9/11 (TV3 - September 2015)

Overheal

DamagedTrax wrote: »

And what then is the trail behind each piece? Why does it follow even the smaller pieces all the way to the ground?

Duh: contrails.

But seriously,

Even while most of the dust cloud behaves like dust, remember that larger pieces of debris will cause their own shocks and slipstreams as they travel. Like a vehicle that moves swiftly off a dirt road, the dust tails behind them for a good bit, most of it accumulated on the body, some is held in place by the vacuum behind the object/vehicle:



Mythbusters probably did this in more ways than one, but in one they tested pickup trucks with their tailgates down and up. You would assume a down gate would create better aerodynamics, but it does not, the large step between the back of the cab and the flatbed creates significant delta forces, and bernoulli's principle comes into play, air is forced to fill that space and to do so must slow down, and pockets of air near the wall of the cab get below atmospheric and/or vacuum, creating drag. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernoulli%27s_principle it turns out the tailgate up has the same effect/principle as a golfballs' dimples, it harbors a more static pocket of air but one that rolls/circulates with the flow passing over it from the top of the cab, in all practical effect acting as a very low friction surface (made of air) that the faster flow can travel across:





Now for a piece of debris instead of slowing down the object much/'affecting its fuel economy' the drag experienced at the debris tail will continue to pull the air behind it. Hence why the dust seems to travel along with it. You see a similar effect in this anime at 4:10 (I know, its a cartoon, but they're japanese and they pay attention to those kind of details)

more: http://ecomodder.com/blog/aerocaps-for-pick-up-trucks/

DamagedTrax

Overheal wrote: »

Duh: contrails.

But seriously,

Even while most of the dust cloud behaves like dust, remember that larger pieces of debris will cause their own shocks and slipstreams as they travel. Like a vehicle that moves swiftly off a dirt road, the dust tails behind them for a good bit, most of it accumulated on the body, some is held in place by the vacuum behind the object/vehicle:

i think you're completely missing my argument here.

what you're saying applies to actual 'dust' and you concentrated on that alone.

my argument above was to suggest that it isnt only dust getting thrown out of the towers & trailing the building, so explaining how dust alone behaves doesnt cut it in this case.

i came to the conclusion after seeing the many samples of dust and the fact (and it is 100% fact now) that they contain explosive residue.

my question to you is to ignore what dust does (as we know its not just dust) and please explain how a piece of free falling debris changes direction mid air (close to a 90% turn, taking perspective into account), when there is no impact to it? (see 1st 45 seconds of the video above).

it cannot happen without a propellant. i suspect that in this case, something fired late or more likely reacted late.

Overheal

Well, a propellant or external force, which could be a lot of things. But you're correct, physically speaking an external force would have to change somethings direction in general principle.

at 1:45 where am I looking exactly? I don't have audio

DamagedTrax

Overheal wrote: »

Well, a propellant or external force, which could be a lot of things. But you're correct, physically speaking an external force would have to change somethings direction in general principle.

at 1:45 where am I looking exactly? I don't have audio

Its at 45 seconds in.

A small projectile shoots clear in the top right hand corner of the falling/exploding debri cloud. As it shoots out horizontally, it suddenly (and without external impact) makes a sharp 90 degree downwards turn - leaving a kind of a number 7 shaped trial in its wake.

I'll hunt out a higher res version for you. it was presented, reviewed and accepted as evidence at the independent Toronto hearings.

Overheal

I see it. Really hard to go off of so hi res would be great if it exists. I can't even tell which way its going, it could as easily be traveling away from the camera in a parabolic arc which would do a lot to explain this travel; if it ejected more or less horizontally and met with air resistance Like this image below, except starting from a near level launch in the X direction give or take a few degrees in the positive.

DamagedTrax

Overheal wrote: »

I see it. Really hard to go off of so hi res would be great if it exists. I can't even tell which way its going, it could as easily be traveling away from the camera in a parabolic arc which would do a lot to explain this travel; if it ejected more or less horizontally and met with air resistance Like this image below, except starting from a near level launch in the X direction give or take a few degrees in the positive.

Yup, thats why i was sure to say it is dependent on perspective.

I have the toronto hearings on dvd so i'll cut the section out for you myself as i cant find hi-res online. And as it was reviewed and accepted by the hearings (and since the hearings only accepted evidence with proof of science behind it) we have to assume that all pertinent measurements were done before it was presented and that the angle shows the true flight of the object.

Overheal

came to the conclusion after seeing the many samples of dust and the fact (and it is 100% fact now) that they contain explosive residue.

For those tuning in, a link

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/thermite/explosive_residues.html

Dohnjoe

Overheal wrote: »

For those tuning in, a link

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/thermite/explosive_residues.html

Good explanation and discussion here

https://www.metabunk.org/debunked-iron-microspheres-in-9-11-wtc-dust-as-evidence-for-thermite.t2523/

Concerning the Benthem Open platform for science articles

In 2009, the Bentham Open Science journal, The Open Chemical Physics Journal, published a study contending dust from the World Trade Center attacks contained "active nanothermite".[12] Following publication, the journal's editor-in-chief Marie-Paule Pileni resigned stating, "They have printed the article without my authorization… I have written to Bentham, that I withdraw myself from all activities with them".[13]

In a review of Bentham Open for The Charleston Advisor, Jeffrey Beall noted that "in many cases, Bentham Open journals publish articles that no legitimate peer-review journal would accept, and unconventional and nonconformist ideas are being presented in some of them as legitimate science." He concluded by stating that "the site has exploited the Open Access model for its own financial motives and flooded scholarly communication with a flurry of low quality and questionable research."[14]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bentham_Science_Publishers


And from the discussion

So Davis teamed up with Kent Anderson, a member of the publishing team at The New England Journal of Medicine, to put Bentham's editorial standards to the test. The pair turned to SCIgen, a program that generates nonsensical computer science papers, and submitted the resulting paper to The Open Information Science Journal, published by Bentham.

The paper, entitled "Deconstructing Access Points" (pdf) made no sense whatsoever, as this sample reveals:

In this section, we discuss existing research into red-black trees, vacuum tubes, and courseware [10]. On a similar note, recent work by Takahashi suggests a methodology for providing robust modalities, but does not offer an implementation [9].

Acronym clue
Davis and Anderson, writing under the noms de plume David Phillips and Andrew Kent, also dropped a hefty hint of the hoax by giving their institutional affiliation as the Center for Research in Applied Phrenology, or CRAP.

Yet four months after the article was submitted, "David Phillips" received an email from Sana Mokarram, Bentham's assistant manager of publication:

This is to inform you that your submitted article has been accepted for publication after peer-reviewing process in TOISCIJ. I would be highly grateful to you if you please fill and sign the attached fee form and covering letter and send them back via email as soon as possible to avoid further delay in publication.

The publication fee was $800, to be sent to a PO Box in the United Arab Emirates. Having made his point, Davis withdrew the paper.

https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17288-crap-paper-accepted-by-journal/#.UlnoRVPhExo

DamagedTrax

iron found in the dust has never been claimed as sole evidence of thermitic reaction, despite how debunking sites like to spin it.

here's a very detailed analysis of the United States Geologic Survey on 911 dust and it gives a very different story to the AE911 reports (but still proves thermitic reaction within the dust samples).

http://www.academia.edu/8679047/9-11_An_Analysis_of_the_US_Geological_Survey_Data_-_Ground_Zero-The_Nuclear_Destruction_of_the_WTC_-_William_Tahil

Dohnjoe

DamagedTrax wrote: »

iron found in the dust has never been claimed as sole evidence of thermitic reaction, despite how debunking sites like to spin it.

here's a very detailed analysis of the United States Geologic Survey on 911 dust and it gives a very different story to the AE911 reports (but still proves thermitic reaction within the dust samples).

http://www.academia.edu/8679047/9-11_An_Analysis_of_the_US_Geological_Survey_Data_-_Ground_Zero-The_Nuclear_Destruction_of_the_WTC_-_William_Tahil

The report is fairly heavy, the conclusion is the below

This report has presented indisputable and overwhelming evidence that the Twin Towers of the World Trade Centre were destroyed by the explosion and core meltdown of at least two nuclear reactors.

He still thinks the reactors are underground

Overheal

Am I reading that the evidence about thermite residue in the dust is also coming from the same people claiming that a pair of nuclear reactors melted down and caused the WTC collapses??

DamagedTrax

Overheal wrote: »

Am I reading that the evidence about thermite residue in the dust is also coming from the same people claiming that a pair of nuclear reactors melted down and caused the WTC collapses??

nope, i was just showing that not every report on thermitic reactions is based around the evidence of iron spheres alone (and not always just thermate being used). his theory on nuclear reactions is interesting, i dont understand it at all to really have an opinion on it, other than it being interesting.

but the debunking sites like to focus the spheres a lot when all of the proponents of the AE911 theories only point to them as 1 part of the picture.

i shouldve worded it better, i was running out the door earlier.

Ctrl Alt Delete

DamagedTrax wrote: »

i came to the conclusion after seeing the many samples of dust and the fact (and it is 100% fact now) that they contain explosive residue.

I may have missed this is in news reports but have you a link that confirms it as 100% fact of it containing explosive residue???

DamagedTrax

Ctrl Alt Delete wrote: »

I may have missed this is in news reports but have you a link that confirms it as 100% fact of it containing explosive residue???

what news reports are you looking for? its not going to be shown on rte.

just google it. kevin ryan has done the experiment and shown the same explosive residue present in his findings, as in the 9/11 dust. he has a microscopic slide show which was presented at the toronto hearings (evidence only hearings). im not sure how much more proof you need to prove the presence?

but be careful with my words! i have not said that either 'how' or 'why' its there, has been proven as fact... just that it is present.

whether you consider his experiment as proof is pretty much your own choice. i believe the man as ive seen him do the experiment (its widely available to view).

Ctrl Alt Delete

DamagedTrax wrote: »

what news reports are you looking for? its not going to be shown on rte.

just google it. kevin ryan has done the experiment and shown the same explosive residue present in his findings, as in the 9/11 dust. he has a microscopic slide show which was presented at the toronto hearings (evidence only hearings). im not sure how much more proof you need to prove the presence?

but be careful with my words! i have not said that either 'how' or 'why' its there, has been proven as fact... just that it is present.

whether you consider his experiment as proof is pretty much your own choice. i believe the man as ive seen him do the experiment (its widely available to view).

So let me get this straight:

1: Guy does experiment and it's concrete proof and treated as "fact" despite the fact the test doesn't factually show anything in relation to thermite in the actual dust from the collapse. Nobody see's any potential flaws.

The only "fact" is a that Kevin done an experiment with thermite and surprise , surprise he found thermite present. I'll ask you again what can you show me that proves it as the "fact" you claimed it was.

2: On the other hand we then have the NIST video with highly detailed physics and computer modelling that shows the timeline and method of collapse and it's not fact.

Double standards much :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

So in other words a test in a lab is concrete evidence (despite nothing happening

DamagedTrax

1: Guy does experiment and it's concrete proof and treated as "fact" despite the fact the test doesn't factually show anything in relation to thermite in the actual dust from the collapse.

'the guy' (former Site Manager for Environmental Health Laboratories, a division of Underwriters Laboratories (UL), the company that originally certified the WTC steel and reported that pre 9/11 test samples showed no signs of losing any fire proofing under test oven conditions) has seperate verifiable samples of wtc dust. He compared his own findings, from his own thermitic reaction to the 9/11 dust. Both samples have been shown to contain the same evidence of thermitic reaction.

If you want proof, you can look at the independent Toronto hearings. Its all there, reviewed and in the open.

Confirmed by:

• Dr. Steven Jones (Prof Physics BYU (ret), BYU Alcuin Award and Fellowship, for excellence in teaching)
• Dr. Neils Harrit (Associate Professor (ret), Department of Chemistry, Copenhagen University)

Reviewed by:

• Ferdinando Imposinato (Hon President Supreme court of Italy, lead prosecutor in John Paul 2 assassination attempt & numerous mafia trials)
• Herbert Jenkins (Prof of emeritus McMaster University)
• David Johnson (Prof of emeritus University of Tennessee)
• Richard B Lee (Distinguished Prof emeritus University of Toronto)

here is the shortened 90 minute edit of the proceedings. The full 6 hours are available on dvd if you like that kinda thing or for the more hardcore viewer, the entire 4 days hearings are available also.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqqelDq4P48

2: On the other hand we then have the NIST video with highly detailed physics and computer modelling that shows the timeline and method of collapse and it's not fact.

The NIST data has never been peer reviewed as their building models were never made available and they still refuse to make them available.

The NIST data doesnt show the collapse, only the events leading to just after the moment of initial collapse. If their building 7 simulation had continued, it has been independently shown to fall asymmetrically and hard, to the right.

The NIST WTC7 simulations deal with 2 scenarios. There are 2 simulations that cover debris related collapse and non-debris related collapse (just in case?)

NIST has done zero examination of the WTC7 steel



So i say no, a non-reviewed, uncompleted government agency report is not fact.



As a logical and scientific person, i can only go on the data that shows evidence with proof of science that is wholly open to review. NIST does not produce this, Kevin Ryan does.

da6xsi

Anyone who doesnt believe 9/11 was set up by the american government is seriously in denial and should fear for a future where you believe mainstream media is there to report real news when in reality all news is screened and scripted before it airs. The real news is never reported on TV the internet is only source for genuine news which is said to say.

The easiest way to disprove the damage to the WTC is simply the heat at which jet fuel burns which is not enough to melt steel. Military grade termite is used to cut steel slant ways in demolition // so once the termite burns through the steel column just slides and building starts to demolish without correct support structure

Also its important to note thermite burns so hot it melts steel into liquid

There is clear evidence from 100s of pictures of the steel structure frame burned perfectly at slant // and video footage of melting steel coming out the side of the building which is only possible after high temp burning from thermite. Jet fuel is not capable of doing this. There is no way impact of a plane would have had that effect so many levels down in the building

100s of professionals from many viewpoints and different jobs all reach same conclusion that it was a planned demolition and majority of public in polls voted yes it was inside job

Mainstream media is only used to destract,disinform and keep the mass's brainwashed hence why no real issues are reported on the news and its more focused towards celebrity and non essential news.

A great example of unreported news is that obama is introducing "prolonged detention" which means after a jury finds you innocent the government can say otherwise remove your right to trial and sent you to jail indefinitely , 800 private prisons built in america for when america turns into a military state, also obamacare "mandatory federal healthcare" is rolled out soon where their talking about putting RFID chips in the hand of every american to track you for life under the pretext of healthcare.

Rte wont report any of this maybe itll be a nice story tonight about cattle or sheep or price of fags gone up anything to keep the mass's in their bubble and unaware to fundamental changes around the world wonder if many people know obama is first US president to become chairman of UN council so he know controls us armed forces and UN armed forces who have bases around the world in nearly every country and obama has already spoke about global implementation of obamacare and mandatory chips in hands of citizens.. dangerous future to be going into if your a sheep with your mind firmly closed

Overheal

A great example of unreported news is that obama is introducing "prolonged detention" which means after a jury finds you innocent the government can say otherwise remove your right to trial and sent you to jail indefinitely , 800 private prisons built in america for when america turns into a military state, also obamacare "mandatory federal healthcare" is rolled out soon where their talking about putting RFID chips in the hand of every american to track you for life under the pretext of healthcare.

That would be the USA PATRIOT act, the prison system, and the Single Payer Mandate? All of those things have been reported on extensively that includes theorization about RFID tagging, which begets all those thoughtful references to the mark of the beast, 1984, etc.

DamagedTrax

Overheal wrote: »

That would be the USA PATRIOT act, the prison system, and the Single Payer Mandate? All of those things have been reported on extensively that includes theorization about RFID tagging, which begets all those thoughtful references to the mark of the beast, 1984, etc.

i think he's talking the push for it on a global scale, being led by Obama through the UN, which is not quite as out in the open as federal policies are in the US. Being the first US president to chair the UN council probably adds fuel to the fire (if there is one).

da6xsi

Overheal wrote: »

That would be the USA PATRIOT act, the prison system, and the Single Payer Mandate? All of those things have been reported on extensively that includes theorization about RFID tagging, which begets all those thoughtful references to the mark of the beast, 1984, etc.

prolonged detention is an executive order by president i thought as patriot act was 10+ years ago after 9/11, the prisons im talkin about are fema camps completely seperate from the prison system in place atm were all the coffins and guillotines bought by the us government reported aswell which are owned by fema 30,000 guillotines and 500,000 coffins?

None of this is reported in news over here .. i think it should be news as the us is starting to replicate early nazi germany !Theres 3 survivors from germany during the war said 15 things changed when hitler came into power between policy changes and the propaganda and all 15 have been seen in the US since obama came in!

obama propaganda is everywhere seen a youtube documentary on songs in schools where kids sing obama now instead of word god in holy songs etc its all surreal and when ya watch clips or a timeline of changes you can see the resemblance and seeing as obama chairs un now and seems reluctant to step down after second term as president if he stays for a third somehow or comes up with way to stay in power its the beginning of the end of the US as we know it i think

Overheal

http://www.snopes.com/politics/conspiracy/guillotines.asp