Creating an online business - How to begin?

dabler

Hi,

Just looking for some advice here from some people who may have had to make similar decisions when creating a business.

I am a software developer and I have a business idea.

I want to know should I approach this idea by myself and make my own website, take care of my own hosting, website design and implementation etc. or should I just take the fast route and pay somebody to make the site for me?

Of course there are adv/disadv's to each approach...

- Will have to learn web development (I'm a developer but do not have web exp)
- Making my own site will therefore take some time

- Presumably, hiring a web developer will see the idea go live more quickly
- But it will cost a lot more money

Also, in the long run, am I tied down to using that web developer for future features of the site or does the developer generally supply the code for the site for me to maintain myself?

Apologies for all the newbie questions, this is my first foray into business pretty much

Thanks,
dabler

smash

What languages do you know? Surely you can create the back end and bare bones of it and then hire a front end dev/designer to pretty it up for you?

jimmii

Only you can really answer which is going to be the best option for you really. The off the shelf packages that drag and drop sites offer have come a hell of a long way in the last few years to such an extent that if you approach a developer their first suggestion is likely to be to use one of them.

To start with its certainly a lot cheaper to take the DIY approach all it really takes is a bit of time and some design nous then if things take off them you can perhaps look at a custom option. At this time of year the developer route might not take any less time than doing it yourself I was quoted 10 days at £500/day for a build based on woo commerce just to give you an idea of the cost.

dabler

Thanks for the quick replies!

I work backend, so I know sql, relational databases, java.

@smash I know what you're saying but in researching the front end there just seems to me to be a big upturn in the use of javascript to create an end-to-end application...for example use of mongodb (json-based), express, angularjs, nodejs - that's all you need really and it's all javascript. I was thinking that learning js would really benefit me in terms of being able to work the front and back end myself in future...only problem being I'd have to learn all this :-|

@jimmii
Thanks for the example, that seems like an awful lot of money :-o
I'm really only starting here by myself.

I suppose I should try not to get buried down in the tech details and just launch a beta site or something, test the market out. Hopefully I should be capable of thrashing out something basic by myself. Thereafter, I guess I can revisit this thread heh

jimmii

Some very big sites are just WordPress nothing wrong with using that sort of thing.

What area is it going to be? As long as the product is right the website only needs to be use able and to look trustworthy and it's fine.

Good luck!

Nika Bolokov

Hi OP,

First check the type of business you want. Sole Trader or company. Google will help you find out which is best for you.

The best way to go when starting out is to build your own website. Its far easier than you might think. If your business takes off maybe consider getting a professional but for now solutions like squarespace, wix or wordpress will get you online pretty quick cheaply. All of these allow for payment gateways to be integrated by anyone.

With a web based business the key to success can by getting a suitable ranking on google. This is very difficult, takes a lot of time and there is conflicting accounts of how to do it. Youtube is your friend here I feel as you can get some helpful tutorials on how to build a site google friendly. Then tools such as seositechecker and Moz will give you some feedback on how well your site is designed. If your site doesnt rank well on Google your facing an uphill battle.

You might also consider getting a landline number that diverts to your mobile if you have no home landline and maybe a professional business address to give yourself a professional appearance on your website if your running the business from home.

All in all spend as little money as possible in the beginning until you prove your concept and please please make sure you know what your profit margin (net and gross) and breakeven point is before you start.

Axwell

Nika Bolokov wrote: »

Hi OP,

First check the type of business you want. Sole Trader or company. Google will help you find out which is best for you.

The OP asked a specific set of questions, your reply is as if you are answering a complete different person. They are asking about development and you are replying about the type of company they should setup, getting a landline and knowing their profit margin..

Relevancy to the main questions asked?

Axwell

Hi Dabler,

You havent really approached on some key questions and some of the answers here arent really relevant depending on the answers to these.

First off you said you have a business idea - so are you looking to build a web system or platform as opposed to just a website to showcase this product or service - these are two totally different things.

Wordpress etc is perfectly adequate for showcasing your services or a product or even smaller e-commerce solutions but not if you are looking to build a web system or platform.

If you are looking to build a platform then you obviously need a solid front end and will need a backend with some sort of functionality (I dont know your idea so this could be a little or a lot of development).

You are a software developer so it is unlikely you have the front end skills when it comes to doing wireframes and mockups with proper UX and UI, building a responsive solution that works across all devices and an eye for design.

On the flip side you know java, sql and relational databases so you could do some work on the backend and get so far on your own. But is it going to be polished and have a decent front end - probably not. Could you hire someone to work on this part of the project and you integrate it? Perhaps but again what kind of knowledge do you have in front end to be able to tie the two together?

If you pay someone to do it then you are looking at someone developing and designing the project. Realistically if its a web based platform it will be built on a html, css frontend with jquery/javascript and maybe some angular for displaying asynchronous content. The backend most likely done with php and MySQL. Ideally built on a front end framework that allows it to be build so its responsive and mobile/tablet friendly.

Will it cost a lot of money - it will cost whatever the development is worth based on the scope of the project - the features, if there is api integration etc - but the job will be done quicker and more importantly done right.

"Also, in the long run, am I tied down to using that web developer for future features of the site or does the developer generally supply the code for the site for me to maintain myself?"

You do up a proper contract based around who owns the ip and you get the code supplied at the end of the development when the site is deployed to the live server. IP wise you would look to own anything developed from scratch and you would license any proprietary code the developer uses for modules that they already have used/build before. For example a login module, a developer will have a module they use on all projects to look after this and reuse it. This code is proprietary to them so you dont own it but you license it and can use it as you see fit or make changes to it but you acknowledge it belongs to them. The rest of the code would be yours and you can maintain it as you see fit or hire another developer afterwards, its entirely up to you.

It depends what your plan is. Do you want to build something as a prototype, take your time doing it and learn as you go, maybe try get some funding at that stage to go further with it. Or do you have an idea that you think is really good and you want to get on it as quick as you can. bare in mind you can still pay someone to build an mvp or prototype version of the project before adding all the bells and whistles down the line. Even at a basic level you can have a clickable version based off mockups if you were looking to maybe pitch it for investment if you thought it was something that was going to get that sort of interest.

Hope that helps..good luck with it whichever way you go.

Graham

dabler wrote: »

there just seems to me to be a big upturn in the use of javascript to create an end-to-end application...for example use of mongodb (json-based), express, angularjs, nodejs

As a learning exercise for yourself any of the above would be a good choice, as a technology stack for a startup I'd be less certain.

The biggest problem with picking any 'flavour of the month' based solution is the availability and cost of resources. Someone with experience in MEAN is going to be in much higher demand and obviously much more expensive.

I'd also think carefully before jumping into a NoSQL DB like MongoDB. Do you have specific requirements that would make the most of MongoDB (high write loads, location based data, big data etc)? At least with an SQL based DB you have your own experience to fall back on.

Axwell has already mentioned PHP/MySQL and although some developers would look down their noses at the LAMP/LEMP stack the fact remains there's a gazillion developers with experience and an infinite amount of technical resources available. Throw in a framework like Laravel and you should be able to pull something together fairly quickly.

dabler

@jimmii
I've been researching sites like Wordpress too, but I was thinking they might be a little restrictive.

I do need to provide some context though so...

Basically, a user:

- can view a map on my site
- enter a location on the map on my site

It sounds very basic I know, but this is what it is at the most fundamental level.
I need some map logic in there to allow users viewing the map to filter it based on certain criteria too.

On top of that some authentication for registering as a user, and some form of integrated payment system would need to be added down the line also.

I do not have auth, payment, map experience so I'd have to bump up on that.

@Graham good points there, you've certainly made me rethink my stack choice. No, I don't have specific requirements that would make the most of MongoDB, at least not that I'm aware of yet. I suppose I just liked the simplicity of the json data storage.
I found a full tutorial online of an application that utilised the MEAN stack in making a maps application and I just thought it looked quite approachable. But you're correct, if I ran into trouble, I'd be pretty lost.

@Nika

I haven't even begun to think about the actual "business" aspects of my business, typically diving straight into development here without considering that But thanks for highlighting this, I'll have to encounter that at some point...all going well!

@Axwell
Thanks for the detailed post!
Hopefully my lines above gave some more context.

You are a software developer so it is unlikely you have the front end skills when it comes to doing wireframes and mockups with proper UX and UI, building a responsive solution that works across all devices and an eye for design.

I was hoping to just use Bootstrap, make an average looking site, but one that scales to all devices so that I could hit the mobile market without having to make an app just yet.
I do lack experience in the wireframes/mockups bit though so that's fair.

Perhaps but again what kind of knowledge do you have in front end to be able to tie the two together?

Good question. I could use Spring Webflow to transition between different pages in the application. I could write the basic flow referencing jsp's that I wish to use, but let a hired dev fill out those for me? That's a way in which I could tie the two together, using what I do know.

it will cost whatever the development is worth based on the scope of the project

Indeed, I have read now that even just using the Google Maps API costs money

It depends what your plan is. Do you want to build something as a prototype, take your time doing it and learn as you go...Or do you have an idea that you think is really good and you want to get on it as quick as you can

I've been reading The Lean Startup by Eric Ries, and it says that you should establish a customer interest first and foremost. That means building an mvp right away, and even going as far as manually carrying out the operations in the business, up to a point where you have to automate it to carry on.

I could apply this to my idea, I could manually get people's info, manually add it to the map, manually build up my database like this. I'm not so naive as to think my idea will be an instant hit, I believe in it but it doesn't mean others will use it. I'd love to really market it first and research it, get feedback so that when I do launch at least people know about it. Going straight to market with a fully-fledged app before doing research might just cost me a lot of time and effort with nobody actually using it.

These are things I have to think about I suppose. I guess I should make a prototype, seek out my target audience and see if there's even interest in this first. I have done a little research, and there is interest so far, but I haven't sampled a very sizeable market.

Nika Bolokov

Axwell wrote: »

The OP asked a specific set of questions, your reply is as if you are answering a complete different person. They are asking about development and you are replying about the type of company they should setup, getting a landline and knowing their profit margin..

Relevancy to the main questions asked?

Sometimes people from a technical background launch straight into a technical solution without considering some other important things first.

It seems this was the case with the OP

Axwell

Nika Bolokov wrote: »

Sometimes people from a technical background launch straight into a technical solution without considering some other important things first.

It seems this was the case with the OP

Very true when there is a product that people can forget to consider some of the business related matters but if the OP is going to go the self dev route which seems likely in order to first build any sort of product/platform then any of those issues are probably a few months down the line and way down the list of to do's before he has to worry about them.

Axwell

dabler wrote: »

I was hoping to just use Bootstrap, make an average looking site, but one that scales to all devices so that I could hit the mobile market without having to make an app just yet.
I do lack experience in the wireframes/mockups bit though so that's fair.

Bootstrap is decent, also maybe have a look at Foundation by Zurb - ver 6 just got released the other day. We have been using 5 lately on some projects and find it very good.

If you are doing wireframes look at Balsamiq, theres a free 30 day trial which should be enough. Not sure how your design skills are like but maybe before even going into development look at using something like Marvel or Invision to create a clickable version of the system so you can show it to a few potential users and get some feedback to see if its a viable product. Even just a few basic views to show the flow through the system and the user interaction to get the idea across and if people seem interested or the value in it then look at going further and developing a prototype.

beauf

Axwell wrote: »

Very true when there is a product that people can forget to consider some of the business related matters but if the OP is going to go the self dev route which seems likely in order to first build any sort of product/platform then any of those issues are probably a few months down the line and way down the list of to do's before he has to worry about them.

Perhaps establishing if it IS a viable business. Would be the first thing. Because if its not, those months of development are pointless. Sure develop a proof of concept for the product/service. But that is not a business. Testing is it a viable business is different to testing is worthwhile/useful product. If the business issues are months down the line, then perhaps this should be in the development forum and not the business one. They'll get better feedback there on the development/website side of things.

dabler

@Axwell

If you are doing wireframes look at Balsamiq, theres a free 30 day trial which should be enough...look at using something like Marvel or Invision to create a clickable version of the system

So, I got that 30 day free trial for Balsamiq last night and mocked up two screens.
One for each of my previously mentioned features...

Basically, a user:

- can view a map on my site
- enter a location on the map on my site

It's pretty simple, non-interactive, but it's a start, and I found Balsamiq nice to work with.
I can probably make a few more images and link them up as you say with Marvel.

I'll take a look at Foundation too, thanks.

@beauf

Good points, I guess this is the point of having a minium viable product, to be lean and reduce wasted development time without even establishing interest yet.

Testing is it a viable business is different to testing is worthwhile/useful product. If the business issues are months down the line, then perhaps this should be in the development forum and not the business one.

I think my initial questions prompted business-like answers but then this got more into development. Now that I have decided to go with making a prototype, I have a few more business-like questions...

Namely, how do I go about finding people to show my prototype to?

Thanks,
Dabler

Mrs OBumble

Where are you getting your map data from ? Is it legal for you to do what you are planning with it? (Think copyright).

What is the incentive for people to enter things onto your site? Who do you expect will do this?

beauf

Is there a useful profit in it?

dabler

@Mrs OBumble

Where are you getting your map data from ? Is it legal for you to do what you are planning with it? (Think copyright).

There will be a registration process on the site.
Users that register will be the only one's capable of entering a location on the map.
It will be made perfectly clear to the user that the location(s) they enter will be viewable by all other users of the site.

In this regard, i.e. when I am stating clearly beforehand what I intend to do with the data, I believe that what I am doing is legal.

Facebook comes to mind, users enter their data and register, Facebook displays their data on a profile/newsfeed, gives users options to restrict what people see etc.

I have not looked into this from a legal perspective so do let me know if there are any problems with my thinking, it is an assumption I'm making.

What is the incentive for people to enter things onto your site? Who do you expect will do this?

I have a target audience in mind, and there is good incentive for a user to want to register on the site. That's all I can say about that right now.

Is there a useful profit in it?

hmmm define "useful"
I foresee a profit a long way down the line, but only if the site is truly successful.

There are ways I can generate income from this idea but I should probably just focus on the viability of the business for now.

Thanks for everyone's feedback by the way! Appreciated!

beauf

What's the objective and how will you know if you've achieved it.

If its not expected to make a profit.

Mrs OBumble

dabler wrote: »

@Mrs OBumble
There will be a registration process on the site.
Users that register will be the only one's capable of entering a location on the map.
It will be made perfectly clear to the user that the location(s) they enter will be viewable by all other users of the site.

It's not the user data that I'm asking about.

Where is the underlying map that they're going to enter data onto coming from?

Graham

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

It's not the user data that I'm asking about.

Where is the underlying map that they're going to enter data onto coming from?

Didn't the OP already mention one option being the Google maps API?

dabler

@Mrs OBumble

It's not the user data that I'm asking about.

Where is the underlying map that they're going to enter data onto coming from?

And from Graham...

Didn't the OP already mention one option being the Google maps API?

That's correct, I was planning on using the Google maps API.

@beauf

What's the objective and how will you know if you've achieved it.

If its not expected to make a profit.

The objective is to make a website which implements my business idea successful.
I will define it's success by having a certain number of registered users, hits per month etc...

dabler

dabler wrote: »

@Mrs OBumble


And from Graham...


That's correct, I was planning on using the Google maps API.

@beauf



The objective is to make a website which implements my business idea successful.
I will define it's success by having a certain number of registered users, hits per month etc...

Well you mentioned the big obstacle you have....and that is the Google Maps API costs money....quiet a lot of money.

I was going to have something along the lines of what you are going to do in all of my Apps until I seen the pricing.....quicky dropped that idea....