Best 161 commercial van - Auris/Focus/Other?

Jesper

I've got my own Ltd. company and I'm looking to buy a commercial next year. Proper 2 seat, 5% BIK, €333 VAT. I won't be doing big mil,age or carrying cargo.
I'm tying between a Focus Style and Auris. I've a quote on a new Style for €19,200 inc. met paint, bluetooth & €200 VRT. It also includes getting a €3,000 trade in included in this for my '02 Primera (value of €500). The trade in price is the 'discount' applied.
There is a ford commercial offer on of 100,000km warrenty, 1 yr tax, 1 free service and 3.9% ApR.

I don't have a price yet for the Auris - Toyota.ie shows €19,500 for the basic Terra new.

I'm lately considering the Kuga or a SUV of that type. Works out to be 20% + more expensive. Would it be worth it?

R.O.R

Jesper wrote: »

I've got my own Ltd. company and I'm looking to buy a commercial next year. Proper 2 seat, 5% BIK, €333 VAT. I won't be doing big mil,age or carrying cargo.
I'm tying between a Focus Style and Auris. I've a quote on a new Style for €19,200 inc. met paint, bluetooth & €200 VRT. It also includes getting a €3,000 trade in included in this for my '02 Primera (value of €500). The trade in price is the 'discount' applied.
There is a ford commercial offer on of 100,000km warrenty, 1 yr tax, 1 free service and 3.9% ApR.

I don't have a price yet for the Auris - Toyota.ie shows €19,500 for the basic Terra new.

I'm lately considering the Kuga or a SUV of that type. Works out to be 20% + more expensive. Would it be worth it?

Ex. Works on an Auris van is €18,000, so €1,500 for metallic and delivery sounds a lot, unless that's including A/C?

Are you planning on keeping it for a long time, or just 3/4 years? Overall cost of ownership between all the car vans available is pretty similar, so it's down to personal choice.

Worth looking at the Hyundai I-pro Excel model (ex. Works €19,495) or the Golf Trendline (Ex. Works €20,785 for the 110ps). Higher initial price on the Golf is generally recouped with a higher resale value, and with the Tech Pack offer (was free, think it's now €161) it's quite a nice place to be - missing Alloys though.


Used Kuga commercials have been selling for really high prices, so depreciation is actually less than car vans, despite the higher initial cost. Whether that continues though I'm not so sure, as the older Kuga was a 140ps 4x4, but the newer is a 120ps 2wd.

Dacia do a Duster commercial starting at €16,190. It's cheap and basic, but it's cheap, and they've held their value surprisingly well so far too.

Casati

Why do you want to buy a van? I know you can reclaim the vat but you'd get a Focus Style car for not much more than 19250, maybe less than 2k more - the car would have a much better resale and the obvious advantage of back seats!

If the car spends its nights at the registered address of your company I think that you will be except from BIK (somebody else here will know the exact ruling on that)

La Fenetre

car vans . . . ? what is this 1992 ?

Long Time Lurker

Dacia Duster commercial. They're like 17 odd grand including VAT.

AMKC

R.O.R wrote: »

Ex. Works on an Auris van is €18,000, so €1,500 for metallic and delivery sounds a lot, unless that's including A/C?

Are you planning on keeping it for a long time, or just 3/4 years? Overall cost of ownership between all the car vans available is pretty similar, so it's down to personal choice.

Worth looking at the Hyundai I-pro Excel model (ex. Works €19,495) or the Golf Trendline (Ex. Works €20,785 for the 110ps). Higher initial price on the Golf is generally recouped with a higher resale value, and with the Tech Pack offer (was free, think it's now €161) it's quite a nice place to be - missing Alloys though.


Used Kuga commercials have been selling for really high prices, so depreciation is actually less than car vans, despite the higher initial cost. Whether that continues though I'm not so sure, as the older Kuga was a 140ps 4x4, but the newer is a 120ps 2wd.

Dacia do a Duster commercial starting at €16,190. It's cheap and basic, but it's cheap, and they've held their value surprisingly well so far too.

Its a van you don,t need soft touch plastics in a van or alloys its used to do a job. I think the Dacia is a great deal and great value.

Jesper

Casati wrote: »

Why do you want to buy a van? I know you can reclaim the vat but you'd get a Focus Style car for not much more than 19250, maybe less than 2k more - the car would have a much better resale and the obvious advantage of back seats!

If the car spends its nights at the registered address of your company I think that you will be except from BIK (somebody else here will know the exact ruling on that)

If anyone knows this rule I'd love to hear it. I was going for a VAN for the 5% BIK and VAT back on the diesel receipts.
A car would suit me best but I do little/no milage for work so I can't claim any milage or benefits from that. But having a van allows me to pay for it through the company, all bills, fixes, get VAT back on the diesel etc.
Unless I'm missing anything (first company car so I may be) the van seems like the best option?

R.O.R

If you have any personal usage of a company vehicle, you are liable for BIK on it. If you have no personal usage of a vehicle (car or van), then there is no liability for BIK.

You could go for a Car - still able to reclaim the VAT on diesel, but you'll be hit with 30% BIK, and you can only reclaim 20% of the VAT on the purchase / lease (have you considered leasing as a cost effective option :-) ) if it's used over 60% of the time for business purposes, and has emissions of 156g or under.

Jesper

R.O.R wrote: »

If you have any personal usage of a company vehicle, you are liable for BIK on it. If you have no personal usage of a vehicle (car or van), then there is no liability for BIK.

You could go for a Car - still able to reclaim the VAT on diesel, but you'll be hit with 30% BIK, and you can only reclaim 20% of the VAT on the purchase / lease (have you considered leasing as a cost effective option :-) ) if it's used over 60% of the time for business purposes, and has emissions of 156g or under.

I intend to use the van solely for business purposes - so I believe I am exempt from BIK. Now it might be a case that if the main car is away I might need to use the van (short trips) which I believe is against the concept of 'company vehicle' but as mentioned in posts it's covered by insurance.
I have the feeling that this is common enough?

Jesper

R.O.R wrote: »

Ex. Works on an Auris van is €18,000, so €1,500 for metallic and delivery sounds a lot, unless that's including A/C?

Are you planning on keeping it for a long time, or just 3/4 years? Overall cost of ownership between all the car vans available is pretty similar, so it's down to personal choice.

Worth looking at the Hyundai I-pro Excel model (ex. Works €19,495) or the Golf Trendline (Ex. Works €20,785 for the 110ps). Higher initial price on the Golf is generally recouped with a higher resale value, and with the Tech Pack offer (was free, think it's now €161) it's quite a nice place to be - missing Alloys though.


Used Kuga commercials have been selling for really high prices, so depreciation is actually less than car vans, despite the higher initial cost. Whether that continues though I'm not so sure, as the older Kuga was a 140ps 4x4, but the newer is a 120ps 2wd.

Dacia do a Duster commercial starting at €16,190. It's cheap and basic, but it's cheap, and they've held their value surprisingly well so far too.

I did some more pricing this weekend (car show in KK) - unfortunately wasn't able to get text drives but I'll try get them this week.

All the below include a trade in of a '02 Primera (worth €500).
Golf Trendline - 1.6, 110ps, 3 services 100km/3yr = €19,250
Focus Style - 1.5, 95ps, 2 services 100km/3yr + bluetooth + met paint + 1 yr tax =€19,000
Auris Terra (Basic)- 1.4, 90ps, 0 services, 100km/3ry = €19,100 new. Expecting €17,000 with trade in.
Hyundai i-30 - PRO = 1.6, 108ps, 150km/5yr = possibly the best looking and the 'PRO' has heaps of extras that aren't on the others. €20,900 new so expecting around €18? with trade in?

I'd like the extra's on the i-30. Feel like I'm getting the best deal on the Golf? Auris is the cheapest and a facelift coming in the new year - But it's even €1,350 for A/C. Very basic.
Anyone have any experience with any of these? Is depreciation on the Hyundai a killer?

R.O.R

Jesper wrote: »

I intend to use the van solely for business purposes - so I believe I am exempt from BIK. Now it might be a case that if the main car is away I might need to use the van (short trips) which I believe is against the concept of 'company vehicle' but as mentioned in posts it's covered by insurance.
I have the feeling that this is common enough?

If it's left at the office overnight, and only used for Business purposes, you should be exempt from BIK. "Technically" if you use it for something other than business purposes you should be liable for BIK, but if it's very infrequent usage, it would be very harsh to have to pay anything.

What sort of proof you'd need to provide to Revenue, I don't know.

Jesper wrote: »

I did some more pricing this weekend (car show in KK) - unfortunately wasn't able to get text drives but I'll try get them this week.

All the below include a trade in of a '02 Primera (worth €500).
Golf Trendline - 1.6, 110ps, 3 services 100km/3yr = €19,250
Focus Style - 1.5, 95ps, 2 services 100km/3yr + bluetooth + met paint + 1 yr tax =€19,000
Auris Terra (Basic)- 1.4, 90ps, 0 services, 100km/3ry = €19,100 new. Expecting €17,000 with trade in.
Hyundai i-30 - PRO = 1.6, 108ps, 150km/5yr = possibly the best looking and the 'PRO' has heaps of extras that aren't on the others. €20,900 new so expecting around €18? with trade in?

I'd like the extra's on the i-30. Feel like I'm getting the best deal on the Golf? Auris is the cheapest and a facelift coming in the new year - But it's even €1,350 for A/C. Very basic.
Anyone have any experience with any of these? Is depreciation on the Hyundai a killer?

It's hard to even guess what used values on the various car vans is going to be, as they are commanding ridiculous prices at the moment due to such a shortage of supply. With more people buying new, there will be better supply in the future so prices will soften, but I wouldn't expect any real difference in value between the Ford/Toyota/Hyundai vans, but I would expect the Golf to sell for €1,500 - €2,000 more for a 3/4 year old with low to medium mileage.

We don't have many iPro vans on fleet, but just had a quick look at the few we do. Highest mileage was 64,000km in October - needed 2 litres of oil at 16,000km, but apart from that, there's nothing out of the ordinary.

Personally, I'd test both the Golf and the Hyundai and see which you prefer. The seats and standard equipment on the Hyundai are better than the Golf, but the Golf is probably a better overall prospect from a total cost of ownership point of view, but not by such a major amount to warrant choosing that over the Hyundai if you prefer the Hyundai.

Haven't driven an iPro (but did have a decent poke around in one when they were launched, and was very impressed), but did have a Golf van for a weekend recently. Except for Lumbar support, the Golf had everything you need, but the lack of Lumbar would probably take it's toll if I had to use it everyday.

celtic_oz

same position.. went for a golf 110, media pack, sports pack and metallic paint + 3 services 100km/3yr I think just over €17K + VAT

note 12 week lead time :-(


5% BIK
diesel, tolls, insurance expensed
vat back on diesel and tolls


where u getting insurance ?

Jesper

celtic_oz wrote: »

same position.. went for a golf 110, media pack, sports pack and metallic paint + 3 services 100km/3yr I think just over €17K + VAT

note 12 week lead time :-(


5% BIK
diesel, tolls, insurance expensed
vat back on diesel and tolls


where u getting insurance ?

Haven't got it yet - quiet surprised at how expensive it is! around 700e from a quick quote (with no licence plate).

The guy in Toyota uses the below insurance and says it's below 300e for him.
http://wrightcover.ie/

I drove the Focus and i-30 Pro yesterday.
Liked them both. Certainly above the Auris in spec. i-30 has a great spec and 108 bhp. Focus was comfortable and peppy enough for a 95bhp.

celtic_oz

what u go for in the end?

celtic_oz

have u seen this ?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057532136

The Sidewards Man

Avoid the Peugeot Partners anyway op.

Jesper

celtic_oz wrote: »

have u seen this ?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057532136

Hi Celtic - On my second visit with a price agreed (nothing signed) I was told about this. I was leaning towards the focus as well but not at the new price.
So now it's down to a new golf

1.6 110bhp standard black for 19250 (19000 I expect) with 3 services.
1.4 i-Pro Delux. 18,000.

Or a second hand. I'm actually leaning towards a 1 or 2 year old second hand now.
There is also a very good scrappage deal on the Pajero Commercial if I wanted to go that extra bit!

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Jesper

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Hi Patww79.
What BHP is the 1.4?
is your model the Delux - middle spec model?
what would you be look to get a new one for? I'm trading in something worth less than 800.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Jesper

Patww79 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I know after driving the Auris the full size bulkhead was something I didn't want as I found the you had to have the seat at a very upright angle if you wanted to recline the chair. Toyota are caging all new vans. I'm 6"2" so might just effect me. I might take another look at it so.

Lord Trollington

Hi Op , did you consider a Nissan Qashqai van or the bigger Nissan X-Trail?

Might be able to avail of scrappage on them .

celtic_oz

Jesper wrote: »

Or a second hand. I'm actually leaning towards a 1 or 2 year old second hand now.
There is also a very good scrappage deal on the Pajero Commercial if I wanted to go that extra bit!

Remember BIK though only 5% is on the price when new not the price you pay for second hand.

Jesper

Lord Trollington wrote: »

Hi Op , did you consider a Nissan Qashqai van or the bigger Nissan X-Trail?

Might be able to avail of scrappage on them .

The Kuga Zeteck is coming in at 21,000 which is very tempting.
The Qashqai is a nice wagon all right and comes in around 23 I think. Haven't looked at the X-Trail.

Mitsubishi are doing a very good scrappage on the Commercials. So the Outlander and the Pajero (SWB) are coming in at good money. But again I don't have a great need for the space or larger vehicle. I would prefer one but can't really justify it.

celtic_oz

just seen this

https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/volkswagen-golf-van-sports-pack/11026519

Lord Trollington

Jesper wrote: »

The Kuga Zeteck is coming in at 21,000 which is very tempting.
The Qashqai is a nice wagon all right and comes in around 23 I think. Haven't looked at the X-Trail.

Mitsubishi are doing a very good scrappage on the Commercials. So the Outlander and the Pajero (SWB) are coming in at good money. But again I don't have a great need for the space or larger vehicle. I would prefer one but can't really justify it.

Not sure how long you plan to hold ono it but Outlander wouldn't have a great resale value down the line. Kuga are a nice machine bit again the engine size and running costs wouldnt be that of a Qashqai or Auris/focus.

Jesper

Lord Trollington wrote: »

Not sure how long you plan to hold ono it but Outlander wouldn't have a great resale value down the line. Kuga are a nice machine bit again the engine size and running costs wouldnt be that of a Qashqai or Auris/focus.

Not much out there in the second hand market for the car van. Slightly better for the Cross over/SUV Commercial.
I would love if more dealers besides Mitsubishi and Nissan were doing a trade in bonus on commercials!!

FYI Nissan Prices (before negotiations)
This is how the deal works out on a New Nissan X-Trail XE 2wd in non-metallic
Full Retail Price € 33,700
Less Scrappage € 4,000
Cost to change €29,700
VAT Amount € 4,825
Net of VAT cost € 24,875

This is how the deal works out on a New Nissan Qashqai XE in non-metallic
(FYI the Qashqai pays full VRT)
Full Retail Price € 29,095
Less Scrappage € 4,000
Cost to change €25,095
VAT Amount € 4,231
Net of VAT cost € 21,056
Metallic paint is €550 more

celtic_oz

What did you end up going for ?

Mintoe

Ive Had a commercial iPro excel model since April, I drive all day every day covering the whole country and have never got out of car at the end of day and felt tired due to the car. Worth going for higher spec excel model (cruise control, a/c, arm rest & alloys)

Spec is very good, great sound system including USB port for music, voice controls, etc..... I haven't thought of anything that carvan is lacking. 1.4 is plenty powerful enough and runs on a sniff. Definitely doesn't disappoint.

Jesper

I bought a new VW Golf in the end. 1.6TDi 110 bhp (red I). Basic Trend line model but I mush say I'm pretty happy with the speck. It's got the 161 pack which is apparently worth 3000. This costs €161 but gives all the steering wheel controls, Bluetooth, cruise control, USB connection, . it's got the start/stop technology and apparently gets 74mpg. Touch screen display.

Anyway after some hard negotiations it cost €19,500 (inc.500 trade in for a car worth probably 0). So 19 with 3 services, 3 yr bumper to bumper warranty, 3 yr roadside. For the flaps and mats thrown in €240 and 161 pack (€161) for free.

Happy with it so far. PM if want some details.

celtic_oz

good choice, good price, when do u get ?

what colour

I got 3.9% APR .. u ?

Jesper

celtic_oz wrote: »

good choice, good price, when do u get ?

what colour

I got 3.9% APR .. u ?

Got it on the 7th Jan. They had a black 110bhp in stock so I just went with it. I Practically pushed my 02 Primera to the garage as the clutch was 3 gear changes from not finding gear again.

3.9% on the PCP.

celtic_oz

Jesper wrote: »

Got it on the 7th Jan. They had a black 110bhp in stock so I just went with it. I Practically pushed my 02 Primera to the garage as the clutch was 3 gear changes from not finding gear again.

3.9% on the PCP.

I just got told mine wont be ready until end of Feb, joke after ordering in November, so angry rang up a few Kuga dealers!

How are you finding the golf ? Is there anything you would have bought differently on it option wise ?

Jesper

celtic_oz wrote: »

I just got told mine wont be ready until end of Feb, joke after ordering in November, so angry rang up a few Kuga dealers!

How are you finding the golf ? Is there anything you would have bought differently on it option wise ?

TBH when they said they had one in stock and just needed to be delivered I was happy enough with that and not adding extras.

I got the Flaps and Mats 'thrown in'. Which according to the docket would have cost e240. A tinted back window would be nice for security/privacy of cargo. I'll probably get a liner or protector for the back. Something easy to clean and remove if ever selling. My first van so new to the 'blind spots' of the back windows so parking sensors might be nice.

celtic_oz

what did u do for insurance in the end ..

also private or commercial road tax?

celtic_oz

what did u do for insurance in the end ..

also private or commercial road tax?

Jesper

celtic_oz wrote: »

what did u do for insurance in the end ..

also private or commercial road tax?

I went with Wrights Insurance Broker - Carlow company with a few offices arround. They got me insurance €600 with Zurich. Also got a good quote from Campion Insurance in Kilkenny.

Commercial road tax €333 - annoyingly would only have been €190 private. But for Benefit In Kind (BIK) purposes the car is commercial and owned by the company. Hence BIK is 5% vs. up to 30% for private.

Trying to figure out best 'fuel card' today. Looking at DCI card or Fuelwise.