Wife can't let a friendship with female colleague go

LegacyUser

Ill try and keep this short and would appreciate any advice on this matter,My wife and i run a business together which consists of 3 retail outlets

A woman started working for us a couple of years ago,and predominately with me in the last 18 months,in the last year myself and this woman got on really well,we would have a similar sense of humour and we generally just clicked personality wise,she is also extremely good at her job and in my view, turned the business around in this particular shop as it was struggling when she arrived

As time went by,I gave her full control of the business as she knew what she was doing better than me,and I rewarded her by giving her pay rises and gifts for xmas and birthdays etc as i valued her as a good employee and wanted to hold on to her,even though i was very fond of her as an employee,i never overstepped those boundaries and was never attracted to her in a sexual way,but i did enjoy her company and would spend more time with her in this shop as i got on well with her,and i started to neglect the other two shops as my wife and her sisters where looking after the other two

Roll on to 2 months ago,and this woman(lets call her Mary) had a row with another employee,because her work ethic was not up to her standard,so the other employee who was giving out to, went back to my wife and told her that myself and Mary was having an affair

Of course all hell broke out,and my wife started doing a lot of shouting and screaming as she always had a jealous streak about Mary,but i always put her at ease when she did say something,thing is i never told her about any gifts i bought her,nor did i tell her about her about Mary joining the same gym as me(she went at totally different times than me)because of the jealous nature she had of her,but after a lot of digging she found receipts and messages containing her joining the gym

She then concluded that, there was something going on with us,not sexual but emotionally,and cannot get it out of her head,for the past two months now,every day there is screaming matches at each other over it,she is constantly looking for reasons to find more information about me and Mary,and is rallying all her friends and family against me

My whole life has being turned upside down because of this,as its day in day out of knocking me down and down,and i am on the brink of a nervous breakdown,as has my wife(ive never seen her like this and would have never gave her reason to),I know im in the wrong and have apologised so many times and asked her for her forgiveness and move on,but she just cant leave it behind her and move on

Mary still works for us,and even though she rang my wife to explain that nothing was or had being going on(in a two hour call)my wife wont believe a word from her, and cant stand her,and cant even bear to work anymore because she doesn't want to confront her in any way

As i said any advice would be appreciated as to how myself and my wife can get back to our nice life we had before all this,we have started counselling,but it doesn't seem to be helping

Merkin

You say you didn't overstep the boundaries but you very clearly did given that you not only gifted this woman birthday presents but the clandestine nature of these too. It sounds like there was an intimacy there without the sex. I'd continue with counselling, explore what's lacking in your marriage that precipitated the need for this kind of friendship and I'd also endeavour to sever all ties with Mary so if that means not having any involvement with the third retail outlet then so be it, send another manager in your place.

Another day

Sorry for your troubles. Unfortunately I imagine it is not an easy one to sort out. However there are a number of things you could try.

1. Take a step back from that shop. Find someone impartial that can take over your role there.
2. Change gym.
3. Discuss with your wife what you need to do to prove yourself to her. What will put her mind at ease.
4. Find out why your wife is insecure in your relationship.
5. Do not let Mary go as in fire her. You will end up in court for unfair dismissal.
6. Have you approached the disgruntled employee? If you haven't done anything wrong she has made a serious allegation to your wife and caused major problems within your relationship and should be repremanded for this at the very least. The employee should also provide you and your wife with her reasons for making such assumptions.

Work relationships so often end up with problems like these. But also your wife should know you well enough to know the type of man you are. I take it your wofe has no close male friends so doesnt realise that men and women can be friends without it being anything more. Also stop the gifts! A bonus in recognition of work done is sufficient.

pookie82

A few things:

You've made the situation pretty damning for yourself by buying her secret birthday and Christmas gifts, I don't care how good an employee she is, you don't overstep this line as an employer unless EVERY member of staff is getting the same bonus/gift. Otherwise it's clear special treatment and whether you like it or not, an indication of a "special" bond, platonic or not, that you have with another woman.

You've also admitted to spending the majority of your time in her shop and neglecting the others; again, this doesn't help your case. Can I ask in a nice way ... what were you thinking?! Did you honestly believe this was all above board? I suspect not, because you hid the presents.

You say that's because your wife was jealous of her anyway, I'm not surprised. It's a vicious circle, the old "oh the wife gets jealous so I hide everything because nothing's going on" but now that your omissions/lies have come to the fore you're making yourself look guiltier than you even are. That's the situation you've put YOURSELF in.

Don't fire this girl - as someone mentioned, she could have you for unfair dismissal.

But for the love of god stop spending all your time in her shop. In fact, designate that to someone else and steer clear of her until the heat dies down if you want to save your marriage. Put yourself in your wife's shoes and imagine how embarrassed, upset and betrayed she feels right now. It's hard, with the facts in front of her (facts she had to DIG for herself), to believe absolutely nothing untoward went on. Successful relationships are based on trust but by omitting all the facts yourself in the first place you've made her question that trust and she can't fathom how far you've gone now in breaking it. Throw a scorned, rumour-bearing employee into the mix and her head must be spinning.

In terms of the employee who told your wife this ... it's easy for you to assume she just fabricated it to get back at Mary. Have you thought about the fact that perhaps yourself and Mary were acting in a manner which led the other staff to believe you were having an affair? You're spending all your time there, have this "great" rapport, and perhaps the gifts haven't gone unnoticed by colleagues.

You've been really foolish, and I know you know that, but you need to give you wife a lot of time and a lot of patience and hope she wants to forgive it, because I'm not sure I would.

Colser

Op if I was your wife I wouldnt believe a word of your story.Im not saying you are lying but just that as a woman I really wouldnt believe that nothing was going on and the thing about the presents is laughable imo.You went out on your own to buy birthday and Christmas presents for another woman because she was such a good employee..really?
You both joined the same gym but were never there at the same time?
You spent most of your time at that shop because you had the same sense of humour but there was no attraction?

Sorry now OP but I fail to see how you cannot see why your wife is acting like she is and my opinion is that if this is to get sorted it will take a lot more time for your wife to even begin to calm down.

I think you need to see your wife as human rather than jealous in relation to how she is reacting to this and I also find the wording in the thread title to be again painting your wife as the one in the wrong here.

As for advise on what you can do all I can say is tell her the truth as she will keep asking questions and dont do anything behind her back with that woman again.

pookie82

Colser wrote: »

I also find the wording in the thread title to be again painting your wife as the one in the wrong here.

I meant to add this in my post, OP - your thread title made me think that perhaps your wife was wound up about a perfectly innocent, here-and-there interaction with a female colleague.

This goes WAY beyond that.

You have to take ownership of all YOU did to paint this situation in a really bad light, and stop labeling her as some jealous, high maintenance wife.

lifeandtimes

walter black wrote: »

Ill try and keep this short and would appreciate any advice on this matter,My wife and i run a business together which consists of 3 retail outlets

A woman started working for us a couple of years ago,and predominately with me in the last 18 months,in the last year myself and this woman got on really well,we would have a similar sense of humour and we generally just clicked personality wise,she is also extremely good at her job and in my view, turned the business around in this particular shop as it was struggling when she arrived

As time went by,I gave her full control of the business as she knew what she was doing better than me,and I rewarded her by giving her pay rises and gifts for xmas and birthdays etc as i valued her as a good employee and wanted to hold on to her,even though i was very fond of her as an employee,i never overstepped those boundaries and was never attracted to her in a sexual way,but i did enjoy her company and would spend more time with her in this shop as i got on well with her,and i started to neglect the other two shops as my wife and her sisters where looking after the other two

Roll on to 2 months ago,and this woman(lets call her Mary) had a row with another employee,because her work ethic was not up to her standard,so the other employee who was giving out to, went back to my wife and told her that myself and Mary was having an affair

Of course all hell broke out,and my wife started doing a lot of shouting and screaming as she always had a jealous streak about Mary,but i always put her at ease when she did say something,thing is i never told her about any gifts i bought her,nor did i tell her about her about Mary joining the same gym as me(she went at totally different times than me)because of the jealous nature she had of her,but after a lot of digging she found receipts and messages containing her joining the gym

She then concluded that, there was something going on with us,not sexual but emotionally,and cannot get it out of her head,for the past two months now,every day there is screaming matches at each other over it,she is constantly looking for reasons to find more information about me and Mary,and is rallying all her friends and family against me

My whole life has being turned upside down because of this,as its day in day out of knocking me down and down,and i am on the brink of a nervous breakdown,as has my wife(ive never seen her like this and would have never gave her reason to),I know im in the wrong and have apologised so many times and asked her for her forgiveness and move on,but she just cant leave it behind her and move on

Mary still works for us,and even though she rang my wife to explain that nothing was or had being going on(in a two hour call)my wife wont believe a word from her, and cant stand her,and cant even bear to work anymore because she doesn't want to confront her in any way

As i said any advice would be appreciated as to how myself and my wife can get back to our nice life we had before all this,we have started counselling,but it doesn't seem to be helping

THe two parts in bold are what stick out for me.

You bought her presents as she was good employee, fair enough these can be seen as incentives or bonus for good work, regardless of if another employee didnt get them, especially if she was the top performer of all employees, the only problem is you hid these from your wife. If you two are in business together would she not need to know that you are rewarding mary for all the good and hard work she has done? This looks like you were trying to impress this woman with gifts regardless of her performance(from your wifes point of view)

part two, how did you wife do digging and find messages and receipts that mary joined the same gym as you? Do you mean she went looknig through your things and found your recipets and messages on your phone etc confirming you two are going to the same place? First off she shouldnt be "digging" but shes has found something and put 2 and 2 together and go 75. The reason i say 75 instead of 100 is because you are still at fault, you have knowingly or unknowingly been having an emotional affair, all be it not a very intense one as you have not said you and mary talk every day by message and meet up outside of work for coffee etc but still enough to have cause of concern.

I would talk to your wife, tell her you did not mean anything by it, in your stupidity you wanted to reward this woman and priase her good work, you did not want to tell your wife due to prenotions of jealously with this woman however you can see that in hindsight that was wrong and you should have been more upfront, ask your wife what she feels you need to do to work on your relationship, stay away from the shop for the time being and work on your relationship with your wife, reprimand the employee who make accusations against you and your employee and try to move forward

zl1whqvjs75cdy

You're in trouble here op. I can clearly see where your wife is coming from. If the situation was reversed how would you feel?

Honestly, and I mean total honesty, is the only option open now. Tell her what is in the op and by apologetic. Try and avoid accusing her of being unreasonable. That won't go well. Be totally apologetic and accept that it is totally your fault. Best of luck with it.

JaMarcusHustle

Have to agree with the others OP, put yourself in your wife's shoes. What if you suddenly found out she was spending a lot of time with another man, buying him Christmas and birthday presents and he joined her gym? And then someone told you they were having an affair?

Its easy to see why she thinks you're lying. And if your turning on her in your arguments the way you are here, then that's even more damning because that's what cheaters do. Hell, I read your post and I'm not sure I believe you either.

Either way, what's done is done. Your wife will come round. Give her time and space. She feels betrayed and is probably embarrassed.

Have to ask, why did not tell your wife about buying this girl presents. Did you know it would upset her? And you still did it anyway?

mapaca

I think your wife's reaction is perfectly understandable. From the outside it certainly looks like you were having an affair. Hiding things from her didn't help your case. It's no wonder she has a hard time believing you. Plus your whole workforce have probably been gossiping about it. She is betrayed, hurt and humiliated in front of her family and staff. You have a lot of work to do to fix this.

amdublin

The other posters make valid points. And I do wonder was there something else going on.

But taking you at your word there was not. Plus most importantly you want to fix this. I am surprised the counselling is not helping. Are you both engaging in it fully? How often are you going? I would think you will need weekly sessions until this is resolved.

LegacyUser

OP here,thanks for all the advice here,ok first of all as some people have pointed out,there has being nothing going on with Mary in any way sexual,but if im honest with myself,there has being an emotional attraction,BTW Mary is married with four children

As for the disgruntled employee,she has now left and has apologised for making the accusation,i have also stepped back from this particular shop and only go there when i really need to,and spend as little time as possible there

I have being reassuring my wife that i made a idiot of myself and this will never ever happen again,as i learned a lesson by getting to close to an employee,but even though she comes around when i do reassure her,a few hours later,something else will pop into her head and we are back at square one,and she wants out of our relationship,and then we start with a very loud and nasty argument,this situation has being repeating itself now for the last few months every day, and its wearing bout of us out,we are both consumed by it now and if it keeps up, not only will our business suffer,it will take a toll on our health

meeeeh

OP, for someone who has three shops your actions were very foolish. You should probably attend a course on employment laws and employee relations because your actions were incredibly stupid and were clearly and unfairly favouring one employee regardless of the gender.

As for the relationship with your wife I agree that getting someone else to manage that shop would be good idea. Stay away from her , keep your head down and maybe you will be able to weather the storm.

dixiefly

I agree with most people on here.

This is a drastic suggestion but I wonder could you allow Mary to buy ye guys out of the shop that she is managing. This would facilitate a cessation of contact and possible redemption of your marriage.

discus

Put the foot down OP, don't start grovelling, you haven't done anything wrong.

meeeeh wrote: »

OP, for someone who has three shops your actions were very foolish. You should probably attend a course on employment laws and employee relations because your actions were incredibly stupid and were clearly and unfairly favouring one employee regardless of the gender.

He was rewarding a particularly effective worker. It happens in tons of employments - retail, finance, corporate commercial, military the works. It's not favouring, she is literally turning around the shop by running it effectively... thereby increasing profit. You don't keep people like that without suitable reward.

As for the relationship with your wife I agree that getting someone else to manage that shop would be good idea. Stay away from her , keep your head down and maybe you will be able to weather the storm.

Correct.

discus

dixiefly wrote: »

I agree with most people on here.

This is a drastic suggestion but I wonder could you allow Mary to buy ye guys out of the shop that she is managing. This would facilitate a cessation of contact and possible redemption of your marriage.

NO!
OP, do not sell a successful business concern and livelihood just because your wife can't deal with your management style. Your wife may still leave you (she obviously doesn't trust you not to cheat, or trust you to tell the truth) and you will be left with nothing.

OneOfThem

Sounds like you're being too spineless tbh. Months this has been going on? Months of your wife starting a nasty row every single day? Months? Genuinely? Tell her she needs to drop it. Now. Permanently. Or it'd be best if you two part ways. Enough is enough for crying out loud. She's not a child. She shouldn't get to act like one. What other choice do you have? Let months become years? Same sh1te? Fvck that. That's no kind of life.

Colser

OneOfThem wrote: »

Sounds like you're being too spineless tbh. Months this has been going on? Months of your wife starting a nasty row every single day? Months? Genuinely? Tell her she needs to drop it. Now. Permanently. Or it'd be best if you two part ways. Enough is enough for crying out loud. She's not a child. She shouldn't get to act like one. What other choice do you have? Let months become years? Same sh1te? Fvck that. That's no kind of life.

Im shocked OneOfThem as I usually agree with you:pac: How do you think his wife should have reacted? Do you not think the OP is way out of line here? I think this will get much worse before it ever gets better. I cant think of one woman I know who would buy his story (not saying its not true).

discus

Put it like this, if the genders were reversed people would be telling OP to get out before the abusive, controlling husband ends up doing something worse than shouting at OP every day.

His wife doesn't trust him, and she starts full on rows everyday. That's abuse, particularly because OP hasn't had an affair. She wants to believe him, otherwise she would have walked by now. Time for OP to bring some leadership into this relationship and either end the discourse or end the relationship.

Colser

discus wrote: »

Put it like this, if the genders were reversed people would be telling OP to get out before the abusive, controlling husband ends up doing something worse than shouting at OP every day.

His wife doesn't trust him, and she starts full on rows everyday. That's abuse, particularly because OP hasn't had an affair. She wants to believe him, otherwise she would have walked by now. Time for OP to bring some leadership into this relationship and either end the discourse or end the relationship.

How is she abusive and controlling? Shes extremely hurt I imagine. Yes shes shouting but he was hanging out with another woman and buying her presents giving her pay rises "as friends" ,does he think his wife was going to roll over and let this slide.

arayess

Colser wrote: »

How is she abusive and controlling? Shes extremely hurt I imagine. Yes shes shouting but he was hanging out with another woman and buying her presents giving her pay rises "as friends" ,does he think his wife was going to roll over and let this slide.

the wife should be begging to apologise for believing some disgruntled employee over her own husband and the person who turned their business around , presumably making her (the wife) richer.

the wife is bang out of order, she will know herself that the employee is somebody with a grudge. The OP did nothing wrong

discus

Colser wrote: »

How is she abusive and controlling? Shes extremely hurt I imagine. Yes shes shouting but he was hanging out with another woman and buying her presents giving her pay rises "as friends" ,does he think his wife was going to roll over and let this slide.

Pay rises because she's an effective manager and is increasing stats across the board. Have none of you here ever come across this phenomenon of performance-related bonus? A few presents to keep profits increasing is good in my books. Abusive and controlling? She is starting fights with him every day. He's nearly in tears. 2 months of psychological abuse and bullying in his own home ffs

My boss gave me two months paid leave as a present for my hard work. Hope his wife never finds out.

Colser

I wouldnt advise him to tell his wife that it was a performance related bonus tbh.

discus

OP has nothing to hide. What shall he say otherwise? Concoct a lie?

Colser

So why did he hide the presents and bonus from his wife? Oh yea sure shes the jealous type.Whats the significance of the gym? Why did his wife find messages relating to the gym if they were never there together.What has that got to do with running a shop?

Carlos Orange

discus wrote: »

Put it like this, if the genders were reversed people would be telling OP to get out before the abusive, controlling husband ends up doing something worse than shouting at OP every day.

Some people would defiantly react differently if the genders were flipped but if the OP knew he was married to the jealous controlling type he should have taken more care to have everything above board and in the open instead of hiding stuff away. Much better to have a small argument earlier than a gigantic one latter.

Penny Tration

discus wrote: »

OP has nothing to hide. What shall he say otherwise? Concoct a lie?

He does though! He hid the gifts, the raises, the fact she joined his gym, all the extra time he spent with her...

And I'd imagine he's hiding the part where he said he's attracted to her!


He may not have done something wrong in your eyes, but his actions have made it look like he's done something wrong.

If it was purely business, he wouldn't have hidden it all, he could have asked his wife's opinion on getting Mary a gift, or let the wife be the one to do it.

He's said he is attracted to her. So no, his actions weren't entirely innocent, hence the hiding.


However, op, you can't let daily screaming matches happen over this. Your wife, while hurt, is completely wrong to do this daily! Whatever you have or haven't done, she has no right to scream at you every single day. That is, as has been pointed out, abusive behaviour.

If nothing has changed in two months, it's time to decide to either put it behind you both and deal with it together, or separate.
Stay away from Mary, you shouldn't be hanging about someone you're attracted to while you're married.

DukeOfTheSharp

OP, I'd hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it really does seem like your wife is obsessively jealous for no reason, so much so that I doubt she ever trusted you to begin with, and this has just 'confirmed' her delusional narrative.
Think about it like this: had your wife not been like this, would you have fallen into this 'emotional affair' at all? It seems like the root cause is her, and your reactions - while really, really stupid (I'm sorry, but come on, nothing to hide means being honest regardless, you don't need to prove yourself) - are in response to her personality. I think her screaming and shouting and acting up like she does is totally unfair, counselling isn't helping her because she doesn't want it to. I think you need to sit down and have a frank, honest discussion with her: tell her that you're done apologising, that you know you made a mistake, but that her reactions are completely overblown. Inform her that her attitude is completely unacceptable and her mistrust is totally off, but that if she keeps this up, you're done. Tell her that either the two of you work at counselling or she leaves, because at this point those are your only two options. This is a mess but she's the cause at the end of the day, I'm not defending your actions, but this is complicated and ridiculous, nobody can live like that.

strandroad

You were giving Mary personal presents (what you give a valued employee is a bonus or a raise, not birthday gifts!), you neglected other sites so that you can keep meeting her, you hid it all from your wife who also seems to be your business partner - if you think you do not have an emotional interest in Mary you are deluding yourself. Even if you did not consummate it.

Counselling is your best option so stick to it but unless you admit your emotional interest in her to yourself counselling will not work. In the course of counselling your wife needs to learn to control how she handles it but you need to recognise your fault and fix it, otherwise there's no point...

Also, rethink your business practices. Such personal interest in an employee is unprofessional at best, and if she was not willing it could land you in trouble.

meeeeh

discus wrote: »

He was rewarding a particularly effective worker. It happens in tons of employments - retail, finance, corporate commercial, military the works. It's not favouring, she is literally turning around the shop by running it effectively... thereby increasing profit. You don't keep people like that without suitable reward.
t.

If you want to give a reward you give a bonus not a birthday present. Especially when there are other employees who don't get birthday or Christmas presents. My parents ran family business and so do my partner and I so I have plenty of experience with employment issues. There are two rules you should stick to, don't employ relatives (outside immediate family) or friends and have the same rules for everyone. It saves you a lot of agro.

There are advantages of family business but major disadvantage is that personal life can heavily influenced running of the business. A solicitor friend of mine was telling me about divorce case she had. Husband and wife had such an acrimonious divorce that they both ended up going to the police reporting the other one for different tax frauds. In the end they both faced prison. It is an extreme case but it can get very messy when businesses life is intertwined with private. Of course this doesn't help OP because he already learned the hard lesson. Trust is subjective and even if the other party is told lies, there is no way how they can know what is true, if there was completely secrete although non sexual side to the relationship with employee.

OP you might also try with counselling because daily shouting matches are leading to complete break up. If it goes on for too long you might forget about original reason and still end up hating each other. Also a bit of a break for one of you away from the other one might not be bad.

Flippyfloppy

Op I certainly think your thread title is completely misleading of the situation, and representative of your own state of mind regarding this issue.
'Wife can't let go of friendship with female colleague' is completely inaccurate.

'Wife cannot comes to terms with my lies and covering up of secret gifts & liaisons with female colleague' is apt, and I think if you start understanding this as the problem, and stop minimising what happened you *might* get somewhere toward rebuilding your relationship.

ceadaoin.

OneOfThem wrote: »

Sounds like you're being too spineless tbh. Months this has been going on? Months of your wife starting a nasty row every single day? Months? Genuinely? Tell her she needs to drop it. Now. Permanently. Or it'd be best if you two part ways. Enough is enough for crying out loud. She's not a child. She shouldn't get to act like one. What other choice do you have? Let months become years? Same sh1te? Fvck that. That's no kind of life.

I'd imagine his wife his finding it hard to let it go due to the fact that the OP is minimizing the whole thing and not being completely honest with her. She knows there is more to it. He has admitted here that he was/is attracted to this woman. I doubt he has told his wife this.

His OP tried to portray it as a totally innocent friendship when it is clearly anything but. Buying personal gifts for her, spending an excessive amount of time with her to the detriment of his other shops and his marriage, joining the same gym etc. That is way overstepping the boundaries of a normal working relationship and is veering into affair territory. He has done something wrong and doesn't sound very sorry about it.

Carlos Orange

ceadaoin. wrote: »

joining the same gym etc. That is way overstepping the boundaries of a normal working relationship

Do you really think it is normal to switch gyms just because someone you work with joins the same gym?

Colser

If they were never at the gym at the same time(seemingly) why did his wife find gym related messages on his phone?

ceadaoin.

psinno wrote: »

Do you really think it is normal to switch gyms just because someone you work with joins the same gym?

Of course not, but this wasn't a normal working relationship. In this situation, combined with all the other stuff, you have to admit it looks suspicious.

The OP should have realised that this was yet another boundary being crossed and taken a step back. Instead, he allowed the situation to continue until someone else blew the whistle on them.

Neyite

OP, in your wife's eyes its an emotional affair. Often for a lot of people, physical cheating is not what causes the damage. Its finding out your spouse has feelings for another person- whether acted on, or not. Its the sustained lies and the secrets kept from them. Its the intimacy of private chats with another person. And it was with an employee, so was not only morally dubious from a marriage point of view, but also from a professional one.

One thing that I wonder is, while you were giving Mary birthday gifts (that in itself is NOT a boss-employee norm) bonuses, and treats here and there to show you appreciate her, were you equally giving your wife nice gifts or a few extra quid to spend on herself? Because if you werent, then its no wonder that she is annoyed at you - its not the gifts, its the intimacy of the gifts and what they represent.

Another thing that is coming across is your reluctance to minimise contact with Mary to professional contact only - that speaks volumes because its telling your wife loud and clear that Mary's feelings come before hers.

Say your wife has a male version of Mary in her role as a manager. You know she fancies him, showers him with gifts on his birthday, hides texts and meetings from you regarding him, then wont cut him loose to focus on repairing the hurt she caused you through her action, you'd be questioning her commitment to you too.

You got emotionally close to an employee. To the extent that you pissed off your other staff, and rocked the foundations of your marriage. Cut contact with Mary and go to counselling with your wife and see if you can save your relationship.

OhDearyMe

ceadaoin. wrote: »

I'd imagine his wife his finding it hard to let it go due to the fact that the OP is minimizing the whole thing and not being completely honest with her. She knows there is more to it. He has admitted here that he was/is attracted to this woman. I doubt he has told his wife this.

Though I do see it from the wife's POV, he didn't admit he was attracted to her.

seenitall

Post #12, first paragraph.

walter black wrote: »

if im honest with myself,there has being an emotional attraction

LegacyUser

if im honest with myself,there has being an emotional attraction

But have you been honest with your wife? You say counselling isn't working and that the fights are just continuing, daily. That's because your wife knows that there's more to this than you're admitting. So far anything she 'knows' she has had to snoop to find out. And I'd guess bit by bit she's finding out a bit more. Maybe bit by bit you're admitting to a little bit more.

I've been there, except my husband's "friendship" went a bit further. We had the daily fights, for months. Because for months I knew he was lying to me. I heard here one time, a liar will only admit to what they've been caught out on. And that's what my husband did. Bit by bit I found out more, and bit by bit he admitted more. Every time telling me " you know everything now". Only for me to find something else out a while later.

I have to agree with the poster who said it's the emotional intimacy that hurts the most. My husband kissed a colleague. A few times over a number of months. This devastated me. But the emotional relationship they had cut me to the bone. The hours they spent on the phone. The thousands (yes, thousands) of texts they sent each other. The intimate talks they had. Etc. Ok, our marriage had it's troubles. But rather than decide to work on those with me, he chose to confide in her.

That is beyond humiliating for me. I have been crushed. My life turned upside down. He, like you kept trying to minimise it. Telling me it wasn't really cheating because they didn't have sex (I still don't know whether they did or not, but it's irrelevant anyway). I told him I was hurting just as much as if he did. He doesn't understand that though. His response was actually "Maybe I should have gone out and got me hole then". Nice.

OP, please google "husband had emotional affair". And please try to get an idea of where your wife is coming from. In order to get past this she's the one that has to hard work to do. She's the one that has to go through the hurt, humiliation, betrayal. She's the one that has to "get over it" and "move on", and unfortunately it's not always that easy. And it's not fair that after doing nothing wrong, the onus is now on her to make the relationship work.

You betrayed your wife. You betrayed your marriage. The hurt she is feeling is no less than if you had a physical affair, so stop trying to minimise it. You had an inappropriate relationship with another woman. And this is a woman that you still have contact with. Whether you believe it or not, or try to put it down to her jealousy that is devastating your wife.

You need to acknowledge that. To her. To yourself. You messed up. Big time. Minimising and somehow blaming your wife for being unreasonable or overreacting is not the way forward. Trust me. It did nothing to help my marriage! You need to acknowledge her hurt. Acknowledge you have caused her hurt. And acknowledge that the hard work to rebuild your marriage is on her shoulders. Not yours. All you have to do is nothing!

I hope you can get through this. But this is something that has been building for 18 months. You're only 2 months into the recovery.

It's going to take an awful lot longer.

The only question is, are you prepared to stick it out for as long as it takes?

zeffabelli

1. Gifts, pay rises etc in conjunction with the amicable chemistry... Big mistake. Anthropological studies across the world show women DO NOT like money going to another woman even more than they hate affairs!!!!

2. A woman who respects your marriage will make good friends with your wife. Even with good make friends I had BEFORE they got married, once they did we'd I made sure to be good friends with their wives and even now most of my contact is through the wives. And that goes double for new male friends.

3. If I can't befriend their wives than back off.

You completely blurred the boundaries of course she is jealous!

Jon Stark

Neyite wrote: »

OP, in your wife's eyes its an emotional affair. Often for a lot of people, physical cheating is not what causes the damage. Its finding out your spouse has feelings for another person- whether acted on, or not. Its the sustained lies and the secrets kept from them. Its the intimacy of private chats with another person. And it was with an employee, so was not only morally dubious from a marriage point of view, but also from a professional one.

One thing that I wonder is, while you were giving Mary birthday gifts (that in itself is NOT a boss-employee norm) bonuses, and treats here and there to show you appreciate her, were you equally giving your wife nice gifts or a few extra quid to spend on herself? Because if you werent, then its no wonder that she is annoyed at you - its not the gifts, its the intimacy of the gifts and what they represent.

Another thing that is coming across is your reluctance to minimise contact with Mary to professional contact only - that speaks volumes because its telling your wife loud and clear that Mary's feelings come before hers.

Say your wife has a male version of Mary in her role as a manager. You know she fancies him, showers him with gifts on his birthday, hides texts and meetings from you regarding him, then wont cut him loose to focus on repairing the hurt she caused you through her action, you'd be questioning her commitment to you too.

You got emotionally close to an employee. To the extent that you pissed off your other staff, and rocked the foundations of your marriage. Cut contact with Mary and go to counselling with your wife and see if you can save your relationship.

He already said in his follow up post that he only goes to the shop when absolutely necessary now. Also, I don't think it was their relationship that pissed off the employee, but rather it was being called out on her work ethic by someone who isn't her boss.

OP there's not a lot I can say that would help your marriage, as it isn't a speciality of mine.

The only thing I will say is that it's perhaps time to start thinking about how you're going to protect your share of the business if your wife or you decide to call time.

LegacyUser

Just to add

...she always had a jealous streak about Mary,but i always put her at ease when she did say something,thing is i never told her about any gifts i bought her...

So your wife isn't a jealous person in general. She was just (rightly) jealous of this budding "friendship" you had. Your wife would have noticed a switch in your behaviour since Mary began working for you. You say you handed over the running of that one shop to her because she was so good. Yet you spent all the time there to the point of neglecting the other two shops. (Your words) Of course your wife noticed. And of course other employees noticed. Which adds to the humiliation for your wife.

Saying you always put her at ease, whilst lying to her about the extent of the friendship, is not putting her at ease. It's lying to her about the extent of your friendship!

I don't think you were deliberately trying to hurt your wife. I just think you were very foolish. At times over the past 12 months when your wife mentioned things she was uneasy about with your "friendship", would that not have been your cue to step back from the friendship a little? If this was a purely plutonic friendship with nothing to hide then I would say your wife was being unreasonable having a problem with it. But your friendship was more than that. Your wife (and other employees) noticed it was more than that. So you were naive in the extreme to continue it along the same path. Not to mention unprofessional.

You didn't mean to hurt your wife. But unfortunately that is the result of your actions. Not much for you to do now except weather the storm and hope you can rebuild the trust. But it won't happen in 2 months. And in future don't get so close to any employee. No matter how good they are. Christmas presents might be ok. Once they are given to all employees. Birthday presents are crossing a line. Reward good work with bonuses in pay cheques.

Another day

In my previous post I kept to what you can do to survive this mountain, not a bump, in your marriage. I kept it impartial as I was in your wife's position many years ago. In the end my exh decided to leave, and moved in with her a few months later...

If you really, genuinely want to save your marriage, may I suggest that you be 100% totally honest with your wife? Do this by putting pen to paper and put everything in it. And I mean everything. Accept responsibility, be humble and ask for forgiveness. Tell her all about your 'relationship ' with Mary. Tell her about how you feel in your marriage. What she means to you. What you want for both your futures. Tell her how sorry you are but also how the daily fights are getting you nowhere. Which is why you need to be completely honest. So there is no more for her to find out. She will have ALL the information to make a decision on whether this is forgivable or not. Be balanced in your wording, accept you were wrong, but also that you both have to work through this together for your marriage to survive.

Why write it down? Because spoken words can go unheard. Written words can be reread and absorbed. I would leave for a few days, stay with parents/family while she figures it out in her head. Arrange to meet alone a couple of days later to discuss where you are both going to go with your marriage based on all the information.

Once you have done this you will both know where you stand and can make decisions based on full disclosure. You may not like the outcome but at least you will both know where you are heading. Uncertainty at the moment is probably killing you both

Best of luck.

LegacyUser

Another day wrote: »

In my previous post I kept to what you can do to survive this mountain, not a bump, in your marriage. I kept it impartial as I was in your wife's position many years ago. In the end my exh decided to leave, and moved in with her a few months later...

If you really, genuinely want to save your marriage, may I suggest that you be 100% totally honest with your wife? Do this by putting pen to paper and put everything in it. And I mean everything. Accept responsibility, be humble and ask for forgiveness. Tell her all about your 'relationship ' with Mary. Tell her about how you feel in your marriage. What she means to you. What you want for both your futures. Tell her how sorry you are but also how the daily fights are getting you nowhere. Which is why you need to be completely honest. So there is no more for her to find out. She will have ALL the information to make a decision on whether this is forgivable or not. Be balanced in your wording, accept you were wrong, but also that you both have to work through this together for your marriage to survive.

Why write it down? Because spoken words can go unheard. Written words can be reread and absorbed. I would leave for a few days, stay with parents/family while she figures it out in her head. Arrange to meet alone a couple of days later to discuss where you are both going to go with your marriage based on all the information.

Once you have done this you will both know where you stand and can make decisions based on full disclosure. You may not like the outcome but at least you will both know where you are heading. Uncertainty at the moment is probably killing you both

Best of luck.

Op, you need to escape this abusive relationship as soon as you can. No one has the right to push you towards a nervous breakdown and your wife's reaction is bizarre for a fairly minor mistake.

Men can be and are the victims of domestic abuse. This is emotional abuse of the worst sort and you need to protect your sanity.

Get a good solicitor and get out.

Emotional abuse can be devastating, good luck.

homerjay2005

the wife seems very unreasonable here. she either trusts the OP or she doesnt and this to me means a very insecure woman who now wants to make the man suffer and grovel for the rest of his life - she will control everything and the man wont have any life in a few months time, he will have to justify everything, answer to everything, change his entire life just because a woman isnt mature enough to grow up and move on.

she either forgets it and moves on or this will only get worse - the term emotional affair was one that was invented to give woman something to feel victimised over when they have no proof or belief that an actual affair took place. if the OP gave the bonus/gifts to a male friend, would there be such support for the wife here?

i doubt it.

discus

Why write it down? Because spoken words can go unheard. Written words can be reread and absorbed. I would leave for a few days, stay with parents/family while she figures it out in her head. Arrange to meet alone a couple of days later to discuss where you are both going to go with your marriage based on all the information.

OP, you don't have to become a transient and live on a friends couch, just because your wife can't get over a working relationship you had.

I have a feeling OPs wife is projecting here.

LegacyUser

OP,

No one has the right to push you to the brink of a nervous breakdown. You are currently experiencing very serious emotional domestic abuse.

There are support services for men in your situation, you need professional support immediately.

I would also suggest legal advice as a priority.

No matter what you did (which was wrong but not unforgivable) your wife is completely out of line, no adult should resort to her behaviour.

pookie82

LegoFriends wrote: »

In order to get past this she's the one that has to hard work to do. She's the one that has to go through the hurt, humiliation, betrayal. She's the one that has to "get over it" and "move on", and unfortunately it's not always that easy. And it's not fair that after doing nothing wrong, the onus is now on her to make the relationship work.

This really hits the nail on the head for me. Why is the WIFE now the one who needs to calm down and drop it and move on? She's not the one who behaved inappropriately and this suggestion that's churned out again and again when men cheat/have emotional affairs is astounding.

"You have to decide to trust him and move on". Well maybe some day, after a lot of work and soul searching, she'll find it in her to regain the trust he has just shattered, but it'll take a bit longer than a couple of months, and if the OP is upset about this, tough. He should be working WITH her, not against her by accusing her of being jealous and overreacting. His OP reeks of the fact that he thinks she's making a mountain out of a molehill here.

OP, if the home situation is as toxic as you say, would you consider moving out for a while? Perhaps she needs space and time to really process this and decide if she can get past it. I would underline to her that moving out is not an intention to break up, just to give her some space. Also persist with counselling ... it won't work overnight but eventually it could help you to mend things.

And for the love of god, no more private texts with this Mary one. For all intents and purposes, delegate her management to someone else and cut her off. You've admitted in your second post there was an emotional attraction there - stop playing with fire and making out your wife needs to "get over it". Shocking behaviour and the kind that can only be attributed to someone who's either extremely naive or extremely self-entitled at the expense of the woman he married.

LegacyUser

God, where do I begin with this OP. I could easily be your wife, I could be reading my own husbands situation...

What shocks me most about some of the replies here is blaming the wife. She has every right to be hurt, shocked, angry etc. She is not being abusive so cut that crap right out. She's so hurt, her world has been rocked. She is trying to process everything that is happening. In a way she is grieving - she has lost trust. The most crucial and vital component of a relationship. And it can take years for that trust to be built up again.

You lied to her, you kept things from her. You cannot blame her 'jealousy' for this but your cowardice. That's what I see here. You knew she might get upset if she knew you were giving this woman preferential treatment so instead of just telling her and TRUSTING your wife, you decided to keep it from her. It was always going to come out, whether the ex employee said anything or not. Because affairs, emotional or physical, always come out.

With my own situation, my partner started acting strangely. Very so slightly but enough for me to do a bit of 'digging' and find out all sorts....

If you truly truly love your wife and see a future with her, give her time and space. Try not to react when she gets angry - while its hard its her way of trying to process things. It will get easier for her. I know, as I said, I've been there. She is completely caught up in a sh*tstorm right now of emotions. She needs support and understanding. Please give it to her. Good luck.

Sleepy

icouldbeyourwife wrote: »

She has every right to be hurt, shocked, angry etc. She is not being abusive so cut that crap right out.

Would her anger justify hitting him too then?

Starting screaming matches on a daily basis is abuse. I have to listen to the poor chap who lives next door get roared at every other day and I can guarantee he's only putting up with it because our perverted legal system would grant his abuser custody of their kids.

Stop trivialising her actions. The OP let himself get too close to an employee. He didn't so much as kiss her, nevermind conduct an on-going sexual relationship with her. Did he over-step the mark? Clearly. Is counselling a good idea? Certainly. Do his actions entitle her to treat him like a punchbag? Of course not.

OP, bring this up at your next counselling session. Perhaps you could diffuse the argument by not responding in kind? If she's screaming, keep your calm and ask if it's perhaps something you can discuss in counselling this week?

TBH, I'd set a deadline on this. Either your wife accepts what has happened, leaves it in the past and you both work on improving your marriage or you call it a day and put whatever arrangements are necessary in place with regards to the kids / the business etc.

K_P

Sleepy wrote: »

Would her anger justify hitting him too then?

Where has the OP said that his wife hits him? Of course she wouldn't be justified in hitting him but she is entirely justified in feeling hurt, confused, angry, suspicious. There is a world of difference between those two behaviours - one is the behaviour of an abuser and the other the behaviour a deeply hurt and betrayed spouse.

I agree that two months on, daily screaming matches is a bit extreme, but the OP's language here in minimising the extent of what happened is quite possibly reflected in how he speaks about it to his wife which wont' help. If the OP refers to the inappropriately close relationship with Mary as "friendship" in front of his wife then he's flat out lying to her face and she knows it. He's admitted here that he was attracted to her. If he's denying this to his wife, she's probably starting the screaming matches every day because she's anxious and on edge as she has no idea what really went on between her husband and Mary.

OP, I'd actually suggest some individual counselling for you both as it will allow you to be calmer and more reflective about what happened, your behaviours, your reactions, your relationship as a whole. With the couples counselling it's possible you may both be re-hashing the same arguments over and over again and to no avail.

I wish you the best OP, but I think the first step in this is to own up to what your relationship with Mary truly was. Or try to see it from your wife's perspective. It was clearly more than a friendship and each time you call it that, you're hurting your wife more.