Tipping Away...

Outside

Over the last…nearly 12 months actually I haven’t really had a target race so anytime someone would ask me “You still running?/How’s training?/Any mad runs recently” the response had always been “Ah good, just tipping away really…”. Which is exactly what I have been doing, just “tipping away”.

But “tipping away” no more!

My last targeted race was Back in July which wasn’t really a race at all, Lakeland 100 in UK. Last year was the year of the Ultra for me and enjoyed training and completing some fantastic events along the way, Donadea 50k, Connemara Ultra, Portumna 100, Wicklow Way Solo and finally Lakeland 100 in July. All in the first half of the year. So possibly I did too much (for me anyway, I know there’s lads/lassies doing these thing day in day out) and after Lakeland I was out of sorts really as to what to do next so just ended up taking it pretty easy, went to a few club sessions but found myself aimlessly running intervals, threshold runs and competed in a few XC runs with the club (Galway City Harriers) but my heart was never fully committed and didn’t really have any great performances to comment on. Just hadn’t the motivation or more importantly the discipline.

So after following a few training logs here for a while and watching club members performances going from strength to strength, I’ve decided I’d like in on this PB action.

I started running in 2011 to loose weight/get fit and my very first race was Streets of Galway 8km in 34:34. Since then I trained on my own and completed Connemara Marathon then joined GCH and have been running on and off since on road, trails, track and mountains.

Current PB’s:

• 5k: 17:06 Galway 5k series 2013
• 10k: 36:56 Galway Bay 2013
• Half: 1:20:29 Galway Bay Half 2012
• Full: 2:57:42 Dublin 2012

So times do not makes any real sense. I haven’t done a lot of 5k/10k racing. Funnily enough, even after all the Ultra escapades, my 5km time seems to be the best of the lot but haven’t done anything in the mean time to improve on that and doing a lot of the longer events, I‘ve probably done more damage than good! But hopefully it won’t be too hard to work my way back, I must have some sort of speed hidden in my legs somewhere.

I’m based in Galway, 29 y/o M with a long term goal of getting a marathon time I’m happy with and hopefully being able to proudly represent GCH in a few races along the way too.

So without further ado, first goal: Dublin City Marathon 2015.

Outside

I haven't exactly done no running in the past while either. All easy runs with nearly all my running from running to work 3-4 times/week, 5mi each way so a nice distance for easy runs.

So I've consistently been keeping up 30-40 MPW with a week off here and there.

So should have some sort of base going into the plan which speaking of is: Jack Daniels 2Q 18 week 60MPW. I've had a good look around at a few different plans but this is the one that will hopefully suit me best. I see from other training logs around these parts it seem to work well for a lot of people so hopefully I'll find the same. I can get the 2Q sessions in and then still use running to work to rack up the Easy runs, and a few strides thrown in here and there for good measure.

So nailing my colors to the mast: I'd ideally like a <2:50:00 marathon in Dublin which is possibly a little optimistic give my easy running the past 6 months but sure worth a shot. I have another card up my sleeve though, Dublin 2012 is my official PB but during Conn Ultra 2014 I went through the full in 2:52:xx and then died a slow death for the last 13 miles so went out far far too fast but my own fault for following a faster club mate and sticking with him until the full. So I reckon I have a sub 2:50 in me for sure, just need to encourage the legs to be able for that pace again.

Outside

Last week was a little of testing the water so:

Monday REST (great start!)
Tuesday 8mi E 6:58
Wednesday 4mi E 7:10
Thursday 6.9mi E@7:48 w10x100m strides and 5.9 mi E@7:10
Friday 5mi E@7:28
Sat 9.8mi with 3.1mi 5km Park-run (19:02)
Sun JD Week 1 Q1: 1E, 6M, 1E, 6M, 2E - continuous!
Decided I'd start program 1 week early to give me a little lee way later on in the plan (4 weddings and turning 30 before DCM!). From having my goal marathon goal of 2:50 that give me a VDOT of 57 and as JD states if that is a goal VDOT then I need to do first 6 weeks at VDOT(goal)-2 so my VDOT for first 6 weeks of plan is going to be 55 (I hope this all makes sense).
So
E:7:54
M:6:43
T:6:20
I: 87s400m
R: 81s400m

So it went: 1mi@7:31, 6mi@6:45, 1mi@8:01 6mi@6:45, 2mi@7:37

To be honest it went better than I expected. I had the 5km from the previous day so knew that wouldn't have helped but still managed to get close to target paces.

I'll keep with this VDOT for the first 6 weeks and see how the Q sessions will build up in the legs.

metamorphosis

You def. have a faster marathon time in you from your original post.

Your half and marathon times are not far from what i am looking to hit later this year so will be following this log to see how things progress for you.

Outside

metamorphosis wrote: »

You def. have a faster marathon time in you from your original post.

Your half and marathon times are not far from what i am looking to hit later this year so will be following this log to see how things progress for you.

Cheers for following. Ya it's only recently from reading through a lot of log's here I'm really seeing the advantage to keeping one up to date to track progress and also to share good/bad(more importantly) experiences with the wealth of knowledge that is boards.

Any advice on where I'm going completely wrong or how I could improve something would be greatly appreciated, I'm sure I'll have plenty of questions as the plan progresses.

Outside

Monday 15th
Rest
Tuesday 16th
6.5@7:32/min, 10xhill strides (about 18/19s each), 2.3@7:44/min
Hill efforts were comfortably hard, trying to keep good form. Legs felt heavy on the way home.
Wednesday 17th
E 4@7:39/min
Wet wet wet.

Outside

Thursday 18th
Plan: 8E - 3T - 3rest - 2T - 2E
Turned out to be:
8@7:50/min
3@6:13/min avgHR 177
5:20min rest (meant to be 3min but stomach giving out, sorry for warts and all account but thank god for that portaloo on the prom, must be the early mornings, I'll get used to it hopefully)
2@6:08/min avgHR 176
1@7:51 (I was sure it was 1 mile warm down, got back home, stopped watch to see 14 mi, thought session was 15 mi?! So just forgot 1 mile at the end. Cycling to work straight after anyway so that should help warm down.)
All in 14 mi
Such nice weather this morning, route took me from the prom in Galway to Dangan pitches along the Corrib, finishing up again on the prom, couln't beat it with a stick...well for the first 8 miles anyway, once those T runs begin a bomb could go off and I doubt I'd notice. It did leave me wondering am I doing these T runs a little too hard but %HR-wise it about 86% which is actually below JD's 88-92% of max recommendation. I don't fancy going harder than that for a while so I'll stick with that effort for now.

Outside

Friday 19th
5E w/8x100m strides

JD 18WTG Summery: 47.8 mi and both Q sessions completed.

Saturday 20th
JD 17WTG Q1
2E@7:31/min - 3T@6:04/min - 60minE@7:31/min - 1T@6:08/min - 1.7E@7:38/min (16mi Total)
Session went well, a lot easier than 1st weeks Q1 session. 1st T run was with the wind so a little faster than should have been but kept the effort. Unlike last week, I had a quick bowl of porraige about 30mins before run. This helped towards end of session for sure. So probably obvious but must have a little food before these Q sessions in future.
Sunday 21st
4.6E@7:09/min
Soaked but had a strong wind with on the way back home...nice.

Galway Track and Field 5000m on Tuesday so going to replace Q2 with that hence the early Q1.

I already like the fact you pick when to fit in these Q sessions and do your own E running when you can around that.

Outside

Monday 22nd
Rest

Tonight Galway County Track and Field takes place so gonna give the 5000m a lash. If my predicted marathon time is 2:50, JD predicts my 5km time as 17:49. PB is 17:06 so might slpit the difference and see where I'm at. I'll give 17:30 a go. That's 84 sec laps.

Outside

Tuesday 23rd - Galway County Track and Field 5000m
E 4.3mi jog to race and warm up - 5000m in 17:22 (5:35's) - E 5.4mi warm down and jog home

Happy with that. I went out targeting 17:30 and was able to pick it up slightly towards the end. Fairly wrecked after it but expected. I don't think I had anymore in me, that was an almost all out effort towards the end. One guy went passed on the last lap and hadn't anything to hang on, pity. Hopefully getting this JD marathon plan under the belt will help with speed and if I survive Dublin in Oct I can target Cross Country and get some proper speed training done. But for now, all roads point to a 2:49:49 Dublin Marathon hopefully!

5000m splits:
1km: 3:28
2km: 3:27
3km: 3:31
4km: 3:31
5km: 3:26

This was my Q2 session this week so E running for the rest and Q1 on Saturday morning hopefully. Planning on a few beers Saturday night so better get it out of the way!

Outside

Wednesday 24th
Run-muting today so 5.3 miles E and 4.5 mi home. Shorter distance on home route due to the weather being so nice, ended up grabbing a pint at the Spanish Arch with the better half. Couldn't beat with a stick. Gotta make most of good weather when its about!

Legs pretty wrecked today from 5km effort last night. Glanced at pace but not going to comment. Pace on way home closer to 7:30/min but still feeling very tough. Hopefully legs better tomorrow, not too much more E miles to run for the week and it's my next Q1 on Saturday morning, their not long coming around!!

Outside

Thursday 25th
3E@7:08/min - 10x20sec hill reps - 3E@7:38/min

Legs a little better today, felt great on the way out to the hill only to realize on the way back there was a substantial wind with me. You never notice it when your running with the wind!

I think that's my prescribed 48 miles for the week for JD so another week down! Phew!

Saturday morning it begins again with Q1 - 16miles E/120mins.

Outside

Friday 26th
Rest
Saturday 27th 16mi
JD 16WTG Q1 - E 16@8:29/min
Very easy long run. A guy interested in doing a bit of ultrarunning contacted the club and forward on details to me. Said I was heading out for a 2hr run on Saturday morning so can chat properly then if interested. Lots of running/galway talk so 2 hours flew by. Didn't watch pace at all. Last couple of miles on my own and 7min/mi felt good. Good to have company on the long E ones.

Outside

Sunday 28th
Extremely hungover...no running.

Monday 29th - 10.8mi
AM: E5.3@7:33/min
PM: E5.6@7:13/min
A LOT of sweating done, hangover improved.

Tuesday 30th - 4mi
E4@7:15/min +10xStrides
Lovely morning, warm with a nice strong breeze.
Hangover gone, yay!

Q2 tomorrow...oh o.

ThebitterLemon

What races if any are you targeting in advance of DCM?

TbL

Outside

Hi TbL,

There should be a Galway 10km Championship coming up later this year so hopefully I'll make that.
I'm missing the Streets of Galway this year again with a wedding the same weekend, pity.

Nothing too much planned yet but Athlone Flatline fits in well so will hopefully do that and possibly Galway Bay Half Marathon but thats only 3 weeks from Dublin so possibly too close to race and might just run it as a marathon paced long run.

I'd like to fit in more racing and hopefully will. With the Jack Daniels plan he encourages racing and just skip the Q2 session and do the Q1 session mid-week. I like it's flexibility.

Outside

Wednesday 1st - 14.6 mi
Q2 for the week so:
6@7:33/min - 3@6:05/min - 3min E - 2@6:15/min - 2min E - 1@6:03/min - 2@7:27
Nice mixed sessions so after the first 6mi easy, the session flew by. The 2 at T pace felt pretty hard. Tough to keep concentrating on moving arms and keeping good form without slacking off. Speaking of, the one thing I'm noticing after the first few weeks of this is how much of a work-out my arms and shoulders are getting. The past 6 months of easy running has really left me lacking in the upper body dept. Come on the supercompensation!

Instead of just working off pace, I kept an eye on HR and used JD's recommendation fo 88%-92% of Max. For me this works out somewhere between 180 and 188 so tried to keep it there thereabouts.
Avg HR for T's:
3T: 180
2T: 181
1T: 183

Enjoyable but glad to have that over.

Outside

Thursday 2nd - 5mi
E 5@7:17/min

Friday 3rd - 4.4mi
E 4.4@7:36/min + 10 x Strides

Saturday 4th - 17mi
JD 15WTG Q1: 2E - 8M - 1E - 3M - 2E
2@7:34/min - 8@6:36/min (HR171) - 1@7:48 - 3.1@6:43/min (HR175) - 2.9@7:22/min
Session went well. Early brekkie, a few stretches and out the gap by 8:30. Used the pitches and trails around Dangan so possibly the pace suffers a little with all the twists/turns and gravel/humps but it's a nice route and I've a nice 4mi loop planned out. If I keep my HR in the early 170's it seem to correspond to a comfortable marathon pace and hopefully pace will improve to my actual marathon pace as the training ticks by. Ideally 6:31 for 2:49:59 marathon. On the 2nd marathon pace effort I ended up running into Gary (2:18 marathoner) on an easy run and he joined me so plenty of chatting done during my MP effort. Ended up just over the planned 3 mi but nice to have the company, sound man. Pretty tired after the 2nd MP effort and the jog home was a little longer than I expected and ended up running 1 mile extra on very tired legs. Glad to get home by the end of it but a good session under the belt I felt. I wonder when I need to start thinking of gels? better consult the Bible (JD's running formula).

Sunday 5th - 4.7mi
E 4.7@7:52/min
After the long run yesterday, off we headed to a friends holiday caravan out in Ballyconneely so a BBQ and one or two (about 6 or 7) beers were had in the smashing weather. This morning I trotted off around the beaches a little "foggy" to clear the head and ended the run with a very fresh dip in the Atlantic. Nice.

Outside

Monday 6th - 10.4 mi
E 10.4@7:39/min
Legs pretty heavy at the start of this and was torn between a rest day or running so decided on 30 mins E and see how it goes. After 30 min out in Dangan I ended up meeting a few lads from the club also on easy runs so jogged around chatting with them and before I knew it I had been running for an hour so made my excuses and jogged the 2 mi back home to make 10.4 miles. Legs felt better at the end of that run so happy with that.

Wedding on Friday so probably try do Q1 of next weeks on Friday morning which means I've a nice bit to do before then if I'm to keep on track. I might push one of my easy runs from this week to Saturday to make up the miles, not too sure it'd be a good idea to try squeeze it all in before Friday and then do one of JD's specials. We'll see. I'll try get this weeks Q2 done tomorrow morning before work. Legs feeling a little more tired than usual this week than the past few weeks so this is where it gets interesting.

Outside

Tuesday 7th - 0 mi
Rest, weather was muck anyway.

Wednesday 8th - 14.4 mi
This weeks Q2: 40min E - 3x (2T - 2min rest) - 2x (1T - 1min rest) - 1E
Finished up with: 5.1@7:57/min - 2@6:02/min - 2@5:58/min - 2@6:14 - 1@5:59 - 1@5:55/min - 1.1@7:54
Avg. HR for T runs: 179, 180, 179, 177, 180
Not easy, not easy at all, I wonder in sticking to my HR am I doing these T sessions too hard? I suppose legs are going to be tired from previous runs anyway so I'm sure these are meant to be tough. Fitting in next weeks Q1 on Friday morning might be a little much, I'll see how legs are tomorrow.

AuldManKing

Nice log detail so far.

Was there a reason you chose this Daniels plan over other Daniels plans or even P&D?

Your easy pace seems to fluctuate by from low 7's to high 7's - maybe take the easy portions of the runs easy (high 7's) to prevent additional tiredness.

I've been enjoying the exploits of one of your GCH comrades. http://www.beermatt.blogspot.de/
Some progress by this lad over the years.

Outside

Hey AuldManKing,

It's the 3rd edition of the book I have in front of me and for the marathon plans he has a good selection - novice, 2Q, 4 week, 5 week, 18 week and 12 week.

The 2Q plan seemed to be a good entry point and is a plan that a nice few people here have already followed to good success. Briefly reading through both JD's book and P&D I found them both very interesting but what pipped it for JD was the flexibility of the plan. 2 "quality" sessions a week and then do your own easy running around that so I can still use the odd day for running to work, running with friends not caring about pace.
Ya your right, I think I might reign in my E pace a little, he stresses on keeping E days easy so that could bite me in the arse down the line.

Matt's blog is a great read, very nice guy too so always willing to share info and help out. He's the perfect example of "consistency is key" over the years. He does lactate threshold testing now too and by training mostly through these threshold runs he's making serious progress recently. I haven't felt the urge to get this done myself yet. I'm sure just following a structured plan is going to get me big improvements so possibly if I start plateauing I'll get tested properly define my correct training zones. For now JD's VDOT will do.

Thanks for following!

ThebitterLemon

Outside,

I've no personal experience with any of Daniels plans but I've spoken to a lot of people that either got injured or burned out from his plans, and I'd agree with AMK that you're easy stuff should be done real easy.

Hope it works out for you.

Every time I'm in Dangan lately I'm looking around for a young lad flakin into a Daniels session

TbL

Outside

Thanks TBL, session this morning was on the prom but if there's any inkling of wind I'll take my run to the sheltered quite corner that is Dangan! We'll cross path's for sure and probably have already!

Ya I'll be keeping careful eye on the state of the legs, I can see how fatigue is building already. Next week has a little less mileage so should provide some relief.

I see you have a 2:55 target in mind, great stuff, we'll have to do a few sessions together for sure.

ThebitterLemon

I'd be a bit off you're pace, I've a 3.05 PB, but I'm hoping to see some decent improvement on this cycle. I'll keep an eye on here and when I've built back up a bit I'd love to join you for one of your easier sessions.

TbL

youngrun

Outside wrote: »

Tuesday 7th - 0 mi
Rest, weather was muck anyway.

Wednesday 8th - 14.4 mi
This weeks Q2: 40min E - 3x (2T - 2min rest) - 2x (1T - 1min rest) - 1E
Finished up with: 5.1@7:57/min - 2@6:02/min - 2@5:58/min - 2@6:14 - 1@5:59 - 1@5:55/min - 1.1@7:54
Avg. HR for T runs: 179, 180, 179, 177, 180
Not easy, not easy at all, I wonder in sticking to my HR am I doing these T sessions too hard? I suppose legs are going to be tired from previous runs anyway so I'm sure these are meant to be tough. Fitting in next weeks Q1 on Friday morning might be a little much, I'll see how legs are tomorrow.

Tough session mayb a bit too quick? is it threshold or tempo pace I would see the latter as faster
Big variation in pace here 20 seconds per mile 5.55-6.14

Outside

Hey youngrun,

Meant to be a threshold run but possibly got caught up with HR a bit too much and ignored pace. For my planned VDOT this cycle T pace should be 6:20 and JD gives a guideline HR. If I follow the HR I get in or around 6:05/min as above give or take for wind, dogs etc. Possibly more important to concentrate on hitting 6:20/min and ignore HR?

Thanks for the feedback

youngrun

Outside wrote: »

Hey youngrun,

Meant to be a threshold run but possibly got caught up with HR a bit too much and ignored pace. For my planned VDOT this cycle T pace should be 6:20 and JD gives a guideline HR. If I follow the HR I get in or around 6:05/min as above give or take for wind, dogs etc. Possibly more important to concentrate on hitting 6:20/min and ignore HR?

Thanks for the feedback

Hard to know maybe you are aiming too low re VDOT and heart rate means you should be running towards a faster goal ?

Outside

youngrun wrote: »

Hard to know maybe you are aiming too low re VDOT and heart rate means you should be running towards a faster goal ?

VDOT is target VDOT-2 at the moment if that makes sense so VDOT is probably a little low as to where I currently am but it's a long road ahead and will be incrementing VDOT as training progresses every 6 weeks. I'll play it by ear but I don't see my goal target changing too much. It's more of a stepping stone to a good spring marathon then hopefully so don't want to push it too much. Speed-wise from my 5km time recently I'm good so just got to concentrate on the long efforts and getting through them in one piece.

Outside

Thursday 9th - 4mi
Nice and easy 4@7:56/min
Legs fairly wrecked at the start but gradually came around towards the last mile. Can really see the benefit of E runs for recovery rather than a day off. Depends on the type of fatigue I suppose. Legs needed some sort of stretching for sure.

Friday 10th - 17mi
Realistically I wasn't going to be able to fit this in properly for the rest of the weekend so chanced it today.
JD 15WTG Q1 - 1E - 2x(2T w/2min rest) - 60minE - 2T - 1E
Ended up with: 1.6@7:37/min - 2@6:11 - 2@6:10 - 60min@7:39 - 2@6:24 - 1.5@7:44

I was happy with how the legs loosened up from yesterday morning 4 miler so said I'd chance this session. Fairly apprehensive to say the least going into this but seemed to work out OK, just about. 1st and 2nd T runs were actually not too bad. Didn't look at HR so instead I just went by feel and made it a comfortably hard effort. Surprised by the pace by the end of those. By the end of the 60mins though, legs were like jelly. Really should have brought a gel or something as after 90mins of running I was fairly pooped and still a 2 mi T run to go. So the 60min ticked by and then I just launched myself into the final 2mi T run. Again ignored HR and instant pace around the pitches in Dangan is useless on the garmin so just went on feel. This felt hard and I knew I wasn't hitting my target either. Glanced at Gamin for current pace but it was reading 4:40min/mi? Well thats helpful. So just put the head down and continued out the trail towards NUIG with a slight headwind. Usually I might give passer by's a nod or friendly hello but not now, head down just concentrating on moving arms. Finished up with 12:47 for the 2mi so 6:24/min. Happy to have that over but slightly outside target of 6:20.

Jogged home, raided fridge and sitting here typing this. Wedding to attend to day so one or two pints are def in order after that week. The Siege of Ennis later is my next session, should be interesting if my legs are still like this.

ThebitterLemon

Great session this early in your cycle.

TbL