Teenager charged with manslaughter for encouraging friend to commit suicide.

J. Marston

Bizarre and sad story from America...

A teenager in the United States is facing manslaughter charges for allegedly encouraging an 18-year-old friend by text message to take his own life.

Michelle Carter, now 18, has been charged with involuntary manslaughter in relation to the death of Conrad Roy in Massachusetts last year, reports by US-based media outlets say.

Carter, who was 17 at the time, was alleged to have encouraged Roy to take his own life by sending him a series of text messages including some that implied he would be happier once dead.

Roy was later found dead in a vehicle in a parking lot in Fairhaven on July 13, 2014.

Carter met Roy in 2012 and formed an online relationship via the internet and mobile phone communication.

An indictment issued by a Bristol County Grand Jury alleges that between July 6 and July 12, Carter assisted Roy to take his own life via dozens of messages.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/71455010/teen-girls-texts-blamed-for-friends-suicide

Her lawyer is arguing that she was brainwashed by him but when you read the series of texts between the two, it's clear to see she wasn't. The guy obviously had some doubts about going ahead with it but she kept pushing and pushing him to do it.

CARTER: You can't think about it. You just have to do it. You said you were gonna do it. Like I don't get why you aren't.

ROY: I don't get it either. I don't know.

CARTER: So I guess you aren't gonna do it then. All that for nothing. I'm just confused. Like you were so ready and determined.

ROY: I am gonna eventually. I really don't know what I'm waiting for but I have everything lined up.

CARTER: No, you're not, Conrad. Last night was it. You kept pushing it off and you say you'll do it, but you never do. It's always gonna be that way if you don't take action. You're just making it harder on yourself by pushing it off. You just have to do it. Do you want to do it now?

ROY: Is it too late? I don't know. It's already light outside. I'm gonna go back too sleep. Love you. I'll text you tomorrow.

CARTER: No. It's probably the best time now because everyone is sleeping. Just go somewhere in your truck and no one is really out there right now because it's an awkward time. If you don't do it now you're never gonna do it, and you can say you'll do it tomorrow, but you probably won't. Tonight? Love you.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/71455010/teen-girls-texts-blamed-for-friends-suicide

And that's just the first few texts from dozens.

Why did she do it though? Many seem to think it was for attention but that is one seriously dark, twisted way to get attention. Anyway, she's looking at a possible 20 years in jail now.

Generic Dreadhead

What a sick and twisted b!tch

the_monkey

What a sick little sociopathic c'nt.

Hope they throw the book at her.

Timberrrrrrrr

Awaits the usual bleeding hearts to come in and tell us that she was just a messed up teenager and should get counseling not prison blah blah blah.....

Stheno

Seriously disturbed person pushing someone like that

Menas

With friends like these who need enemies?

CARTER: So I guess you aren't gonna do it then. All that for nothing. I'm just confused. Like you were so ready and determined.

greenfrogs

I couldn't read all of that article. He was her boyfriend though, not friend. They were saying I love you to each other. What a disturbing girl. Why didn't she encourage him to seek help. What she did was sick and twisted. The poor guy.

KKkitty

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Awaits the usual bleeding hearts to come in and tell us that she was just a messed up teenager and should get counseling not prison blah blah blah.....

Counseling with a shovel to the face maybe.

2smiggy

greenfrogs wrote: »

I couldn't read all of that article. He was her boyfriend though, not friend.

online relationship ? sounds very odd. obviously he was not 100% , and with that sort of encouragement she gave, she may as well have setup the hose from the exhaust for him (or what ever way he died)

knird evol

she was just a messed up teenager and should get counseling not prison

When the Sun Hits

I remember the days when you had to actually kill someone to be charged with manslaughter.

Ridiculous sentence.

Generic Dreadhead

When the Sun Hits wrote: »

I remember the days when you had to actually kill someone to be charged with manslaughter.

Ridiculous sentence.

This is a dumb post.

When the Sun Hits

Cormac... wrote: »

This is a dumb post.

Great contribution. :rolleyes:

If it's so dumb then explain why. Anyone can say "dumb post" to something people disagree with and get a load of thanks for it. Doesn't exactly contribute much though, does it?

knird evol

When the Sun Hits wrote: »

Great contribution. :rolleyes:

If it's so dumb then explain why. Anyone can say "dumb post" to something people disagree with and get a load of thanks for it. Doesn't exactly contribute much though, does it?

From a purely legal point of view she doesn't have to physically kill him. If her actions are deemed reckless as to whether they would result in him staying alive or dying she could be guilty of manslaughter. Reckless is gauged on what the reasonable man would consider a risk leading to a certain outcome.

MilesMorales1

Thats so sad, poor bloke.

cassid

MilesMorales1 wrote: »

Thats so sad, poor bloke.

totally agree, this poor guy only 17 , in need ,reaches out to someone (Which so many people don't ) and unfortunately it was to this woman and she ensured he stayed focus and killed himself:mad: If only he found someone who could support and help him through his pain, its incredibly sad and as a mum of boys , your heart goes out to his family.

suicide_circus

That's messed up, I'd say herself and graham dwyer would get on well

Summer wind

This is like a really extreme case of bullying. This has really shocked me. That poor boy being so influenced that he went ahead and actually killed himself. If she did that to my son I'd be waiting for her when her jail time was done. She's evil.

One eyed Jack

Summer wind wrote: »

This is like a really extreme case of bullying. This has really shocked me. That poor boy being so influenced that he went ahead and actually killed himself. If she did that to my son I'd be waiting for her when her jail time was done. She's evil.

I genuinely don't think it was bullying tbh. Upon reading the opening post, I thought it was simply a case of two perfectly abnormal teenagers, but upon reading the article and the transcripts of their communications, I think what's basically happened here was a "Romeo and Juliet" scenario, with them both professing their love for each other and all the rest of it. We're lacking context here, but to say she was "brainwashed" by the guy into encouraging him to take his own life?

I know it happens, and I can see how it's possible here, but I don't think that argument in her defence is likely to get her off the hook for this one.

The_Valeyard

That could possibly be the most twisted and creepiest conversations I've read in recent times.

That poor guy just needed the right help to get him through his depression. such a shame. She knew exactly what she was doing.

Medusa22

When I read the excerpt that the OP posted, I thought that she was clearly goading him into it, and then when I read the full article, at first I thought that possibly he had asked her to make sure that he didn't ''back out'' or change his mind because he was so miserable. Perhaps he asked her to ensure that he had the determination to go through with it, but after reading the rest of the transcript it seems to me that she was constantly pushing him, and reassuring him when he expressed uncertainty (because of his family and at other times). We don't have have the whole story here, because this is just an excerpt of their conversations and so we are missing context but still I find the whole situation very odd. If it was a case that they were in love with each other and he wanted to die, then why would she be encouraging him, unless she was going to kill herself too? Why continuously remind someone that they want to and should kill themselves? (even if he was miserable, and no doubt he was suffering terribly, you don't encourage someone you love to kill themselves because they are unhappy) I fail to see how he brainwashed her but I don't have the full picture either.

Kaiser Sosay

Creepy fúcked up stuff.

Cuban Pete

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Awaits the usual bleeding hearts to come in and tell us that she was just a messed up teenager and should get counseling not prison blah blah blah.....

Well the main thing is that you found a way to use this tragedy to make a cheap point.

Cold War Kid

Cuban Pete wrote: »

Well the main thing is that you found a way to use this tragedy to make a cheap point.

Yeah I don't know if the "usual suspects" they're referring to exist tbh. Now some may suggest she might be mentally unstable, but so? She might be - she very well could be (seems like it - who in their right mind would do what she did?) Merely suggesting that, doesn't make her any less to blame or any less deserving of consequences.

When the Sun Hits

I had thought perhaps they had some sort of suicide pact, but we really are lacking information and context. I am by no means a bleeding heart liberal, but I wouldn't necessarily be calling her an evil bitch without knowing the whole story.

One eyed Jack

Cold War Kid wrote: »

Yeah I don't know if the "usual suspects" they're referring to exist tbh. Now some may suggest she might be mentally unstable, but so? She might be - she very well could be (seems like it). Merely suggesting that, doesn't make her any less to blame or any less deserving of consequences.

That's the thing though - the consequences seem to be on the upper end of the scale for what she could have been charged with. It's like the prosecutor went all-in so to speak, and must be pretty sure they'll get a conviction too, especially when the best her defence seems to have been able to come up with is that she was "brainwashed" by this guy. It's impossible to know what that even means without more context to understand if either, or both of them actually had any mental health or psychological issues.

That article is terribly written, and terribly sourced. I wouldn't immediately be calling for her to be incarcerated for 20 years based upon what I'm seeing written in that article. The prosecution have set themselves a high bar to have her found guilty, but they must have something other than what's been released to the media.

Summer wind

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I genuinely don't think it was bullying tbh. Upon reading the opening post, I thought it was simply a case of two perfectly abnormal teenagers, but upon reading the article and the transcripts of their communications, I think what's basically happened here was a "Romeo and Juliet" scenario, with them both professing their love for each other and all the rest of it. We're lacking context here, but to say she was "brainwashed" by the guy into encouraging him to take his own life?

I know it happens, and I can see how it's possible here, but I don't think that argument in her defence is likely to get her off the hook for this one.

I think when you read the texts between them you can see how unsure and hesitant to kill himself the boy was. I can't understand how they can say he brainwashed her I mean have they actually read what she texted him? What ever you call it bullying, cajoling, pushing, asking, begging, pleading she was a huge massive influence on this boys decision. She should pay for that.

seamus

I thought initially that manslaughter sounded crazy. But she's actually being charged with assisting suicide, which falls under the blanket heading of involuntary manslaughter in the US.

Here in Ireland this would be a specific charge of assisting a suicide.

Seems like a fair call given that she encouraged his actions. She's not responsible for his death, but she didn't help. I wonder if she was a bit sick of him, but rather than break up with him and be labelled a bitch when he commits suicide, she reckoned she could speed things along a bit; she wouldn't have to break up with him and she'd get months playing the "grieving widow".

One eyed Jack

Summer wind wrote: »

I think when you read the texts between them you can see how unsure and hesitant to kill himself the boy was. I can't understand how they can say he brainwashed her I mean have they actually read what she texted him? What ever you call it bullying, cajoling, pushing, asking, begging, pleading she was a huge massive influence on this boys decision. She should pay for that.

I'm sure though that you know too how easily communications can be misinterpreted when read out of context, and even more so if a person is unfamiliar with the people involved. I'm not willing to accept that either of them (the guy or the girl), were fully aware of the possible consequences of what they found themselves swept up in.

I've seen enough crap written in suicide ideation forums and on social media to understand how it may well be possible for a person to manipulate someone else into thinking they are actually helping someone in encouraging them to take their own life, and the messages in the article could be interpreted a number of different ways that may not immediately be so obvious.

enfant terrible

seamus wrote: »

Seems like a fair call given that she encouraged his actions. She's not responsible for his death, but she didn't help. I wonder if she was a bit sick of him, but rather than break up with him and be labelled a bitch when he commits suicide, she reckoned she could speed things along a bit; she wouldn't have to break up with him and she'd get months playing the "grieving widow".

Yes seemed she enjoyed the attention afterwards

http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/michelle-carter-claims-she-was-brainwashed-into-helping-conrad-roy-in-his-plans-to-commit-suicide/story-fnixwvgh-1227500030945

Paramite Pie

There are entire websites devoted to encouraging suicide... makes you wonder how many are driven to do something they wouldn't have otherwise...

..and a lot more guilty people out there.

seamus

enfant terrible wrote: »

Yes seemed she enjoyed the attention afterwards

http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/michelle-carter-claims-she-was-brainwashed-into-helping-conrad-roy-in-his-plans-to-commit-suicide/story-fnixwvgh-1227500030945

Stone cold bitch. I reckon I have her card properly marked there so. Probably rationalised it to herself by saying he'd be dead soon either way.

Can't imagine how his parents feel. They probably grieved with her, treated her as a daughter in law. Then they have to find out that not only did she fail to help him, she basically handed him the figurative rope.

I wonder how they discovered it. Maybe his parents found the texts on his phone or something.

Stheno

enfant terrible wrote: »

Yes seemed she enjoyed the attention afterwards

http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/michelle-carter-claims-she-was-brainwashed-into-helping-conrad-roy-in-his-plans-to-commit-suicide/story-fnixwvgh-1227500030945

That is just beyond the realms of normality

Chain Smoker

seamus wrote: »

I thought initially that manslaughter sounded crazy. But she's actually being charged with assisting suicide, which falls under the blanket heading of involuntary manslaughter in the US.

Here in Ireland this would be a specific charge of assisting a suicide.

Seems like a fair call given that she encouraged his actions. She's not responsible for his death, but she didn't help. I wonder if she was a bit sick of him, but rather than break up with him and be labelled a bitch when he commits suicide, she reckoned she could speed things along a bit; she wouldn't have to break up with him and she'd get months playing the "grieving widow".

Was gonna post exactly that. Could also be a bit of a narcissistic streak deluding herself into thinking how great and selfless she was to be willing to let him go, the type who will happily alter reality entirely so that they come out on the righteous side.

She's a total headcase whatever way you look at it.

catsbanter

I'd stone cold stunner that bitch

retro:electro

That transcript is so sad. I make no apologies for calling her a cold stone hearted fcuked up bitch.

tosspot

enfant terrible wrote: »

Yes seemed she enjoyed the attention afterwards



This was one of the first things I thought after reading the op. A tragedy like this attracts huge social media attention to those nearest and dearest, and from looking at that article it does seem she used the tragic event to try to increase her social media profile.
A crazy indication of how many of the youth today value their relationship with social media more than real life relationships today.

Summer wind

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I'm sure though that you know too how easily communications can be misinterpreted when read out of context, and even more so if a person is unfamiliar with the people involved. I'm not willing to accept that either of them (the guy or the girl), were fully aware of the possible consequences of what they found themselves swept up in.

I've seen enough crap written in suicide ideation forums and on social media to understand how it may well be possible for a person to manipulate someone else into thinking they are actually helping someone in encouraging them to take their own life, and the messages in the article could be interpreted a number of different ways that may not immediately be so obvious.

This girl repeatedly and relentlessly told this boy to kill himself. Told him he should die. That makes her an evil bully in my world.

TomBtheGoat

One can only hope that such a sick bitch will face her own karma someday.

Paramite Pie

When the Sun Hits wrote: »

I had thought perhaps they had some sort of suicide pact, but we really are lacking information and context. I am by no means a bleeding heart liberal, but I wouldn't necessarily be calling her an evil bitch without knowing the whole story.

Her tweets after the suicide indicate an attention seeking sociopath.

"I will never understand why this had to happen"

She often tweeted about suicide prevention with the #WeCanEndSuicide.

The link was posted earlier in the thread. Either she regretted her part or more than likely reveled in playing the mourning victim.

Samaris

I'm usually pretty inclined to assume people are basically decent, media inclination to weave a story aside, but the texts and then the stuff online are just disturbing and quite thoroughly give me the creeps about this girl.

Actually, when typing that, I was reminded of a rather odd condition called Munchausen's-by-Proxy. Its a thoroughly bizarre narcissistic condition where someone causes injury to someone else to ...well, live vicariously from the sympathy generated. Most of the cases I've read about tend to be women with a child victim. Not suggesting it IS that, mind, just made me think of it.

Still a pretty evil act, an impulse is one thing, but she made the choice to encourage that poor kid to suicide and then dived into the social media to suck up attention around it, whatever her reasons.

seamus

Samaris wrote: »

Actually, when typing that, I was reminded of a rather odd condition called Munchausen's-by-Proxy. Its a thoroughly bizarre narcissistic condition where someone causes injury to someone else to ...well, live vicariously from the sympathy generated. Most of the cases I've read about tend to be women with a child victim. Not suggesting it IS that, mind, just made me think of it.

Munchausen's and -by-Proxy are pretty strictly defined by the fact that the sufferer is specifically looking for attention from medical personnel or otherwise attention based on medical problems.

You're right in that this appears very similar, they're probably both subtypes of a family of mental illnesses.

Samaris

seamus wrote: »

Munchausen's and -by-Proxy are pretty strictly defined by the fact that the sufferer is specifically looking for attention from medical personnel or otherwise attention based on medical problems.

You're right in that this appears very similar, they're probably both subtypes of a family of mental illnesses.

Ah, that was it. I should have looked that up again before talking about it, but you're right. I'd lump the whole thing under "extreme narcissism" myself, but I'm no medical wotsit.

Melisandre121

I haven't seen this story posted on here?

A girl pressured her boyfriend into committing suicide, she is being tried for manslaughter but her defence feel she is protected by free speech.

What a disgusting excuse for a human being.


http://deadstate.org/here-are-the-disturbing-texts-from-michelle-carter-pressuring-her-boyfriend-to-commit-suicide/

osarusan

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057483587

Horrible story.

KERSPLAT!

Christ that's a shocking read. She should have been there to help him or get him help, not to do this. Poor lad.

That_Guy

Just read a couple of her texts to him. What an absolutely cruel and evil bitch.

KERSPLAT!

Threads merged.

wakka12

She did it because she's a ****ing dangerous psychopath . If she were a man she'd probably become the next serial killer , the only reason she wont is because she's a teenager girl who couldn't overpower many people.

Sir Gallagher

Is it surprising really? Shocking to read and very disturbing, but all you have to do is take a look at facebook on any given day to see certain people trying to garner sympathy by proxy from other people's death or ilness. Obviously this girl is at the extreme end of it, the queen coffin chaser what a cnut.

K4t

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Awaits the usual bleeding hearts to come in and tell us that she was just a messed up teenager and should get counseling not prison blah blah blah.....

Strange post. She most likely is messed up and probably should get counselling from seeing the texts she sent to the guy, but please enlighten me to as why she should serve prison time, and why anyone who might not share your judgement is automatically a bleeding heart? The guy committed suicide, the clue is in the name - the act or an instance of taking one's own life voluntarily and intentionally. She didn't kill him and any evidence to suggest she is the reason for him killing him is and always will be pure speculation.