IFA Protest Dublin 31st Aug 2015

frazzledhome

Got a call to attend Farm Income Protest in Dublin tomorrow.

Is this a real issue?

Is it just a day out for top brass to be seen as active?

What exactly do they expect to achieve?

Are you going?

I won't be attending as I think it's a complete waste of my time. Absolutely nothing will be achieved in my opinion

farawaygrass

frazzledhome wrote: »

Got a call to attend Farm Income Protest in Dublin tomorrow.

Is this a real issue?

Is it just a day out for top brass to be seen as active?

What exactly do they expect to achieve?

Are you going?

I won't be attending as I think it's a complete waste of my time. Absolutely nothing will be achieved in my opinion

I think I agree with you. Also, these seem to protest too much, and it's losing effect. I didn't see them being so worked up when beef and sheep prices hit the floor previously

Dawggone

frazzledhome wrote: »

Got a call to attend Farm Income Protest in Dublin tomorrow.

Is this a real issue?

Is it just a day out for top brass to be seen as active?

What exactly do they expect to achieve?

Are you going?

I won't be attending as I think it's a complete waste of my time. Absolutely nothing will be achieved in my opinion

Be in Paris on the third sept and there should be fireworks!

frazzledhome

Dawggone wrote: »

Be in Paris on the third sept and there should be fireworks!

Now that would be worth going to see. Will they wreck the place? Do they have committeemen full time on protest tactics. That said it's a fine line between protesting and thuggery/vandalism. Not judging but observing from afar

Dawggone

frazzledhome wrote: »

Now that would be worth going to see. Will they wreck the place? Do they have committeemen full time on protest tactics. That said it's a fine line between protesting and thuggery/vandalism. Not judging but observing from afar

I can't condone the tactics used.
I'm at a showjumping thingy and was talking to a cop for a while to pass the time, and he was saying to me that farmers are highly respected for being honest, hardworking and big tax payers.
There was a poll done by one of the national papers recently and 86% of the people supported the farmers actions. I find that amazing.
The unions are terribly well organised. Protests (riots!) are really well run, but what surprised me the most is the way they can organise the mainstream and social media.

mahoney_j

frazzledhome wrote: »

Got a call to attend Farm Income Protest in Dublin tomorrow.

Is this a real issue?

Is it just a day out for top brass to be seen as active?

What exactly do they expect to achieve?

Are you going?

I won't be attending as I think it's a complete waste of my time. Absolutely nothing will be achieved in my opinion

Real issue .milk prices are low yes so tend to agree but think there bugging it up into something else and making it look like there doing something

Day out for top brass to be seen and heard def yes

What they'll achieve ?????hard to see anything been achieved

Am I going ,not a hope same reasons as yourself

Biggest issue worldwide is supply a lot stronger than demand .its been corrected monthly slowly but surely and we need to leave this happen as the quicker a floor is achieved the quicker price and demand will recover .i also think intervention price should be left unchanged .we wanted quotas gone and are now fully exposed to world markets and majority of us expect volatility up and down .its up to us to position ourselves to ride the storms

blue5000

Not a member anymore and I've already got 2 phonecalls about it, said no, told them they did nothing about beef prices in spring last year. Too little too late in Oct. Told the first lad they should change their name to Irish Dairy Farmer's Association. Beef levies are cancelled as well. Fcuk em, if enough grassroots ppl cancelled their membership the lads at the trough might sit up and listen.

rangler1

mahoney_j wrote: »

Real issue .milk prices are low yes so tend to agree but think there bugging it up into something else and making it look like there doing something

Day out for top brass to be seen and heard def yes

What they'll achieve ?????hard to see anything been achieved

Am I going ,not a hope same reasons as yourself

Biggest issue worldwide is supply a lot stronger than demand .its been corrected monthly slowly but surely and we need to leave this happen as the quicker a floor is achieved the quicker price and demand will recover .i also think intervention price should be left unchanged .we wanted quotas gone and are now fully exposed to world markets and majority of us expect volatility up and down .its up to us to position ourselves to ride the storms

Suppose it's because Hogan is reconsidering the intervention price, but like some here I'd be disgusted if it was raised. The agriculture budget is not going to be changed and it'd be stupid to spend it encouraging over production and storing the excess produce from it.
On saying that I'll probably be in Dublin tomorrow

whelan2

blue5000 wrote: »

Not a member anymore and I've already got 2 phonecalls about it, said no, told them they did nothing about beef prices in spring last year. Too little too late in Oct. Told the first lad they should change their name to Irish Dairy Farmer's Association. Beef levies are cancelled as well. Fcuk em, if enough grassroots ppl cancelled their membership the lads at the trough might sit up and listen.

not being smart here but at the protests at the beef factories last year it was mainly dairy farmers there, did beef farmers not want to be there ??????????? Anyways we wont be going tomorrow

mahoney_j

rangler1 wrote: »

Suppose it's because Hogan is reconsidering the intervention price, but like some here I'd be disgusted if it was raised. The agriculture budget is not going to be changed and it'd be stupid to spend it encouraging over production and storing the excess produce from it.
On saying that I'll probably be in Dublin tomorrow

Why if u disagree with it ,personally want no association with it

rangler1

blue5000 wrote: »

Not a member anymore and I've already got 2 phonecalls about it, said no, told them they did nothing about beef prices in spring last year. Too little too late in Oct. Told the first lad they should change their name to Irish Dairy Farmer's Association. Beef levies are cancelled as well. Fcuk em, if enough grassroots ppl cancelled their membership the lads at the trough might sit up and listen.

What could they do about beef prices, haven't seen one viable suggestion here yet, if you think a protest is helping dairy farmers there was a dozen beef protests last year.....fair's fair.
If you have the solution to controlling the market price of our produce it'd probably work on milk price too
I also notice that dairy farmers aren't pushing IFA to blockade the processors in a glut situation either, at least they have something between their ears

mahoney_j

rangler1 wrote: »

What could they do about beef prices, haven't seen one viable suggestion here yet, if you think a protest is helping dairy farmers there was half a dozen beef protests last year.....fair's fair.
If you have the solution to controlling the market price of our produce it'd probably work on milk price too
I also notice that dairy farmers aren't pushing IFA to blockade the processors in a glut situation either, at least they have something between their ears

The problem with beef is the factories and them controlling the markets etc by having their own feedlots etc .ifa protests were too late they should of happened spring 14 not autumn 14 .ifa need to totally disassociate themselves from them .they can't whilst taking Subs from finished cattle .run with the foxes hunt with the hounds comes to mind .....I've removed ifa subs from snytime I take an animal to factory ditto my milk cheque

rangler1

mahoney_j wrote: »

The problem with beef is the factories and them controlling the markets etc by having their own feedlots etc .ifa protests were too late they should of happened spring 14 not autumn 14 .ifa need to totally disassociate themselves from them .they can't whilst taking Subs from finished cattle .run with the foxes hunt with the hounds comes to mind .....I've removed ifa subs from snytime I take an animal to factory ditto my milk cheque

I think that one has been done to death, it's just a poor excuse not to pay it,

mahoney_j

rangler1 wrote: »

I think that one has been done to death, it's just a poor excuse not to pay it,

Not wanting to derail this thread but why pay a sub to an organisation who haven't fully got ur back .where have the last couple of presidents ended up after there ifa stints ....

rangler1

whelan2 wrote: »

not being smart here but at the protests at the beef factories last year it was mainly dairy farmers there, did beef farmers not want to be there ??????????? Anyways we wont be going tomorrow

A lot of those that wanted to block the factories hadn't cattle to sell and I think the dairy farmers knew they might be needing some support this year...how right they were

blue5000

whelan2 wrote: »

not being smart here but at the protests at the beef factories last year it was mainly dairy farmers there, did beef farmers not want to be there ??????????? Anyways we wont be going tomorrow

Not being smart either, but I was at a local factory and I did notice that too, even though I wasn't a member at the time. I reckon a lot of beef farmers have already left I(D)FA, you know why? Simply wasn't enough money in our bank accounts when the membership direct debit came due.

rangler1 wrote: »

What could they do about beef prices, haven't seen one viable suggestion here yet, if you think a protest is helping dairy farmers there was a dozen beef protests last year.....fair's fair.
If you have the solution to controlling the market price of our produce it'd probably work on milk price too
I also notice that dairy farmers aren't pushing IFA to blockade the processors in a glut situation either, at least they have something between their ears

We'll always be price takers, we produce a fresh product, when there's a glut the price goes down, when it's scarce the price hopefully goes up.

Throw in a bit of political interference, weather, currency exchange rates, a few middle men and one or two buyers with too much monopoly into a market and you have a crisis every few months/years depending on the product.

What did dairy farmers think was going to happen when quotas were abolished and production increased 10-20%? I know they are not fools, there is no point in blockading dairies when they have created the problem themselves.

Look at all the past presidents who went on to, or attempted to go on to have careers in mainstream politics after using farmers as stepping stones.

kowtow

It's an irregular verb. One of the many charms of the English language.

"I protest, you demonstrate, he vandalises."

mahoney_j

rangler1 wrote: »

A lot of those that wanted to block the factories hadn't cattle to sell and I think the dairy farmers knew they might be needing some support this year...how right they were

Pile of bs

rangler1

blue5000 wrote: »

Not being smart either, but I was at a local factory and I did notice that too, even though I wasn't a member at the time. I reckon a lot of beef farmers have already left I(D)FA, you know why? Simply wasn't enough money in our bank accounts when the membership direct debit came due.



We'll always be price takers, we produce a fresh product, when there's a glut the price goes down, when it's scarce the price hopefully goes up.

Throw in a bit of political interference, weather, currency exchange rates, a few middle men and one or two buyers with too much monopoly into a market and you have a crisis every few months/years depending on the product.

What did dairy farmers think was going to happen when quotas were abolished and production increased 10-20%? I know they are not fools, there is no point in blockading dairies when they have created the problem themselves.

Look at all the past presidents who went on to, or attempted to go on to have careers in mainstream politics after using farmers as stepping stones.

We're basically saying the same thing, there was nothing could be done last year, was just a perfect storm if you like.
Plenty of critics on here and if they have a fail safe solutions to controlling market forces, now's the time to pull it out...that's all I'm saying

rangler1

mahoney_j wrote: »

Pile of bs

Poor answer
Plenty of beef farmers told me they didn't want to be seen at the gates and when I asked dairy farmers why they were there that's the reply I got

Miname

mahoney_j wrote: »

Pile of bs

Most beef men are now part time. Getting days off to head for dublin can be torture. It's nothing to do with the foresight of needing support this year. Your trying to pull a guilt trip on lads who are purely disallusioned with the way agri has gone.

mahoney_j

rangler1 wrote: »

A lot of those that wanted to block the factories hadn't cattle to sell and I think the dairy farmers knew they might be needing some support this year...how right they were

Pile of bs

rangler1

mahoney_j wrote: »

Pile of bs

Very stimulating discussion....again

Willfarman

ANgry farmers. Boiling point. Crisis crisis. Usual scutter. It does no good. The IFA have no form of pr stradegy.

frazzledhome

rangler1 wrote: »

A lot of those that wanted to block the factories hadn't cattle to sell and I think the dairy farmers knew they might be needing some support this year...how right they were

Hold up your horses a minute. I attended the beef protests in solidarity with my neighbours not because I want a favour returned. I've much more respect for myself and others to think that way.

On withdrawing subs, I've no intention of doing so as I feel the organisation despite all its failings needs our support.

Blue referred to it being the Dairy farmers organisation. The only interest in dairy is in the dairy bull calf

mahoney_j

frazzledhome wrote: »

Hold up your horses a minute. I attended the beef protests in solidarity with my neighbours not because I want a favour returned. I've much more respect for myself and others to think that way.

On withdrawing subs, I've no intention of doing so as I feel the organisation despite all its failings needs our support.

Blue referred to it being the Dairy farmers organisation. The only interest in dairy is in the dairy bull calf

But why support ann organisation with a load of so called failings ???suppirt at local level here for ifa is at an all time low you only have to look at branch agms ,handful of older generation farmers or ifa diehards at them more for social aspect than anything I'm 36 and youngest person at our meetings by a long way

poor farmer

blue5000 wrote: »

Not being smart either, but I was at a local factory and I did notice that too, even though I wasn't a member at the time. I reckon a lot of beef farmers have already left I(D)FA, you know why? Simply wasn't enough money in our bank accounts when the membership direct debit came due.



We'll always be price takers, we produce a fresh product, when there's a glut the price goes down, when it's scarce the price hopefully goes up.

Throw in a bit of political interference, weather, currency exchange rates, a few middle men and one or two buyers with too much monopoly into a market and you have a crisis every few months/years depending on the product.

What did dairy farmers think was going to happen when quotas were abolished and production increased 10-20%? I know they are not fools, there is no point in blockading dairies when they have created the problem themselves.

Look at all the past presidents who went on to, or attempted to go on to have careers in mainstream politics after using farmers as stepping stones.

The abolishion of quota has very little to do with the current drop in milk price.
The president of the Ifa is a tough job, why wouldn't anyone want to go on to something else.

frazzledhome

mahoney_j wrote: »

But why support ann organisation with a load of so called failings ???suppirt at local level here for ifa is at an all time low you only have to look at branch agms ,handful of older generation farmers or ifa diehards at them more for social aspect than anything I'm 36 and youngest person at our meetings by a long way

That's exactly why it needs support. It has its failings but is far from a failed organisation. It has a huge legacy of good work done in the past and I know of many cases where they've been of huge assistance to the farming and rural communities.

I'm not prepared to get involved at this stage but will continue to support. I do not like being used as a reason to protest. There is no appetite for this demo among dairy farmers.

We wanted an end to quota and got it but cannot go running to Mammy at the first hurdle despite the fact that quota removal only coincided with this price slump rather than caused it.

Any suggestions that quota removal caused it is demonstrating a complete lack of knowledge of the facts

rangler1

mahoney_j wrote: »

But why support ann organisation with a load of so called failings ???suppirt at local level here for ifa is at an all time low you only have to look at branch agms ,handful of older generation farmers or ifa diehards at them more for social aspect than anything I'm 36 and youngest person at our meetings by a long way

Standard of representation is set by the members, if they can't be bothered it'll be reflected in the organisation.
On your age comment I pulled back at 55 but took a position three years ago because no one else wanted it, mainly out of loyalty, was happy enough to get away this year when some one else wanted to do it, but it'll probably befor the social aspect I'll go tomorrow, why not,
I thought that when all the graduates that are farming at the moment became our representatives, representation might step up a notch!!!!!!
Politically at least, farmers need representation

orm0nd

frazzledhome wrote: »

That's exactly why it needs support. It has its failings but is far from a failed organisation. It has a huge legacy of good work done in the past and I know of many cases where they've been of huge assistance to the farming and rural communities.

I'm not prepared to get involved at this stage but will continue to support. I do not like being used as a reason to protest. There is no appetite for this demo among dairy farmers.

We wanted an end to quota and got it but cannot go running to Mammy at the first hurdle despite the fact that quota removal only coincided with this price slump rather than caused it.

Any suggestions that quota removal caused it is demonstrating a complete lack of knowledge of the facts

agree, But I think we would see price recovery faster with quota in place & perhaps a higher bottom line as well

anyhow , back on topic

not going to morrow & any body I spoke in the local branch likewise

rangler1

poor farmer wrote: »

The abolishion of quota has very little to do with the current drop in milk price.
The president of the Ifa is a tough job, why wouldn't anyone want to go on to something else.

Takes huge drive and work to be president and then the experience that comes with it it'd be a awful waste to go back to th'ould farm

frazzledhome

rangler1 wrote: »

Takes huge drive and work to be president and then the experience that comes with it it'd be a awful waste to go back to th'ould farm

Agree, serious commitment and political ability required to become president. In the other hand the caliber has fallen IMO.

The 2 immediate past presidents failed to make any contribution since they left office.

I know we're way off topic but there needs to be a way found to encourage younger guys to get involved post Macra.

Something that always got to me was the "we tried that before and it didn't work" attitude. I've seen young energetic guys sidelined as they posed too much of a threat to the guy who's waited his turn.

Btw, that's not purely the preserve of the IFA but present in all political structures

kowtow

poor farmer wrote:

The president of the Ifa is a tough job

Don't know about tough but he certainly manages to make it look difficult.

frazzledhome

kowtow wrote: »

Don't know about tough but he certainly manages to make it look difficult.

LOL

mf240

They have a protest every year.

What are protesting about now. To much rain!!!!

rangler1

mf240 wrote: »

They have a protest every year.

What are protesting about now. To much rain!!!!

No, worse...... th'ould 5 and 7 series beemers are two year old now and dairy farmers don't have the funds to trade'm in.:eek:

kowtow

mf240 wrote: »

They have a protest every year.

What are protesting about now. To much rain!!!!

That, and the price of orphan's tears is getting fierce high.

We'll have to find something else to cool the milk.

frazzledhome

rangler1 wrote: »

No, worse...... th'ould 5 and 7 series beemers are two year old now and dairy farmers don't have the funds to trade'm in.:eek:

Lol

mf240

rangler1 wrote: »

No, worse...... th'ould 5 and 7 series beemers are two year old now and dairy farmers don't have the funds to trade'm in.:eek:

Are things that bad!!!.

orm0nd

frazzledhome wrote: »

Agree, serious commitment and political ability required to become president. In the other hand the caliber has fallen IMO.

The 2 immediate past presidents failed to make any contribution since they left office.

one of them failed utterly to make any contribution while in office

Hugh 2

frazzledhome wrote: »

Got a call to attend Farm Income Protest in Dublin tomorrow.


Are you going?

All farms round here seem to be one man opperatiins
Would be hard to find anyone here with enough free time to partake in this demonstration
I would find it hard to have cows milked by then let allone catch the 8,30 buss

Mad4simmental

IFA nowadays are a joke. Let's go to dub and take a few pics. They have no affect whatsoever. The sooner the better everyone drops all subs from factory and marts to them.

Even Rangler dosnt know what side of the fence to sit on.

Hugh 2

frazzledhome wrote: »

Got a call to attend Farm Income Protest in Dublin tomorrow.


Are you going?

All farms round here seem to one man opperatiins
Would be hard to find anyone here with enough free time to partake in this demonstration
I would find it hard to have cows milked by then let allone catch the 8,30 buss

rangler1

Mad4simmental wrote: »

IFA nowadays are a joke. Let's go to dub and take a few pics. They have no affect whatsoever. The sooner the better everyone drops all subs from factory and marts to them.

Even Rangler dosnt know what side of the fence to sit on.

No interest to rangler whether farming fails or thrives at this stage, glad to be so near finished with it

frazzledhome

Mad4simmental wrote: »

IFA nowadays are a joke. Let's go to dub and take a few pics. They have no affect whatsoever. The sooner the better everyone drops all subs from factory and marts to them.

Even Rangler dosnt know what side of the fence to sit on.

Do you see a role for a farmers representative organisationn?

Willfarman

We need representation. It just that the ifa are poor communicators with the public. Joe soap cares little about the angry farmers at boiling point over the annual crisis.

I've never seen a farmer actually boil!

rangler1

frazzledhome wrote: »

Do you see a role for a farmers representative organisationn?

I think if the government isn't lobbied continuously, they just won't bother about us, there is huge demand on funding, if farmers don't look for it, some one else will. concessions like tax free lease, cgt exemptions to farmers, 90% allowances on land acquisition could go overnight, like the roll over relief on CGT did,
I don't really believe that agriculture is driving the irish economy, despite the bumph that IFA put out.
Farmers are losing voting power big time, so it isn't that important for rural TDS to have the farmer vote, So that card isn't going to work either.
The EU has to be marked full time as well, I think the way IFA blocked flat rate SFP (for the time being anyway) is a prime example of influencing other farm organisations across eu to support them and get it our way.
Some might call it kicking the can down the road, but a lot might happen before 2019.
As I say politically we need something, I thought by now we'd see the benefit of the grads that are gone into farming in our representation, expenses cheque isn't attractive enough for them obviously

rangler1

Willfarman wrote: »

We need representation. It just that the ifa are poor communicators with the public. Joe soap cares little about the angry farmers at boiling point over the annual crisis.

I've never seen a farmer actually boil!

Farmers being ''punch drunk'' would be a better term,

Brown Podzol

rangler1 wrote: »

I don't really believe that agriculture is driving the irish economy, despite the bumph that IFA put out.

I agree with you but making a significant contribution. For every job in PRODUCTION and PROCESSING in dairying there are three more created in the wider economy in America, would not be as high here where more inputs are imported but using the same criteria would certainly be more than two.

Mad4simmental

frazzledhome wrote: »

Do you see a role for a farmers representative organisationn?

I'd like to see the subs payed from factory's and marts to an independent observer over factory grads and weights representing the farmers.

F.D

I am a member but Not going to the protest today i am at work
Do not know what the protest is for, Suckler / Beef / Tillage incomes not going to rise because we are on the world market and the price we are getting is dictated by the factorys, merchants and world prices
as for Dairy farmers, welcome to every other sectors problems, intervention should not be allowed in my opinion or you will have quotas back in no time when the milk lakes get bigger (nothing against dairy farmers i would love to be one)

Farmers are there own worst enemy, Dairy farmers getting bigger, More milk to find a market for
Drystock farmers are paying way over the odds for cattle,(good news for the man selling) but bad news when the exporters are been out bidded and we end up with a flood of beef and rubbish price next year
Maybe the IFA should be saying Less is more and keep more profit in your pocket rather than giving the coop's merchants all our hard earned cash