Working in IT

dinnynora

Hey,
I am looking for a career change and want to get into working in the IT Sector. I will be commencing to study a two year Higher Certificate Computer Science course in two weeks and I want to be working and studying simultaneously.
As a complete novice of the IT world I would love any advice of the best place to start to look for work. I have done a very small amount of software testing but don't have qualifications in that just yet or much experience.
Should I go down the road of recruitment agencies or will I find it difficult getting a job with my lack of experience.
Any advise is greatly appreciated!
Thanks,

steved2010

Hi,

What area of IT interests you? and what is your background?

- Steve

dinnynora

Hi Steve,

My background is finance. I have been working in finance for about 10 years now.
Areas I would like to get into is software development or an analyst but unfortunately I have no experience in the IT sector yet.

ejabrod

There are a few things to consider here...

What age group are you in? (a lot of people will see this as irrelevant but believe me, it's not)

Due to the fact that you have no experience a lot of (bigger) companies will probably not look at you as a possible candidate.

The minimum qualifications most companies look for now is a Level 8 BSc.

Sometimes this will be overlooked if the candidate is exception in a particular area.

You should select an area in IT that appeals to you and investigate the best avenues of attaining relevant qualifications and work from there.

There are also a lot of roles in IT that most people, new to IT, aren't aware of....I'll post more when I have time

Esho

ejabrod wrote: »

There are a few things to consider here...

What age group are you in? (a lot of people will see this as irrelevant but believe me, it's not)

Could you expand on this?

Hollister11

Are you doing the higher cert course in the National College Of Ireland ?

Esho

I did a HDIP in Computing in IT Tallaght - it was 9 months and excellent. Its focus was on development, but we covered networking , databases, analysts role.

I chose it because it had an internship as the final module from the course, and all of us except maybe one or two (I think) are now working in IT.

Some of the analysts here have finance/ accounting backgrounds, which I see as a huge benefit to them.

Good luck with it!

dinnynora

Hollister11 wrote: »

Are you doing the higher cert course in the National College Of Ireland ?

Hi Hollister11, yes that is the course that I am doing

jester77

You have 10 years of finance experience, that is huge. You can definitely use that as leverage to counter balance your lack of IT knowledge. Some companies may even see that as an advantage, you have the business knowledge so they just need to get you up to par on the technical side. This could be easier for them than trying to teach someone a business domain.

Set yourself up with a github account, find some projects that interest you, play around with the code, look at their current issues, when you are comfortable with the code base and language, then submit a fix using a pull request. This will get you experience and feedback and will help with job applications later on when people can look at your github activity.

Also look into good design and clean architecture. There are plenty of books out there on design patterns, clean architecture, etc. I'd recommend Martin Fowler and Uncle Bob as good guys to follow.

ejabrod

Esho wrote: »

Could you expand on this?

Yes, actually, I can.....

If someone was born in the 70's will likely have less exposure to technology growing up, but will have developed other skills that can be utilized within IT organisations. Skills which may be lacking in those born in the mid/late 90's, who frequently have very high levels of technical competencies.

Hollister11

dinnynora wrote: »

Hi Hollister11, yes that is the course that I am doing

I just finished my first year of that.

If you have any questions, fire away.

dinnynora

Hollister11 wrote: »

I just finished my first year of that.

If you have any questions, fire away.

No way, thats really kind! Thanks so much for the offer!
How did you find it? I don't come from an IT background so am a bit nervous. Are you currently working in IT?

Hollister11

dinnynora wrote: »

No way, thats really kind! Thanks so much for the offer!
How did you find it? I don't come from an IT background so am a bit nervous. Are you currently working in IT?

I loved it, and I can't wait until I start 2nd year next week. In semester 1, you do 5 modules Intro to computing, intro to programming, html and web design, Maths for computing and PPD (which is a business and presentation module).

For the introduction to computing module, you learn the basics of the Microsoft Suite (Word, Excel, Powerpoint,Publisher) You have a two individual submissions, and some deliverables cross over with PPD. So its the one project submitted to two modules. You also have a Drgaons Den presentation at the end. They get professionals from the industry as the 'Dragons'.

Into to programming wa my favorite module. You learn the basics of java. If you go to class, and stay on top of lessons, you will be fine. Its nothing to hard.

HTML and Web Design, you learn HTML5, CSS3, and you touch on javascript and jQuery. In week 3 you are given a web site to make which is due for the week before we finish for Christmas.

Maths, is sets, Relations and Functions, Logic, Stats and Calculus. I found this a bit hard, but that's because i couldn't see what was going on, I needed glasses which i didn't realise until this summer . You have a background in Finance so that should be a big advantage.

If you want an overview on semester 2, let me know.

Berserker

ejabrod wrote: »

Yes, actually, I can.....

If someone was born in the 70's will likely have less exposure to technology growing up, but will have developed other skills that can be utilized within IT organisations. Skills which may be lacking in those born in the mid/late 90's, who frequently have very high levels of technical competencies.

Whilst you come across some people who are lacking in terms of social skills, it isn't that bad. The person born in the 70s may find it difficult to find work in the sector, as employers tend to gravitate towards younger people who are "flexible" when it comes to working hours.

Hollister11 wrote: »

Into to programming wa my favorite module. You learn the basics of java. If you go to class, and stay on top of lessons, you will be fine. Its nothing to hard.

How long does your 'Introduction to Programming' module last? I interview graduates and the amount of them who do not know what an interface or abstract class is always amazes me.

Hollister11

Berserker wrote: »

Whilst you come across some people who are lacking in terms of social skills, it isn't that bad. The person born in the 70s may find it difficult to find work in the sector, as employers tend to gravitate towards younger people who are "flexible" when it comes to working hours.



How long does your 'Introduction to Programming' module last? I interview graduates and the amount of them who do not know what an interface or abstract class is always amazes me.

All of semester 1 so 12/13 weeks. 2 hours twice a week in class, and quizzes, video lessons and assignments out of class time.

In semester 2 we have an object oriented programming module. This is another 12/13 weeks. You learn more advanced stuff, and you have to build a GUI desktop application for your project.

ejabrod

Berserker wrote: »

Whilst you come across some people who are lacking in terms of social skills, it isn't that bad.

I disagree. Trying to complete a project across 8 -10 development teams in a particular section is a total nightmare when dealing with people (usually younger) who have almost no communication skills. Those who just want to code. While this is fine in traditional waterfall, prototyping or spiral approaches but with companies that have/are transitioning to Agile and Scrum, the ability to effectively communicate is as important as the code that is written.

Berserker wrote: »

The person born in the 70s may find it difficult to find work in the sector, as employers tend to gravitate towards younger people who are "flexible" when it comes to working hours.

Again, I disagree with this statement. People from that generation don't find it difficult to find work in the IT sector, the appear to find it challenging to find work in the programming areas of IT. It's near impossible to compete with a dev with 10+ years coding experience if one has little to no experience and especially with the influx of talented (particularly Brazillian) programmers that have started to populate the IT companies here.

To the OP. I have worked with and currently have, in my line, 3 'crossovers' from the financial sector. The 3 of them have done a MSc in Applied Software Development and are doing really well in their respective roles.

Again, as I have stated before, there are many, many roles in IT that are not coding roles. So if you find it difficult to get your head around coding don't despair.

There are online resources that can help you on your way Udemy was already mentioned, The New Boston and Coursera HERE are but two more.

You could also look int Agile and Scrum methodologies as there are roles there also.

evey3624

I would love to do some IT but I do not want to complete a degree. I am interested in the analyst side and I am wondering are there shorter courses you can do that will be sufficient if paired with a business degree and a MSc?

I am not sure if I would change direction in my career but I would love to learning coding and algorithms for myself either way but I do not have enough time or money to complete a degree.

Any advice?

ejabrod

evey3624 wrote: »

I would love to do some IT but I do not want to complete a degree. I am interested in the analyst side and I am wondering are there shorter courses you can do that will be sufficient if paired with a business degree and a MSc?

I am not sure if I would change direction in my career but I would love to learning coding and algorithms for myself either way but I do not have enough time or money to complete a degree.

Any advice?

You could do a 'crossover' MSC something like THIS?

evey3624

"You could do a 'crossover' MSC something like"

Thanks but I really do not have the time to complete a Masters, I have been there and done that so I know the amount of time I need to dedicate and I cant give it right now especially on something I really do not know much about. I would like to get a taste of it first before I commit to something big like a masters

dinnynora

evey3624 wrote: »

I would love to do some IT but I do not want to complete a degree. I am interested in the analyst side and I am wondering are there shorter courses you can do

It would be great if we found some online teach yourself courses just to get a better understaning of it

ejabrod

evey3624 wrote: »

"You could do a 'crossover' MSC something like"

Thanks but I really do not have the time to complete a Masters, I have been there and done that so I know the amount of time I need to dedicate and I cant give it right now especially on something I really do not know much about. I would like to get a taste of it first before I commit to something big like a masters

Unfortunately I have no further advice for you on this then.

dinnynora

To the OP. I have worked with and currently have, in my line, 3 'crossovers' from the financial sector. The 3 of them have done a MSc in Applied Software Development and are doing really well in their respective roles.

I am starting from scratch in the IT world though. I need to obtain a degree before I could thin about the MSc in Software Development.
Hopefully people with see beyond my lack of experience and will see that I am willing and able to learn and starting this course will stand for me.

ejabrod

dinnynora wrote: »

To the OP. I have worked with and currently have, in my line, 3 'crossovers' from the financial sector. The 3 of them have done a MSc in Applied Software Development and are doing really well in their respective roles.

I am starting from scratch in the IT world though. I need to obtain a degree before I could thin about the MSc in Software Development.
Hopefully people with see beyond my lack of experience and will see that I am willing and able to learn and starting this course will stand for me.

I understand that you are starting from scratch. The point was that the 3 that have come from financial services (like you are) have done very well in their roles. None of them had experience in SD previously.

Yes, the did do thew MSc and had Level 8 degrees but all 3 felt that their background in FS helped.

As for people seeing beyond you lack of experience (from what I have experienced myself), companies will see beyond you lack of experience if you have a Degree. Depending on the companies you will be targeting. Large multinationals tend to use a Level 8 as a minimum qualification (be it right or wrong) but know there is a lead time involved with new grads. a lot of them will allow 12-18 months for a new grad to develop him/herself.

In my opinion, the Higher Certificate Computer Science will be an introduction to IT, you may need to do more than this to progress your career.

dinnynora

In my opinion, the Higher Certificate Computer Science will be an introduction to IT, you may need to do more than this to progress your career.

Many thanks for your advise & help in relation to this, it's very mucha ppreciated.

Hollister11

ejabrod wrote: »

I understand that you are starting from scratch. The point was that the 3 that have come from financial services (like you are) have done very well in their roles. None of them had experience in SD previously.

Yes, the did do thew MSc and had Level 8 degrees but all 3 felt that their background in FS helped.

As for people seeing beyond you lack of experience (from what I have experienced myself), companies will see beyond you lack of experience if you have a Degree. Depending on the companies you will be targeting. Large multinationals tend to use a Level 8 as a minimum qualification (be it right or wrong) but know there is a lead time involved with new grads. a lot of them will allow 12-18 months for a new grad to develop him/herself.

In my opinion, the Higher Certificate Computer Science will be an introduction to IT, you may need to do more than this to progress your career.

I do the higher cert course and i'm about to enter second year.

The two years of the higher cert, are identical to the Bsc in Computing.
Upon completion of the highe cert, you progress into year 3 of Bsc in computing, BSC in Business Information Systems, or BA in Technology Management. (Subject to places).

In year 3, you have a normal semester, during semester 1, and work experience during semester 2.

In year 4, you pick an area to specialise in.

ejabrod

Hollister11 wrote: »

I do the higher cert course and i'm about to enter second year.

The two years of the higher cert, are identical to the Bsc in Computing.
Upon completion of the highe cert, you progress into year 3 of Bsc in computing, BSC in Business Information Systems, or BA in Technology Management. (Subject to places).

In year 3, you have a normal semester, during semester 1, and work experience during semester 2.

In year 4, you pick an area to specialise in.

I have done a 2 year Higher Cert in Commercial Computing, a Level 7 in Computing for Informatics, a Level 8 in Computing and a Masters in Software. Have many years experience in "IT" and from my experience, college introduces the student to the concepts etc but in no way prepares a student for actually working in the industry.

The main point I was making was that the OP would have to progress to yr3/yr4 in order have a realistic chance of securing a role. A 2 year higher cert will not be enough.

We have had 2 'co-op students' on placement with one of our teams for the last 6 months and have performed beyond expectation for the RA that they were placed in.

Personally I believe that all colleges should be forced to make work placement a mandatory part of any 3+ year course.

dinnynora

ejabrod wrote: »

Personally I believe that all colleges should be forced to make work placement a mandatory part of any 3+ year course.

While I do agree with you in relation to this sometimes a work placement is not practical for some individuals, especially a placement without pay.

Thank you for your advise. I do intend to progress to year 3 and 4 to obtain a Level 8 qualification. I just hope to be in a position where I can study and work in the same sector as I think it will be more beneficial. Hopefully once I commence studying this can be achieved.

ejabrod

dinnynora wrote: »

While I do agree with you in relation to this sometimes a work placement is not practical for some individuals, especially a placement without pay.

Thank you for your advise. I do intend to progress to year 3 and 4 to obtain a Level 8 qualification. I just hope to be in a position where I can study and work in the same sector as I think it will be more beneficial. Hopefully once I commence studying this can be achieved.

Yes, I agree a placement without pay is not suitable for some. TBH, I genuinely thought all placements were paid or subsidised in some way.

When you get the L8 you will increase your opportunities and when you do get into a company, a lot (of the bigger companies) will subsidize ongoing study (such as a P/T MSc).

amen

ejabrod wrote: »

Yes, actually, I can.....

If someone was born in the 70's will likely have less exposure to technology growing up, but will have developed other skills that can be utilized within IT organisations.

mods, sorry for dragging this off topic, but I don't even know where to start with the above statement. If you said the above statement replacing born in the 70s with females there would be uproar. There should be an uproar about your born in the 70s statement.

You do realise that computers have been around for the last 80 odd years?
That those who grew up in the 70s are now only in their early forties and mid 30s?
That they often learnt to program before the internet and from reading a manual inside out.

That they helped build the internet infrastructure, created new programming languages, often have an in depth knowledge of several programming languages, understand infrastructure issues.

Have seen most problems/issues before.

younger people who are "flexible" when it comes to working hours

working long hours does not mean you are doing more work.

Hollister11

ejabrod wrote: »

I have done a 2 year Higher Cert in Commercial Computing, a Level 7 in Computing for Informatics, a Level 8 in Computing and a Masters in Software. Have many years experience in "IT" and from my experience, college introduces the student to the concepts etc but in no way prepares a student for actually working in the industry.

The main point I was making was that the OP would have to progress to yr3/yr4 in order have a realistic chance of securing a role. A 2 year higher cert will not be enough.

We have had 2 'co-op students' on placement with one of our teams for the last 6 months and have performed beyond expectation for the RA that they were placed in.

Personally I believe that all colleges should be forced to make work placement a mandatory part of any 3+ year course.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I agree with you 100%, that a two year cert is not enough for a career in IT. I'm using this to progress to a degree, then hopefully a masters in Software Development.

ejabrod

amen wrote: »

mods, sorry for dragging this off topic, but I don't even know where to start with the above statement. If you said the above statement replacing born in the 70s with females there would be uproar. There should be an uproar about your born in the 70s statement.

You do realise that computers have been around for the last 80 odd years?
That those who grew up in the 70s are now only in their early forties and mid 30s?
That they often learnt to program before the internet and from reading a manual inside out.

That they helped build the internet infrastructure, created new programming languages, often have an in depth knowledge of several programming languages, understand infrastructure issues.

Have seen most problems/issues before.

working long hours does not mean you are doing more work.

Firstly, you are attempting to create something out of nothing in the highlighted section. I didn't say females and why should there be uproar about the statement I made? Because you say so?

I was born in the mid 70's, in Ireland and had a commodore 64. Learned to program in BASIC. the school I went to didn't even have computers.

The majority of those who went to school in Ireland in the 80's-early 90's had very little exposure to programming (which was my original point that you chose to take exception to)

So who exactly are 'they'? "helped build the internet infrastructure, created new programming languages, often have an in depth knowledge of several programming languages, understand infrastructure issues."

amen wrote: »

working long hours does not mean you are doing more work.

Berserker never said anything about working longer hours. He said "flexible" - FL-EX-IB-LE

You clearly like to raise where there are none

amen wrote: »

You do realise that computers have been around for the last 80 odd years?
That those who grew up in the 70s are now only in their early forties and mid 30s?
That they often learnt to program before the internet and from reading a manual inside out.

Really? They have been around for 80 years? That's amazing! Thanks for enlightening me. So when was the interned invented? (no Googling now, you hear?)

Why bother replying to a thread that you are not adding in a positive way to?













Suppose you just need to have an opinion