not what you know its who you know.

Hunter456

these days applying for a job is like looking for a needle in a hay stack dis-morning i applied for a few jobs and got one reply back the usual crap sorry need more experience then y in the hell would i apply for the job in the first place, i though this rubbish was long gone ''its not what you know its who you know''. being seeking employment for nearly 5 years now how many of ye are coming to up against a brick wall every time they apply for work.

Lux23

What kind of jobs are you looking for? Have you much working experience?

eeguy

What have you been doing with yourself the past 5 years.

No employer wants someone whose been out of the workforce for a prolonged period and has nothing to show for it.

Timberrrrrrrr

Hunter456 wrote: »

these days applying for a job is like looking for a needle in a hay stack dis-morning i applied for a few jobs and got one reply back the usual crap sorry need more experience then y in the hell would i apply for the job in the first place, i though this rubbish was long gone ''its not what you know its who you know''. being seeking employment for nearly 5 years now how many of ye are coming to up against a brick wall every time they apply for work.

Does your CV look like this?

Miaireland

As Lux said what kind of jobs are you going for and how much work experience do you have? Are you tailoring your CV and Cover Letter for each individual job that you are going for or are you sending a generic cv and cover letter. Have you correct grammer etc on both.

It is quite hard to understand what you are saying above about the job you applied for today? Most jobs do look for some experience these days. It is a fact of life.

Hunter456

I specailize in I.T and have 8 years experience. My Cv looks fine to me the right grammer used.....

Miaireland

You mention that you have been searching for work for the last five years? Have you been out of the industry for the five years. That could be what is putting people off. Maybe look into doing so internships or voluteering if there are gaps in your cv.

In my experience employers do understand that people have gaps on their cvs due to dificiulty finding jobs but they want to see that you have been taking proactive steps in that time like voluteering, fas course etc, even free online course look show that you are trying to improve your skills and actively using the ones that you have.

Hunter456

I actively keep my skills up to date by doing reading and keeping up to date with the latest technology for pc and consoles its the gap is most likely due to looking and to being family cometted I stayed at home looking after my kids for the first years of their life... i never stopped looking something will come my way or I might open my own IT business but you need money to make money for a business

Tefral

I know this is a message board so the grammar and spelling kind of go out the window especially on a mobile device, but it's hard to look past it in your posts. Have you had someone else proof read your cover letters and CV?

My other half is an employer and she routinely throws CV's straight in the bin if she spots a spelling or grammer mistake.

johnnyskeleton

Might I suggest that you forget about the attitude that its not you that is unappealing to employers and that they are giving their jobs to contacts or people in the know?

That may well be true, but even if it is it just means you are going to have to be twice as good as the well connected person. The only way to go about achieveing that is to up your game.

Keep trying, dont get dismayed by rejection, do a course on interview/cv techniques and if necessary work in an internship/voluntary placement for 6 months.

I take the point that youve been keeping yourself up to date. But while you know that how is an employer supposed to? The only way they can assess how up to date you are is if you have bren recently been working or have the qualifications to show for yourself.

Best of luck

bar32

grammar:)

eeguy

First thing an employer would look for is qualifications or a portfolio of work to show you've been active in the last 5 years.

Most IT skills are of a "use it or lose it" type. Things can change very quickly and knowledge can become obsolete.

I know you say you keep up to date, but if you can't quantify that and prove it on your CV, then it's useless.

Timberrrrrrrr

Hunter456 wrote: »

I specailize in I.T and have 8 years experience. My Cv looks fine to me the right grammer used.....

I'm sorry, I'm really not nit picking on your spelling but it's not great and I asked if your CV looked like that because you would be surprised how many I have seen where people have actually used text speak the way you did in the op. Maybe get someone to proof read/spell check it for you.

December2012

What are you basing your opinion of "it's who you know" on?

It sounds a lot like a refusal to accept that "what you know" isn't up to par with other candidates.

Are you taking professional career advice and support? Has a career consultant ever reviewed your cv for you? What are your key skills and do they match the jobs you are applying for?

Hunter456

The spelling dose go out the window in regards to using a mobile but I a sure ye my grammer is good on my Cv. lets not get carried away I know the Irish public complain about everything but this a forum, I posted this thread to see was there anybody else in the same boat.

Mrs OBumble

Of course it's who you know. Always has been.

So - who do you know?

How many of your former colleagues have you had coffee with in the last month? How many of your contacts from mother's groups (or whatever you've done while not working) know what sort of work you're looking for? How many of them have asked their husbands if they have any work for you? How many LinkedIn groups are you an active member of?

Mrs OBumble

Hunter456 wrote: »

The spelling dose go out the window in regards to using a mobile but I a sure ye my grammer is good on my Cv. lets not get carried away I know the Irish public complain about everything but this a forum, I posted this thread to see was there anybody else in the same boat.

Mod-note: Lads, please give the grammar / spelling bit a rest. Yes it was worth a short mention, but it's far from the only issue and has had quite enough coverage now.

padd b1975

Five years out of any profession is an eternity, it would be even worse for IT given the pace at which technology moves.

What have you done to keep your skills up to date and relevant in the past five years?

Hunter456

Reading the relevant sites for updates on software and hardware.

Stheno

Hunter456 wrote: »

I specailize in I.T and have 8 years experience. My Cv looks fine to me the right grammer used.....

What area of IT/technologies did you work in? I.e.. we're you a service desk analyst, a developer, network admin?

Also what certifications do you currently hold?

cnoc

cronin_j wrote: »

I know this is a message board so the grammar and spelling kind of go out the window especially on a mobile device, but it's hard to look past it in your posts. Have you had someone else proof read your cover letters and CV?

My other half is an employer and she routinely throws CV's straight in the bin if she spots a spelling or grammer mistake.

Do not let your other half see this post.....or else you are in trouble!

eeguy

Hunter456 wrote: »

Reading the relevant sites for updates on software and hardware.

If it's not quantifiable, then you're wasting your time.

_Brian

I'm not in IT but in management and hired for a MN for many years.

Reading to keep up with what is essentially a hands on creative process probably doesn't inspire during an interview.

I'd be thinking you need to get some actual current IT work into your CV, maybe this means voluntary or maybe it means looking for lower grade IT jobs just to get your foot back in the door.

In the five years I'm presuming you had some interviews - did you ask for feedback from them for points to improve on.

Hunter456

_Brian wrote: »

I'm not in IT but in management and hired for a MN for many years.

Reading to keep up with what is essentially a hands on creative process probably doesn't inspire during an interview.

I'd be thinking you need to get some actual current IT work into your CV, maybe this means voluntary or maybe it means looking for lower grade IT jobs just to get your foot back in the door.

In the five years I'm presuming you had some interviews - did you ask for feedback from them for points to improve on.

reading is knowledge my friend but yes it dose not help with an interview but i do my own work on my own machines and help build custom PCs and repair consoles for friends have stated all of the above on my c.v i think its time for setting myself up.

MouseTail

Mrs O'Bumble is correct, its absolutely who you know, especially in SMEs, so work your networks, in addition to what she suggested contact all those people who you helped out with PC and console repair and let them know you are looking to reenter the workforce, and if they hear of any opportunities to let you know. Do
you have qualifications, or are you self taught? If the latter you really need to get a qualification. A 5 year CV gap doesn't look too bad if its explained by caring for children in the early years, but is ameliorated substantially by an accredited refresher course.

Stheno

Hunter456 wrote: »

reading is knowledge my friend but yes it dose not help with an interview but i do my own work on my own machines and help build custom PCs and repair consoles for friends have stated all of the above on my c.v i think its time for setting myself up.

So are your eight years experience in building individual custom pcs and doing pc repair?

JigglyMcJabs

Hunter456 wrote: »

reading is knowledge my friend but yes it dose not help with an interview but i do my own work on my own machines and help build custom PCs and repair consoles for friends have stated all of the above on my c.v i think its time for setting myself up.

If you build and repair pc's, have you done any certifications? If not, it would be a good place to start. Things like A+ and Network+. If you've been out of the workforce for 5 years, you probably qualify for access to some courses for free.

You may know a lot of what the course teaches you, but a lot of these courses line up work experience which can turn into a job.

Setting up for yourself is also something you could look at. Again, there are grants and courses you can do to help you start a small business.

Stheno

JigglyMcJabs wrote: »

If you build and repair pc's, have you done any certifications? If not, it would be a good place to start. Things like A+ and Network+. If you've been out of the workforce for 5 years, you probably qualify for access to some courses for free.

You may know a lot of what the course teaches you, but a lot of these courses line up work experience which can turn into a job.

Setting up for yourself is also something you could look at. Again, there are grants and courses you can do to help you start a small business.

Agreed with this, especially if OP wants to be employed by an IT organisation, certs are essential especially after 5 years

OP you could also contact your local entreprise board if you are thinking of setting up yourself. It's an area I'd consider fairly crowded in terms of competition though

Hunter456

Stheno wrote: »

Agreed with this, especially if OP wants to be employed by an IT organisation, certs are essential especially after 5 years

OP you could also contact your local entreprise board if you are thinking of setting up yourself. It's an area I'd consider fairly crowded in terms of competition though

This area of work is fairly crowded as its the way forward but none are employing atm, they are just working from them selves which isn't a bad thing either.

uck51js9zml2yt

What courses have you done in the last 5 years. There are free ones out there through springboard , fas and skillnets.
You don't seem to have any recent qualifications.
An employer sees your CV and sees you've done nothing . reading doesn't get you certified.

ComfortKid

Hunter456 wrote:

I actively keep my skills up to date by doing reading and keeping up to date with the latest technology for pc and consoles its the gap is most likely due to looking and to being family cometted I stayed at home looking after my kids for the first years of their life... i never stopped looking something will come my way or I might open my own IT business but you need money to make money for a business

Keeping up to date with the latest technology and consoles could easily be "Browsing the internet and playing my xbox"

You need to account for those 5 years with something on your CV. I am long term unemployed myself (13 months now) but I haven't had any negative responses to my applications as you mentioned.

You are right though, it is who you know. While I was employed I noticed that plenty positions were coming up, but they were going to current employees family and friends.
These positions were advertised even though they had been filled before hand. Joke really.

the_syco

Hunter456 wrote: »

but i do my own work on my own machines and help build custom PCs

The above means jack.

A CompTIA A+ cert and the above means that your knowledge about PC's has been certified, and you are constantly keeping your certified knowledge up to date.

The CompTIA cert was developed for that one purpose in 1982; to show employers that the hobbyist actually knows what they're on about, as opposed to someone talking the talk, but unable to walk the walk. And as it's being around for so long, it's a well known cert.

Stheno

Hunter456 wrote: »

This area of work is fairly crowded as its the way forward but none are employing atm, they are just working from them selves which isn't a bad thing either.

I meant that you may struggle to make a living in this area as there are already lots and lots of operators in that business.

You'd want to do a detailed business plan to see if it's something that you could earn a living at if you set up on your own.

the_syco wrote: »

The above means jack.

A CompTIA A+ cert and the above means that your knowledge about PC's has been certified, and you are constantly keeping your certified knowledge up to date.

The CompTIA cert was developed for that one purpose in 1982; to show employers that the hobbyist actually knows what they're on about, as opposed to someone talking the talk, but unable to walk the walk. And as it's being around for so long, it's a well known cert.

syco is now about the 10th person to reference getting qualifications, why do you keep ignoring this?

edit I just checked your posting history and you got this exact same advice about qualificaitons five months ago here, have you done anything since to progress that?

What sorts of jobs are you applying for?

catsbanter

You said you have been keeping up with the latest technologies? Where are your certifications? There's Linux , Windows, Cisco, java, Cisco , C++ exams, .Net framework, Oracle, SQL Server exams along with plenty more.

What area do you specialize in? You need to pick an area you want to work in , set up a lab on your computer, download the training videos and pay 150 to sit an exam in testing centres. Certifications can range from 3 exams to beginner level and 12 exams to master level. (And some of these "beginner exams" can take a year to get.

A five year gap on a C.V doesn't look good even with experience and companies will take graduates ahead of you with more recent qualifications.

My advice if you don't want to go down the exam root is to try and get a helpdesk posisition after just sitting one or two exams and try to work your way up in a company. If your a programmer then start making applications, fancy JSP, PHP websites to show off your talents when applying for jobs.

Edited just because I missed out on something but repairing PCs and Xbox's is not I.T at all. Its far far from it. There's plenty of graduates who know how to put a PC together. If you don't mind me asking what jobs have you been applying for? Maybe the Windows Servers exams might help along with an ITIL exam. If its just PC repair your into a very limited field.

Stheno

catsbanter wrote: »

Edited just because I missed out on something but repairing PCs and Xbox's is not I.T at all. Its far far from it. There's plenty of graduates who know how to put a PC together. If you don't mind me asking what jobs have you been applying for? Maybe the Windows Servers exams might help along with an ITIL exam. If its just PC repair your into a very limited field.

Sorry for being pedantic but I don't think you can do an ITIL exam here without a course, I've two friends who were trying but were told they had to do a course before they could sit the exam

Personally I think pc repair for individuals is on the way out, too much work covered by warranty these days, and devices are becoming more and more dispensable, people will go out and buy a replacement rather than deal with paying for a repair which may or may not work

catsbanter

Stheno wrote: »

Sorry for being pedantic but I don't think you can do an ITIL exam here without a course, I've two friends who were trying but were told they had to do a course before they could sit the exam

Personally I think pc repair for individuals is on the way out, too much work covered by warranty these days, and devices are becoming more and more dispensable, people will go out and buy a replacement rather than deal with paying for a repair which may or may not work

I wasn't totally sure on the ITIL one actually as got taught by an ITIL instructor in work for three days in a group and did the exam at the end.
But yeah PC repair is nearly dead as everyone knows someone who is handy enough at computers down the road from them. Antivirus etc is always in the news about buying things online and Windows XP was a hooor for viruses, Windows 7 not half as bad.

Stheno

catsbanter wrote: »

But yeah PC repair is nearly dead as everyone knows someone who works in IT whom they assume will have no problem fixing their pc after a long days work in an entirely unrelated area .

FYP

_Brian

Hunter456 wrote: »

reading is knowledge my friend but yes it dose not help with an interview but i do my own work on my own machines and help build custom PCs and repair consoles for friends have stated all of the above on my c.v i think its time for setting myself up.

See, I see an attitude and a level of denial in this post.

Reading is fine but you need the credentials to prove you've absorbed some of your five year reading. I know SFA about PCs and have built two, but putting that on a CV doesn't entitle me I a job in IT like you seem to think it does.

Honestly, between a five year gap of "reading" in your CV, combined with your point blank refusal to acknowledge the need to be certified and active in IT. I can see your CVs at the bottom of the pile and wonder about interview skills.

Hunter456

_Brian wrote: »

See, I see an attitude and a level of denial in this post.

Reading is fine but you need the credentials to prove you've absorbed some of your five year reading. I know SFA about PCs and have built two, but putting that on a CV doesn't entitle me I a job in IT like you seem to think it does.

Honestly, between a five year gap of "reading" in your CV, combined with your point blank refusal to acknowledge the need to be certified and active in IT. I can see your CVs at the bottom of the pile and wonder about interview skills.

the funny thing is its not a level of denial its me asking a question that's all. i have slacked off a small bit and desperate to enter back into the work force. have being applying for jobs day in n day out most of the time i get no reply but how many people have applied for that job already or is it gone. all a person can do is keep trying till you succeed.

eeguy

all a person can do is keep trying till you succeed.

True, but the point everyone here is trying to make is that you need to upskill and get certs and experience to improve your chances.

You've been applying for jobs for years. Do you really think one will drop into your lap now if it hasn't already?


Take the bull by the horns and get yourself onto some relevant, accredited courses.

BabysCoffee

Hunter456 wrote: »

I actively keep my skills up to date by doing reading and keeping up to date with the latest technology for pc and consoles its the gap is most likely due to looking and to being family cometted I stayed at home looking after my kids for the first years of their life... i never stopped looking something will come my way or I might open my own IT business but you need money to make money for a business

Serious question. Did you get someone to proof read your CV?

If not, I'd do that as a first step towards getting a job.

Secondly, I'd get someone in the industry to then read your CV and to see what could be improved.

Thirdly, as mentioned before, I'd start doing some serious networking with past contacts and get involved with Linkedin Groups, etc.

Finally, your OP seems to have a negative attitude - I'd lose this pronto.

eeguy

all a person can do is keep trying till you succeed.

True, but the point everyone here is trying to make is that you need to upskill and get certs and experience to improve your chances.

You've been applying for jobs for years. Do you really think one will drop into your lap now if it hasn't already?


Take the bull by the horns and get yourself onto some relevant, accredited courses.

challengemaster

Hunter456 wrote: »

I specailize in I.T and have 8 years experience. My Cv looks fine to me the right grammer used.....

What sort of company did you work for last?
Have you any sort of qualifications at all?
What sort of jobs are you applying for?

Hunter456 wrote: »

Reading the relevant sites for updates on software and hardware.

ComfortKid wrote: »

Keeping up to date with the latest technology and consoles could easily be "Browsing the internet and playing my xbox"

That's essentially what it sounds like.

JigglyMcJabs

Hunter456 wrote: »

the funny thing is its not a level of denial its me asking a question that's all. i have slacked off a small bit and desperate to enter back into the work force. have being applying for jobs day in n day out most of the time i get no reply but how many people have applied for that job already or is it gone. all a person can do is keep trying till you succeed.

I don't think you're getting the point, or at least you're choosing to ignore it. In today's job market, "trying" does not mean firing out cv's, it means retraining, upskilling, networking, volunteering and putting time into well written cv's and cover letters.

Employers have pretty much indicated at this stage that either your cv, your attitude, your experience or your qualifications are falling short somewhere. You need to find out where and work on correcting it.

Alternatively you can look at working for yourself.

GalwayGrrrrrl

OP, you have got loads of really good advice here. Get your CV checked by someone impartial- some university open days have "CV clinics" for example. Try to stay positive. Take at least one course to keep your mind active and help to build up those all important contacts. In the area I work in (hse) we very rarely take on anyone that has not been with us for work experience. Try to arrange a few sessions of work experience to get your foot in the door.

the_syco

Stheno wrote: »

Personally I think pc repair for individuals is on the way out, too much work covered by warranty these days, and devices are becoming more and more dispensable, people will go out and buy a replacement rather than deal with paying for a repair which may or may not work

People are getting dumber, so more of the repair crew are going for the longer maintenance jobs than the quick fix computer jobs. Most lads that I know that did it on the side have quit as it's too much hassle.

Oh, and as they get dumber, they expect you to backup their stuff on C:\users\default user\app data\random-directory\pictures and go mad if you don't as "that's what they paid you for".

Hunter456 wrote: »

i have slacked off a small bit and desperate to enter back into the work force.

But not desperate enough that you'll upskill?

=-=

First off, goto http://www.professormesser.com/free-a-plus-training/free-a-plus/ and watch all the videos. Then do the exam. Advise you do the exam in two parts, as it gives you the option of a quick cram before the 2nd part; it costs the same.

Next off, do an IT job with scambridge for 6 months, and use the experience on your CV. Cert followed by experience will give you more of a chance than what you have now.

Hunter456

thanks very much for that link i'll watch those in the morning over my coffee.

Stheno

Hunter456 wrote: »

thanks very much for that link i'll watch those in the morning over my coffee.

OP if you post up your c.v. with all of your personal details and employer names blacked out, you might get some advice on how you could improve it

catsbanter

Hunter456 wrote: »

thanks very much for that link i'll watch those in the morning over my coffee.

Not sure if been sarcastic :pac:

Uve been given a lot of great advice. Maybe Jobridge might be the way to go to get some experience because so far you have 0 years expierence 0 certs so you need to improve those stats and you will land a job!

the_syco

Hunter456 wrote: »

thanks very much for that link i'll watch those in the morning over my coffee.

And this attitude is why no-one will hire you.

Stheno

catsbanter wrote: »

Not sure if been sarcastic :pac:

Uve been given a lot of great advice. Maybe Jobridge might be the way to go to get some experience because so far you have 0 years expierence 0 certs so you need to improve those stats and you will land a job!

the_syco wrote: »

And this attitude is why no-one will hire you.

I kinda thought the same. No response from my post suggesting the Op post their c.v for free feedback, then a response that they'll look through free training when they are having coffee in the morning.

I know OP has posted they have kids to look after, but this is bordering on trolling.

I'm currently looking to become a ScrumMaster, can't find any free resources outside of scrum.org to help me, but am constantly researching on it to pass the exam.

OP, if you want to work in IT, here is the reality. In 2010 I lost my job in IT and got a new one a month later. I then did 13 exams to advance myself in a month, and currently I'm studying for another three professional certifications as required by one of the companies I work for.

I don't get to do that over my morning coffee, as I'm working, I get to do that evenings and weekends, with a time limit, while I'm also studying for a MAsters. That's an extreme example, but no one in IT ever stops studying/keeping up to date/participating in tech groups relating to their speciality.

You seem to be content to meander along on the basis that because you think you know the stuff, you should get the job.

In the current market, you've no experience, and no qualifications.

You need to get both