rules of the road things would be a whole lot better."

straw man?

Firstly, I am not entirely sure why remaining stationary and allowing cars to join the road from the left is against the rules of the road - can you explain?

Second, if your position is that we should all keep driving unless explicitly told otherwise, have the decency to own it and defend it rather than sending rather odd and personal speculations about other posters.

If that isn't your position then let us know.

Ave Sodalis

Babooshka wrote:

No I don't need pats on the back, I was having a rant because of a bad mannered piggy person behind me beeping at me to move when there was nowhere to move forward to, as the cars in front were crawling - see previous posts of which there were many explaining why the cars got out in front of me. I am just surprised there are so many piggy types posting here too, but there seems to be a lot of it about. It explains why we have so many bad mannered drivers also though.

And yet unless they agree with you entirely, you seem to have a very poor opinion of people who have any objection to anything you say or do.

Deleted User wrote:

Do you think people should use their judgement and exercise courtesy or not?

There's a difference between letting out a car, and letting out three. One is courtesy but letting out three cannot be courtesy when you're displaying none for the people behind you. If you want to be courteous, do so. Letting out 3 cars isn't courteous.

Babooshka

sup_dude wrote: »

And yet unless they agree with you entirely, you seem to have a very poor opinion of people who have any objection to anything you say or do.



There's a difference between letting out a car, and letting out three. One is courtesy but letting out three cannot be courtesy when you're displaying none for the people behind you. If you want to be courteous, do so. Letting out 3 cars isn't courteous.

Re your first point, I am only referring to those who keep giving smart answers and have from the outset, they got the same back from me, and no one else has. In relation to your second point, I have explained and re explained, I did not stop to let them through, I was stopped to asses whether or not I could progress, which I believed that no I could not, as the car to my right wanted to turn into my path and had every right to, there being a junction box in front of me. Sigh. I am more tired after this than the actual event and I am done explaining now.

Edit: I did not stop specifically to let them through, I stopped to assess and they made for it because they're stuck there every morning for ages which is why when you stop you can expect this but I am not going to skip assessing whether it is safe to continue or not because I don't want to let a car out.

KwackerJack

Driving manners, in Ireland

sup_dude

sup_dude wrote: »

There's a difference between letting out a car, and letting out three. One is courtesy but letting out three cannot be courtesy when you're displaying none for the people behind you. If you want to be courteous, do so. Letting out 3 cars isn't courteous.

I think it very much depends on the context - if there is a large tailback in the side road that has not moved for some time (which would be possible to observe as the OP approached), I think it would be entirely appropriate to let three cars out.

It is interesting that in many places in Dublin yellow boxes are painted to explicitly enforce this behaviour. A good example is here.

There are at least four car lengths covered by the yellow box at that junction, painted solely to allow multiple cars out of a side road when the light is red.

In the absence of a yellow box but in a similar situation, I see no issue in a polite driver extending such a courtesy using their own judgement - whether I was behind them or not.

bmstuff

This guy thought I had manners but I used my horn and my fist

One of those dickheads on getting into Sandyford from the M50 trying to skip the traffic queue turning right only.
He basically prevented his lane from turning left for about 2mn.

Too many of those muppets on the roads
Nevermind the timestamp on the video, I never got around of setting up tine on the camera

bucketybuck

Babooshka wrote: »

No I don't need pats on the back

Perhaps a pat on the head would be appropriate?

Deleted User wrote: »

If that isn't your position then let us know.

I see no need to repeat my very clear and concise original post simply to help you understand it better. You seem determined to misrepresent it, but luckily that doesn't bother me much.

bucketybuck

bucketybuck wrote: »

I see no need to repeat my very clear and concise original post simply to help you understand it better. You seem determined to misrepresent it, but luckily that doesn't bother me much.

"If everybody followed the rules of the road things would be a whole lot better. Instead we have thousands of people stepping outside of those rules with no understanding of the unintended consequences. Thats Ireland for you."

I think I owe you an apology.

Nowhere in the rules of the road does it suggest you should not allow traffic to join from the left if it is safe to do so.

It does explicitly limit use of the horn, and clearly the driver the OP was complaining about was breaking the rules of the road.

You were agreeing with the OP. Like I say, apologies.