Warwick student rejects consent lessons.

Whitewinged

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

By the standards of today's feminists, most of us are probably serial rapists, especially in Ireland. Ever kissed a woman in a nightclub after she'd had a couple of drinks? Sexual assault. Your girlfriend ever done you a sexual favour out of kindness even when she wasn't particularly in the mood? Sexual assault. Woman ever woken up still spooning you after falling asleep that way? Sexual assault - you can't assume that consent lasts the whole night and should have repeatedly woken her to make sure she was ok with you continuing to hold her in her sleep.

None of this is hyperbole. The brand of SJW which is pushing this kind of crap genuinely believes that consent is this fickle.

As someone posted on Boards before, can't remember who it was, "Nobody has a problem with 'no means no' or 'lack of no doesn't mean yes', it's all of these new scenarios in which 'yes still means no' that people have a problem with".

I dont know much about feminist ideas or what they preach but ive never heard of any of the "standards" that you listed above however if consent is that confusing for both sexes then would classes not be possibly beneficial for men and women to talk about and learn about together?

At first when reading the op, i thought it could be percieved as labelling men and offensive but thinking about it, and if classes are directed at both rather than taking it as a dig at men, is it not a way of educating and trying protect men and women from getting into misunderstandings or "grey areas" of consent?

Also teaching and discussing how perceptions of consent can be misread BUT aswell teaching the importance and responsibility on yourself of giving consent to someone to sleep with you and putting yourself in situations where your consent may be interpreted differently or confused. So the classes could cover both sides.

Who knows whether they would work or not but i dont think the intent is to make men seem stupid or as though they are all rapists. Does anyone know what is actually covered in the consent classes?

hatrickpatrick

Whitewinged wrote: »

I dont know much about feminist ideas or what they preach but ive never heard of any of the "standards" that you listed above however if consent is that confusing for both sexes then would classes not be possibly beneficial for men and women to talk about and learn about together?

If they don't preach that kind of crap, then yes. But given who's advocating them and who's pushing for them, I feel pretty justified in assume that they're not pushing a healthy definition of consent, but rather the extremely broad definition of rape I've outlined.

At first when reading the op, i thought it could be percieved as labelling men and offensive but thinking about it, and if classes are directed at both rather than taking it as a dig at men, is it not a way of educating and trying protect men and women from getting into misunderstandings or "grey areas" of consent?

If it's taught in a gender neutral manner and teaches that yes means yes, then sure. but I highly doubt it ticks either of these boxes.

ALiasEX

Zillah wrote: »

The vast majority of rapists are men though, in fairness; are we really going to throw a hissy fit over anti-rape campaigns being focused on men?

What makes you think the vast majority of rapists are men?

The CDC’s Rape Numbers Are Misleading - Men reported being “made to penetrate” at virtually the same rates as women reported rape

Paramite Pie

Tarzana2 wrote: »

Well, that depends on each individual case. It may well be the facts in some instances. You can't make a blanket statement like that, as every case will differ. It's not unfair or biased if it's what happened.

I'm well aware that those cases do unfortunately happen, what I meant was that peoples minds rush to the worst possible and creepiest scenario when most cases are far generally more nuanced. I'd rather you didn't nitpick slightly unclear wording (as I wan't saying that never happens) and focus on my correction of your argument that these laws are about barely conscious people women being taken advantage of.

These laws are also referring to drunk women who are seemingly alert and who may seem like they can consent but legally can't because they won't remember later. Short of doing a memory test before sex, there's not much that can be done in so many cases. He said, she said but no-one actually remembers what they said the night before.

meeeeh

Azalea wrote: »

I think the internet and social media have helped create a monster of misogyny and very hardline feminism (misandry really - suspicion of men, victimisation of women) which exacerbates all this stuff in my opinion. It's worrying I think.

"There are numerous examples in the media where the guy in question, who was later found guilty of rape by the court, appeared to genuinely believe that he was not guilty of sexual assault and that the girl had been a willing participant" - I don't know that there are numerous examples in the media?

I also don't think someone who doesn't give a sh-t about consent (rare in fairness) is going to do anything but laugh at such classes, let alone attend them. Instead I think they will be taken seriously by self-doubting young lads lacking in confidence. I also think they'd just be used by guys to meet ladies and show how sensitive they are.

I think social media definitely influenced policies. Not (only) for the reasons you outlined though. When cases like the one below happen and the idiots post their conquests on social media. That can cause a lot of damage to the schools/universities they attend, especially when it involves their star athletes. Coincidentally the bellow example possibly also shows that morons we're not exactly aware that what they were doing was rape or at least how serious it was.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steubenville_High_School_rape_case

There is an awful lot contributed to hard core feminists but frankly I would say that at least part of it is because perpetrators can't stop broadcasting themselves. They made the crimes a lot more public. Also the victims and perceived victims have very public forum to air their grievances. And I think that forced institutions to do something and organize some courses more than some extremist definitions of rape.