glyphosate ban date

mikeecho

What date will the ban* on the sale of Glyphosate (roundup/gallup etc) come into effect ?

I'm looking to stock up, and monsanto have emailed me to say that roundup will have a 7 to 8yr shelf life.
So i'm looking to buy it at pretty much the last minute so that i can get the freshest batch.




*licence required to buy

monkeynuz

mikeecho wrote: »

What date will the ban* on the sale of Glyphosate (roundup/gallup etc) come into effect ?

I'm looking to stock up, and monsanto have emailed me to say that roundup will have a 7 to 8yr shelf life.
So i'm looking to buy it at pretty much the last minute so that i can get the freshest batch.




*licence required to buy

No ban, the licence is only required if you are using it commercially.

solargain

30 November , you need a licence to buy it after that. You will be able to buy 1 ltr carton without a licence , licence for any larger quantity

lazybones32

You won't need a license to buy herbicides but you will need one to buy anything over 1 litre of product. More specifically, whoever sells you more than 1 litre of chemical will need your license number, so they can show exactly where the product has gone, ie; it has been sold to someone who has been trained in the safe use of pesticides/herbicides.
It looks like the 1 litre bottles that will be available for public use will be diluted.

Marhay70

You can buy weedkillers which contain pelargonic acid and are organic and biodegradable. Quite expensive presently but costs may come down with more sales.
Very effective and quicker acting than Roundup.

Qualitymark

Roundup weedkiller banned from French garden centres over 'probable' link to cancer

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/roundup-weedkiller-banned-from-french-garden-centres-over-probable-link-to-cancer-10319877.html

France has announced a ban on over the counter sales of a brand of weedkiller from garden centres after the active ingredient was classified as "probably carcinogenic to humans" by the UN.

The UN’s International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC) classified glyphosate in March as "probably carcinogenic to humans", and is the active ingredient in Roundup.

Marhay70

Marhay70 wrote: »

You can buy weedkillers which contain pelargonic acid and are organic and biodegradable. Quite expensive presently but costs may come down with more sales.
Very effective and quicker acting than Roundup.

What are the trade names of weed killers with this active ingredient?

_Brian

Tha availability or not of chemicals after the introduction of the new regulations is not base on the size of the container.

The department have listed chemicals as either Amature or Professional depending in the active ingredient and the concentration of same. If your chemical is listed as Professional then a liscence will be required to purchase it, if it's Amature then it can be purchased in any quantity.
I'm on the phone, but I can post a link to the website later on.

Qualitymark

Deleted User wrote: »

What are the trade names of weed killers with this active ingredient?

Here's one http://www.johnstowngardencentre.ie/p/earth-matters-natural-weedkiller/em_weedkiller

You're not supposed to spray it near edible plants within 24 hours of eating.

Marhay70

Suresanders, on my phone so can't link. The one I've used is Neudorff Fast Acting Weedkiller. It retails for about E25/litre for concentrate or E8 for 750ml dilute. Should be readily available.

deandean

This ban is politically inspired rubbish.
I am still using Gramaxone, I appear to be aok, when was that banned?
Drinking water from plastic bottles probably leads to 1000 fold ingestion of toxins compared to a once yearly spray of roundup on your vege patch..

Qualitymark

deandean wrote: »

This ban is politically inspired rubbish.
I am still using Gramaxone, I appear to be aok, when was that banned?
Drinking water from plastic bottles probably leads to 1000 fold ingestion of toxins compared to a once yearly spray of roundup on your vege patch..

That's your choice. And I'm sure you have good scientific backing for your statement that drinking water from plastic bottles gives you a thousand times as much poison as a yearly spray of Roundup.

I don't personally like using oil from plastic bottles - wouldn't worry so much about water. But when I see a world body of doctors warning on a pesticide made by a company far more wealthy and powerful than that doctors' body, I take notice.

I also don't like drenching soil with weedkillers because of its effect on the 'microherd' - the vast number of helpful bacteria living in the soil and, with the earthworms and other beasties, helping the plants to grow.

magicbastarder

deandean wrote: »

I am still using Gramaxone, I appear to be aok, when was that banned?

your extensive research has me convinced.

Qualitymark

This reminds me of similar chats when organo-phosphates were first theorised to be dangerous. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organophosphate_poisoning The BBC early-morning farming programme had many pieces about it, with farmers talking about memory loss and confusion after dipping sheep without protective clothing. They banged on about it for a couple of years, and meanwhile farmers and gardeners were using the deadly stuff. I don't like to think how much early Alzheimer's was caused by it.

blackbox

deandean wrote: »

This ban is politically inspired rubbish.
I am still using Gramaxone, I appear to be aok, when was that banned?
Drinking water from plastic bottles probably leads to 1000 fold ingestion of toxins compared to a once yearly spray of roundup on your vege patch..

Gramoxone (paraquat) is very poisonous in concentrate form. It was restricted to reduce poisonings, not because of any damage to the environment.

As far as I am aware Roundup is not generally considered to be poisonous.

Calahonda52

How about rack of jellyfish:
http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jun/23/french-authorities-investigate-gm-jellyfish-lamb-sold-as-meat-in-paris

mikeecho

Just an Update, i've stocked up with 2x20L of Glyphosate, that should keep me going for a few years.

BTW, i paid the extra for Roundup, as it seemingly has a longer shelf life (i mailed monsanto, and the makers of Rosate and Gallup etc)

Roundup has a shelf life of 7 to8 years, while the others have 3 to 5 yr shelf life

mikeecho

mikeecho wrote: »

Just an Update, i've stocked up with 2x20L of Glyphosate, that should keep me going for a few years.

BTW, i paid the extra for Roundup, as it seemingly has a longer shelf life (i mailed monsanto, and the makers of Rosate and Gallup etc)

Roundup has a shelf life of 7 to8 years, while the others have 3 to 5 yr shelf life

How will you be storing it for the few years?

mikeecho

[Deleted User] wrote: »

How will you be storing it for the few years?

Well, I have some 5l containers of Gallup and Rosate, that I'll use up this year and next.
Then I'll start on the 20l containers of roundup.

So I reckon I'll have a 6 or 7yr supply of glyphosate.

After that, there should be a relatively potent and cost effective alternative available.

(I might even get another 20 or 40l before the restrictions kick in)

Edit. Just noticed what the actual question was.

I'll be storing it indoors in a well insulated garage, where the temp will never drop below freezing ( unless we have a repeat of the winter of three years ago)

And it will be on an industrial shelving unit, on the top shelf along with my other most toxic chems away from harms way.

but where will you store it? The reason I ask is that if the temperature drops below -10 degrees the glyphosate will crystalize and loose its effectiveness. If we to have a really bad winter what would you do. Bring it into the house and store it there?

mikeecho

[Deleted User] wrote: »

but where will you store it? The reason I ask is that if the temperature drops below -10 degrees the glyphosate will crystalize and loose its effectiveness. If we to have a really bad winter what would you do. Bring it into the house and store it there?

I doubt we'll get -10 in this county, but if we do, I'll take your advice and bring it indoors

mikeecho

mikeecho wrote: »

I doubt we'll get -10 in this county, but if we do, I'll take your advice and bring it indoors

we did in 2010 and 2011. Glad your able to save yourself a few quid

deandean

I would ignore any best before date on roundup.
In reality it doesnt lose its potency under normal (Irish) storage conditions. Buy enough now, your next of kin will be keeping your grave clear with the stash!!

mikeecho

deandean wrote: »

........ Buy enough now, your next of kin will be keeping your grave clear with the stash!!

mikeecho

Qualitymark wrote: »

That's your choice. And I'm sure you have good scientific backing for your statement that drinking water from plastic bottles gives you a thousand times as much poison as a yearly spray of Roundup.

I don't personally like using oil from plastic bottles - wouldn't worry so much about water. But when I see a world body of doctors warning on a pesticide made by a company far more wealthy and powerful than that doctors' body, I take notice.

I also don't like drenching soil with weedkillers because of its effect on the 'microherd' - the vast number of helpful bacteria living in the soil and, with the earthworms and other beasties, helping the plants to grow.

Interesting... I gave my property a good dosage of rosrate recently, and in the following days I noticed a few dead/dieing bees around the place.

Might be coincidence, but it won't stop me from using glyphosates anytime soon..

Btw, am I better off getting the 20l containers or the 5l containers.

I reckon I use about 5 to 7l a year.
I'm just wondering about storing glyphosate in an unsealed drum over a 2 or 3yr period

lazybones32

Went about applying for my license 2 months ago. On the Dept. website there is the option to apply in writing using a downloadable form, or you can apply using the online form. I filled in the online form. A week later, I got a reply e-mail with my reference number.
Last week I got an e-mail saying that to complete the next step of the process, I must print off the downloadable form, fill in the information (that I've already supplied) and send it off to them.

I can't help but get the feeling that this whole thing exists primarily to give someone a job.

elsie1b

deandean wrote: »

I would ignore any best before date on roundup.
In reality it doesnt lose its potency under normal (Irish) storage conditions. Buy enough now, your next of kin will be keeping your grave clear with the stash!!

Dont worry,it will only break down into harmless substances when it hits the soil.....

deandean

Well I stocked up today, 20 litres of Roundup at €55 per 5L container! The generic stuff was all sold out. I wonder why.

This must be a sales bonanza for Monsanto. This stupid (IMO) new rule has caused massive stockpiling of weedkillers in houses and sheds throughout the country hence the risk to Joe Public is actually increased.

deandean

deandean wrote: »

Well I stocked up today, 20 litres of Roundup at €55 per 5L container! The generic stuff was all sold out. I wonder why.

This must be a sales bonanza for Monsanto. This stupid (IMO) new rule has caused massive stockpiling of weedkillers in houses and sheds throughout the country hence the risk to Joe Public is actually increased.

I don't agree. the amount of people I see going around with a knapsack and no mask spraying in poor conditions. people need to be trained. Take for example this question. after spraying do you take your clothes of and wash them or wear a spray suit. Any chemical residue on them can be very harmful to pregnant women.

You have fellas going around for the day in the clothes with chemicals on them. clueless to the harm they might be causing

lazybones32

deandean wrote: »

Well I stocked up today, 20 litres of Roundup at €55 per 5L container! The generic stuff was all sold out. I wonder why.

This must be a sales bonanza for Monsanto. This stupid (IMO) new rule has caused massive stockpiling of weedkillers in houses and sheds throughout the country hence the risk to Joe Public is actually increased.

The 20L drum costs about 160.

Although measuring out 100mls from a 20L drum is more trouble than it's worth.

deandean

lazybones32 wrote: »

The 20L drum costs about 160.
Although measuring out 100mls from a 20L drum is more trouble than it's worth.

Yea I looked at the 20L container. I decided to pay for convenience by paying extra for the 5L containers..
Any time I siphon from the car I end up witb a mouthful of diesel.

elsie1b

You are being sarcastic ?

mikeecho

These taps are handy for dispensing from 20/25l drums.
They cost about €3 - 5

deandean

elsie1b wrote: »

You are being sarcastic ?

No I am not being sarcastic.

The appropriate phrase is

dramatic irony.

elsie1b

Dramatic irony occurs when the audience knows something the characters do not.
Mouthful of diesel.
Mouthful of roundup.
Both cause cancer.

mikeecho

lazybones32 wrote: »

The 20L drum costs about 160.
.

Co-op superstore near me is selling roundup 5L for €39
And 20L drum for €130

The generic versions are cheaper again, but I opted for roundup as it has a longer shelf life.

gctest50

elsie1b wrote: »

Dramatic irony occurs when the audience knows something the characters do not.
Mouthful of diesel.
Mouthful of roundup.
Both cause cancer.

be grand

mikeecho

I was in the chemical store of my local co_op recently. ( the drums of chems were too heavy for the girls to lift) and I noticed that their stocks of glyphosate were well down on this time two years ago.

Looks like they have reduced their stocks significantly of 5l's and they didn't have a huge amount of 20l's either.

It's definitely time for the unlicensed joe soap to stock up.

monkeynuz

mikeecho wrote: »

Co-op superstore near me is selling roundup 5L for €39
And 20L drum for €130

The generic versions are cheaper again, but I opted for roundup as it has a longer shelf life.

Is that for the pro biactive? If so that is very cheap.

mikeecho

monkeynuz wrote: »

Is that for the pro biactive? If so that is very cheap.

Roundup xl

It's a concentrate, don't have it near me to check

mikeecho

monkeynuz wrote: »

Is that for the pro biactive? If so that is very cheap.

It's this stuff

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/331591539680

Sorry if posting that link breaks any rules..

If so, mods please delete

elsie1b

gctest50 wrote: »

be grand

You can always get someone to say the truth , for money.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-y_N4u0uRQ

laoch na mona

would I be in the minority in actually being happy about this new law

elsie1b

We probably are in a minority.

_Brian

People need to relax..
There is no restriction on the likes of Gallup..

Panic buying large volumes of chemicals to be stored in rickedy old wooden garden sheds probably poses a bigger risk than the chemicals themselves..

If anyone is interested in facts..
HERE is the link to the register of pesticides. All chemicals listed as amateur will have no restriction to their purchase.

Agricultural commercial chemicals should only be handled by someone with some level of training, this makes perfect sense..

Doubt.It

That link's not working I'm afraid. The error seems to be with their server.

In fact I can't find any solid details about this licensing restriction anywhere. All I know is that someone in my family heard something on the radio, and now they all think they have to either get a college degree in biochemistry or go weeding by hand again.

johnb25

Doubt.It wrote: »

That link's not working I'm afraid. The error seems to be with their server.

In fact I can't find any solid details about this licensing restriction anywhere. All I know is that someone in my family heard something on the radio, and now they all think they have to either get a college degree in biochemistry or go weeding by hand again.

I have just used the link; working ok.

recedite

_Brian wrote: »

People need to relax..
There is no restriction on the likes of Gallup..

Panic buying large volumes of chemicals to be stored in rickedy old wooden garden sheds probably poses a bigger risk than the chemicals themselves..

If anyone is interested in facts..
HERE is the link to the register of pesticides. All chemicals listed as amateur will have no restriction to their purchase.

Agricultural commercial chemicals should only be handled by someone with some level of training, this makes perfect sense..

So there are two Gallups on the list there; "Home and Garden" which is full strength 360g/litre glyphosphate, but only available in a 1 litre bottle. So this corresponds with the info on page one of this thread (saying a 1 litre limit).

The other Gallup listed there is called "Gallup Biograde Weedkiller RTU" which is pre-diluted at 7.2g/litre with some of the most expensive water you will ever buy

There is another Gallup called "360" produced in 5 litre containers which is not listed. But if and when it is listed there, presumably it would be listed for "professional use", just like the equivalent Roundup is.

recedite

_Brian wrote: »

Agricultural commercial chemicals should only be handled by someone with some level of training, this makes perfect sense..

Its all the same chemical, its the quantity really that is being restricted for amateurs. Which still makes some sense, but less.
Its like being allowed to buy prescription drugs without a prescription, but one tablet at a time.

recedite

Mind you, if money was no option, maybe you could buy a crate of one litre amateur bottles? One law for the rich and another for the poor... again :pac:

recedite

recedite wrote: »

Mind you, if money was no option, maybe you could buy a crate of one litre amateur bottles? One law for the rich and another for the poor... again :pac:

Or you could just do the course which I have seen is down to €100. In last weeks Mayo News