New car problems

JJJJNR

long life $ervicing = new turbo$$$

R.O.R

JJJJNR wrote: »

long life $ervicing = new turbo$$$

We haven't replaced a single turbo from memory.

9935452

R.O.R wrote: »

My personal car is an N47 engine 520d, which is extending it's own service intervals past 30,000km, then I'm going further than that due to one thing or another. 208,000km on it now and pulls like a train. Expect servicing, tyres and bulbs there has been no other work done in the 120,000km I've put on.

good luck with the car if you are doing that . I wouldnt do it myself. it does nothing for the resale value of that car eithre. If i was buying a 520 with extended service intervals i would walk away, especially when they are known for timing chain problems

R.O.R wrote: »

That's just poor design. Opel have the same issues expect they have an oil quality warning. That means we generally end up doing an oil change on those before the 30k service interval.

We're running Mazda's on 15k intervals (rather than the 20k Mazda say) to try and stop problems arising, but it doesn't seem to be making a blind bit of difference.

Is that not exactly what im saying. By your argument there should be no problem running the full service interval and you are cutting them short .
The reason for cutting it short here is you are lubricating your engine with diesel.
would it not be the same well educated engineers that design these engines badly that set the service intervals

R.O.R wrote: »

If it's that cheap and you have time to do it yourself then you may as well, but I still reckon you are wasting money.

A gallon of long fuchs long life low sulphur oil costs just under 30 euros .
20 minutes and the oil and filter are changed.
There is a saying that oil and grease are the cheapest parts you will buy.

milhous

Look what I started..oops. On the oil issue they said the long life oil is good for 30k km again and that's what my next oil change is programmed at.
I still don't see how this is, because it doesn't last for 30k km, It's empty within 15k km.
Will book in every 15k km going forward.

On another note, needed a software update for the infotainment system, got that and car was given back to me yesterday (6 days later). at least they didn't charge for the courtesy car.

166man

Sitec wrote: »

Would it not effect the marketing and accounting department more if the car was constantly breaking down?

30k intervals on long life oil is perfectly safe, we used to run Iveco trucks on 100,000 km intervals and there was never any trouble.

bucketybuck wrote: »

Your logic is completely faulty. Do you really think the accountants want people servicing their cars at longer intervals?

The aftersales market is huge and every manufacturer has vested interest in it, it's a godsend to the manufacturer that there is an accepted wisdom that people should be changing their oil more frequently. Shorter intervals mean more money for dealers and best of all they don't need to sell that fact, people want to believe it already.

The manufacturer will not claim a longer service interval lightly, not only because of revenue but also because they will want that vehicle serviced and checked when it is still in the warranty period to prevent any major issues from developing. (better to catch things early if they have to pay for them). But the fact is that the oils can easily run for far far longer than is commonly accepted and the designers of the vehicles know this.

You guys are talking about changing oils every 10 or 15k, actually the oils in our range are designed to run for over 80000km depending on usage, and they are not some super oil but a common 10/30 and 5/30. Believe, there is a lot more room for error in those oil change intervals than you might think.

swarlb wrote: »

If I was running the 'accounting or marketing' dept, I'd insist on oil changes every 1000km or 5 days, whichever came first, using the most expensive oil available, and only from the main dealership (any other outlet voids the warranty) Same with any other service items....
Any 'service engineers' disagreeing with this would be sacked forthwith........

As above, I mentioned it with regards to total cost ownership from a fleet point of view. A car doing 150k km over three years needs 5 services @ 30k km. it needs 10 services @ 15k km. That saving multiplied by x amount of cars sold to a fleet amount up to quite a substantial saving, as SC mentioned.

bucketybuck wrote: »

I'm not getting into a pissing match between you and your dealer, I just find it noteworthy that as you berate the dealer for not changing the oil as standard, you also don't check your own fluid levels on a regular basis.

Dealers always used to carry out a service on used cars, but then drivers always used to do regular checks before driving. The world has changed on both sides it would appear.

Me, I check my oil and water, but I'm old school to be honest.

Are you also old school in how you keep having sly nasty digs at posters in this thread? If I bought a new car I'd expect it to need nothing more than servicing and tyres etc. if my mum was elderly I'd not expect her to have to check them.

Maybe if you drive a sh1t car you have to check it weekly though.

johnny osbourne

milhous wrote: »

Look what I started..oops. On the oil issue they said the long life oil is good for 30k km again and that's what my next oil change is programmed at.
I still don't see how this is, because it doesn't last for 30k km, It's empty within 15k km.
Will book in every 15k km going forward.

On another note, needed a software update for the infotainment system, got that and car was given back to me yesterday (6 days later). at least they didn't charge for the courtesy car.

the last "good" car made by vw was the vento (petrol)

*Kol*

166man wrote: »

If I bought a new car I'd expect it to need nothing more than servicing and tyres etc. if my mum was elderly I'd not expect her to have to check them.

+1 on that. The first time I looked under the bonnet of my car was when the washer fluid ran out!

R.O.R

milhous wrote: »

Look what I started..oops. On the oil issue they said the long life oil is good for 30k km again and that's what my next oil change is programmed at.
I still don't see how this is, because it doesn't last for 30k km, It's empty within 15k km.
Will book in every 15k km going forward.

On another note, needed a software update for the infotainment system, got that and car was given back to me yesterday (6 days later). at least they didn't charge for the courtesy car.

The oil in a VW Diesel is good for 30,000km. It's few and far between these days that they need a top up before getting to 30,000km. I'd be concerned about that.

When you had to top it up, did you use VW Spec oil? If it's not the right stuff, it will burn through it in no time.

bucketybuck

166man wrote: »

If I bought a new car I'd expect it to need nothing more than servicing and tyres etc. if my mum was elderly I'd not expect her to have to check them.

Its a very naive attitude though. Brand new toasters can develop faults, brand new tools made from solid metal can break, so its silly to think that a piece of equipment with miles of wiring and thousands of moving parts is guaranteed to run perfectly for years. This type of attitude here:

*Kol* wrote: »

+1 on that. The first time I looked under the bonnet of my car was when the washer fluid ran out!

is the reason slight oil leaks turn into engine failures, because of people today taking pride in their ignorance. Its a complicated piece of equipment that costs tens of thousands of euro and needs constant maintenance, I would suggest people should consider their expectations and perhaps think about looking after the damn thing.

Toyotafanboi

Not really though. When i pay €14k for something, I want it to work, correctly, for a reasonable timeframe.

If I buy a toaster or a microwave and it breaks, or doesn't perform to a level I am happy with, the shop will replace it or refund me, pretty much no quibble in most places.

But if I buy a new car, that has destroyed itself by means of the manufacturers specified maintenance plan, it's somehow my own fault?

bucketybuck

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

But if I buy a new car, that has destroyed itself by means of the manufacturers specified maintenance plan, it's somehow my own fault?

At risk of getting into another pissing match, if your engine is burning oil or losing oil, you are indeed contributing to the issue by never checking your oil level. Stop placing all the blame on the manufacturer when you yourself didn't carry out the driver daily checks as noted in the driver handbook.

If there is an issue there, you cannot drive a car for thousands of kilometres with that issue occurring and not take some culpability. If the toaster was smoking every time you used it you wouldn't keep using it until it exploded in flame and then bring it back blaming the manufacturer.

That car didn't need to be destroyed. If you had been checking oil and coolant level regularly, something all drivers should be doing, then you could have noted that oil consumption was high and the issue could have been addressed long before any car was destroyed.

Should the dealer have serviced that car at sale? Maybe, I know I would have, but that has little to do with manufacturers service specifications. The oil in those cars can indeed run to 30000kms easily, but that doesn't at all mean that the bonnet doesn't need to be opened for 30000kms. If drivers would educate themselves to do some simple checks they could save themselves a lot of money in the long run.

Toyotafanboi

It's very reasonable to expect a new car to burn less than a liter of oil per thousand miles. I can-not accept responsibilty for anything like what you are saying as checking the oil more often than once every thousand miles is definitely OCD or anxiety related unless you are suspicious of a fault, which we weren't in a virtually new car.

The reason it is burning that much i'd wager is because the engine was gone way beyond what it was capable of doing with 2.6 liters of oil but the retailer played along with the cost saving myth of long life servicing and us, the end consumer are taking the financial hit for it.

We specifically asked at the time of buying, the car has 16k on it, it will be serviced? And he said yes it's fully serviced. Which is a lie, what he meant to say was, it's not due a service, which is entirely different, and what he neglected to say was that they didn't even check the levels before it was sold. So it was't what he said, but the the lies that were told through omission.

I would be particularly curious to know BB, would you, as a consumer accept this. As you say."personal redponsibility", money is hard enough earned to just lie down and accept this behaviour so it would be wrong to just lie down and accept it. This is the very reason why the vast majority of people fear bringing their car to a garage here in Ireland. One slip of terminology and we were completely fleeced.

Toyotafanboi

Perhaps other manufacturers have invested more research into their long life servicing intervals and the vehicles requirements. I'm not coming out and saying I think it doesn't work as a concept, just that our own particular experience of it has been negative.

bucketybuck

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

I would be particularly curious to know BB, would you, as a consumer accept this. As you say."personal redponsibility", money is hard enough earned to just lie down and accept this behaviour so it would be wrong to just lie down and accept it. This is the very reason why the vast majority of people fear bringing their car to a garage here in Ireland. One slip of terminology and we were completely fleeced.

Would I accept it? Which part?

If you specifically agreed a service as part of the deal at sale then no, I would not be happy that it wasn't done and I would be using my contacts to raise considerable hell.

But I would still consider the mechanical fault and the loss of oil to be a separate issue to the service. The lack of service pre-sale is certainly a factor in how the car reached the point of running without oil, but it didn't cause the fault and it doesn't mean I wouldn't check my own oil regularly. The dealers poor standards contributed, but that wasn't the only factor.

bucketybuck

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

Perhaps other manufacturers have invested more research into their long life servicing intervals and the vehicles requirements. I'm not coming out and saying I think it doesn't work as a concept, just that our own particular experience of it has been negative.

There is definitely a change in the concept of servicing. As a rough example, in the truck industry oil change intervals can range from 30000kms to 100000kms depending on usage. The oils are absolutely fine to run to those limits.

But the changing of oils is now disassociated from vehicle inspections. A truck will get an oil change when needed, but will get a safety inspection every 6 or 12 weeks, and its DOE test annually. The SI will pick up on all the issues that needed to be picked up, suspension faults, brake faults, oil leaks, levels, lights etc, but the oils and filters are left alone until they are needed.

It could easily be the same with cars. Change the oils at the recommended intervals, but give the thing a once over a lot more frequently than that.

*Kol*

bucketybuck wrote: »

Its a very naive attitude though. Brand new toasters can develop faults, brand new tools made from solid metal can break, so its silly to think that a piece of equipment with miles of wiring and thousands of moving parts is guaranteed to run perfectly for years. This type of attitude here:



is the reason slight oil leaks turn into engine failures, because of people today taking pride in their ignorance. Its a complicated piece of equipment that costs tens of thousands of euro and needs constant maintenance, I would suggest people should consider their expectations and perhaps think about looking after the damn thing.

I have to disagree with you there. I fully expect for a new vehicle not to require constant maintenance. That is my expectation. Even if I did look under the bonnet there is nothing to see. There isn't even a dipstick. With respect my car is as well looked after as anybody else's and is not suffering from neglect in any way.

milhous

R.O.R wrote: »

The oil in a VW Diesel is good for 30,000km. It's few and far between these days that they need a top up before getting to 30,000km. I'd be concerned about that.

When you had to top it up, did you use VW Spec oil? If it's not the right stuff, it will burn through it in no time.

Yeah I used the recommended oil, the first warning light came on around 15k km. It's under warranty for three years, I was planning on paying the lump sum at the end (I'm on a pcp deal) and keeping it but I reckon I'll pay the lump sum at the end and look to trade it in against something else.

mech123

jimgoose wrote: »

A litre in less than 10,000 miles is by no means excessive. I keep hearing these fancy-dan in-car entertainment systems are too bloody clever by half for their own good these days as well. And the key, well - shít happens I suppose. I'd give them a chance, at least they didn't see you immobile.

no good car should burn any oil.

milhous wrote: »

Hi,

I bought a new car in march and it has given me a few niggly problems. keys not working, infortainment system crashing and I also put two litres of oil in it since I got it, I've put up 30k km tbf.

I left it in for a service last Thursday and still haven't gotten it back, they said they are trying to re-code the keys but are awaiting instructions from VW (who they have not heard anything back from since last Friday) in Germany. Because they wiped the keys I cannot take the car back at all.

Is it just a waiting game for me that I should go along with? They gave me a petrol trendline golf for my troubles as they said they don't keep any bigger/higher spec courtesy cars.

Thanks for any help.

what model car is this ? 30k km is way over the service mileage. all cars are different but i would imagine most cars that travelled 30k km should have been serviced twice.

mech123

should have nearly be due a second service would be a better way to put it. altough it seems some cars can do lots of miles before a service but that cant be good for it.