Prime Time special on a United Ireland

Jawgap

For anyone who might be interested......

Godge

Oh why, did you post that up here? At least we will get to see many of the regular contributors on here in the audience. Will be looking for Tom from Waterford or Jack the successful Northern businessman or the happy looking guy involved in community activity in south Fermanagh.:D:D:D:D

Berserker

I saw an advert for this earlier. Miriam and Stephen Nolan are presenting it. Should be interesting. Waiting to see how those who are pro try to spin that it is financially viable. If Pearse 'Numbers' Doherty is there, god only knows what economic wonders we will witness.

Godge wrote: »

Oh why, did you post that up here? At least we will get to see many of the regular contributors on here in the audience.

Expected one of them to start this thread. They are probably off trying to source tickets as we speak.

Connacht15

I bet a surprising amount of Taigs up North will support The Union,!

Connacht15

Berserker wrote: »

I saw an advert for this earlier. Miriam and Stephen Nolan are presenting it. Should be interesting. Waiting to see how those who are pro try to spin that it is financially viable. If Pearse 'Numbers' Doherty is there, god only knows what economic wonders we will witness.



Expected one of them to start this thread. They are probably off trying to source tickets as we speak.

Will Miriam be transferred to The Beeb as a result?

feargale

I thought that following the GFA it was deemed acceptable to hold one view or the other.

Second Toughest in_the Freshers

...audience to reflect Irish society.

fat chance of that. it wouldn't be a thing the vast majority down here really think about.

"man in the second row, with the blue shirt, whats your opinion?" I, I don't really know... I've no opinion on it, one way or the other, to be honest Miriam...

timthumbni

Berserker wrote: »

I saw an advert for this earlier. Miriam and Stephen Nolan are presenting it. Should be interesting. Waiting to see how those who are pro try to spin that it is financially viable. If Pearse 'Numbers' Doherty is there, god only knows what economic wonders we will witness.



Expected one of them to start this thread. They are probably off trying to source tickets as we speak.

I've no idea who Miriam is but if Steakie Nolan is involved then you can be pretty sure it will be quite low brow entertainment.

Berserker

Connacht15 wrote: »

Will Miriam be transferred to The Beeb as a result?

Not sure. Checked the tv listings and it is being televised up there by the looks of things.

Connacht15

I would be surprised if a United Ireland was supported by more than 30% up there and more and more are into McIlroyism - I.E. defining themselves as 'Northern Irish'!

timthumbni

Doherty from SF does not like to break it down into the religious aspect apparently. He leaves that to Gerry Kelly.

Happyman42

timthumbni wrote: »

Doherty from SF does not like to break it down into the religious aspect apparently. He leaves that to Gerry Kelly.

He left it to the RTE/BBC and the pollsters (which is what Gerry Kelly quoted...a poll) to do it>

If I quote this survey to promote my stance am I being sectarian?

Berserker

Without even taking time to put the finances under a microscope, which will display the financial difficulties that a UI would bring for all, the majority of people are against this. I think it's time to put this old nonsense to bed. Had to laugh at the FF man claiming that they are pro UI when they were slating people who crossed the border to shop when they were in power.

Berserker

Lol, 1 of 10 people in NI would go for it, if it means more tax. Pearse is some man for talking utter nonsense. Not a number in sight from him.

Happyman42

This is nonsense, nobody is getting a chance with loudmouth in BBC studios

timthumbni

Sinn Fein have just got an awful beat down there on the united Ireland pipe dream. Probably a big mistake to put Doherty on.

The DUP will get their arse handed to them on the gay marriage issue.

JustTheOne

timthumbni wrote: »

Sinn Fein have just got an awful beat down there on the united Ireland pipe dream. Probably a big mistake to put Doherty on.

The DUP will get their arse handed to them on the gay marriage issue.

Hes finance minister for Sinn Fein and he cant even give numbers.

Happyman42

JustTheOne wrote: »

Hes finance minister for Sinn Fein and he cant even give numbers.

Nobody knows the numbers was his point.

Iwasfrozen

Happyman42 wrote: »

Nobody knows the numbers was his point.

11% Happyman 11%....

Looks like this idea is dead for the next 50 years at minimum.

Second Toughest in_the Freshers

Second Toughest in_the Freshers wrote: »

"man in the second row, with the blue shirt, whats your opinion?" I, I don't really know... I've no opinion on it, one way or the other, to be honest Miriam...

I just don't know, Miriam, never really thought about it, to be honest...

Happyman42

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

11% Happyman 11%....

I not suprised by the short time findings and I agree with Pearse on the Scottish referendum, when you get the debate happening properly those figures will change dramatically.

Actually, have you noticed something about the rest of the findings...very little difference in thinking on social issues. As I have always said on here, that is my experience, Unionism on the ground is a very pragmatic ideology. That is very heartening, the Unionist politicians are out of touch, there is no doubt about that.

As fear diminishes (and the don't give in mentality disappears) and as the British show their punitive hand (which has begun) I expect the figures to shift much more.

Iwasfrozen

Happyman42 wrote: »

I not suprised by the short time findings and I agree with Pearse on the Scottish referendum, when you get the debate happening properly those figures will change dramatically.

Actually, have you noticed something about the rest of the findings...very little difference in thinking on social issues. As I have always said on here, that is my experience, Unionism on the ground is a very pragmatic ideology. That is very heartening, the Unionist politicians are out of touch, there is no doubt about that.

As fear diminishes (and the don't give in mentality disappears) and as the British show their punitive hand (which has begun) I expect the figures to shift much more.

Why would you expect a change? Unless you can show unification won't require an increase in taxes you have no reason to expect a change.

Also given those numbers a border poll will never be called so you won't have a chance to hope for a "Scottish move".

Berserker

Happyman42 wrote: »

Nobody knows the numbers was his point.

But it's up to those who are for it to come up with those numbers. Those for it, need to sell the idea to those against it. I am no fan of SF but they were woefully under-prepared for that tonight. This is their ultimate dream, apparently. Have they given up on it behind the facade?

Btw, respect to you for coming on here to post tonight after a beating like that. The rest of the crew seem to have disappeared.

Happyman42

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Why would you expect a change? Unless you can show unification won't require an increase in taxes you have no reason to expect a change.

Also given those numbers a border poll will never be called so you won't have a chance to hope for a "Scottish move".

Because of the numbers who want a UI in their lifetime and the don't knows. You are just choosing to ignore that aspiration. To me it means, present the right vircumstances and the figures will change. Loads of potential there.
You may block the poll, but you won't block the debate and you won't block closer ties.

*Looking at the poll would you be confident that Unionist politicians are speaking for the people...they plainly aren't on those figures. A UI is a huge barrier for Unionist people but I have always believed that it will diminish, the 'don't know' figures in the Unionist side was interesting.

Dyr

I don't watch prime time because O'Callaghan is embarassing . What were these polling figures and were they adjusted for don't know's?



I would have said 70-80% in the republic in favour and 50-60% agin in norn iron, that seems to be about the norm over the years. Probably depends on the sample size and how honest RTE were feeling

The figure to watch is amount of papist bead rattlers in the north who are agin, that's what scuppers the deal. Jaysus you'd think they'd go for it just to see the fleggers attain heights of hysteria thought achievable without hallucinogens.

timthumbni

JustTheOne wrote: »

Hes finance minister for Sinn Fein and he cant even give numbers.

I really think Sinn Fein throw the United Ireland line out the odd time just to keep their grassroots supporters happy. I don't think they are really that serious.
Tonight was quite laughable actually.

SF are the ones who apparently most want a United Ireland but they don't appear to have any clue, nor even put a bit of effort into research apparently re the benefits,costs or anything else about the issue.

Maybe Pearse's fact finding Greek vacations have taken it out of him....

Iwasfrozen

Happyman42 wrote: »

Because of the numbers who want a UI in their lifetime and the don't knows. You are just choosing to ignore that aspiration. To me it means, present the right vircumstances and the figures will change. Loads of potential there.
You may block the poll, but you won't block the debate and you won't block closer ties.

*Looking at the poll would you be confident that Unionist politicians are speaking for the people...they plainly aren't on those figures. A UI is a huge barrier for Unionist people but I have always believed that it will diminish, the 'don't know' figures in the Unionist side was interesting.

You're grasping, the don't know figure made no difference to the result. There isn't a debate to be had Happy, most people are clearly happy with partition. Perhaps things will change in the future but you're looking at no border poll for "at least" 50 years.

Also note this poll was taken at a time of political strife in NI so would have hurt the pro union figures.

Iwasfrozen

Happyman42 wrote: »

Because of the numbers who want a UI in their lifetime and the don't knows. You are just choosing to ignore that aspiration. To me it means, present the right vircumstances and the figures will change. Loads of potential there.
You may block the poll, but you won't block the debate and you won't block closer ties.

*Looking at the poll would you be confident that Unionist politicians are speaking for the people...they plainly aren't on those figures. A UI is a huge barrier for Unionist people but I have always believed that it will diminish, the 'don't know' figures in the Unionist side was interesting.

You're grasping, the don't know figure made no difference to the result. There isn't a debate to be had Happy, most people are clearly happy with partition. Perhaps things will change in the future but you're looking at no border poll for "at least" 50 years.

Also note this poll was taken at a time of political strife in NI so would have hurt the pro union figures.

Happyman42

Berserker wrote: »

But it's up to those who are for it to come up with those numbers. Those for it, need to sell the idea to those against it. I am no fan of SF but they were woefully under-prepared for that tonight. This is their ultimate dream, apparently. Have they given up on it behind the facade?

Btw, respect to you for coming on here to post tonight after a beating like that. The rest of the crew seem to have disappeared.

You cannot cost a UI without the coming together of all the interests and both governments being transparent (they simply aren't)
As to being unprepared, not defending them but what chance had any speaker got there tonight...it was laughable...Nolan's shouty manner when Doherty was trying to explain his problem with the figures available was ridiculous. Rabitte resorted to soundbytes, Deenahin was somewhere else, Susan Mckay wanted to talk about women's issues and Arelene Foster wanted to have a political swipe. Ridiculous debate tbh

timthumbni

Second Toughest in_the Freshers wrote: »

I just don't know, Miriam, never really thought about it, to be honest...

That sounds bit like Pearse's reply when asked of the costs of a "United Ireland"

Happyman42

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

You're grasping, the don't know figure made no difference to the result. There isn't a debate to be had Happy, most people are clearly happy with partition. Perhaps things will change in the future but you're looking at no border poll for "at least" 50 years.

Also note this poll was taken at a time of political strife in NI so would have hurt the pro union figures.

Happy in the short term and I am on record as saying the same. So no big revelation to me.
The revelation to me is how close we are to ordinary Unionists on social issues and how far apart southerners and the politicians of the DUP are. That is a real revelation there.