Downstairs neighbour constantly banging on their ceiling but only normal house noise

dandroid89

Myself and a friend moved into a rented apartment about 3 months ago. All working out well and we are only really there 3 or 4 times a week due to work commitments etc.

Basically the only problem is the people below us keep knocking up and it is starting to drive us insane.

I have a 3 year old who lives local and he comes over a couple of times a week. We were watching the toy show the other night and he was running around and playing on the floor with play doh. They were banging up constantly.

This morning my friend was up at 6.30 and getting ready for work. He was not even wearing shoes until he got to the door....they were banging up again and again obviously with a sweeping brush or something.

We don't play music loud, or have any parties and we do hear the people upstairs to us walking around etc... Obviously we cant prevent them from walking around the apartment they are probably paying ALOT of money to rent and it would be absurd to bang on the floor for this.

What do I do? Because something has to happen as it is starting to drive me insane.

My worry is that if I knock down to them and ask them what there problem is that an argument will follow and I don't particularly want there to be any tension.

Should I call my landlord and get him to sort it out? Can he sort it out?

The problem is that we can't do things any differently. We walk around our apartment and these people have a problem with it.

intheclouds

Why dont you just go down and ask why they keep knocking up?

If they say its very noisy then apologise and tell them you will get onto the landlord re soundproofing. And then do that.

You might just need to get some mats put down to deaden the noise.

dandroid89

intheclouds wrote: »

Why dont you just go down and ask why they keep knocking up?

If they say its very noisy then apologise and tell them you will get onto the landlord re soundproofing. And then do that.

You might just need to get some mats put down to deaden the noise.

I absolutely get where you are coming from and I will do just that. As I said, I don't want to have an argument with these people as I have to live over them.

The thing is, will it really change anything? I already have mats down in the living room and hall but I certainly will not apologise for walking around my apartment or for my son playing with his toys on the weekend.

Cuddlesworth

dandroid89 wrote: »

I absolutely get where you are coming from and I will do just that. As I said, I don't want to have an argument with these people as I have to live over them.

The thing is, will it really change anything? I already have mats down in the living room and hall but I certainly will not apologise for walking around my apartment or for my son playing with his toys on the weekend.

Wooden floors throughout the apartment?

WoollyRedHat

Maybe their cats can't sleep?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ritLRY6_1BI

dandroid89

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Wooden floors throughout the apartment?

Yep, tiles in the kitchen!

jester77

Have they ever approached you at your door? I hate that type of passive aggressive nonsense. Just go down and knock on their door and ask them why they keep knocking on the ceiling instead of coming to your door, and that in future if they have a problem to come directly to your door. Otherwise I would make a complaint about them to your landlord.

Cuddlesworth

dandroid89 wrote: »

Yep, tiles in the kitchen!

Badly fitted wooden floors in apartments can cause nightmares for tenants below, with you being aware of none of the noise. Vibration through the walls and ceiling turns their living space into a giant speaker.

Since its not actually your apartment, that makes things difficult.

Arbiter of Good Taste

jester77 wrote: »

Have they ever approached you at your door? I hate that type of passive aggressive nonsense. Just go down and knock on their door and ask them why they keep knocking on the ceiling instead of coming to your door, and that in future if they have a problem to come directly to your door. Otherwise I would make a complaint about them to your landlord.

Yeah,because this won't escalate the situation at all....

OP, these are not "bad neighbours". They're the ones who have to live with badly insulated flooring. It's not their fault. Go down and explain that you are trying not to make noise, but there's not much more you can do.

Having lived through it, there's nothing worse than a toddler running around half the day. So try and have a bit of patience with your neighbours.

See if your LL will put down some sound insulation. But reporting the neighbours to your LL? I can only imagine what the LL will say....

eladnova

It's amazing how sound travels with wooden and tiled floors. Your 3 year old is probably generating a lot of racket just by playing with plastic toys etc.

Having been on the receiving end of this before it can end up being very stressful. In our case, our neighbors son in the house next door seemed to be rolling marbles against the skirting board. The sound (to them) was probably a few light clicks. To us, the result was a loud bang which began to get stressful. I ended up knocking on the walls a few times but felt bad. The guy probably had no idea how his games were affecting our evenings and TV watching.

You sound very reasonable and completely conscientious. They could do a lot worse. Instead of just dropping round, have you thought of dropping in a letter first and asking them if you could all sit down and chat. Maybe there's a way you could hear things from their apartment (get your mate to walk around etc). But I think just arriving on their door mightn't be a good idea. A letter first worded properly will show them that you're reasonable and possibly stop them getting defensive or aggressive etc

Lux23

It's the height of ignorance to bang on a ceiling like that, would it kill them to come round at least once and explain the problem they are having. Until they actually got off their fat bums and tell me what the problem is I wouldn't be too concerned.

dandroid89

Lux23 wrote: »

It's the height of ignorance to bang on a ceiling like that, would it kill them to come round at least once and explain the problem they are having. Until they actually got off their fat bums and tell me what the problem is I wouldn't be too concerned.

Absolutely, and this is where I am at with the situation. My kid doesn't live with me so I literally get to take him once (Sometimes twice) a week. I felt like I was giving out to him for walking around because they kept banging up.

He literally was standing at the coffee table playing with play doh. He was not banging or anything.

I think the letter is a good Idea. Might get them to understand.

Whosthis

Drop into them and explain the situation, if they seem reasonable invite one of them up to yours and one of you stay in theirs for a few minutes just so each of you can get an idea of what the other is living with. It won't do anything to solve the noise issue but at least they might understand you're not giving tap dancing lessons 7 days a week.

justsomebloke

Lux23 wrote: »

It's the height of ignorance to bang on a ceiling like that, would it kill them to come round at least once and explain the problem they are having. Until they actually got off their fat bums and tell me what the problem is I wouldn't be too concerned.

Do the people down stairs know that there are new tenants in the apartment above them? Unless the LL or tenant have gone down they could be oblivious to the change in occupant and maybe just basing their reaction to people they have talked to before

dandroid89

justsomebloke wrote: »

Do the people down stairs know that there are new tenants in the apartment above them? Unless the LL or tenant have gone down they could be oblivious to the change in occupant and maybe just basing their reaction to people they have talked to before

The apartment was empty for around 4 months before we moved in. It's just really annoying that they have not said anything too. I was walking in with my son on Saturday morning and she was walking out and didn't say anything at all.
This did not happen for the first two months though so I don't know why it's a problem all of a sudden

eladnova

dandroid89 wrote: »

This did not happen for the first two months though so I don't know why it's a problem all of a sudden

Maybe the people downstairs are only there two months?

Call me Al

Are you wearing shoes on the floors, or do you go into your socks when you come in the door?

dandroid89

eladnova wrote: »

Maybe the people downstairs are only there two months?

Nope, seen them the day I moved in. I am going to write a polite letter up today and leave it in their mail box. Think its the only way forward and then I will contact my landlord and fill him in on what has been happening. I can't force him to change the floors because of the people downstairs - it is his call.

sKeith

Banging on a celing is a very poor way of communicating. It may be slightly understandable if there was very loud music on, then bangs, you lower music, all good. But for the noise a child makes while playing with playdoh at a coffee table, under supervision, banging on the ceiling only adds confusion to your situation as you dont know why they are banging. For all you know, they could have burnt toast and are banging at a smoke detector.

dandroid89

Call me Al wrote: »

Are you wearing shoes on the floors, or do you go into your socks when you come in the door?

Obviously sometimes of course we wear shoes/runners in our apartment. A lot of the time though we wouldn't. The issue is not this, it's that they are complaining about something that we can't do anything about. We aren't going around on roller blades or dancing or playing bowling or running around like lunatics. It is simply if we walk in from one room to another they bang up. I would say on average about 10 times per night. I walked from the living room to the kitchen and poured a glass of water. And they banged up.

It could not be that bad. We do hear the guys upstairs walking around and stuff but it certainly would not disturb me from watching a movie or anything.

looksee

Are you sure they are banging? It couldn't be something like a door being closed or similar, could it?

dandroid89

looksee wrote: »

Are you sure they are banging? It couldn't be something like a door being closed or similar, could it?

100% they are banging the ceiling. You can actually feel the vibrations. It is like they using the handle of a sweeping brush. We initially thought it was something like that.. But it is definitely them banging up.

Cuddlesworth

dandroid89 wrote: »

100% they are banging the ceiling. You can actually feel the vibrations. It is like they using the handle of a sweeping brush. We initially thought it was something like that.. But it is definitely them banging up.

They could just be difficult people and used to nobody above them. Or your landlord could have got a shoddy job done in the past(or in the 4 months it was empty). I'd try to verbally talk to them first and scope the situation before approaching your landlord. If your neighbour is unreasonable, then you approach the landlord and let him know of the situation.

Giblet

No point in changing anything if they don't bother to say anything to you directly. Most apartments aren't supposed to have wooden floors on any floor but the ground floor, the management company usually has this specified somewhere as well.

dandroid89

I have just printed this out and will post it in their mailbox later.

Hello,
This is your neighbour from above.

We have noticed you are knocking on the ceiling regularly due obviously due to what you perceive to be us making noise purposely.
We are not doing anything other than walking around our apartment which we are very much entitled to do. On Friday I had my 3 year old son over who stays once a week, twice max. He was standing at the coffee table playing with play doh and you continued to knock up over and over again. I am not going to give out to him for walking around his Dad’s apartment.
This is becoming an issue that I think we need to address now. I have contacted my landlord and told him of the situation and asked him if there is anything we can do ie. Soundproofing etc.
Until he gets back to me with a solution… there is unfortunately nothing we can do to limit the noise on the floor. We have the same problem with our neighbours above so we do understand the situation and we would like to move forward without any difficulty or issues.

Warm regards,
----

I am at a loss as to why they have not knocked in although its easy to say not to change anything until they speak to me they are bugging the absolute hell out of me.

Clearlier

If they're banging on the ceiling they're not likely to be doing it for the good of their health. A poor way to communicate for sure but you can rise above that. Contact them by letter in the first instance by all means but you need to talk to them face to face too and establish a relationship. It's very possible that they're living a total nightmare at the moment.

If you can arrange to be in their apartment while your friend walks around in yours it'll give you an idea as to whether they're over sensitive or not and you can subsequently decide whether you need to make a complaint about your neighbour or if your landlord needs to do something about the sound insulation.
I understand the frustration of having to deal with such a passive aggressive form of complaint but it doesn't mean that there isn't a problem that needs to be solved and you may have a role to play in that which would hopefully alleviate your frustration at the ceiling banging with the brush.

Stheno

dandroid89 wrote: »

I have just printed this out and will post it in their mailbox later.

Hello,
This is your neighbour from above.

We have noticed you are knocking on the ceiling regularly due obviously due to what you perceive to be us making noise purposely.
We are not doing anything other than walking around our apartment which we are very much entitled to do. On Friday I had my 3 year old son over who stays once a week, twice max. He was standing at the coffee table playing with play doh and you continued to knock up over and over again. I am not going to give out to him for walking around his Dad’s apartment.
This is becoming an issue that I think we need to address now. I have contacted my landlord and told him of the situation and asked him if there is anything we can do ie. Soundproofing etc.
Until he gets back to me with a solution… there is unfortunately nothing we can do to limit the noise on the floor. We have the same problem with our neighbours above so we do understand the situation and we would like to move forward without any difficulty or issues.

Warm regards,
----

I am at a loss as to why they have not knocked in although its easy to say not to change anything until they speak to me they are bugging the absolute hell out of me.

I'd soften the tone of that note if I were you, it comes across as a little confrontational.

listermint

Stheno wrote: »

I'd soften the tone of that note if I were you, it comes across as a little confrontational.

Looks alright to me, I dont think its overly confrontational its to the point.


Banging on the ceiling daily with a brush is confrontational.

dandroid89

Stheno wrote: »

I'd soften the tone of that note if I were you, it comes across as a little confrontational.

Yeah I was thinking so too...Thanks for the advice.

Clearlier

dandroid89 wrote: »

I have just printed this out and will post it in their mailbox later.

Hello,
This is your neighbour from above.

We have noticed you are knocking on the ceiling regularly due obviously due to what you perceive to be us making noise purposely.
We are not doing anything other than walking around our apartment which we are very much entitled to do. On Friday I had my 3 year old son over who stays once a week, twice max. He was standing at the coffee table playing with play doh and you continued to knock up over and over again. I am not going to give out to him for walking around his Dad’s apartment.
This is becoming an issue that I think we need to address now. I have contacted my landlord and told him of the situation and asked him if there is anything we can do ie. Soundproofing etc.
Until he gets back to me with a solution… there is unfortunately nothing we can do to limit the noise on the floor. We have the same problem with our neighbours above so we do understand the situation and we would like to move forward without any difficulty or issues.

Warm regards,
----

I am at a loss as to why they have not knocked in although its easy to say not to change anything until they speak to me they are bugging the absolute hell out of me.

To be honest that's a bit of a PFO letter. Fine if that's what you want to say but if were me I'd remove the 'entitled' bit - it's a little defensive. I'd also offer to show them what you're doing and to listen to the noise that they have to. I'd seek to empathise and appear open to any solutions that they may have to offer.

N.B. The noise that you hear from your neighbours above may not be at the same level as what your neighbours experience.

dandroid89

dandroid89 wrote: »

I have just printed this out and will post it in their mailbox later.

Hello,
This is your neighbour from above.

We have noticed you are knocking on the ceiling regularly due obviously due to what you perceive to be us making noise purposely.
We are not doing anything other than walking around our apartment which we are very much entitled to do. On Friday I had my 3 year old son over who stays once a week, twice max. He was standing at the coffee table playing with play doh and you continued to knock up over and over again. I am not going to give out to him for walking around his Dad’s apartment.
This is becoming an issue that I think we need to address now. I have contacted my landlord and told him of the situation and asked him if there is anything we can do ie. Soundproofing etc.
Until he gets back to me with a solution… there is unfortunately nothing we can do to limit the noise on the floor. We have the same problem with our neighbours above so we do understand the situation and we would like to move forward without any difficulty or issues.

Warm regards,
----

I am at a loss as to why they have not knocked in although its easy to say not to change anything until they speak to me they are bugging the absolute hell out of me.

Don't send it. Instead, knock on their door and explain your predicament and ask for their help/advice on how to overcome it.

If that fails, then send the letter.

ScottStorm

Definitely call in to them for a face to face, but if you are set on sending the letter, then be prepared to escalate and treat yourself to a trampoline and a threadmill for christmas.

Starokan

I would chance talking to them first , they could be sound enough and you might get on once you have a chance to chat.

I have lived in many apartment blocks, some very good and some shocking. Do you guys have the same landlord, if you do that's how I would try and resolve if talking does nothing.

Compromise is everything I think in blocks of apartments and flats, if wooden flooring is the issue slippers can help instead of boots and shoes, likewise they need to understand that when your kid is around you will never stop him playing and having fun, once they know its only once twice a week they will probably put up with it, if the noise is really bad not due to you but due to the flooring structure then the landlord needs to act, it may well be why his previous tenants left.

I get why you would not want to have a falling put but hopefully you do not need too. People do try and make life easier at times, I had it myself, I like music , I once had a neighbour knock, he explained that he had a son with mental issues and my music was really affecting him. I would never have it on late but even if played anyway loudly around 6-7pm it coincided with his child trying to sleep . I understand and got a pair of wireless headphones - problem solved. Its not always that easy but it can be

intheclouds

That letter is confrontational and full of assumption. How do you even know they are knocking up to tell you to keep the noise down? With what you describe a child standing and playing with play doh isn't making any noise so why assume the knocking is about noise? Could it be possible the knocking is something else entirely?

I think you should just go and speak to them. Knocking on ceilings, letters....seriously just knock in the door and say "hi I'm your upstairs neighbour! Just wondering if everything is ok because I've heard a knocking nose from your place and wasn't sure if it was directed at me? And if it was I'm not sure what you are trying to tell me?"

Clive Bisquette

intheclouds wrote: »

That letter is confrontational and full of assumption. How do you even know they are knocking up to tell you to keep the noise down? With what you describe a child standing and playing with play doh isn't making any noise so why assume the knocking is about noise? Could it be possible the knocking is something else entirely?

I think you should just go and speak to them. Knocking on ceilings, letters....seriously just knock in the door and say "hi I'm your upstairs neighbour! Just wondering if everything is ok because I've heard a knocking nose from your place and wasn't sure if it was directed at me? And if it was I'm not sure what you are trying to tell me?"

Yes read this thread ...and the above is the best advice in my opinion.

The real problem here is shoddy build and lack of sound proofing..but sure our brave developers have to pay for their Moet and helicopters someway !

I would be wary of anybody who bangs up constantly...it kinda indicates that they may have some ..uh..issues.

Civilised conversation and compromise may just not be in their social skill set !

How about knocking back? Say they knock three times, you do the same. If they only knock twice, so do you. etc...

Tarzana2

Clearlier wrote: »

N.B. The noise that you hear from your neighbours above may not be at the same level as what your neighbours experience.

What can the OP do about that though? He can ask the landlord is there anything that can be done but who wants to have to tiptoe around their own home?

OP, could you not just speak to them instead of sending a letter? Much less formal, and it's easier to get people onside that way, IMO.

nuckeythompson

Ignore them until they come up and politely discuss it with you

Turtle_

If you're going to send a note in you're being WAY too confrontational.

I'd be more inclined to say something more along the lines of:

Hi

This is X from the apartment above you. We've noticed a knocking noise coming from your apartment recently. Please feel welcome to call over for a chat any time after Xpm [insert days]. If there's a problem we're keen to find a solution.

Thanks,

Mr Upstairs.

You don't need to go into much detail - the ball is now in her court. It's up to her now to lay out what the problem is. In the mean time, if your kitchen cupboards bang, get those little dots that soften the close. Wear slippers in the house, don't slam doors, don't drag chairs across the floor etc. That's all you can do. If you go into her apartment and it's horrific noise, then you probably should put a bit of pressure on the LL to provide a decent underlay and carpet.

jeamimus

Wooden floors are a nightmare, if they're not properly insulated, as seems to be the case here.

I've been in the situation of these people downstairs and its not pleasant. Kids playing eg bouncing balls, running around etc is much worse downstairs than in the room where its happening.

The people downstairs are rude but they do have to endure this noise. However its neither of yours fault, its probably bad construction standards.

Put down some rugs and don't wear shoes indoors. If your kids are running around, try to let them do it in a part of the apartment where the sound will cause least nuisance.

Meet the guy downstairs and discuss things with him. If he understands that you also see things from his point of view and are doing your best he should be reassured. Notes are a bad idea and will not achieve anything useful.

the_pen_turner

your only option is to go down and have a chat.

find out why they are banging .

then offer to get someone to walk around and do daily jobs

then you can see if its normal noise or excessive.

if its normal noise then tell them to cop them selves on

if its excessive then get on to the land lord , but get them on side and go together to resolve this joint problem

Electric Sheep

I've been in the situation of the downstairs neighbors - it was hell. The upstairs tenants insisted there was no noise, but it was constant. Thank God they eventually moved, and lo, no child, no more problems.

I think it is kind of like the way parents don't notice their child screaming or making noise because they are so used to it. I swear I think they had a small trampoline there.

Apartment living (in the kind of poor quality apartments that are the norm in Ireland) is difficult if you live under an apartment with kids in it.

Turtle_

Electric Sheep wrote: »

I've been in the situation of the downstairs neighbors - it was hell. The upstairs tenants insisted there was no noise, but it was constant. Thank God they eventually moved, and lo, no child, no more problems.

I think it is kind of like the way parents don't notice their child screaming or making noise because they are so used to it. I swear I think they had a small trampoline there.

Apartment living (in the kind of poor quality apartments that are the norm in Ireland) is difficult if you live under an apartment with kids in it.

Yeah that's fine... Relevant to the OP one, sometimes two, days per week. The rest of the time it's two adults who are out at work all week.

April 73

I wouldn't send that letter. To me it reads as a mix between defensive & confrontational. "Entitled" isn't a good word to use in this context.
Much better to knock in & have a chat.

There was a thread on here a month or two ago started by InvisibleWoman - she had terrible trouble with noise from an upstairs apartment because of poor sound insulation between the apartments. What is normal living noise in one apartment can be magnified & amplified so it sounds like elephants dancing downstairs.

Better to have a chat first & see where it goes. Having a sound check in both apartments sounds like a good idea.

Clearlier

Tarzana2 wrote: »

What can the OP do about that though? He can ask the landlord is there anything that can be done but who wants to have to tiptoe around their own home?

Context is everything. I was commenting on the OP's proposed letter which mentioned that they understood how noisy the apartment must be because the neighbours above them also make noise.

It's not the fault of the OP or the neighbour if the sound insulation is terrible (I can't understand why wooden floors are allowed without specific sound insulation standards being met) however they are the ones that have to come to some kind of resolution and it may help if both can empathise with the other's position.

eladnova

Would this work? I know it's a little formal and tbh I wouldn't be in a rush to give out my phone number. Perhaps an email would be better.

Dear downstairs
In an effort to address noise issues from our apartment (number x) we are keen to meet neighbours who are affected and reach a positive outcome. Hopefully if we can present facts to our landlord, there may be the possibility of getting this resolved for everyone.
If you're free and can spare 5 minutes, please get in touch at 086 xxxx xxx

Regards
Upstairs

athtrasna

I wouldn't give a phone number, that's asking for trouble. To be honest I wouldn't send a letter, too easily misinterpreted. I think the OP needs to call down to the neighbour first and foremost.

faceman

dandroid89 wrote: »

I have just printed this out and will post it in their mailbox later.

Hello,
This is your neighbour from above.

We have noticed you are knocking on the ceiling regularly due obviously due to what you perceive to be us making noise purposely.
We are not doing anything other than walking around our apartment which we are very much entitled to do. On Friday I had my 3 year old son over who stays once a week, twice max. He was standing at the coffee table playing with play doh and you continued to knock up over and over again. I am not going to give out to him for walking around his Dad’s apartment.
This is becoming an issue that I think we need to address now. I have contacted my landlord and told him of the situation and asked him if there is anything we can do ie. Soundproofing etc.
Until he gets back to me with a solution… there is unfortunately nothing we can do to limit the noise on the floor. We have the same problem with our neighbours above so we do understand the situation and we would like to move forward without any difficulty or issues.

Warm regards,
----

I am at a loss as to why they have not knocked in although its easy to say not to change anything until they speak to me they are bugging the absolute hell out of me.

DON'T SEND THAT LETTER!

You are making assumptions here about the issue. Your first step is to knock on their door and ASK them about the knocking they are doing. Right now, the only person who has a known issue is you, as their knocking is causing you a disturbance and nuisance. You are only assuming that their knocking is related to your noise.

In the vast majority of cases like this, assuming they do have an issue with noise, is resolved by having a conversation first.

eladnova

athtrasna wrote: »

I wouldn't give a phone number, that's asking for trouble. To be honest I wouldn't send a letter, too easily misinterpreted. I think the OP needs to call down to the neighbour first and foremost.

Agree. Scrap the phone number I mentioned.

The reason people are suggesting a letter as the first point of contact is because you get to set the tone. Helpful, concerned, friendly. Whatever ....
Calling down unannounced doesn't give the neighbour time to react. Their default might be to assume you're there to cause problems They could go on the defensive or it might not simply be a convenient time.

And let's face it, if they really wanted a face to face they wouldn't be resorting to a brush against the ceiling.

Just my 5 cents.

Seanachai

OP I live in a period house split up into flats, you can't hear anything from the neighbours either side but I can hear everything from footsteps to phone conversations and the odd groan from the woman above me. I say woman, it sounds more like a pony or boar is up there they way she seems to move furniture around (why?) and stomps from one side of the flat to the other. There was a woman there before her and you would barely know she was there.

For the past two years I have had to wake up at 6.30 every morning, if I'm having a lie-in I'm up at that time and then I try to get back to sleep. During Ramadan I also have to wake up for the prayer schedule as she's a Muslim. I stay because the rent is very reasonable and were I to move I would be paying at least €200 more a month in Dublin.

From speaking to friends they are in similar situations even in new builds, for some reason in this country, builders don't do soundproofing. Having worked in construction this doesn't surprise me as a lot of the them are chancers who just want to slap the houses up for a quick profit.

April 73

eladnova wrote: »

Would this work? I know it's a little formal and tbh I wouldn't be in a rush to give out my phone number. Perhaps an email would be better.

Dear downstairs
In an effort to address noise issues from our apartment (number x) we are keen to meet neighbours who are affected and reach a positive outcome. Hopefully if we can present facts to our landlord, there may be the possibility of getting this resolved for everyone.
If you're free and can spare 5 minutes, please get in touch at 086 xxxx xxx

Regards
Upstairs

This sounds like you are aware you are creating a noise problem & affecting loads of neighbours.