No notice inspections

Deepsouthwest

What are these?

_Brian

The only two instances i know where these happen are where two close relatives have herds numbers brothers and mother and son.
I know both have been caught on previous inspections with cattle mixed in each other's herds.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

What are these?

It's where a Dept official arrives in the yard without prior notice and carries out a check, eg tagging, pollution, welfare etc.

They normally try to do a few on the one visit but the farmer has the option of postponing the optional ones for a few days/week so only one normally is the no-notice one.

djmc

I had one last year the no notice is for food hygiene and animal welfare and you have the option to postpone the rest but they don't tell you this and generally do a full cross compliance inspection when they call out.

cute geoge

I presume cattle identification is a no notice inspection ,otherwise it makes a mockery of the trouble of keeping tags on cattle.
I heard last year a armchair farmer caught out on a no notice inspection when his neighbours cattle grazing his ground trying to claim they were after just breaking in'
I had a cross compliance inspection a few years ago and the inspector rang just one hour before he arrived ,he rang at 9 in morning and arrived at 10

Sam Kade

cute geoge wrote: »

I presume cattle identification is a no notice inspection ,otherwise it makes a mockery of the trouble of keeping tags on cattle.
I heard last year a armchair farmer caught out on a no notice inspection when his neighbours cattle grazing his ground trying to claim they were after just breaking in'
I had a cross compliance inspection a few years ago and the inspector rang just one hour before he arrived ,he rang at 9 in morning and arrived at 10

Sure you'd hear all sorts of stories, whether they are true or not is another thing. I suppose he was sitting in his blackened armchair like father jack when the inspector arrived

oldsmokey

djmc wrote: »

I had one last year the no notice is for food hygiene and animal welfare and you have the option to postpone the rest but they don't tell you this and generally do a full cross compliance inspection when they call out.

Dead right, its a nasty little stunt they pull, 2 buckos arrived into us last year,one little prick says he's going doing a full inspection - it didnt suit me at the time, and something told me they had to give some notice beforehand - I rang our friends in IFA Dublin and asked the nice man what were my rights - he said they can only do animal welfare and food safety without notice - the remainder of the inspection could be postponed for 48 hours. Thats exactly what i did but our Dept friend didn't like it one little bit..he'd obviously scheduled the full inspection in his day... I think its shameful that they don't spell out the farmers rights /options in this scenario...

farawaygrass

oldsmokey wrote: »

Dead right, its a nasty little stunt they pull, 2 buckos arrived into us last year,one little prick says he's going doing a full inspection - it didnt suit me at the time, and something told me they had to give some notice beforehand - I rang our friends in IFA Dublin and asked the nice man what were my rights - he said they can only do animal welfare and food safety without notice - the remainder of the inspection could be postponed for 48 hours. Thats exactly what i did but our Dept friend didn't like it one little bit..he'd obviously scheduled the full inspection in his day... I think its shameful that they don't spell out the farmers rights /options in this scenario...

I wonder are the dept boyos like the Bord Bia lads in that there are giving a lust of farms to inspect and can come up with their own schedule once they keep on top of their work. If so your probably spoilt a day off on your man!

amacca

what happens with the large number of farmers who have off farm jobs nowadays + out farms etc

probably a stupid question if they are in work on the day (and it could be many miles from farm) , how can an inspector possibly do a zero notice inspection?

djmc

amacca wrote: »

what happens with the large number of farmers who have off farm jobs nowadays + out farms etc

probably a stupid question if they are in work on the day (and it could be many miles from farm) , how can an inspector possibly do a zero notice inspection?

One such farmer told me he got a call one evening that he had an inspection in the morning
He informed the inspector he was quite welcome to come out and do the inspection but he wouldn't be there as he had work and couldn't get a day off from his employer at such short notice.
I think they rescheduled the inspection after that but I assume that they can carry on without the farmer.

rangler1

djmc wrote: »

One such farmer told me he got a call one evening that he had an inspection in the morning
He informed the inspector he was quite welcome to come out and do the inspection but he wouldn't be there as he had work and couldn't get a day off from his employer at such short notice.
I think they rescheduled the inspection after that but I assume that they can carry on without the farmer.

You're right, they can do most of it without you.
TBH an inspection with notice doesn't really reflect what's going on on the farm

cute geoge

rangler1 wrote: »

You're right, they can do most of it without you.
TBH an inspection with notice doesn't really reflect what's going on on the farm

Do creameries and meat factories get no notice inspections?
I ask because i worked in a meat processing factory and the day before any inspection was spent power washing and tidying and Paper work.
There was nothing underhand going on but the best practices was always on show for any inspestion http://b-static.net/vbulletin/images/icons/icon10.png
No notice for food hygine and animal welfare What exactly does this cover ?

mf240

If your in work with the place locked up and the two guard dogs in the yard what can they do.

Not everyone can get a day off work at a moments notice.

rangler1

mf240 wrote: »

If your in work with the place locked up and the two guard dogs in the yard what can they do.

Not everyone can get a day off work at a moments notice.

Did you not sign that you agreed to the T and Cs of the scheme when you applied.

''On applying for payment, an applicant accepts that inspections under the direct payment
schemes may be announced or unannounced. Where inspections are not notified, the inspector
will explain to the applicant or his/her agent the inspection procedure adopted and satisfy
himself/herself that the applicant or his/her representative fully understands it. If the applicant
cannot be present, he/she can be represented by a person of his/her choice.''

At this stage you can't really complain

Reggie.

This is one of the benefits of getting no payments. No inspections

lakill Farm

Reggie. wrote: »

This is one of the benefits of getting no payments. No inspections

no payments here but still be afraid of an inspection . should I be?


Am I restricted to slurry and FYM dates when getting no payments ?

Reggie.

lakill Farm wrote: »

no payments here but still be afraid of an inspection . should I be?


Am I restricted to slurry and FYM dates when getting no payments ?

That I don't know. Can call out all they want anyways

rangler1

Reggie. wrote: »

This is one of the benefits of getting no payments. No inspections

There's a lot of rubbish talked...I've never met an awkward inspector yet.
Going by your pics, you'd fly it

rangler1

lakill Farm wrote: »

no payments here but still be afraid of an inspection . should I be?


Am I restricted to slurry and FYM dates when getting no payments ?

Yes

Farmer Pudsey

amacca wrote: »

what happens with the large number of farmers who have off farm jobs nowadays + out farms etc

probably a stupid question if they are in work on the day (and it could be many miles from farm) , how can an inspector possibly do a zero notice inspection?

The no notice is mostly to do with cattle identification. They will have maps of all you land declared on area aid and can check identy of cattle by reading numbers and also they are looking for any untagged cattle. I think you are allowed 2 in the first 50 and 1/50 there after. They will be on to you about single tags but in general thsi is not an issue. The other thing they are looking for are unregistered calves. It is one thing leaving a calf in the rushes for 3-4 weeks. However there was a lad down in cork caught with yearling's as well as calves unregistered about 4-5 years ago.

djmc wrote: »

One such farmer told me he got a call one evening that he had an inspection in the morning
He informed the inspector he was quite welcome to come out and do the inspection but he wouldn't be there as he had work and couldn't get a day off from his employer at such short notice.
I think they rescheduled the inspection after that but I assume that they can carry on without the farmer.

When he notified the inspector that he was unable to get time off work this is the same as insisting on you rights. The inspector then had to reschedule he could however stll do the no notice part of the inspection.

rangler1 wrote: »

You're right, they can do most of it without you.
TBH an inspection with notice doesn't really reflect what's going on on the farm

Look we all have things out of place a bit now and again. In general it only gives you a chance to collect and make sure paperwork is right etc.

mf240 wrote: »

If your in work with the place locked up and the two guard dogs in the yard what can they do.

Not everyone can get a day off work at a moments notice.

They can still check cattle in fields off your farm maps.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Farmer Pudsey wrote: »

The no notice is mostly to do with cattle identification. They will have maps of all you land declared on area aid and can check identy of cattle by reading numbers and also they are looking for any untagged cattle. I think you are allowed 2 in the first 50 and 1/50 there after. They will be on to you about single tags but in general thsi is not an issue. The other thing they are looking for are unregistered calves. It is one thing leaving a calf in the rushes for 3-4 weeks. However there was a lad down in cork caught with yearling's as well as calves unregistered about 4-5 years ago.



When he notified the inspector that he was unable to get time off work this is the same as insisting on you rights. The inspector then had to reschedule he could however stll do the no notice part of the inspection.



Look we all have things out of place a bit now and again. In general it only gives you a chance to collect and make sure paperwork is right etc.





They can still check cattle in fields off your farm maps.

Should be fun to watch if the bull is running with them:D

Nettleman

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Should be fun to watch if the bull is running with them:D

bull sign.jpg

AP2014

Do you have to have the Farm Satety notice sign up? I have none on my farm, never had an inspection either.

whelan2

Reggie. wrote: »

This is one of the benefits of getting no payments. No inspections

know someone who gets no payments and gets inspected very often- all deserved- wonder though how can they be penalised if they get no payments

lakill Farm

whelan2 wrote: »

know someone who gets no payments and gets inspected very often- all deserved- wonder though how can they be penalised if they get no payments

explain the" all deserved " part with examples

Just so we can learn, not ripe parts off them

whelan2

lakill Farm wrote: »

explain the" all deserved " part with examples

Just so we can learn, not ripe parts off them

not registering calves until they are a few months old and then running in to problems when the cow calves the next year and they go to register calves. For a few years all animals where just let run wild . Theres also animal welfare issues

Reggie.

whelan2 wrote: »

know someone who gets no payments and gets inspected very often- all deserved- wonder though how can they be penalised if they get no payments

I wonder also

Reggie.

whelan2 wrote: »

not registering calves until they are a few months old and then running in to problems when the cow calves the next year and they go to register calves. For a few years all animals where just let run wild . Theres also animal welfare issues

I've no time for lack of animal welfare

whelan2

Reggie. wrote: »

I've no time for lack of animal welfare

last time i was talking to them-which was a while ago as i fell out with them:rolleyes:- the dept said they could call in at any time and walk around as they please.

rangler1

Reggie. wrote: »

I wonder also

You can be fined, a lot of cross compliance rules are legislation now, ie nitrates directive, pollution control....winding them up is like winding up the guards...you probably won't win

Sheep breeder

the unannounced inspections are the full cross compliance and the map acre cases and inter mixing of herds,
as for as stated earlier once you sign the sps form you are agreeing to inspections and when you signed up for the herd number you had to name an agent to work on your behalf if unavailable,
i agree with rangler a waste time winding them up as they will still do the inspection,
a neighbour of ours 4 years ago got the call for a cross compliance inspecion he told the guy to f off and would not go ahead with the inspection, the guy called to the house and left him a form stating a nil payment for the year and two weeks later the inspectors boss rang him and told him to let the inspection go ahead the worst result he would get would be a 20 per cent cut, again told the guy to f off as he already had got his first payment, a month later got a letter stating a nil payment for two years, the double f off cost him two years money and now he will have inspection at any time,

MrMuscles96

2 weeks ago at about 10 to 1 the auld lad got a phonecall that we were up for inspection and that he was in our area. 1 o clock he landed up and looked at everything. Depth of slatted shed, measurements of the shed, the handling yards, land we cleared 2 years ago, tags of cattle and sheep. We had to bring in the ewes so he could take their tags nos. 70% of the flock i think it was. Then looked at all the dispatch dockets and that.. Didn't leave till half 4

oldsmokey

MrMuscles96 wrote: »

2 weeks ago at about 10 to 1 the auld lad got a phonecall that we were up for inspection and that he was in our area. 1 o clock he landed up and looked at everything. Depth of slatted shed, measurements of the shed, the handling yards, land we cleared 2 years ago, tags of cattle and sheep. We had to bring in the ewes so he could take their tags nos. 70% of the flock i think it was. Then looked at all the dispatch dockets and that.. Didn't leave till half 4

I hate that - every other lowlife in the country gets 'his rights' and is handled with kid gloves - the farmer is treated like a donkey from the outset...surely you should be informed that you have the option of postponing the large bit of the inspection for 48 hrs?

MrMuscles96

oldsmokey wrote: »

I hate that - every other lowlife in the country gets 'his rights' and is handled with kid gloves - the farmer is treated like a donkey from the outset...surely you should be informed that you have the option of postponing the large bit of the inspection for 48 hrs?

Ah in all fairness we could have left it till the next day but while help was on hand we thought we we'd better off doing it there and then

merryberry

oldsmokey wrote: »

I hate that - every other lowlife in the country gets 'his rights' and is handled with kid gloves - the farmer is treated like a donkey from the outset...surely you should be informed that you have the option of postponing the large bit of the inspection for 48 hrs?

U have rights when it comes to an inspection...farmers charter. Recently updated. Check dafm or ifa website for latest version

Base price

We got notice at 3pm on a Tuesday that a cross compliance inspection was taking place the following day at 10am.
We were told that the inspection was triggered because we had sold over 100 animals.
Two inspectors arrived, one stayed with me in the office looking at paperwork (herd & remedies register, movements) and the other went with OH checking cattle, tags, facilities etc.
I lost a days work (self employed) but that was my decision as I deal with the paperwork and preferred to be there during the inspection to answer any queries/questions.
In fairness to the inspectors they were courteous, friendly and afferable.

mf240

Most of the department lads are sound enough in fairness.

Theres one local lad here thats fairly well disliked but hed be a prick no matter what job he was in.

Its all fine saying about your rights and this and that but we all know your only making hassle for yourself going down that road.

Base price

mf240 wrote: »

Most of the department lads are sound enough in fairness.

Theres one local lad here thats fairly well disliked but hed be a prick no matter what job he was in.

Its all fine saying about your rights and this and that but we all know your only making hassle for yourself going down that road.

+1
If you keep everything in order then you have nothing to hide or worry about.

frazzledhome

Base price wrote: »

+1
If you keep everything in order then you have nothing to hide or worry about.

That's the holy all of it. Even if a few things aren't right or correctly recorded they move on and point it out.

If they see that a good effort or being made you've nothing to worry about. Most inspections can be passed in the office.

We have a simple way for medicines, clip board in parlour, calf sheds, jeep and calving box with Pre printed columns for animal id, date, drug, vpa, batch and expiry. Even this will satisfy if not recorded in computer. We also clip scripts to these boards

http://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/new-tagging-tolerances-allowed-under-farmers-charter/

Buford T. Justice XIX

frazzledhome wrote: »

That's the holy all of it. Even if a few things aren't right or correctly recorded they move on and point it out.

If they see that a good effort or being made you've nothing to worry about. Most inspections can be passed in the office.

We have a simple way for medicines, clip board in parlour, calf sheds, jeep and calving box with Pre printed columns for animal id, date, drug, vpa, batch and expiry. Even this will satisfy if not recorded in computer. We also clip scripts to these boards


http://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/new-tagging-tolerances-allowed-under-farmers-charter/

Wasn't the whole purpose of the prescription to reduce paperwork by keeping the script and you wouldn't have to enter the useage into the remedies book unless it was given to an animal not written on the script?

Instead we have the same regulations as before just with more paper to keep track of?

dzer2

Young lads here have app on phone they take pics of animal and medicine when we are doing it. I down load to computer and once a month fill out form great yoke.

rangler1

dzer2 wrote: »

Young lads here have app on phone they take pics of animal and medicine when we are doing it. I down load to computer and once a month fill out form great yoke.

Yea was surprised to see frazz using pen and paper, OH does it all here on the phone

frazzledhome

dzer2 wrote: »

Young lads here have app on phone they take pics of animal and medicine when we are doing it. I down load to computer and once a month fill out form great yoke.

Do you down load straight to computer or copy to computer. Problem here is up to 4 different people may be administering meds.

We have herd downloaded onto phones from IFC but all it took was one not to input to mess it up. Will stay old school for a while yet

dzer2

frazzledhome wrote: »

Do you down load straight to computer or copy to computer. Problem here is up to 4 different people may be administering meds.

We have herd downloaded onto phones from IFC but all it took was one not to input to mess it up. Will stay old school for a while yet

Download to computer There are 3 here administering also the golden rule is spray calf when done we have a different colour for each of us and never treat someone elses calf without consulting me.

I haven't had an inspection here in ages after the dog episode But Bord Bia every 18 months and have very little paper its all on the computer

frazzledhome

dzer2 wrote: »

Download to computer There are 3 here administering also the golden rule is spray calf when done we have a different colour for each of us and never treat someone elses calf without consulting me.

I haven't had an inspection here in ages after the dog episode But Bord Bia every 18 months and have very little paper its all on the computer

What's the app?

dzer2

frazzledhome wrote: »

What's the app?

memo on a samsung phone

Deepsouthwest

When inspecting cattle tags, cards etc. do u have to put every animal through a crush or do they just count them in the field and count the cards?

Buford T. Justice XIX

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

When inspecting cattle tags, cards etc. do u have to put every animal through a crush or do they just count them in the field and count the cards?

Any inspection i had involved putting them ALL through the crush, even the young calves, the fekkers:mad:

frazzledhome

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

When inspecting cattle tags, cards etc. do u have to put every animal through a crush or do they just count them in the field and count the cards?

Never had to here

whelan2

frazzledhome wrote: »

Never had to here

or here, i'd say it just depends on the inspector

lakill Farm

what happens if you have a parcel of land without a cattle crush? like a rented outfarm ? and they want to read all the cattle that day