FBD??????????

whelan2

What's the story ?

larrymiller

whelan2 wrote: »

What's the story ?

They really didn't know what was around the corner

Farmer Pudsey

Bad management. They chased business without reserves in place and some of this was relatively high risk(in that it was buisnes that other insurers shyed away from). They are also caught by new solvency arrangements from 01/16 where reserves must be in virtual cash(government bonds etc). They had part of the reserves in property and have to exit this,

Over last few years they have been paying dividends that they really should not have been paying. Now they have to put reserves in place as well as exit property. The other half of the property portfolio is owned by the FBD trust. Even if the FBD trust buy this back at relative value (farmers drive a hard bargin at the best of times) they will still more than likly have to do a rights issue or pay for a high interest bond.

Timmaay

where to next for them?

whelan2

Can those who broke it fix it?

Panch18

whelan2 wrote: »

Can those who broke it fix it?

The CEO stepped down a few days ago

As far a I know a new CEO hasn't yet been appointed

They'll be ok in the long run I reckon

frazzledhome

What major news have I missed?

blue5000

It didn't exactly happen overnight, they've been in trouble since the storms in feb '14.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Panch18 wrote: »

The CEO stepped down a few days ago

As far a I know a new CEO hasn't yet been appointed

They'll be ok in the long run I reckon

Not so sure about that, tbh.

With the share price so low, there are a number of vulture funds sniffing around at under valued entities like FBD.

Panch18

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Not so sure about that, tbh.

With the share price so low, there are a number of vulture funds sniffing around at under valued entities like FBD.

No doubt they need to stabilise and you are right they could be wide open to a take over - they are the largest non life insurer in the country I believe so if another mutli national fancied a piece of the irish market they would be a great way to get their foot in the door

If they get the right person to lead them though I think they'll be ok on a stand alone basis

Western Pomise

As Farmer Pudsey alluded to above they went chasing business that no one else was in a rush to take on because of the risks involved!...as someone who has been a longtime customer I expect to see premiums go up well in next few years:(

tanko

Western Pomise wrote: »

As Farmer Pudsey alluded to above they went chasing business that no one else was in a rush to take on because of the risks involved!...as someone who has been a longtime customer I expect to see premiums go up well in next few years:(

Their motor insurance quotes have gone through the roof for the last year or two.

blue5000

Anyone old enough to remember the kowloon bridge story?

Panch18

blue5000 wrote: »

Anyone old enough to remember the kowloon bridge story?

No but I'd like to hear it!!

MickeyShtyles

Panch18 wrote: »

No but I'd like to hear it!!

This regards buying it, Blue?

monkeynuz

tanko wrote: »

Their motor insurance quotes have gone through the roof for the last year or two.

Our car premium went up over €200 this year so we have changed insurers after being with them for 9 years and no claims it's a shame but the price was ridiculous.

grange mac

blue5000 wrote: »

Anyone old enough to remember the kowloon bridge story?

Yep, saw it recently down in toe head....well where it all happened!!

rangler1

monkeynuz wrote: »

Our car premium went up over €200 this year so we have changed insurers after being with them for 9 years and no claims it's a shame but the price was ridiculous.

did you appeal it with them, my complete farm motor etc only went up a lot less than that and I've had loads of claims

Greengrass1

rangler1 wrote: »

did you appeal it with them, my complete farm motor etc only went up a lot less than that and I've had loads of claims

Farm insurance was up for renewal this week. Got it for 1k less off another company. Been with them a very long time

whelan2

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Farm insurance was up for renewal this week. Got it for 1k less off another company. Been with them a very long time

is the cover the same? Have been given cheaper quotes here but cover doesnt match, read the fine print

blue5000

Panch18 wrote: »

No but I'd like to hear it!!

MickeyShtyles wrote: »

This regards buying it, Blue?

grange mac wrote: »

Yep, saw it recently down in toe head....well where it all happened!!

It had a sister ship the derbyshire which also went down. I think there was a fault with the hatches, anyway they were all insured by Lloyds, a big London based insurance company.

http://www.aquaventures.ie/kowloon.htm I think the kowloon bridge was about £10m of a loss on it's own. Lloyds almost went broke and AFAIK the shareholders had to contribute.

Long story short, if the same happens with fbd it's a lot of farmers who originally bought shares to set up fbd. If there is a lot of shares changing hands, it's unlikely to be farmers selling them.

monkeynuz

rangler1 wrote: »

did you appeal it with them, my complete farm motor etc only went up a lot less than that and I've had loads of claims

Yes I did as I have done the last few years and they always knocked off a bit, this year they wouldn't budge and when I said I couldn't justify it they just said ok it's your choice....

Greengrass1

whelan2 wrote: »

is the cover the same? Have been given cheaper quotes here but cover doesnt match, read the fine print

Nope exact same.
Fbd had taken the Wind screen cover off the 2 tractors when they sent out renewal forms.
That really took the biscuit

Farmer

The mad thing with insurance, particularly car insurance, is the way they all thrash each other for new business but never reward loyal existing, and I'm sure, quite profitable customers.

The way it is now, a bit like air fares, is that you either get very cheap cover if you're prepared to keep moving, or else get ripped off. They will then quote customer "churn" as one of the reasons they are losing money. In a way, they deserve it, out pricing themselves to their existing loyal customers while, at the same time, courting the "NoNonsense" brigade

Base price

Farmer wrote: »

The mad thing with insurance, particularly car insurance, is the way they all thrash each other for new business but never reward loyal existing, and I'm sure, quite profitable customers.

The way it is now, a bit like air fares, is that you either get very cheap cover if you're prepared to keep moving, or else get ripped off. They will then quote customer "churn" as one of the reasons they are losing money. In a way, they deserve it, out pricing themselves to their existing loyal customers while, at the same time, courting the "NoNonsense" brigade

+1
I was a customer of FBD for 28 years and never had a claim either on house/farm or vehicle insurance. Renewal came up last December and they increased the jeep insurance by €130, the farm/multiperil by €120, the MF 168 by €50 and the house by €120. When I asked what was the reason they quoted increased prices.
I priced around and got a substantially cheaper quotation with another company. I got back onto FBD and told them that I had a cheaper quote and they said there is nothing that they could do about it
So after 28 years I am now insured with another company and getting the same cover - I checked the small print.
TBH I felt disappointed 1) because loyalty did not seem to matter any longer,
2) No claims history meant feck all, 3) I was now paying a non Irish company.
OH also moved his house, farm and jeep insurance to the same provider as he received an exorbitant renewal notice from FBD.

darragh_haven

grange mac wrote: »

Yep, saw it recently down in toe head....well where it all happened!!

You were in my part of west cork so Grange. Live in Toe Head. The Kowloon bridge was moored in bantry harbour, but was more trouble than it was worth (and less value than insure for). It "broke" anchor and somehow hit the stags rocks off Toe Head.
Was sold for 1 punt for salvage.....

grange mac

darragh_haven wrote: »

You were in my part of west cork so Grange. Live in Toe Head. The Kowloon bridge was moored in bantry harbour, but was more trouble than it was worth (and less value than insure for). It "broke" anchor and somehow hit the stags rocks off Toe Head.
Was sold for 1 punt for salvage.....

I'm a fachtnas boy so down that side now n then nice side of country....But also bit of a traveller cork to w cork daily....

darragh_haven

grange mac wrote: »

I'm a fachtnas boy so down that side now n then nice side of country....But also bit of a traveller cork to w cork daily....

Fachtnas boy too. Close to two decades ago now

Used to do all our business, farm and personal, with FBD, but the personal service is gone and the price is gone up with everything evening tho we have no claims in years and years.

grange mac

darragh_haven wrote: »

Fachtnas boy too. Close to two decades ago now

Used to do all our business, farm and personal, with FBD, but the personal service is gone and the price is gone up with everything evening tho we have no claims in years and years.

We could have been class mates!!! Circa 20 years P Cleary brought our ag science class out there!!!
Switched to Avaya this year as premiums jumped 40% & wasn't going to be ripped off...

monkeynuz

Ironic as we had the home renwal a couple of weeks ago also with fbd and that had also jumped so phoned them and got a bit knocked off, I think they rely on the fact that most people want to avoid the hassle of phoning round and switching companies, which in truth is why we've stayed with them so long and also we naively thought loyalty would be reciprocal!

It'll be interesting to see how much my commercial vehicle policy is going up by in a few weeks also with fbd!

For the record my car insurance is now with quote devil after two days of phoning numerous insurance companies and getting some stupid car insurance quotes one of which was three times the fbd price (over €2000)

rangler1

Base price wrote: »

+1
I was a customer of FBD for 28 years and never had a claim either on house/farm or vehicle insurance. Renewal came up last December and they increased the jeep insurance by €130, the farm/multiperil by €120, the MF 168 by €50 and the house by €120. When I asked what was the reason they quoted increased prices.
I priced around and got a substantially cheaper quotation with another company. I got back onto FBD and told them that I had a cheaper quote and they said there is nothing that they could do about it
So after 28 years I am now insured with another company and getting the same cover - I checked the small print.
TBH I felt disappointed 1) because loyalty did not seem to matter any longer,
2) No claims history meant feck all, 3) I was now paying a non Irish company.
OH also moved his house, farm and jeep insurance to the same provider as he received an exorbitant renewal notice from FBD.

They'll more than likely be taken over now...plenty of others in the market anyway, whether they'll insure unregistered quads, livestock theft, drivers without trailer licences etc and many farmers sons got insurance when they could get it no where else.
everyone tells me I was lucky to get compensated for a stolen jeep seeing that the keys were in it.
It could be very changed times without them

Nekarsulm

Luckily I lodged the dividend cheque on Monday.

blue5000

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Luckily I lodged the dividend cheque on Monday.

Hasn't cleared yet:pac:

rangler1

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Luckily I lodged the dividend cheque on Monday.

continuing the dividends through the recession was probably no help

WheatenBriar

My renewal notice with them,just arrived
Up €300 for the farm and €200 for the Jeep (full no claims bonus) :eek:

Time to ring around methinks

larrymiller

What insurance company's do tractor insurance alone? As in not done through farm insurance?

lakill Farm

larrymiller wrote: »

What insurance company's do tractor insurance alone? As in not done through farm insurance?

I think axa did it if you have a car with them

Dad had his auld tractor for the bog insured with them , I think

whelan2

http://ow.ly/RgFSL

monkeynuz

whelan2 wrote: »

http://ow.ly/RgFSL

Well I'm not digging them out of the hole they've dug!

They say in the article something about good relationships with customers, well I've been with them since I moved here and the premiums have climbed steadily the last few years and this year my car insurance went from something like €600 to €850 I think and the van up another €150 I have already moved the motor policy and will be moving the van one tomorrow.

The home insurance will move next year on renewal.

Birtles

Got quote for my house Ins ( have ranger with them also) for €498. Went on-line and plugged in exact same details as my renewal quote and got same policy for €314. even with the 2 months free and 10% on-line, there is a €100 difference. have checked policy Doc's and they are identical. looks like they are hoping a large majority of people just renew. They would prob have an older demographic of customers who this would apply to.

rangler1

Birtles wrote: »

Got quote for my house Ins ( have ranger with them also) for €498. Went on-line and plugged in exact same details as my renewal quote and got same policy for €314. even with the 2 months free and 10% on-line, there is a €100 difference. have checked policy Doc's and they are identical. looks like they are hoping a large majority of people just renew. They would prob have an older demographic of customers who this would apply to.

Paid the main part of my insurance today, house,farm, jeep, quad, etc etc...only increased by €50 on last year

frazzledhome

rangler1 wrote: »

Paid the main part of my insurance today, house,farm, jeep, quad, etc etc...only increased by €50 on last year

Paid in July, no change in premium. We renew all policies at the same time

hiddenmongoose

quote for the jeep went up 250 euro this year from them for no reason,full no claims, didnt even want to know about it on the phone when I asked how they could justify the quote.needless to say they didnt get my money

whelan2

last year my brother bought his first car -at 35 long story- couldnt get insurance, fbd covered him as I had him named on my car years ago. He bought a corsa, got 3rd party fire and theft cover, car was faulty and he got a yaris instead-worth more- when he went to change the cover they gave him comprehensive insurance, roadside assist and 150 euro back

Base price

whelan2 wrote: »

last year my brother bought his first car -at 35 long story- couldnt get insurance, fbd covered him as I had him named on my car years ago. He bought a corsa, got 3rd party fire and theft cover, car was faulty and he got a yaris instead-worth more- when he went to change the cover they gave him comprehensive insurance, roadside assist and 150 euro back

That is the FBD that I used to deal with, flexible, helpful and value for money especially if you were a farmer. As Rangler posted above most farmers children were insured with FBD as other companies were too expensive.
As far as I am concerned they are no longer the company that they used to be and don't seem to care about customer loyalty.

rangler1

Base price wrote: »

That is the FBD that I used to deal with, flexible, helpful and value for money especially if you were a farmer. As Rangler posted above most farmers children were insured with FBD as other companies were too expensive.
As far as I am concerned they are no longer the company that they used to be and don't seem to care about customer loyalty.

The company themselves could say that the customers are showing poor loyalty when FBD is in trouble. I know I owe them the benefit of not leaving them at least for a couple years to give them a chance.

monkeynuz

rangler1 wrote: »

The company themselves could say that the customers are showing poor loyalty when FBD is in trouble. I know I owe them the benefit of not leaving them at least for a couple years to give them a chance.

I don't owe them anything, I've been with them for nine years even though they were always a bit more expensive than other firms but I liked the fact that I could phone my local office but also felt I was doing my bit, but now they are substantially more expensive and whenever I phone I get through to the national call centre I have no qualms in changing providers and have already saved about €400 on car and van insurance with another company.

Unfortunately loyalty should be repaid with loyalty, not the other way around.

orm0nd

Base price wrote: »

That is the FBD that I used to deal with, flexible, helpful and value for money especially if you were a farmer. As Rangler posted above most farmers children were insured with FBD as other companies were too expensive.
As far as I am concerned they are no longer the company that they used to be and don't seem to care about customer loyalty.

FBD didnt want to know about learner drivers when mine were starting , eg €4000 quotes for cover available else where for 1200 , I think I must have insurance with circa 8 to 10 different cos. . each time time an renewal came a new battle began

Loyalty ?? my whole... I was with them since 1972,

for a couple of years we were paying over €25k between vhi farm etc motors

thankfully all mine (offspring) are on their own steam now & some have reverted to fbd , daughter has to carry very expensive test equipment in her line of work , no problem getting cover with fbd where as other cos. it was a non runner.

my premium is due shortly & I've already warned them not to hike it , they won't be getting a second shot at it

I helped buy their hotels and apartments , & always recommended them but have had enough

the renewal notice will decide

rangler1

orm0nd wrote: »

FBD didnt want to know about learner drivers when mine were starting , eg €4000 quotes for cover available else where for 1200 , I think I must have insurance with circa 8 to 10 different cos. . each time time an renewal came a new battle began

Loyalty ?? my whole... I was with them since 1972,

for a couple of years we were paying over €25k between vhi farm etc motors

thankfully all mine (offspring) are on their own steam now & some have reverted to fbd , daughter has to carry very expensive test equipment in her line of work , no problem getting cover with fbd where as other cos. it was a non runner.

my premium is due shortly & I've already warned them not to hike it , they won't be getting a second shot at it

I helped buy their hotels and apartments , & always recommended them but have had enough

the renewal notice will decide

Were they not buying property to comply with regulation, all insurance companies have to have assets to cover extraordinary claims,
I know cases where farmers were covered that shouldn't have been covered and I'm sure there was lots more than I know about.
What about the contribution to the fodder crisis in 2012, there's a brilliant trip given to about 50 farmers every year, they put loads of money into IFA every year,
The farmers that started the company are extremely well treated and like that farmers sons got employment with them at the start.
It's only twelve months since people on here were saying farmers should have their own meat factory...what a joke

Base price

rangler1 wrote: »

The company themselves could say that the customers are showing poor loyalty when FBD is in trouble. I know I owe them the benefit of not leaving them at least for a couple years to give them a chance.

Simple economics forced me to leave. I would be doing a disservice to myself and my business by ignoring the fact that there is better value out there . As I posted previously, I have been a loyal claim free customer for 28 years with house, multiperil, tractor, commercial and private car insurance. They refused to budge on renewal quotation last December

CHOPS01

Have the house and 2 cars with them. Wife's premium came and was well up and house came a week after. Both came to 1130. Told em they either dropped the price our those two would be canceled and my own car next Feb.
Was pleasantly surprised when they came down to 1000. Probably still could have done a little better but good service and loyalty played a part.