Misspelled name on my speeding ticket

2rkehij30qtza5

Hi all..

Can you please advise me on what to do here.

I got a fixed charge notice in the post today. It's for doing 51kph in a 50kph zone...like 1km over the speed limit?! I thought there was supposed to be a teeny bit of leniency?...like how can they even calibrate to within 1km?!?!

Also, my first name is spelled wrong..they have the first and second letter mixed up. So it's Ellen and they have written Lelen instead.

Can I say to them that no Lelan resides at my address?...and get the points quashed because ok yes, maybe I was 1km over the speed limit but it seems a bit harsh. I'm usually a model driver and didn't even notice I was over the limit on this occasion.

I don't want my day in court by the way. I'd rather pay and get it over with but how can I even fill out the form when the name is wrong? Thanks

mikehn

51 in a 50 zone, I always thought that there was a 10% tolerance, certainly with the Go safe vans. I doubt that any Judge would convict on that margin if you claimed that your speedo showed you were not above the limit

wonski

The fine is against your car rather than the driver.
If you don't agree you have driven the car, you have to declare who was driving it...

51 in 50 zone? First time I hear of that. Ridiculous, but nothing you can do about it really...

slimjimmc

If you want to contest the offence in court then that's your right but I wouldn't do it on the basis of a misspelling of your name without proper legal advice. Minor errors such as this would be corrected in court by the judge especially as he is very likely to ask you your name and if you are the registered owner and if you were driving at the time of the offence. The photograph taken by camera vans usually shows the driver too.

You can have the spelling on the FPN corrected by contacting the Fixed Charge Processing Office (details on the form). Do it promptly because the clock doesn't stop ticking and the deadline is fixed.

cml387

Really op? 51 in a 50 zone?

You were very unlucky.

Atlantic Dawn

Is your name wrong on the logbook of your car too?

NIMAN

They told you that you were doing 51 in a 50?

Find that hard to believe, Im shocked.
I always heard there was a margain of error in all car speedo's, we could all get caught like that so.

You sure it wasn't a 40 or 30kph zone?

Squatman

51 in a 50 zone is ridonkulus. I would try and contest it on the basis of accuracy. Have a quick google and see if it has been contested before

2rkehij30qtza5

Thanks all. Yea it's nuts alright. I'm not going to court though..don't fancy risking 5 points on my license and a day in court would stress the daylights out of me. Yeah always thought there was a tolerance too in the speeds..clearly not. I have no idea if I was over the limit on my car speedometer...maybe I was doing 55kph and the 'tolerance' has brought it down to 51?..either way I'll ring them in the morn and see. Just be easier to pay the fine as is...incorrect or correct spelling it probably makes zero difference.

Satori Rae

I know some one who got off for having no tax as the reg number of the car was put down wrong, they still had to attend court but the solicitor got them off.

Tax I would say, would be more serious then a slight increase over the speed limit. But a misspelling of a name may not matter at all (which I am sure it doesn’t) and you could end up worse off then paying a lousy fine.

5W30

Crew Witty Mustang wrote: »

Thanks all. Yea it's nuts alright. I'm not going to court though..don't fancy risking 5 points on my license and a day in court would stress the daylights out of me. Yeah always thought there was a tolerance too in the speeds..clearly not. I have no idea if I was over the limit on my car speedometer...maybe I was doing 55kph and the 'tolerance' has brought it down to 51?..either way I'll ring them in the morn and see. Just be easier to pay the fine as is...incorrect or correct spelling it probably makes zero difference.

Even if it was 55 km/h on the speedo, 51 km/h should not be a punishable speed. I would expect to at least be allowed to go 5 km/h over the limit but realistically it should be more like 10 km/h.

pippip

Not sure how the speeds are entered into the system but I'd almost say its a typo and should be a 61.

It really is the first ever case on here of such a small margin. Definitely worth following up. Maybe speak to a solicitor in this area, 1kph seems a very small margin for calibration equipment to stay in legally.

PrettyBoy

51 in a 50 zone? I don't believe it. If you're telling us the truth then something isn't right. Does it clearly state on the ticket that you were going 51 in a 50 zone?

XR3i

Crew Witty Mustang wrote: »

Hi all..

Can you please advise me on what to do here.

I got a fixed charge notice in the post today. It's for doing 51kph in a 50kph zone...like 1km over the speed limit?! I thought there was supposed to be a teeny bit of leniency?...like how can they even calibrate to within 1km?!?!

Also, my first name is spelled wrong..they have the first and second letter mixed up. So it's Ellen and they have written Lelen instead.

Can I say to them that no Lelan resides at my address?...and get the points quashed because ok yes, maybe I was 1km over the speed limit but it seems a bit harsh. I'm usually a model driver and didn't even notice I was over the limit on this occasion.

I don't want my day in court by the way. I'd rather pay and get it over with but how can I even fill out the form when the name is wrong? Thanks

you should still turn up, but if the name is written wrong it will be thrown out

galwaytt

If it really is 51 in a 50 I'd fight it on that alone, that's ridiculous.

visual

XR3i wrote: »

you should still turn up, but if the name is written wrong it will be thrown out

Had this once over no tax brought to court it was thrown out and garda got lecture from judge

But you must turn up in court

Second Toughest in_the Freshers

The law is the law, don't do the crime if you can't pay the fine, you should have the book thrown at you... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

OttoPilot

Seems like a case of sloppy work. Challenging it would probably get you off as it was probably supposed to be 61, 51 is too close to the limit.

Atlantic Dawn

For a 1kmh figure would the road not need to be almost 100% level with the camera and the car to produce such an accurate figure? It's a 2% margin or error, surely should be let go? Any solicitor should be able to get you off.

endacl

Squatman wrote: »

51 in a 50 zone is ridonkulus. I would try and contest it on the basis of accuracy. Have a quick google and see if it has been contested before

There's no ridonkulus at this address. Should work...

Toyotafanboi

Id imagine being ticketed for 51km/h means the speedo was reading 56~km/h. This is how the margin of error works.

Del2005

Unless you already have penalty points it's going to cost more to fight it, you'll need a solicitor and a day off work to avoid an €80 fine and 2 points.

kirving

Very harsh, the thickness of the needle on my cars is about 2kph, and when the needle rests deaf on the centre of 100kph, GPS says 100kph. I better watch out if they're desperate enough to catch you 1kph over the limit.

I'd be pretty sure that the radar or laser would be capable of measuring down to multiple decimal places very accurately, but I don't think the display could round up ro the nearest 1kph for legal reasons.

I did head of a solicitor with a great knowledge of electronics who specialised in getting people off on very tight margins by asking all sorts of questions about the gun's accuracy.

Keith186

Del2005 wrote: »

Unless you already have penalty points it's going to cost more to fight it, you'll need a solicitor and a day off work to avoid an €80 fine and 2 points.

3 points now. One quarter of the way towards being banned.
Seems harsh for a trivial offence because it is. If they typed the name wrong and perhaps the speed too, they should not be able to get people convicted with such inaccurate details.

R.O.R

I've seen hundreds of speeding fines, and the lowest one in a 50km/h zone is 56km/h.

I'd love to see a picture of this speeding fine for 51 in a 50 zone.

galwaytt

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Id imagine being ticketed for 51km/h means the speedo was reading 56~km/h. This is how the margin of error works.

...doesnt matter what your speedo says, that's not the instrument used in court. 1km/h is well within the realms of being error.....even 'sideslip' error

numorouno

I sincerely doubt that you got a ticket for 1kmph over they limit. I thought the general was 10% plus 1.

Could you take a picture of the speeding part of the ticket out of interest if it does say the speed
Obviously not identifying your car, address etc

Jawgap

Are you sure it was a 50 kph zone (what's on the ticket?) - just because the road signs say 50 it doesn't mean it's a 50 - you are dealing with Irish local authorities! They may have varied the limit in effect but not changed the signage. That being the case you may have god grounds for getting the ticket quashed, but you'd be better off talking to a solicitor about it.

As for the name thing - what's on your logbook?

SeanPuddin_

You don't need a solicitor, just say that's not my name Judge. Fine will be struck out immediately.

KK4SAM

That would not be processes if presented to the court clerk on your day in court .The margin allowed is 10%+1 =56 Km/hr

Del2005

Keith186 wrote: »

3 points now. One quarter of the way towards being banned.
Seems harsh for a trivial offence because it is. If they typed the name wrong and perhaps the speed too, they should not be able to get people convicted with such inaccurate details.

Still going to cost more to fight it. The OP admitted that their speedo was showing more than 50.

ironclaw

galwaytt wrote: »

...doesnt matter what your speedo says, that's not the instrument used in court. 1km/h is well within the realms of being error.....even 'sideslip' error

Cosine and Sideslip are in the motorists favor i.e. It reduces your measured speed versus your actual. It doesn't apply to GoSafe as the radar is fixed relative to you.

51 in a 50 sounds suspect. Given some other threads on the motoring forum the past few days, I figure this is trolling.

That would not be processes if presented to the court clerk on your day in court .The margin allowed is 10%+1 =56 Km/hr

This is not legislated. Its just rehashed from press releases and real world examples. GoSafe is accurate to +/- 1.5km/h or there abouts. Add in the speedo inaccuracy of 10 to 5%, and they generally allow 3km/h or so leeway i.e. You knew you were well over and the GoSafe van's accuracy & error is taken care off.

Either way, there is NO obligation in Irish legislation for a speed measurement device to be accurate or calibrated. The famous case taken was that the Ultralyte Laser gun could not produce a permanent record, the ruling had no bearing on its accuracy. You cannot challenge the accuracy unless you want to take a case against the statue and you better have mile deep pockets.

Del2005

SeanPuddin_ wrote: »

You don't need a solicitor, just say that's not my name Judge. Fine will be struck out immediately.

A person who represents themselves in court has a fool for a client.

Comhrá

That would not be processes if presented to the court clerk on your day in court .The margin allowed is 10%+1 =56 Km/hr

I got a speeding ticket three years ago for doing 109 kph in a 100 kph zone.

That's under the 10%+1 margin. I felt miffed as it was an empty main road after midnight but I paid up, took the p/points & moved on.:(

Dermo123

Del2005 wrote: »

A person who represents themselves in court has a fool for a client.

That was a phrase invented by the legal system.... It is foolish to keep putting it out there unless you work in the legal system?
She does not need a solicitor to state the blatantly obvious to a judge.

pred racer

XR3i wrote: »

you should still turn up, but if the name is written wrong it will be thrown out

No it won't, the judge will amend the name and you will get done.

Cee-Jay-Cee

I would contest it in court. I honestly can't see a judge convicting for 1kmph (which is 0.6mph) over the speed limit, any half sensible judge will see the ridiculousness of the case.

AlanG

I know a friend whose name was wrong on a fine. he went to pay in the post office and they could not accept payment. He was told to forget about it as it was not issued correctly. Nothing more ever came of it. That was about 6 years ago.

Del2005

Dermo123 wrote: »

That was a phrase invented by the legal system.... It is foolish to keep putting it out there unless you work in the legal system?
She does not need a solicitor to state the blatantly obvious to a judge.

All the judge will do is ask what speed was the speedo showing and she will have to say more than 50, conviction and more points. A solicitor will know what to say to get her off.

Red Kev

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Id imagine being ticketed for 51km/h means the speedo was reading 56~km/h. This is how the margin of error works.

Margin of error works both ways. So using your example the speedo could be reading 46 km/h.

I'd fight it. At the worst I'd see the judge telling you to put €50 in the poor box.

You also need to check with your insurance company to see how much the premium will go up. If it's by a considerable amount over 2 years I'd definitely fight it.

Dermo123

Del2005 wrote: »

All the judge will do is ask what speed was the speedo showing and she will have to say more than 50, conviction and more points. A solicitor will know what to say to get her off.

Can anyone recall exactly what their speedo was showing at a particular point in their journey? I am assuming this was a gatso van!
She can say about 50 your honour but I cannot precisley say whether it was below or above.
The element of doubt over 1kph will give the judge no choice but to throw it out.
This is common sense.
Are you a solicitor?

bpmurray

The manufacturers claim that the accuracy is "±1 mph (±2 km/h)" so unless they state that they measured you doing 53kph or more, there is no case to answer. If asked by the judge what the speedo was reading, you can confidently and truthfully claim that you don't know exactly when they measured so you simply don't know. If you're a member of the AA, I believe they help with this sort of thing.

A friend received one of these a few years ago and politely wrote back essentially asking them if they were serious: the thing was dropped.

Victor

Are you saying you were caught by a technicality? Well, the law is technical.

Name amendments are made all the time in district courts.

SeanPuddin_ wrote: »

You don't need a solicitor, just say that's not my name Judge. Fine will be struck out immediately.

You forget this bit:

wonski wrote: »

The fine is against your car rather than the driver.
If you don't agree you have driven the car, you have to declare who was driving it...

Dermo123

Victor wrote: »

Are you saying you were caught by a technicality? Well, the law is technical.

Name amendments are made all the time in district courts.

You forget this bit:

A good many years ago before fixed penalty charges were there, I got a speeding summons. The guard put the reg of car down almost right but incorrect all the same.
On day of court I pointed this out to guard beforehand and asked him which of us should point this out to judge. He said he would, and he said defandant "very kindly" pointed out the technical error.
Judge asked me if I was speeding. I said I was.
Judge struck it out on condition that I did not come in front of court for 6 months for another speeding offence.
So a technicality can be struck out if you approach it correctly.
No solicitor required. Just apply common sense.

Cienciano

Can you post up a photo or scan of the fine? No one seems to believe the 51kph bit.

Toyotafanboi

Red Kev wrote: »

Margin of error works both ways. So using your example the speedo could be reading 46 km/h.

Exactly, so someone doing an actual 51 in a 50 would never see a ticket.

Joe 90

A guard got my name wrong on a speeding ticket a long time ago. It was thrown out of court. No doubt I was speeding I always was in those days.:)

bladespin

TBH I'd be amazed if radar or laser was so poor that it had an error anything near 1kmh on an object travelling at 50khm, that's 2% of the range.

The whole 10% thing is a bit of an urban legend, I know several gardai who use it but it's purely at their discretion.

That said I can't see a court holding that up, I'm wondering how the superintendent even authorized it.

ironclaw

bladespin wrote: »

TBH I'd be amazed if radar or laser was so poor that it had an error anything near 1kmh on an object travelling at 50khm, that's 2% of the range.

In a lab, under perfect conditions you'll have extremely good accuracy. On the side of the road, weather, environmental factors, set up etc can all play a big part in error. The tech is sound, its just to air on the safe side.

MojoMaker

I think we're fairly sure the offence was 61 in a 50 zone but the printed notice c*cked this up to be 51 in a 50.

Still, on that basis I would show up, indulge the judge and look contrite and my opinion is he/she will throw it out.

bladespin

In a lab laser accuracy should be a couple of microns per metre, if that, they're fairly robust re enviromnent etc, radar is not as good but not that far off and does require more careful setup.

I'd still be amazed with a reading that far off.