Witness to a violent incident on the Red line Luas tonight 30/10

kezia21

Hi,

I'm very sporadically on Boards (as in every 4 years) but I witnessed something horrible tonight 30/10 at about 20:45 on the red line Luas between Jarvis and middle abbey St. A guy who was perhaps German or Swiss (really not sure) was punched by a man for no reason, I missed it as he was sitting behind me but as he moved towards my end of the tram and I realised what was happening I made him sit with me, he was so scared, and talk a bit. I made him stay on the Luas at middle abbey St where I was getting off as I heard the three antagonists (and they were horrendous on the Luas) saying they were getting off there (I was also getting off there). I got off at middle abbey St along with the attacker, who was trying to beat his way back onto the Luas to the poor guy that he'd already punched. At this point two very drunk older people (on crutches!) who'd gotten on at James and the attackers two friends were restraining him - (beyond that No One on the Luas intervened). Eventually the Luas's hazards went on and the driver seemed to have stopped hopefully for the guards, ie doors
Locked so he couldn't get on to hit the guy again (the attacker was crazed, I have never seen Anyone, like this before). I ran towards o'connell St the attacker now screaming at me, for deeming to talk to the guy who he'd punched, it was really terrifying. I feel so bad for that guy who's experience of Ireland was getting his face punched in. I am really traumatised by this, I don't know how the poor guy feels much much worse no doubt , I would really like to stress to LUAS how awful this was and how dangerous the red line consistently feels but there is only a very general email on their site. My question is- does anyone know an email for Luas that will actually get read regarding safety on the line?

Thanks,
Karen

The Dogs Bollix

That is horrific. That poor guy. Fair play to you for helping him out. They could have easily turned on you too.

Payton

Jesus that's horrendous. There are some quality of low life in this town!!
Hopefully the cctv on the luas and the platform where the toe rag got off will help the garda.
The link for Luas is https://www.luas.ie/contact-form.html
Phone 1850300604

frostyjacks

The Red Line really is like something out of the wild west. You need to keep your wits about you at all times. I don't think trams in other European countries have the same problem.

Terrontress

frostyjacks wrote: »

The Red Line really is like something out of the wild west. You need to keep your wits about you at all times. I don't think trams in other European countries have the same problem.

It depends on the European country. You'll get low level begging / busking as well as pick-pocketing in Paris or Berlin. London Underground is completely sealed, plus has a dedicated transport police so the begging and busking is less common. What you describe is a whole other level though and I think those cities would come down on that sort of thing like a ton of bricks.

RainyDay

Scary - there needs to be a discreet way to call for emergency assistance on public transport without making it obvious - app anyone?

Tom Dunne

kezia21 wrote: »

My question is- does anyone know an email for Luas that will actually get read regarding safety on the line?

I honestly don't think an e-mail is the way to go. Ring somebody. Speak to a human. Get your point across and then maybe follow it up with an email.

RainyDay wrote: »

Scary - there needs to be a discreet way to call for emergency assistance on public transport without making it obvious - app anyone?

Call me old-fashioned, but in a situation like that dialing 999 is the most effective way of getting help.

RainyDay

Tom Dunne wrote: »

RainyDay wrote: »

Scary - there needs to be a discreet way to call for emergency assistance on public transport without making it obvious - app anyone?

Call me old-fashioned, but in a situation like that dialing 999 is the most effective way of getting help.

You're old fashioned. The problem with dialling 999 is that the guy who you're trying to report to 999 is standing 2 feet away from you and tends to get a little irked.

Woodround

Red Line Luas is a complete joke. I started using it regularly again in July last year out of necessity, after years of avoiding it. Since then not a week has passed that I haven't witnessed at least 1 unsavoury incident. Most recently I witnessed an attempted mugging of a young student by 2 undesirables last Thursday morning. Routinely there are instances of verbal abuse, people under the influence of drink and/or drugs getting up to all sorts as well is general anti social behaviour. Thursday evenings seem to be the worst for some reason.

Contacting the operators seems to be a complete waste of time as it continuously falls on deaf ears. They only seem to be interested in checking and fining fare dodgers between Busarus and the Point during rush hour in the morning. They have no problem handing out fines to those people, yet on the few occasions that I have seen them check tickets up around Jervis or Abbey St and they come across an undesirable individual they tend to instead ask them to get off at the next stop and purchase a ticket or sometimes just bypass them altogether - strange!

And their solution to all this - http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/fare-increases-luas-ticket-holders-face-60-hike-in-fares-34155060.html

Fleawuss

The truth is that there is no political will to make streets and transport safer. And there is no political will because people accept it. We rant on social media and then march on while the next victims are picked off. I reached a stage where I plan my journeys: not through there, not at that time. I can do without the hassle.

BabySlam

complain to your public representatives - those people you elect to represent you in local and national government. They are there to serve you and the public interest. Complain and keep following up with them to see what is happening.

savagethegoat

It's one train line operating only a few trams, it wouldn't be at all difficult to police this properly. Does someone have to die first?

Kermit.de.frog

Terrible OP. Not surprising though.


And there are people, including on Boards, that are totally deluded and out of touch with the reality of anti social behaviour in Dublin that will be just itching to tell you that you are either lying or exaggerating.

I have said it before - there are sections of the red line that are dangerous at certain times, it's as simple as that. When you route a tram through the dodgiest areas of Dublin from junkie central passed the children's court and other such amenities stuff like this is always going to happen.

As for paying you would almost feel like a complete fool for actually buying a ticket on that line given what seems to be most other passengers either don't bother or have a welfare card.

The line is a disgusting metaphor for all that is wrong with Dublin.

The sad thing is it was forseeable before it opened and the exact same inflictions will affect the new cross city line too.

end of the road

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

there are people, including on Boards, that are totally deluded and out of touch with the reality of anti social behaviour in Dublin that will be just itching to tell you that you are either lying or exaggerating.

no there aren't. everyone is well aware that dublin has problems of anti-social behaviour. yes, people exist like myself who have been lucky to get away with not being witness to hardly anything bar the odd shouty dimwit but that means nothing. its just simply being lucky

Kermit.de.frog

It depends where you have to walk through or go about your business. The north side is dodgy and you do need your wits about you. Parts of the south side are not that much better either though in general I find the south side of the city center better to be around.

If I was a tourist visiting O'Connell st, for example, I could well see myself finding the city a little intimidating and it's not just the junkies and the casual scumbags you see but it's the whole ambiance that creates. It's not the most comfortable.

The thing is that is supposed to be the main thoroughfare and the wounds are self inflicted which is the annoying thing.

kezia21

Thanks everyone for the suggestions, will follow it up.

beauf

There definitely needs to be some response team for the trains and particularly the Luas.

Tom Dunne wrote: »

...Call me old-fashioned, but in a situation like that dialing 999 is the most effective way of getting help.

In recent years that seems to get very little response to that either. A good question for the politicians when they come knocking. Where are there never police around.

Muahahaha

Some sort of Transport Police is badly needed now in Dublin. Garda visibility on public transport is virtually zero and the bulked up security guys seem pre occupied with revenue protection rather than customer protection.

beauf

There were no cops available when a fare evader held up the maynooth train for almost 2 hrs. Its an issue that's just being ignored.

When these get to court the person will have a marathon load of priors. Where's the deterrent?

Patrick Wheelock

post this on Rabble and see how far you get

foggy_lad

Muahahaha wrote: »

Some sort of Transport Police is badly needed now in Dublin. Garda visibility on public transport is virtually zero and the bulked up security guys seem pre occupied with revenue protection rather than customer protection.

Seriously who is going to pay for extra Gardai to travel up and down the red line all day? they have feck all powers really and can only bring people to the station process them and release them yet again! All that costs us taxpayers a fortune though while there are even less Gardai on the ground to deal with even more serious crimes!

also Dublin tansport is not like other cities where transport police are found, they would be totally useless in Dublin because of the time it would take them to travel between the places they will be needed. What do people held up in Maynooth waiting on transport police for a fare dodger do when the transport police are all miles away out in bray, Dundalk, Kildare and dealing with incidents all over the country on buses?

We don't have enough high density transport to justify the massive costs of a dedicated police force or even a dedicated Gardai unit. By the time they reach incidents the troublemakers will be gone.

jobless

foggy_lad wrote: »

Seriously who is going to pay for extra Gardai to travel up and down the red line all day? they have feck all powers really and can only bring people to the station process them and release them yet again! All that costs us taxpayers a fortune though while there are even less Gardai on the ground to deal with even more serious crimes!

also Dublin tansport is not like other cities where transport police are found, they would be totally useless in Dublin because of the time it would take them to travel between the places they will be needed. What do people held up in Maynooth waiting on transport police for a fare dodger do when the transport police are all miles away out in bray, Dundalk, Kildare and dealing with incidents all over the country on buses?

We don't have enough high density transport to justify the massive costs of a dedicated police force or even a dedicated Gardai unit. By the time they reach incidents the troublemakers will be gone.

I think its up to the luas operators to increase the security presence on these trams, they run a highly profitable business and are not facing up to the problems on it...
I feel sorry especially for any older people travelling along that line, it must be very intimidating... My own dad in his 60's had to shield some kids from some guy off his face waving a knife about.... thankfully he doesnt have to use it anymore

bk

foggy_lad wrote: »

Seriously who is going to pay for extra Gardai to travel up and down the red line all day? they have feck all powers really and can only bring people to the station process them and release them yet again! All that costs us taxpayers a fortune though while there are even less Gardai on the ground to deal with even more serious crimes!

The same way that the British Transport Police are paid for, by the transport companies themselves.

Get rid of the useless security and ticket checkers and use the money they spend on them on financing a dedicated transport police instead.

No one is suggesting reducing the number of Gardai, but instead increasing them.

Also crime is crime and people being attacked and robbed on trams is certainly a very real and serious crime! I'd expect Gardai on trams would do more to reduce real crime then the Gardai I see regularly driving around leafy affluent suburbs.

Really, I'm shocked at your statement above, there are few crimes more serious then assault. Assault is pretty much the most serious crime a uniformed Garda deals with. Only rape and murder (and maybe burglary) are more serious and they are dealt with by detectives anyway.

BTW even if the transport police were to just arrest these people and bring them to a station for 24 hours and end up realising them again, I think it would still have a very positive impact. Many of these scumbags actually have places to go, drug deals to do, etc. A night in a cell will ruin their plans.

If the trams had regular uniformed and undercover Gardai on them, I think you would find most of the trouble makers would quickly shut up and be more careful as they wouldn't want to spend a night in a cell and have their plans ruined. Of course there would be still the odd nutcase off his head on something, but the majority of trouble makers are still relatively rational human beings.

I've actually seen this once. I was on the Red tram heading into town and there was some noisy, drunk/drugged trouble makers on the tram. At the courts two uniformed Gardai got on (simply using it as transport) and the trouble makers immediately shut up, sat their quietly and got off at the next tram.

Alf Veedersane

Part of the problem is 'transport police' wouldn't have the powers to forcibly remove the toerags as required. The best you could hope for is that the visibility of someone they know has more legal power might be a deterrent.

wrt40

Looking forward to all this fun coming to the Green line soon.

bk

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Part of the problem is 'transport police' wouldn't have the powers to forcibly remove the toerags as required. The best you could hope for is that the visibility of someone they know has more legal power might be a deterrent.

Actually the "Transport Police" in Britain are full Police Constables, with all the powers of arrest, etc. They even carry guns. They are the people you see patrolling airports, train stations, etc. Definitely not to be messed with.

I'm suggesting the same for Ireland. Though it would probably make more sense for an Irish "Transport police" to just be a separate, dedicated division within the Gardai, but fully dedicated to transport matters and financed and directed by the transport companies.

BTW even the ticket checkers and security on trains and Luas have the powers to remove a person from the tram/train.

Alf Veedersane

bk wrote: »

Actually the "Transport Police" in Britain are full Police Constables, with all the powers of arrest, etc. They even carry guns. They are the people you see patrolling airports, train stations, etc. Definitely not to be messed with.

I'm suggesting the same for Ireland. Though it would probably make more sense for an Irish "Transport police" to just be a separate, dedicated division within the Gardai, but fully dedicated to transport matters and financed and directed by the transport companies.

BTW even the ticket checkers and security on trains and Luas have the powers to remove a person from the tram/train.

The LUAS security can't physically remove people or detain them.

That's why a dedicated division within AGS is what would be needed but it will be a long time before they commit the resources needed to actually make a difference.

beauf

bk wrote: »

...BTW even the ticket checkers and security on trains and Luas have the powers to remove a person from the tram/train.

But they don't.

allybhoy

Awful incident, hope the poor guy is ok. Make sure you follow it up with the Gardai and report it as a witness. Hopefully they arrived to arrest the scrote.

bk

beauf wrote: »

But they don't.

Well I've certainly seen the security people remove people from the late DARTs. So they do have the power, even if they don't use it often.

Seanachai

I hate the LUAS but especially the red line and I'm well able to take care of myself, the air of menace and general noise from lowlifes is awful. About two weeks ago I saw two Russian guys attack an Asian guy on Henry street at about 5.30 in the evening. I was a bit away from them and by the time I went back up people has intervened and managed to separate them. One of the Russian guys was a lot tougher than the other and was intent on causing damage.

It was mostly women that stepped in and I think that this worked out better as men could have inflamed the situation. As dodgy as the guys were they drew the line at striking the women, they were kind of just overwhelmed by the people gathering around them and telling them to stop. It just goes to show that even if people used their words they could de-escalate these situations. I can understand why people would be frightened though.

There's a lot of unhinged people about lately and I don't know if it's because of the creaking health service or cutbacks in policing. I had a fella square up to me on Prospect road in Glasnevin last Sunday night wearing a pair of sunglasses just muttering to himself!. If I had of reacted then it could have escalated, sometimes it's better to do nothing. In that situation on the LUAS anybody there would have every right to fight back and throw those guys off of the tram.

wrt40

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

The LUAS security can't physically remove people or detain them.

Of course they can. Anyone can make a citizens arrest. They choose not to get involved because they are not getting paid enough to put their own safety at risk and probably have a family to consider. I'd imagine they also fear prosecution.

gizmo555

bk wrote: »

Actually the "Transport Police" in Britain are full Police Constables, with all the powers of arrest, etc. They even carry guns. They are the people you see patrolling airports, train stations, etc. Definitely not to be messed with.

There is also ample precedent for this in Ireland, e.g., the Airport Police, Dublin Harbour Police, and Dún Laoghaire Harbour Police

_Kaiser_

wrt40 wrote: »

Looking forward to all this fun coming to the Green line soon.

This is a valid point too.. all this disruption and expense to link the 2 lines together will be only fantastic for the junkie wasters and scum who can then start day-tripping out to Dundrum and the likes more easily.

Watch though as it THEN suddenly becomes an issue. Can't have this sorta thing in the famed SCD area after all! :rolleyes:

Alf Veedersane

wrt40 wrote: »

Of course they can. Anyone can make a citizens arrest. They choose not to get involved because they are not getting paid enough to put their own safety at risk and probably have a family to consider. I'd imagine they also fear prosecution.

That's what I was referring to.

Frank Grimes

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

The LUAS security can't physically remove people or detain them.

I've seen it happen at least once, possibly twice. I can't remember for certain on the other occasion if it ended up with them physically removing the guy or else he got off the tram when he realised he would be removed.

Spanish Eyes

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

This is a valid point too.. all this disruption and expense to link the 2 lines together will be only fantastic for the junkie wasters and scum who can then start day-tripping out to Dundrum and the likes more easily.

Watch though as it THEN suddenly becomes an issue. Can't have this sorta thing in the famed SCD area after all! :rolleyes:

I often wondered if the segregation of the lines back in the day had something to do with "protecting" the SCD. lol. But there may be some truth in it just the same!

I hope there will be no migration of the Red Line issues when the lines are merged, but at the same time, hope that the Red Line issues are resolved too.

We are all travelling public after all.

LXFlyer

wrt40 wrote: »

Looking forward to all this fun coming to the Green line soon.

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

This is a valid point too.. all this disruption and expense to link the 2 lines together will be only fantastic for the junkie wasters and scum who can then start day-tripping out to Dundrum and the likes more easily.

Watch though as it THEN suddenly becomes an issue. Can't have this
sorta thing in the famed SCD area after all! :rolleyes:

This sort of nonsense keeps sprouting up here every so often.

I would think that you would find that most of the Red Line "undesirables" are making the same journeys that they always did, but have swapped over from the bus to the LUAS.

Anyone who used the old 51b/51c, 77, 78a, 123 regularly would have experienced varying degrees of anti-social behaviour over the years - many of those responsible now get the LUAS.

For that reason, I really don't see them heading south along the Green Line in any great numbers. They are generally heading into town for somewhere specific, be it clinics etc., not going out "on spec".

BoatMad

Armed LUAS police with provide them with attack dogs. Problem solved

Del2005

bk wrote: »

The same way that the British Transport Police are paid for, by the transport companies themselves.

Get rid of the useless security and ticket checkers and use the money they spend on them on financing a dedicated transport police instead.

No one is suggesting reducing the number of Gardai, but instead increasing them.

Also crime is crime and people being attacked and robbed on trams is certainly a very real and serious crime! I'd expect Gardai on trams would do more to reduce real crime then the Gardai I see regularly driving around leafy affluent suburbs.

Really, I'm shocked at your statement above, there are few crimes more serious then assault. Assault is pretty much the most serious crime a uniformed Garda deals with. Only rape and murder (and maybe burglary) are more serious and they are dealt with by detectives anyway.

BTW even if the transport police were to just arrest these people and bring them to a station for 24 hours and end up realising them again, I think it would still have a very positive impact. Many of these scumbags actually have places to go, drug deals to do, etc. A night in a cell will ruin their plans.

If the trams had regular uniformed and undercover Gardai on them, I think you would find most of the trouble makers would quickly shut up and be more careful as they wouldn't want to spend a night in a cell and have their plans ruined. Of course there would be still the odd nutcase off his head on something, but the majority of trouble makers are still relatively rational human beings.

I've actually seen this once. I was on the Red tram heading into town and there was some noisy, drunk/drugged trouble makers on the tram. At the courts two uniformed Gardai got on (simply using it as transport) and the trouble makers immediately shut up, sat their quietly and got off at the next tram.

The problem on our public transport can't be solved by throwing more security or Gardaì at it. The problem is in the courts and the lack of any sanctions for anti social behaviour or assault. The reality is that when the Gardaì arrest a scumbag off public transport it's takes 2 or more Gardaì to deal with them. Yet if they go to court they get a fine, which they never pay just waste more state resources for the day trip to jail. Even bringing them to the cells for 24 hours means we are spending money on them which could be spent better elsewhere and again taking several Gardaì off the streets.

We need to have court sanctions that actually affect the scumbags not the current incestuous relationship between scumbags and solicitors milking the free legal aid system. The problem has to be fixed from the top down, it can't be fixed on public transport. Why should a Garda risk injury and loads of paper work to see the person walk out of court laughing.

I had a different experience. Was stopped at Jervis when the security tried to remove someone, couple of off duty Gardaì where assisting. The people on the tram where giving the security and Gardaì loads of abuse saying leave him alone, eventually the security had to shout to say that he was a paedophile and then the tram eventually shut up and let them remove him.

Grandeeod

lxflyer wrote: »

This sort of nonsense keeps sprouting up here every so often.

I would think that you would find that most of the Red Line "undesirables" are making the same journeys that they always did, but have swapped over from the bus to the LUAS.

Anyone who used the old 51b/51c, 77, 78a, 123 regularly would have experienced varying degrees of anti-social behaviour over the years - many of those responsible now get the LUAS.

For that reason, I really don't see them heading south along the Green Line in any great numbers. They are generally heading into town for somewhere specific, be it clinics etc., not going out "on spec".

I would tend to disagree with you on that opinion. In the mid 90s the Arrow service opened along the Kildare/Naas route. Within 12 months or so anti social behaviour had increased in the areas it served and a substantial amount of this stemmed from people travelling from the city centre, Cherry Orchard and Clondalkin. Back then we didn't have the internet so relied on the regular news articles in publications like the Leinster Leader and Kildare Nationalist. It was well documented that the likes of Naas District Court were dealing with undesirables that had committed crime in the area after travelling down by the new train service. Sallins village, the site of the station itself was particularly affected. I personally witnessed aggressive "day trippers" out of their brains on drink and whatever else, upset locals, after travelling down on the train.

Believe me when I say that new routes are an attraction to some of these guys. If its easy to get to then they will take their day out.

Sierra Oscar

foggy_lad wrote: »

Seriously who is going to pay for extra Gardai to travel up and down the red line all day? they have feck all powers really and can only bring people to the station process them and release them yet again! All that costs us taxpayers a fortune though while there are even less Gardai on the ground to deal with even more serious crimes!

The operators. Force them to fund a transport police with real actual policing powers instead of paying for ineffective private security. The British Transport Police are mainly funded by the operators.

Fianna Fáil has actually been talking about this of late. Hopefully it's something that gets traction in the run up to the election.

Dublin Transport Police

Fianna Fáil will examine the concept of establishing a Dublin Transport Police unit which will be responsible for enforcing the law on all public transport services in Dublin. The majority of this funding would be sourced through the public transport operators themselves.

The powers of the Transport Police will reflect the powers of An Garda Síochána with specific limits as to jurisdiction.

https://www.fiannafail.ie/download/dublin/Dublin%20Election%20Manifesto.pdf

LXFlyer

Grandeeod wrote: »

I would tend to disagree with you on that opinion. In the mid 90s the Arrow service opened along the Kildare/Naas route. Within 12 months or so anti social behaviour had increased in the areas it served and a substantial amount of this stemmed from people travelling from the city centre, Cherry Orchard and Clondalkin. Back then we didn't have the internet so relied on the regular news articles in publications like the Leinster Leader and Kildare Nationalist. It was well documented that the likes of Naas District Court were dealing with undesirables that had committed crime in the area after travelling down by the new train service. Sallins village, the site of the station itself was particularly affected. I personally witnessed aggressive "day trippers" out of their brains on drink and whatever else, upset locals, after travelling down on the train.

Believe me when I say that new routes are an attraction to some of these guys. If its easy to get to then they will take their day out.

Right so now they're going to all get the red line into town, walk to the green line and then head south?

How is that different from taking a tram into town and switching to another bus?

You're quoting an example where there was a new direct link.

I just don't see it being this huge problem that some seem to think it will be.

Alf Veedersane

Frank Grimes wrote: »

I've seen it happen at least once, possibly twice. I can't remember for certain on the other occasion if it ended up with them physically removing the guy or else he got off the tram when he realised he would be removed.

I probably should clarify. Legally I'm pretty sure they can't physically remove people unless they're reacting. I'm not saying it hasn't been done. I'm just saying that they are legally skating on thin ice.

I don't have a problem with them removing people. It doesn't happen enough. But they need more legal powers

Grandeeod

lxflyer wrote: »

Right so now they're going to all get the red line into town, walk to the green line and then head south?

How is that different from taking a tram into town and switching to another bus?

You're quoting an example where there was a new direct link.

I just don't see it being this huge problem that some seem to think it will be.

You are quite entitled to disagree with me, but the tone of your post is a little indignant.

How is that different from taking a tram into town and switching to another bus?

Rail transport has always been easier for fare dodgers than a bus service. Fare dodgers tend to be proponents of anti social behaviour.

You're quoting an example where there was a new direct link

The problem existed bedore the rail link, but increased after the rail link opened.

And finally...

Right so now they're going to all get the red line into town, walk to the green line and then head south?

This was the indignant bit. No need for the "right so". Regarding your point, it is quite possible that once the luas is effectively linked up, it is not beyond reasonable to suggest that red line problems will be more easily exported to the green line.

end of the road

bk wrote: »

Get rid of the useless ticket checkers and use the money they spend on them on financing a dedicated transport police instead.

so who is going to check tickets and protect revenue? because the transport police don't really do it as its not their remit. at least its not in the uk. i'd doubt the current costs of security and ticket checkers would even cover a dedicated transport police?

bk wrote: »

The same way that the British Transport Police are paid for, by the transport companies themselves.

i am taking it then you would be willing to increase the subsidy to the subsidized operators to allow this to happen?

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

The operators. Force them to fund a transport police with real actual policing powers instead of paying for ineffective private security. The British Transport Police are mainly funded by the operators.

i put the above question to you also

LXFlyer

Grandeeod wrote: »

You are quite entitled to disagree with me, but the tone of your post is a little indignant.

Rail transport has always been easier for fare dodgers than a bus service. Fare dodgers tend to be proponents of anti social behaviour.

The problem existed bedore the rail link, but increased after the rail link opened.

And finally...

This was the indignant bit. No need for the "right so". Regarding your point, it is quite possible that once the luas is effectively linked up, it is not beyond reasonable to suggest that red line problems will be more easily exported to the green line.

Indignant? No.

Strongly disagree - yes.

I don't see (for example) large hordes of people travelling from some of the DART stations in working class areas to the western suburban line for example.

I really think this notion is blown out of all proportion, hence my choice of words, as frankly it's nothing more than scaremongering nonsense.

RainyDay

BoatMad wrote: »

Armed LUAS police with provide them with attack dogs. Problem solved

How's that arming police and attack dogs working out in stopping anti-social behaviour in the States?

Captain Chaos

RainyDay wrote: »

How's that arming police and attack dogs working out in stopping anti-social behaviour in the States?

We used to have them here on suburban services in the Dublin area until the DART arrived, worked very well then.

Pinch Flat

RainyDay wrote: »

How's that arming police and attack dogs working out in stopping anti-social behaviour in the States?

My own experience of this was while living in Germany - similar incident with anti-social behaviour. Tram stops, door locked and at the next stop there's the polizei - armed and with feck off German Shepherd dogs. Perpetrator is identified, two burly coppers manhandle him, put him on the ground, cuffed and in the back of the waiting Audi with its tail gate ready and waiting before he know what hit him.

I've seen similar crack downs by the gendarmerie in France and caribineiri in Italy.

Tigger

the nightlink buses used to be bad (i haven't been on one in 18 years)