Change in buildings regulations

caitb1

Did anyone hear that there is a relaxation coming in the building regulations and wat they are.heard its ment to come into effect on 1st September but havnt heard what changes have bn made. For one time private house builders.does anyone know

sydthebeat

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057470187

Strolling Bones

no nead to waist mony on archteks enny moor

DOCARCH

Strolling Bones wrote: »

no nead to waist mony on archteks enny moor

arch techs...or...architects...or...both?

Strolling Bones

all dem fellas are a big munny rakit

caitb1

We have r planning got but havnt started building yet. Does it mean we can go direct labour r does a contractor still have to sign off

DOCARCH

caitb1 wrote: »

We have r planning got but havnt started building yet. Does it mean we can go direct labour r does a contractor still have to sign off

Apparently you will still have to appoint/assign a building contractor, and the building contractor (signatory) has to be the principal/director of a building company.

No exact details as yet, so don't take that as gospel, but, that's what I am led to believe.

caitb1 wrote: »

Did anyone hear that there is a relaxation coming in the building regulations...

The 'relaxation' may only be theoretical!

sydthebeat

caitb1 wrote: »

We have r planning got but havnt started building yet. Does it mean we can go direct labour r does a contractor still have to sign off

just wait till 1st september when the details will be released.

i dont think Ministers Coffey or O'Keeffe post here

Gumbo

caitb1 wrote: »

We have r planning got but havnt started building yet. Does it mean we can go direct labour r does a contractor still have to sign off

Yes you should be able to go direct labour, and the home owner can sign as the builder. You may still have to demonstrate compliance so some form of supervision may still be required.

DOCARCH

kceire wrote: »

...the home owner can sign as the builder...

Can...but should they? After all, they will be signing a statutory document stating that they are the principal or director of a building company.

Gumbo

DOCARCH wrote: »

Can...but should they? After all, they will be signing a statutory document stating that they are the principal or director of a building company.

With the amendments, that wording will change.
Something along the lines of, "if a building contractor is appointed, it must be signed by the director" with great emphasis on IF a,contractor is appointed.

caitb1

That would be great if that happened as direct Labour would save us so much money than gettin a contractor. Everything can stil get done to high quality

Strolling Bones

DOCARCH wrote: »

Can...but should they? After all, they will be signing a statutory document stating that they are

responsible.

for the building.

themselves.

no one else.

Gumbo

DOCARCH wrote: »

Can...but should they? After all, they will be signing a statutory document stating that they are the principal or director of a building company.

Strolling Bones wrote: »

responsible.

for the building.

themselves.

no one else.

I got this online :

the person assigned as builder and notified to the Building Control Authority (who may also be the owner of the building or works concerned) must at the appropriate time sign Part A – Certificate signed by Builder of the Certificate of Compliance on Completion as set out in the Sixth Schedule. Where, and only where, the assigned builder is a building company, this certificate must be signed by a Principal or a Director of the Building Company and may not be signed by an ordinary employee.”

galwaytt

Strolling Bones wrote: »

responsible.

for the building.

themselves.

no one else.

...indeed, and it may come to pass that even if the system is relaxed on paper, that the likes of Banks may still want things done the forma DC/AC way before they'd issue a mortgage for it. At the end of the day, if the flow of money stops, it won't matter what the BCMS does/doesn't say.

Ditto at time of sale in the future.

This is ultimate kicking of can down the road stuff - and that only ever ends up one way.

Strolling Bones

When the DOE Ministers pronounce that new regs will stop another Priory Hall happening again they mean that it will not happen again to the DOE.

That is all.

Strolling Bones

kceire wrote: »

Wording as promised :

Do you have any wording from the new regs from the undertaking by builder document i.e. the statement of responsibilities that owner "builders" will take on ?

Gumbo

Strolling Bones wrote: »

Do you have any wording from the new regs from the undertaking by builder document i.e. the statement of responsibilities that owner "builders" will take on ?

No sorry. I heard a rumour too online that the CN fee looks to be going up to €35 too.

caitb1

So a building contractor will still hav to do the work? I'm confused.was hoping to get it all done direct labour.father in law to plumb it and finish internally apart from electrical work. Hav a friend who is in his house for 100k house is 1600sf he was n on old regs but new ber ratings. Wasn't allowed put n an open fire but to get house done kitchen in and all for that is great. The house we want to build is 1830sf and the cheapest quote we got for complete to second fix was 140k still hav to get kitchen,appliances,paint, garden etc after that, we would b almost n it for 140k Iif we could use direct Labour

sydthebeat

caitb1 wrote: »

So a building contractor will still hav to do the work? I'm confused.was hoping to get it all done direct labour.father in law to plumb it and finish internally apart from electrical work. Hav a friend who is in his house for 100k house is 1600sf he was n on old regs but new ber ratings. Wasn't allowed put n an open fire but to get house done kitchen in and all for that is great. The house we want to build is 1830sf and the cheapest quote we got for complete to second fix was 140k still hav to get kitchen,appliances,paint, garden etc after that, we would b almost n it for 140k Iif we could use direct Labour

SOMEONE will have to take responsibility for full building regulation compliance.

if you are going to build by "direct labour" its is taken de facto that YOU are the building contractor and YOU will have to take full responsibility for all building regulations

... all 1000 pages of them.....

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=87869380&postcount=289

RORY O CONNOR

The 'relaxation' may only be theoretical![/QUOTE]

The legislation is still place. The ministers can't simply announce a change from September 1st. New legislation will need to be drafted to amend the current rules. Unless otherwise advised old system is still formally in place!

exile2005

To avail of the new building regs, would one have to send in a commencement notice after sept the first or could one send one in now n begin building in September??thanks

RORY O CONNOR

exile2005 wrote: »

To avail of the new building regs, would one have to send in a commencement notice after sept the first or could one send one in now n begin building in September??thanks

The building regs have not changed!

Nor has the building control act-Nothing has changed until the legislation is changed and this will require the signing of new documentation by the relevant Minister-who is currently on holiday.

Gumbo

exile2005 wrote: »

To avail of the new building regs, would one have to send in a commencement notice after sept the first or could one send one in now n begin building in September??thanks

Nobody can avail of it yet. The Building Control Authorities don't even know if it will be ready for the 1st September or not. They have seen internal Drafts of the new SI and it states the 1st September, but its getting very close with no concrete change in place just yet.

Also, if you submit a CN now, you have to adhere to the current regulations. If you want to take the gamble and hold off, then you must continue to do so.

RORY O CONNOR

I'm hearing it will change for new extensions but not for full houses where the old system will remain in place. But then there is so much information and mis-information about no one knows whats happening

Gumbo

RORY O CONNOR wrote: »

I'm hearing it will change for new extensions but not for full houses where the old system will remain in place. But then there is so much information and mis-information about no one knows whats happening

It is changing for extensions and one off houses. i've seen the Draft SI, it will also allow self build with the home owner signing that he is building it himself.

DOCARCH

One week to September 1st...and...no legislation/amending regulations published! Joke!?!

Strolling Bones

DOCARCH wrote: »

Joke!?!

Yes they are

Gumbo

Strolling Bones wrote: »

Yes they are

Notice, how the photshop'd out the selfie stick :P

galwaytt

Strolling Bones wrote: »

Yes they are

If I meet two lads like that I'd assume they're...........pulling for tax.......or dipping diesel tanks........either way, nothing I'd connect to building !

Strolling Bones

To take affect tomorrow.
Regs that no one ( outside of DOE ) have seen yet....

sydthebeat

SI 80 of 2013
SI 9 of 2014

SI ? of 2015


surely they can get it right at third time of asking....

(rhetorical)

Gumbo

Self build forums on Facebook seem to be confirming that the new regs are in force from tomorrow.

Will23

kceire wrote: »

Self build forums on Facebook seem to be confirming that the new regs are in force from tomorrow.

Supposedly, but has the SI been published and signed Into law?

Do the local authorities have guidance on it yet? What have you seen in DCC?

Gumbo

Will23 wrote: »

Supposedly, but has the SI been published and signed Into law?

Do the local authorities have guidance on it yet? What have you seen in DCC?

No SI published yet. The draft wasn't even listed under an SI number and we have nothing yet in DCC.

Angry bird

Changes to building control to be signed today. Not sure of commencement order but may be today.

Gumbo

Once the minister signs it later, it will take effect straight away from today.
What some people still don't realise is that DCC will still look for an inspection plan and construction drawings.

Strolling Bones

kceire wrote: »

What some people still don't realise is that DCC will still look for an inspection plan and construction drawings.

One off new builds may well be processed like so.

I doubt extensions will - no change from what has occured for decades I suspect will be the de facto situation i.e. people will "choose to beleive" the regs don't apply to them and choose to face the consequences another day. For who will "make them" do otherwise?

Gumbo

Strolling Bones wrote: »

One off new builds may well be processed like so.

I doubt extensions will - no change from what has occured for decades I suspect will be the de facto situation i.e. people will "choose to beleive" the regs don't apply to them and choose to face the consequences another day. For who will "make them" do otherwise?

Quite possible, but the minute a BCO inspects (if inspects ) then construction drawings will be requested

sydthebeat

http://www.bregsforum.com/2015/09/01/si-9-review-announcement-91-update/

so a definite "later today"

Strolling Bones

kceire wrote: »

Quite possible, but the minute a BCO inspects (if inspects ) then construction drawings will be requested

Agreed.
But "catch me if you can" will be the prevailing attitude.
Encouraged by recent political rhetoric.

Gumbo

Strolling Bones wrote: »

Agreed.
But "catch me if you can" will be the prevailing attitude.
Encouraged by recent political rhetoric.

I can do Tom Hanks, who wants to play Leaordo Di Caprio????

Strolling Bones

I was thinking of Speedy Gonzales vs Wily Coyete.

Gumbo

Strolling Bones wrote: »

I was thinking of Speedy Gonzales vs Wily Coyete.

None of them get hot women

sydthebeat

end of business 1st sept... no amended legislation

atech

A badly scanned version is up now

http://www.environ.ie/en/DevelopmentHousing/BuildingStandards/News/MainBody,42562,en.htm

Seems as if there is no need for an inspection plan if you opt out.

Gumbo

atech wrote: »

A badly scanned version is up now

http://www.environ.ie/en/DevelopmentHousing/BuildingStandards/News/MainBody,42562,en.htm

Seems as if there is no need for an inspection plan if you opt out.

Looks that way alright.

BryanF

Where to begin...
Define a 'registered construction professional' ?

What if anything does a registered construction professional supply at practical completion to 'suggest' building regs or planning regs or contract practical completion in order for owner to draw down final portion of mortgage?

Homeowners should weigh up carefully the implications of a decision to opt out of the statutory certification process. The cost associated with engaging the services of a registered construction professional for design, inspection and certification purposes is likely to be a key consideration. It is worth bearing in mind that a reasonable investment in the design, inspection and certification of works will pay dividends in terms of delivering a quality, compliant building.
Homeowners should be aware of the Sample Preliminary Inspection Plan which is published on the Department’s website that outlines the typical hourly service required from construction professionals. Fees charged by professionals may vary.
Homeowners should appraise themselves of any potential cost or other implications that may arise as a result of choosing to opt out of the statutory certification process. Prior to deciding on whether or not to avail of the opt out option, it is recommended that a homeowner should consult with their solicitor.

Will your solicitor, when asked directly, as a professional, and looking out for your interests, future & present, offer a positive opinion on the opt out clause ? And would you get that opinion in writing, for when you or your loved ones wish to sell the property?

Strolling Bones

BryanF wrote: »

Where to begin...
Define a 'registered construction professional' ?

One of the Holy 3

BryanF wrote: »

What if anything does a registered construction professional supply at practical completion to 'suggest' building regs or planning regs or contract practical completion in order for owner to draw down final portion of mortgage?

the much loved and heavily qualified opinions on complaince

BryanF wrote: »

Any solicitors care to offer a professional opinion on the opt out clause ?

You have got to be kidding. Only construction profesionals cough it for free on the internet.

Strolling Bones

Homeowners should weigh up carefully the implications of a decision to opt out of the statutory certification process. The cost associated with engaging the services of a registered construction professional for design, inspection and certification purposes is likely to be a key consideration. It is worth bearing in mind that a reasonable investment in the design, inspection and certification of works will pay dividends in terms of delivering a quality, compliant building.
Homeowners should be aware of the Sample Preliminary Inspection Plan which is published on the Department’s website that outlines the typical hourly service required from construction professionals. Fees charged by professionals may vary.
Homeowners should appraise themselves of any potential cost or other implications that may arise as a result of choosing to opt out of the statutory certification process. Prior to deciding on whether or not to avail of the opt out option, it is recommended that a homeowner should consult with their solicitor.

Translation - don't be wasting your money on architects when you have all that faux stone cladding to be paying for

thatslife

So if you go for opt out option,
- architect should be providing DEAP/BER compliance & rating with his drawings and details and materials specs, so that should cover the majority of it?
-The engineer will provide any additional details/checks required for structure and then he will do the stage payments sign offs for the mortgage

You sign the 'Assignment of Builder' notice. Build your house, direct labour of course. Anything goes wrong - your problem.

Otherwise live happy ever after..