Car seized

Neo17

With great embarrassment I write this post. I did something stupid I am sorry for it.

Yesterday my car was seized by Garda on the roadside because it did not have a valid insurance on it.

I had to show my license, they wrote down my name and phone number. Then I walked home.
What will happen now? They said I will receive a phone call. I mean, what will they tell me then and who is going to call me?

The car is a foreign reg car. My license is Full EU. I have no prior convictions and no history with police.

Ken.

Well first off you are being charged (I think) €120 per day(or part of a day) that they store the car + a towing fee. You need to either get insurance and go collect the car ASAP or if you sign a form allowing the Gardai to crush the car you won't be charged.

Gatling

ken wrote: »

Well first off you are being charged (I think) €120 per day(or part of a day) that they store the car + a towing fee. You need to either get insurance and go collect the car ASAP or if you sign a form allowing the Gardai to crush the car you won't be charged.

Will they need to register and get a Irish plate at all ?

Berkieahern

ken wrote: »

Well first off you are being charged (I think) €120 per day(or part of a day) that they store the car + a towing fee. You need to either get insurance and go collect the car ASAP or if you sign a form allowing the Gardai to crush the car you won't be charged.

And hell get he's day in court as well!

Ken.

Gatling wrote: »

Will they need to register and get a Irish plate at all ?

I somehow missed the bit about the foreign reg. I wouldn't know as I only know someone that was stopped with an Irish reg car and what I described was the process for an Irish reg car.

January

No insurance is an automatic court date these days.

From citizens information:

Motor insurance offences: Generally punishable by a fine of up to €5,000, 5 penalty points and, at the discretion of the court, a term of imprisonment not exceeding six months. The court may decide that you be disqualified from driving instead of incurring penalty points. In that case,you will be disqualified for 2 years or more for a first offence and 4 years or more in the case of a second offence committed within 3 years of the first.

Neo17

What action should I take at this point?

slimjimmc

ken wrote: »

Well first off you are being charged (I think) €120 per day(or part of a day) that they store the car + a towing fee. You need to either get insurance and go collect the car ASAP or if you sign a form allowing the Gardai to crush the car you won't be charged.

It's not as high as that
€125 for the first day (inclusive of towing)
€35 per subsequent day / part of day storage.
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2011/si/460/made/en/print

MarkAnthony

Neo17 wrote: »

What action should I take at this point?

Call the guards and ask what you need to do next.

You may then wish to engage the services of a solicitor for court, others may advise you on whether it's needed or not.

On the whole don't worry too much. This is going to cost you financially rather than create a massive issue for you in relation to a criminal record. All in all lesson learned and just get out from under it with the minimum of cost.

slimjimmc

Neo17 wrote: »

What action should I take at this point?

Get down to the impound depot, pay the fees and get your car out of there. If you have proof of insurance you'll be allowed to drive it out, otherwise you'll need to use a trailer/truck and store it off the road or any other public place. And definitely get a solicitor because a criminal prosecution is highly likely.

Neo17

Thanks MarkAnthony.

But since there is a mandatory court appearance for this offence, there will not be much of a chance of avoiding a conviction, right?
So how am I going to avoid a criminal record then?

myshirt

First step is to get the car out as it is running up the charges. Pay the money, and get it towed to private land. Thereafter, immediately book an appointment to pay the VRT you owe, along with the penalty charges and any interest. You will need insurance in order to bring it to be inspected so you can pay the VRT, it gets inspected against your ownership documents. Provided no modifications, there is no extra VRT to pay. The requirments for VRT are that an appointment to pay it has to be made within 7 days of the car coming into the state, and you have to have it paid within 2 weeks after that.

That's what you can act on now in order to mitigate the damage.

Going forward then is your second issue. What will happen is that you will be pulled up in court. Certainly do get a solicitor. Depending on how long you had the car in the republic, and any past history, you could be facing a hefty fine, time off the road, a few years where insurance premiums will be treble what they should normally be for you, no one here can really tell you.

The most critical thing at this point is that you come up with the cash. I would very much anticipate you will find yourself in extremely deep water if you don't come up with the cash and put right what went wrong. I say that from experience.

sonny.knowles

Neo17 wrote: »

What action should I take at this point?

Stay off the roads for a start.

Neo17

@myshirt
I cannot imagine it is that easy... just getting the car out of that depot like that?
Then why did they seize it in the first place?

ardmacha

The OP may or may not have to pay VRT. He may not be resident in Ireland and if he moved to Ireland then he could bring his car, it could be a case of having allowed the insurance lapse. This issue is separate from the insurance, but is also now important to sort out. However, if the OP is considered resident in Ireland then he would require Irish rather than insurance from the original country of registration.

myshirt

Neo17 wrote: »

@myshirt
I cannot imagine it is that easy... just getting the car out of that depot like that?
Then why did they seize it in the first place?

You cannot drive an uninsured car on Irish roads. That is why they seize it. But it is your car Neo17, your property, so you are entitled to get it back.

I will search and post the website to calculate your Vehicle Registration Tax (VRT) for you. Pay it immediately. The timelines are very tight. 7 days really. How long is the car in Ireland on foreign plates?

Edit: Enter your car details here to get an estimate of the VRT due (excluding penalties) ---->>>https://www.ros.ie/evrt-enquiry/vrtenquiry.html?execution=e1s2

stefanovich

How did they know you didn't have Insurance from the country of origin?

slimjimmc

Neo17 wrote: »

@myshirt
I cannot imagine it is that easy... just getting the car out of that depot like that?
Then why did they seize it in the first place?

Well there's a little bit more to it as you may need the registration documents and photo id (and driving license and insurance if driving it) but that's basically it. They seized it as it was not allowed to be on the road so they removed it off the road.
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2011/si/460/made/en/print

myshirt

ardmacha wrote: »

The OP may or may not have to pay VRT. He may not be resident in Ireland and if he moved to Ireland then he could bring his car, it could be a case of having allowed the insurance lapse. This issue is separate from the insurance, but is also now important to sort out. However, if the OP is considered resident in Ireland then he would require Irish rather than insurance from the original country of registration.

You still have to make an appointment within 7 days. When you go you either show them a cheque at the appointment, or 2-3 lever arch folders of proof you were abroad and working for 2 years, or an exemption cert (say if disabled). You then cannot sell the car for 2 years.

myshirt

slimjimmc wrote: »

Well there's a little bit more to it as you may need the registration documents and photo id (and driving license and insurance if driving it) but that's basically it.
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2011/si/460/made/en/print

If Revenue get to it before he does, then they might not release it until he pays the VRT and up to €5k fine. That would be my worry for him. He might end up with no car, and an attachment order on his income to pay off the fines (i.e if on dole, taken directly out of his money; if working, taking directly out of his pay packet)

Neo17

Now I may sound naive, but should I not be given the option to make sure the car leaves Ireland within a certain amount of days?
Instead of importing it etc.
I think I remember this option existed, I have heard of something like this.

Berkieahern

Neo17 wrote: »

Now I may sound naive, but should I not be given the option to make sure the car leaves Ireland within a certain amount of days?
Instead of importing it etc.
I think I remember this option existed, I have heard of something like this.

They seized it because you had no insurance! Nothing to do with whether you had the VRT paid or not!

Gatling

Neo17 wrote: »

Now I may sound naive, but should I not be given the option to make sure the car leaves Ireland within a certain amount of days?
Instead of importing it etc.
I think I remember this option existed, I have heard of something like this.

How long have you been here with the car

Neo17

Berkieahern wrote: »

They seized it because you had no insurance! Nothing to do with whether you had the VRT paid or not!

I know, that's not my point.
But now, given is has been seized, can I now not choose to take the car out of the country?

Neo17

Gatling wrote: »

How long have you been here with the car

8 Months.

Losty Dublin

Neo17 wrote: »

8 Months.

Was it insured at all, either in Ireland or in another country?

myshirt

Christ. 8 months?
Lad, I can't see this going well for you at all. You'll be a while paying fines here.

In relation to taking the car out of the country, you can do this yes, there's a process, if you want people can let you know about, but financially it'll have no effect if that's what you're thinking. Zero way of manoeuvring your way out of it money wise. Seriously talking tasty money here. And a few years of treble insurance premiums for whenever you do get back driving. Ouch.

MarkAnthony

Neo17 wrote: »

Thanks MarkAnthony.

But since there is a mandatory court appearance for this offence, there will not be much of a chance of avoiding a conviction, right?
So how am I going to avoid a criminal record then?

It's a motoring offences, it's technically a criminal record but it's not declared in 90% of scenarios.

Nib

I hope they give you a massive fine and a 2 year disqualification.

It's people like you that have insurance premiums sky high.

Duke O Smiley

Neo17 wrote: »

8 Months.

If this is the case you will also be liable to pay VRT + additional 7 month late penalty on top of other ccosts to get your car back.

Upon entering the country an owner has 30 days to register his or her car here.

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/vrt/leaflets/vrt-appeals.html

It should also be noted that where Revenue are of the opinion that a vehicle has not been registered within 30 days of importation, additional VRT may be charged on late registration.

MarkAnthony

Nib wrote: »

I hope they give you a massive fine and a 2 year disqualification.

It's people like you that have insurance premiums sky high.

It really isn't. It's PI claims (spurious and otherwise). I've no sympathy for the uninsured but the current system of seizure and fines is pretty well adjusted.

Careful falling off that high horse could get you a nasty soft tissue injury! :pac:

Kristopherus

Neo17 wrote: »

8 Months.

WTF were you up to? Not registering your car within that timeframe is just criminal. You deserve to have the book thrown at you. You have been acting illegally for 8 months. I hope the car is a valuable one, because you will have to give it to Revenue to pay off the charges. No wonder we all pay increased premia to cover cheapskates like you.:mad::mad::mad:

bilbot79

Kristopherus wrote: »

WTF were you up to? Not registering your car within that timeframe is just criminal. You deserve to have the book thrown at you. You have been acting illegally for 8 months. I hope the car is a valuable one, because you will have to give it to Revenue to pay off the charges. No wonder we all pay increased premia to cover cheapskates like you.:mad::mad::mad:

You sound like lots of fun

bilbot79

Vrt is an import tariff and should be illegal under eu law

Duke O Smiley

bilbot79 wrote: »

Vrt is an import tariff and should be illegal under eu law

But it isn't now and OP is still liable to pay it

myshirt

Insurance premiums are high because of the significant amount of claims in this country, because of years of underpricing, because of quinn insurance, and because of new rules on cash reserves and capital adequacy. It's not all down to one reason.

Bit off topic anyway.

Key point for the chap here is he'll be dipping into the pocket for a significant amount of cash, or if he refuses, the state dip into his pocket for an even greater amount until he has it paid off. That's hard for a guy on the dole, or working on low pay, to have it deducted off him before he even collects his pay, and for what could be a few years until paid off. Not easy on the young man, but certainly should have had insurance and paid his VRT.

Kristopherus

bilbot79 wrote: »

You sound like lots of fun

I enjoy a bit of fun of course, but I abhor people like the OP who drives around in an uninsured vehicle for 8 months. Thats just criminal behaviour.

whomitconcerns

He didn't say it was uninsured for 8 months. Just in the country for 8 months. If the former lock him up. If latter a big fine

Fred Swanson

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myshirt

Fred Swanson wrote: »

That is something I would love to know too.

I'd say likely they were surveiling the car for a while. Extremely typical in certain parts of Donegal where there are a large portion of people needing as swift and as hard a boot in the hole that it's just unbelievable. Other than that, I'm not aware myself, does anyone know if they have cross border information readily available?

Marcusm

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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THey are entitled to ask for the reg cert and insurance proof for any foreign car - that's why I generally carry them with me when I head over to Ireladn. I wonder was he stopped at a checkpoint or identified by being seen about on a regulat basis. Simply being in the country for 8 months is not a problem provided the OP is not resident in Ireland, ie he was not here before the beginning of the 8 months and intends to leave imminently. None of this excuses the absence of insurance.

In order to recover the car, I assume that the OP would need either to bring proof of insurance to the depot or else to take it away on a trailer.

Fred Swanson

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slimjimmc

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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But surely that cert would have the name and address of the policy holder and the name(s) of any other person(s) covered so the Garda should be at least able to match that against the driver's licence details at the roadside, as well as determine the date of issue and expiry.

In any case if he's not satisfied then he can detain the car anyway and the OP wouldn't have to pay any impound fees if the policy was later verified as valid.

Of course it's quite possible the OP admitted to having none or realised it had expired.

greasepalm

dont they photocopy things and easily get that translated?

slimjimmc

greasepalm wrote: »

dont they photocopy things and easily get that translated?

Perhaps some time later back at the station but I doubt at the roadside where the car is at risk of being detained on the spot.

Nichard Dixon

Duke O Smiley wrote: »

Upon entering the country an owner has 30 days to register his or her car here.

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/vrt/leaflets/vrt-appeals.html

This is only true if the person concerned is resident in Ireland. Someone who was not resident in Ireland do not become resident in a month. If the OP moved to Ireland from somewhere else they could import their car VRT free when they decided to settle here. The 8 months is not a major problem in this respect, if the car had been used legally during that period. Most likely the OP came to Ireland with insurance which expired at some stage. If he can show that this was only a day or two, that might be put down to bureaucracy. But if it is a long period then the judge will not be impressed, to say the least and this would probably affect the importation too, as any car imported with a VRT exemption had to have been legal for 6 months before.

awec

Nichard Dixon wrote: »

This is only true if the person concerned is resident in Ireland. Someone who was not resident in Ireland do not become resident in a month. If the OP moved to Ireland from somewhere else they could import their car VRT free when they decided to settle here. The 8 months is not a major problem in this respect, if the car had been used legally during that period. Most likely the OP came to Ireland with insurance which expired at some stage. If he can show that this was only a day or two, that might be put down to bureaucracy. But if it is a long period then the judge will not be impressed, to say the least and this would probably affect the importation too, as any car imported with a VRT exemption had to have been legal for 6 months before.

You only get away without paying VRT if you can prove you owned the car for 6 months before you moved.

But no matter if you actually have to pay VRT or not you still have to present the car at the VRT centre within the allowed time frame to get your new Irish reg. You cannot drive around on foreign plates.

Irish insurance companies will generally only cover foreign plates for 30 days (and the reason for this is to insure you for driving to the VRT centre).

Nichard Dixon

awec wrote: »

But no matter if you actually have to pay VRT or not you still have to present the car at the VRT centre within the allowed time frame to get your new Irish reg. You cannot drive around on foreign plates.

Any person who is not resident can drive on foreign plates, but must have insurance etc. The question of the OPs residency is unclear. People not resident do not become so overnight.

Fred Swanson

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Nichard Dixon

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Residency is sticky. Motors is full of threads about Irish people working a mere 6 months in England trying to import a car they are not entitled to. But by the same token someone coming here doesn't become resident the day after they arrive.

Fred Swanson

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