The English and their weird fascist nationalism again.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

James McClean refused to stand and face towards the English flag while God Save The Queen was playing today and is now getting dogs abuse from many of the jingoistic English.
He doesn't want to respect the English national anthem, he doesn't want to wear a war poppy, he just wants to play some football. Why do so many English fans and press get so caught up and attack him?
He literally just can't stand there and respect any symbolism that represents forces that murdered people where he lives. The British Army were ruthless towards the people of Derry.

Let the man have his beliefs, they come from a very real place.

http://www.expressandstar.com/sport/2015/07/19/albions-james-mclean-refuses-to-face-english-flag/

... honestly, if it were an Englishman on the Irish team and they didn't do the same to the Irish anthem, there'd be a similar outcry. Let's face it - it'd be true.

Ave Sodalis

Why's he playing for an English football team if he doesn't want to stand for the English National Anthem?

john.han

Deleted User wrote: »

... honestly, if it were an Englishman on the Irish team and they didn't do the same to the Irish anthem, there'd be a similar outcry. Let's face it - it'd be true.

But they'd have no reason to do the same... the Irish nation never did what the British army did in Derry, you've kinda missed the point.

Cantona's Collars

They are stealing our sportsmen,McGregor last week and now the BBC have called Paul Dunne a "Brit".

The Backwards Man

As my granny used to say about the Derry men, 'they're all big fellas until you try to pay their dole in Punts.'

cloud493

Jesus, some boards people have a proper chip on their shoulder about british people and 'the brits'

Hammer89

I don't have a view, but please watch the first minute of that match. The commentator describes Tony Pulis as "one of the best in Europe" and repeatedly refers to them as "the West Bromwich Albion".

Cold War Kid

It's not fair to imply this kind of fanaticism is just an English thing.

It would be the same in the US or Russia.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

Deleted User wrote: »

... honestly, if it were an Englishman on the Irish team and they didn't do the same to the Irish anthem, there'd be a similar outcry. Let's face it - it'd be true.

You've just made up a fantasy situation to counter what's happened.

sup_dude wrote: »

Why's he playing for an English football team if he doesn't want to stand for the English National Anthem?

He plays football for whoever will pay him the most. Why do national anthems, flags, poppies, politics, nationalism ect. come into it?

Dozen Wicked Words

Cold War Kid wrote: »

It's not fair to imply this kind of fanaticism is just an English thing.

No but it's very easy, especially for some here, doesn't take much.

It'll help to fill the void until the build up to the annual November poppy-athon anyway.

Carlos Orange

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo wrote: »

You've just made up a fantasy situation to counter what's happened.

Is this the first time someone used if in your presence?

HandsomeDan

If he feels so strongly about what the English apparently did to Derry, then why play play on their national team?

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Dirty Dingus McGee

HandsomeDan wrote: »

If he feels so strongly about what the English apparently did to Derry, then why play play on their national team?

He doesn't play on their national team.

jimgoose

Tuk err idjits!!

Cold War Kid

sup_dude wrote: »

Why's he playing for an English football team if he doesn't want to stand for the English National Anthem?

HandsomeDan wrote: »

If he feels so strongly about what the English apparently did to Derry, then why play play on their national team?

I Googled - doesn't seem like he does. I could be wrong though - can't keep up with sport.

darkpagandeath

There would be the same outrage If it was an American team and the American Anthem.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

sup_dude wrote: »

Why's he playing for an English football team if he doesn't want to stand for the English National Anthem?

I lost brain cells reading this post.

Ave Sodalis

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo wrote: »

He plays football for whoever will pay him the most. Why do national anthems, flags, poppies, politics, nationalism ect. come into it?

Whatever about the poppy, I agree with him there but he was playing an American team and therefore was representing England by playing with an English team, which is why the anthem was played. I would be very surprised if he didn't know that was going to happen.

Also, if he felt that strongly about it, then it shouldn't matter how much he's getting paid.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

psinno wrote: »

Is this the first time someone used if in your presence?

Nope. But if my auntie had balls she'd be my uncle.

HandsomeDan wrote: »

If he feels so strongly about what the English apparently did to Derry, then why play play on their national team?

He doesn't play on their national team. He regularly plays for Ireland.

mjsc1970

There's 2 minutes of my life ill never get back after reading this thread

Ave Sodalis

Cold War Kid wrote: »

I Googled - doesn't seem like he does. I could be wrong though - can't keep up with sport.

The Honey Monster wrote: »

I lost brain cells reading this post.

An English team, not the English team...

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Oh Lord here we go again. Any excuse to rake up the past and anti British waffle. Life's too short.

We were brought up to respect and honour any national flag or anthem, regardless of our personal bias or political persuasion.

Sheep Lover

I love these threads, it's like a competition for who can be the most righteous, high on their horse PC whore going.

Micky Dolenz

I am horrified and shocked in equal measures.

HandsomeDan

HandsomeDan wrote: »

If he feels so strongly about what the English apparently did to Derry, then why play play on their national team?

I see many of the people queuing up to stick the knife in McLean have a firm grasp of facts.

1. It wasn't 'the English' it was the British Army that carried out systematic repression and the killing of innocent civilians in Bloody Sunday and more.

2. He doesn't play for the English national team. Are you for real?

Dirty Dingus McGee

sup_dude wrote: »

Why's he playing for an English football team if he doesn't want to stand for the English National Anthem?

It's not a requirement.

The only requirement is that he is good enough to play for the team.

I work for a French company but if Le Marseillaise was played I wouldn't stand up for it and I doubt my employers would expect me to.

cloud493

You know, in 6 years living in Ireland as a British person, I have heard/seen anti British rhetoric maybe, once or twice, IRL. On boards, I see it at least a couple of times a month, maybe more. People need to get over themselves and move on.

eet fuk

sup_dude wrote: »

Why's he playing for an English football team if he doesn't want to stand for the English National Anthem?

By that logic anyone who works for any English company should stand for the English national anthem.

darkpagandeath

I hear they eat babies too.

Lemming

Having read that article, what he did was the height of disrespect so he deserves everything he's getting (within legal reason of course ... ). HE is the one who has dragged politics on top of himself instead of standing for a national anthem in an event in which he is taking part. It shouldn't matter whose anthem it is that is being played on that pitch, he should at least stand and show a modicum of civility and token respect.

Absolute clown. And he was doing so well with his perfectly crafted PR letter. Then he goes and does this ...

daisybelle2008

cloud493 wrote: »

Jesus, some boards people have a proper chip on their shoulder about british people and 'the brits'

It's like we have small man syndrome. I spend a lot of time there, the irony is the are very positive about the Irish....but 800 years and all that :rolleyes:.

Alpha Romeo

sup_dude wrote: »

Why's he playing for an English football team if he doesn't want to stand for the English National Anthem?

In my opinion, I think he shouldn't have made it so obvious by turning away, and just let it go over his head. It is asking for trouble.

In reply to what you said. Many clubs in England, and around the world, are made up of many nationalities as I'm sure you know.

Why was the national anthem played anyway?

mrsoundie

He can't be that upset, but he should be when he realises that the income tax he pays to Her Majesty's Government, pay the wages of the British Army.

If he does not like the anthem, then perhaps working for an English team in England is not the wisest.

I do agree with him on the poppy subject, but you must always show respect to any anthem, whether you dislike the country or not.

tonycascarino

I'd guarantee you he doesn't have a problem getting his wages with Liz's face on it. If he's that anti English....

Ave Sodalis

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I work for a French company but if Le Marseillaise was played I wouldn't stand up for it and I doubt my employers would expect me to.

If you went abroad with said company to compete with said company against another company from another country, and the national anthem was playing for the company which you now represent, would you do the same?

Micky Dolenz

cloud493 wrote: »

You know, in 6 years living in Ireland as a British, I have heard/heard anti British rhetoric maybe, once or twice, IRL. On boards, I see it at least a couple of times a month, maybe more. People need to get over themselves and move on.

Quick, get him!!

:pac:

In time I think McLean will be respected for standing up for his beliefs and not caving in to societal pressure.

Reminds me of the story of Muhammad Ali refusing to go to Vietnam because as he put it "no Vietcong ever called me ******". He was ostracised and vilified in the same way McLean is but ultimately emerged as a bit of a hero for not capitulating to the prevailing view of the time.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

Noemi Unsightly Second wrote: »

Oh Lord here we go again. Any excuse to rake up the past and anti British waffle. Life's too short.

We were brought up to respect and honour any national flag or anthem, regardless of our personal bias or political persuasion.

It's not the 'past' my man. I posted something that happened today. I generally love the British btw.

You respect something/someone that gives you respect back, end of. Unwavering respect is for the dumb.

Timberrrrrrrr

darkpagandeath wrote: »

I hear they eat babes too.

FYP for truth

Ave Sodalis

eet fuk wrote: »

By that logic anyone who works for any English company should stand for the English national anthem.

But it's not a company, it's a sports team who were essentially representing the country of origin (i.e. England)

cloud493

Micky Dolenz wrote: »

Quick, get him!!

:pac:

Ooh! Ah, that's it. I'm going to report this to me member of Parliament.

darkpagandeath

hahaha some random soccer player and Muhammad ali used as a comparison Jesus.

Dirty Dingus McGee

sup_dude wrote: »

If you went abroad with said company to compete with said company against another company from another country, and the national anthem was playing for the company which you now represent, would you do the same?

I only represent the company not the country the company is from.I'd imagine they'd have more important things to do than to waste time playing a national anthem and that the company I work for wouldn't force their nationality upon their employees.

It was idiotic that it was played in the first place and all he did was not turn round to face the british flag a flag which isn't his own, he was standing for the anthem.

Dirty Dingus McGee

sup_dude wrote: »

But it's not a company, it's a sports team who were essentially representing the country of origin (i.e. England)

They weren't representing england they were over their to build up their own brand and make money for themselves.

darkpagandeath

darkpagandeath wrote: »

hahaha some random soccer player and Muhammad ali used as a comparison Jesus.

Yes in terms of standing up for your beliefs in the face of adversity. Not in terms of relative sporting success. You know what I meant so give it a rest with the not-so-clever attempt at humour.

Skylinehead

sup_dude wrote: »

But it's not a company, it's a sports team who were essentially representing the country of origin (i.e. England)

No, it's the English national team that does that.

darkpagandeath

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I only represent the company not the country the company is from.I'd imagine they'd have more important things to do than to waste time playing a national anthem and that the company I work for wouldn't force their nationality upon their employees.

It was idiotic that it was played in the first place and all he did was not turn round to face the british flag a flag which isn't his own, he was standing for the anthem.

See how long you will be collecting a pay check in another country if you did that to their flag. Any European country would react exactly the same. Just like people here would.

Ave Sodalis

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

I only represent the company not the country the company is from.I'd imagine they'd have more important things to do than to waste time playing a national anthem and that the company I work for wouldn't force their nationality upon their employees.

It was idiotic that it was played in the first place and all he did was not turn round to face the british flag a flag which isn't his own, he was standing for the anthem.

It's fairly common practice in other sports to play the national anthem when two or more countries come together, even if it isn't the official national teams playing.
Standing for the anthem generally means acknowledging it as opposed to physically stand for it. Which he didn't. If he was playing for an Irish or other country's team and didn't acknowledge it, then it would be rude but not hypocritical. To do it when playing for an English team is, in my opinion, hypocritical and petty and completely pointless.

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

They weren't representing england they were over their to build up their own brand and make money for themselves.

As far as I'm concerned, when a team from one country meets a team from another, each team are representing their country to a certain degree. Obviously, the match organisers agree with this.

mrsoundie

If my memory serves me right, I do remember a certain Mr Martin Johnson standing on the wrong side of a bit of carpet, which caused some righteous indignation.