looking to start up my own Business

tonyheaney

As the heading says i am looking to start up my own Business. I would be retail and dealing with the public. I have never done this and i want to know what measures are in place to help people get off the ground. what kind of funding is offered and social welfare payments entitlements do i revive?

Mrs OBumble

Are you on social welfare at the moment?

People you could talk to include your Local Enterprise Office.

Help!!!!

tonyheaney wrote: »

As the heading says i am looking to start up my own Business. I would be retail and dealing with the public. I have never done this and i want to know what measures are in place to help people get off the ground. what kind of funding is offered and social welfare payments entitlements do i revive?

If your on social welfare over 12months you can do the back to work enterprise allowance.....100% social welfare payments for first year 75% for second year

tonyheaney

Yes job seekers allowance did a 4.5 year ce scheme and at the end i was left high and dry. I feel i need to take control of my life wasted enough of it and its time to pull my socks up. The thing is i don't have a lot of catalpal and im afraid of what happens if it goes belly up as i have 2 young kids so a family to take care of,

Help!!!!

tonyheaney wrote: »

Yes job seekers allowance did a 4.5 year ce scheme and at the end i was left high and dry. I feel i need to take control of my life wasted enough of it and its time to pull my socks up. The thing is i don't have a lot of catalpal and im afraid of what happens if it goes belly up as i have 2 young kids so a family to take care of,

Yeah you should be ok to do the back to work enterprise allowance then.
You need to go to your local welfare office to get the form, you will then need to do a business plan. They should have someone you can speak to

professore

tonyheaney wrote: »

Yes job seekers allowance did a 4.5 year ce scheme and at the end i was left high and dry. I feel i need to take control of my life wasted enough of it and its time to pull my socks up. The thing is i don't have a lot of catalpal and im afraid of what happens if it goes belly up as i have 2 young kids so a family to take care of,

Yes it's tough alright - biggest problem I have with being self - employed is that if my business goes belly up, I'll be left waiting at least 12 months for any social welfare - whereas if you sit on your ass doing nothing you get it straight away. After 12 months I'd be long homeless.

It's a tough road, but is rewarding if it works. I'd swap any grants for the ability to get social welfare like any normal person if my business went under.

jimmii

Its not cheap to start up in retail what exactly where you planning? Its also incredibly tough and there is little funding other than BTWEA. Your Local Enterprise Office is the best place to start they run a start your own business course which is definitely worth doing there is some small funding you can get a voucher to help pay for online and same if you are looking to export and plan on going to trade shows abroad.

Help!!!!

professore wrote: »

Yes it's tough alright - biggest problem I have with being self - employed is that if my business goes belly up, I'll be left waiting at least 12 months for any social welfare - whereas if you sit on your ass doing nothing you get it straight away. After 12 months I'd be long homeless.

It's a tough road, but is rewarding if it works. I'd swap any grants for the ability to get social welfare like any normal person if my business went under.

Why would you have to wait so long?

tonyheaney

Help!!!! wrote: »

Yeah you should be ok to do the back to work enterprise allowance then.
You need to go to your local welfare office to get the form, you will then need to do a business plan. They should have someone you can speak to

meant to say i finished January 16th so i think i may fall short

Help!!!!

tonyheaney wrote: »

meant to say i finished January 16th so i think i may fall short

Are you still on JSA? How long have you been?

tonyheaney

jimmii wrote: »

Its not cheap to start up in retail what exactly where you planning? Its also incredibly tough and there is little funding other than BTWEA. Your Local Enterprise Office is the best place to start they run a start your own business course which is definitely worth doing there is some small funding you can get a voucher to help pay for online and same if you are looking to export and plan on going to trade shows abroad.

Phone repair and phone sales like phone, phone covers and such. I know there are a good few in carlow and there is an Asian lad after opening up on Kennedy ave but i have to do something

tonyheaney

Help!!!! wrote: »

Are you still on JSA? How long have you been?

Finished CE scheme on January 16 got JSA on 19th January

DoYouEvenLift

tonyheaney wrote: »

Yes job seekers allowance did a 4.5 year ce scheme and at the end i was left high and dry. I feel i need to take control of my life wasted enough of it and its time to pull my socks up. The thing is i don't have a lot of catalpal and im afraid of what happens if it goes belly up as i have 2 young kids so a family to take care of,

Help!!!!

tonyheaney wrote: »

Finished CE scheme on January 16 got JSA on 19th January

Qualifying periods
Periods of time spent in FET and Failte Ireland training courses, Community Employment, Tús, Social Economy Programme, Job Initiative, Rural Social Scheme, VTOS, Teagasc, FIT and Back to Education Schemes are accepted as qualifying periods provided you were entitled to a qualifying payment before starting on the study or training. The Department of Social Protection also counts time spent on the Community Services Programme provided you were getting a qualifying social welfare payment for at least half of the qualifying period.

jimmii

tonyheaney wrote: »

Phone repair and phone sales like phone, phone covers and such. I know there are a good few in carlow and there is an Asian lad after opening up on Kennedy ave but i have to do something

That shouldn't be too expensive as long as you can find a unit that doesn't need too much work. Best to check that there is enough demand stand outside each of their shops for a couple of hours see how many people are going in and out and how many look like they have bought something. There are really good margins in phone accessories but you need to get a lot to be able to make sure you have something for the majority of phones people will bring in. I can't stress enough how important it is to the do the research first it will safe you a lot of time in the long run.

tonyheaney

DoYouEvenLift wrote: »

Dont understand your meaning

tonyheaney

jimmii wrote: »

That shouldn't be too expensive as long as you can find a unit that doesn't need too much work. Best to check that there is enough demand stand outside each of their shops for a couple of hours see how many people are going in and out and how many look like they have bought something. There are really good margins in phone accessories but you need to get a lot to be able to make sure you have something for the majority of phones people will bring in. I can't stress enough how important it is to the do the research first it will safe you a lot of time in the long run.

i was considering the old O2 store or the shop beside the meteor store

Help!!!!

Where are you planning on opening?

professore

Help!!!! wrote: »

Why would you have to wait so long?

You have to provide 12 months of accounts showing you have made no money at all and are completely out of business.

Since presumably the last year you were in business you were making SOME money, even if it was only a few thousand, you would be seen to be going through a "rough patch" and still self employed.

Remember there's no FIS for self employed people - Revenue seem to think it's no problem to have an income of € 1000 for a full year coming into a family home if you're self employed "sure aren't they all stacking it up in offshore accounts"

Maybe you can get some emergency from the HSE in the meantime, I don't know. Maybe someone who's had the misfortune of going through this can advise.

DoYouEvenLift

tonyheaney wrote: »

Dont understand your meaning

If you're looking for capital to start a business, it's important to be able to spell it first.

tonyheaney

DoYouEvenLift wrote: »

If you're looking for capital to start a business, it's important to be able to spell it first.

Hmm i see, :rolleyes: so to to clarify, lets say crystal clear so we have no misunderstanding, being slightly dyslexic i should stay at home and do some daytime TV and just live off the state? Is that what you are trying to get across? :eek: Its a good thing im not completely disabled then i might as well top myself as i probably wouldn't be able to open the door let alone a business. By the way i got a good on-line app that auto corrects this message for you so as not to offend you with my bad spelling mistakes.

LOL :D

Help!!!!

DoYouEvenLift wrote: »

If you're looking for capital to start a business, it's important to be able to spell it first.

Never made a spelling mistake? Must be great to be so perfect

tonyheaney

sorry i just saw this and cound'nt resist hahahaha

tonyheaney

anyhow i am thinking if i could be next to a main dealer in phones like three, vodafone or meteor it could help as that's were my main customer bas could be

Help!!!!

tonyheaney wrote: »

anyhow i am thinking if i could be next to a main dealer in phones like three, vodafone or meteor it could help as that's were my main customer bas could be

Whereabouts are you planning on opening?

jimmii

tonyheaney wrote: »

i was considering the old O2 store or the shop beside the meteor store

That seems like a good spot but I would imagine it wouldn't come cheap.

tonyheaney

Help!!!! wrote: »

Whereabouts are you planning on opening?

i have a few ideas i was thinking about next to cash for gold as it could generate business there or on potato market with the major phone retailers, or tullow street by meteor all have heavy traffic flow and all have something in common with what i have in mind. Its all on paper stage for now so just throwing out feelers.

Help!!!!

tonyheaney wrote: »

i have a few ideas i was thinking about next to cash for gold as it could generate business there or on potato market with the major phone retailers, or tullow street by meteor all have heavy traffic flow and all have something in common with what i have in mind. Its all on paper stage for now so just throwing out feelers.

Do you have enough capital to pay rent & rates for approx. 6months? + stock?
Have you thought about going to one of the shops & asking if they have space they would rent you on a weekly basis
As you said there are a few round Carlow town so if you can keep your overheads down you keep your prices down.

Geniass

Your business model would be to buy mobile phone related stuff cheap and sell it without adding any value and have a great enough Gross profit to cover O/Hs (Rent, rates, insurance, electricity, advertising)... and pay a living wage.

I'd say it would be very tough. You'd need a very high footfall near you, and that will cost rent wise (i.e. close to a Vodafone store).

Not trying to knock your initiative, but be careful, you'll be signing up to a rental contract which may have implications if your business is not successful.

To be a further negative nelly, you might need to convince the land lord your business idea is workable. He wont want to let to someone that's going to close down in a few months time.

Are you going to limit your liability by operating a company?

This tread could possibly benefit from being transferred over to the entrepreneur forum.

tonyheaney

Geniass wrote: »

Your business model would be to buy mobile phone related stuff cheap and sell it without adding any value and have a great enough Gross profit to cover O/Hs (Rent, rates, insurance, electricity, advertising)... and pay a living wage.

I'd say it would be very tough. You'd need a very high footfall near you, and that will cost rent wise (i.e. close to a Vodafone store).

Not trying to knock your initiative, but be careful, you'll be signing up to a rental contract which may have implications if your business is not successful.

To be a further negative nelly, you might need to convince the land lord your business idea is workable. He wont want to let to someone that's going to close down in a few months time.

Are you going to limit your liability by operating a company?

This tread could possibly benefit from being transferred over to the entrepreneur forum.

Hi Geniass

Yes as i mentioned above its all on paper and im looking at all angles, as you said there more to lose then gain here if it all goes belly up.

Can i ask in regards to convincing the land lord your business idea is workable. I have a friend recently in Waterford who was turned down by perspective landlords when he told them what he planed to do. Can a landlord refuse him on the grounds of his business?

The plan is maximum profit on maximum footfall given the nature of what i have in mind. Id have one person doing all the repairs in back and me on the front of house. I am also thinking of incorporating an on-line order service too so as to maximise profits. I know that the on-line side of the can easily start with out an external premises but I'm literally spring boarding all ideas to see if what i plan is viable. Plus i have no experience in business. The closest i have ever come was working as an assistant manager of several pubs in the uk when i was younger (10 years go).

jimmii

The Landlord can do whatever he want its his property. Some Landlords will be reluctant to lease a property to a new company and if you are going for a property along with someone who is already trading you are going to need to put in a pretty convincing argument. When we were looking for our first unit we ran into that a lot.

Mrs OBumble

Geniass wrote: »

This tread could possibly benefit from being transferred over to the entrepreneur forum.

Thanks Geniass, good post.

I wondered about transferring it when I first saw it, but thought that we'd get some more information from the OP first rather than foisting a total dreamer on them. Since the OP clearly is doing research etc, I'm going to move it after making this post.

/mod-note



OP, I'm not trying to be mean here - but 4.5 years on on a CE scheme? That's a very long time to be sitting in job-you-have-when-you-don't-have-a-job. Did you apply for lots of other jobs during that time and not get them? Have you addressed why you didn't get them? Were you doing some training or something else on the side (eg childcare of young children) which was keeping you busy instead?

Being self employed is a LOT harder than working in a paid job, and if you're not succeeding in getting paid jobs then I'd worry that you'll struggle with the sheer amount of work and problem-solving that a self-employed person needs to do.


Definitely try the Local Enterprise Office.

Also, talk to the people in Welfare. I don't think that all the advice posted here about getting nothing for 12 months if the business fails is 100% accurate, especially for means-tested benefits. But welfare are the best people to advise you.

Help!!!!

tonyheaney wrote: »

Hi Geniass

Yes as i mentioned above its all on paper and im looking at all angles, as you said there more to lose then gain here if it all goes belly up.

Can i ask in regards to convincing the land lord your business idea is workable. I have a friend recently in Waterford who was turned down by perspective landlords when he told them what he planed to do. Can a landlord refuse him on the grounds of his business?

The plan is maximum profit on maximum footfall given the nature of what i have in mind. Id have one person doing all the repairs in back and me on the front of house. I am also thinking of incorporating an on-line order service too so as to maximise profits. I know that the on-line side of the can easily start with out an external premises but I'm literally spring boarding all ideas to see if what i plan is viable. Plus i have no experience in business. The closest i have ever come was working as an assistant manager of several pubs in the uk when i was younger (10 years go).

I would really recommend doing a start your own business course run by the local enterprise office 75euro.
Don't want to knock you but I cant see you making a living & paying some ones wages as well.
Have you seen the guy in the Fairgreen shopping centre selling the phone covers? You would be better off starting with something like that. If the overheads are not too bad

skibum

Would you consider doing a course with these guys:
http://www.igniteireland.com/

6 months, they go through everything involved in setting up a business, well worth the time

jimmii

Help!!!! wrote: »

I would really recommend doing a start your own business course run by the local enterprise office 75euro.
Don't want to knock you but I cant see you making a living & paying some ones wages as well.
Have you seen the guy in the Fairgreen shopping centre selling the phone covers? You would be better off starting with something like that. If the overheads are not too bad

€75! Jaysus its €200 here! Definitely worth the money!

tonyheaney

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Thanks Geniass, good post.

I wondered about transferring it when I first saw it, but thought that we'd get some more information from the OP first rather than foisting a total dreamer on them. Since the OP clearly is doing research etc, I'm going to move it after making this post.

/mod-note



OP, I'm not trying to be mean here - but 4.5 years on on a CE scheme? That's a very long time to be sitting in job-you-have-when-you-don't-have-a-job. Did you apply for lots of other jobs during that time and not get them? Have you addressed why you didn't get them? Were you doing some training or something else on the side (eg childcare of young children) which was keeping you busy instead?

Being self employed is a LOT harder than working in a paid job, and if you're not succeeding in getting paid jobs then I'd worry that you'll struggle with the sheer amount of work and problem-solving that a self-employed person needs to do.


Definitely try the Local Enterprise Office.

Also, talk to the people in Welfare. I don't think that all the advice posted here about getting nothing for 12 months if the business fails is 100% accurate, especially for means-tested benefits. But welfare are the best people to advise you.

Hi Mrs OBumble

Firstly thanks for the great advice to you and all here today. Regarding the 4.5 years. I worked in Delta with special needs and i only have a level 5 FETAC. The FAS supervisor there was meant to have me on courses so that by the time i finished i would be at least an 8 FETAC. This never happened sadly however as he kept cancelling courses for oner reason or another apparently money and funding was the biggest killer. I was told there was money/ there was no money. There are a few home issues that also stood in the way.

As for starting up a business i know the 12 month rule is actually a thing and I know i can keep 100% of my JA year one 75% year two and year three its 50%.

Help!!!!

tonyheaney wrote: »

As for starting up a business i know the 12 month rule is actually a thing and I know i can keep 100% of my JA year one 75% year two and year three its 50%.

There is no year 3

DoYouEvenLift

tonyheaney wrote: »

Hmm i see, :rolleyes: so to to clarify, lets say crystal clear so we have no misunderstanding, being slightly dyslexic i should stay at home and do some daytime TV and just live off the state? Is that what you are trying to get across? :eek: Its a good thing im not completely disabled then i might as well top myself as i probably wouldn't be able to open the door let alone a business. By the way i got a good on-line app that auto corrects this message for you so as not to offend you with my bad spelling mistakes.

LOL :D

I just submitted this post to Oxford dictionary to be used as a picture perfect example of both 'hyperbole' and ' misconstrue'.


Rofl @ someone even being capable of drawing those conclusions from my post. I'm not even mad, I'm impressed. I'll be even more impressed if you manage to succeed in opening your business so I genuinely wish you luck!

Axwell

Lads, the post wasn't originally on this forum so previous posts aren't mine to mod but it's on this forum now though so lets cut out the nonsense and the handbags, this isn't a spelling test.

Tony as posted above you can only get payments for up to 2 years, there is no third year. See the rates section towards the bottom.

http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Enterprise-Allowance-Self-Employed.aspx

tonyheaney

Axwell wrote: »

Lads, the post wasn't originally on this forum so previous posts aren't mine to mod but it's on this forum now though so lets cut out the nonsense and the handbags, this isn't a spelling test.

Tony as posted above you can only get payments for up to 2 years, there is no third year. See the rates section towards the bottom.

http://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Enterprise-Allowance-Self-Employed.aspx

Cheers Axwell much obliged

pedronomix

You have no money, no assets and I am sorry to say, no chance. You have no track record to support any application. Focus on getting a job to sustain your young family, you are being fed fasle hope by well meaning people on here that is simply fantasy.

Lau2976

I have to agree with the poster above. Opening a business required time and the ability to give it 100%

Taking in this, while raising a young family, IMO would be insane. I run my own business (although not retail) and I couldn't imagine doing it with young children if I had no experience, no capital and no market gap.

I would suggest applying to courses, as other posters have mentioned, or trying to get practical help off of business owners before you even consider taking in this massive challenge.

pedronomix

That you feel "left high an dry" after 4.5 years on a CE scheme says it all. Did you ever hold down a proper job for a meaningful period? I see no evidence that you have either the work ethic or the skills to run any business. Do let us know how you get on.

tonyheaney

pedronomix wrote: »

That you feel "left high an dry" after 4.5 years on a CE scheme says it all. Did you ever hold down a proper job for a meaningful period? I see no evidence that you have either the work ethic or the skills to run any business. Do let us know how you get on.

Re: My FAS supervisor is no longer a supervisor after what he did
Re: I did run my own pub for 3 yeas (didn't mention personal circumstances prevent me)
RE: I worked for Mitchells & Butlers for 5 years successfully thanks you,

There is no need to start a slagging match, i have other factors behind me and many options ahead of me. I may not reveal all but i have my reasons. Boards was helpful in handing out helpful advice while others dish out harsh sentences before ive even begun.

I have a H-dip in social studies and classroom assistant if i wanted to go down that Route but for now id like to try my hand at some thing new, If you wish to slag me off don't,

Mrs OBumble

tomheany, one of the reasons that I hesitated in moving this thread here from Work and Jobs is that the peadro's and friends give excellent advice - but do tend to be quite blunt about it. Personally I love that they don't mess people around or give false hope. Sometimes I think it sounds more hostile than it's meant to be - but running a business needs toughness, so I think that this is good for people, too.

I think you should do one of the courses that have been suggested here. (Try to get Welfare / FAS - whatever they're called now - to pay for it).

It's quite likely you will come to the conclusion that your current business plan isn't going to work: as well as income for your family, you need capital for stock and key-money for a premises, and the rent on a well-enough located premises to get customers is going to be quite high. Technology is changing all the time, too, so there's lots of learning to be done all the time, and new stock to be investing in. Many people start businesses like these, and lots fail.

The fact that you have managed a business before certainly does stand in your favour. It means that you do know more about running a business and customer service (including dealing with difficult people) than your previous posts suggested.

Hopefully during the course you will be able to look at other possible businesses and business models, and find one that will work for you.

pedronomix

If you think we are harsh, wait till you try the real thing!! The Christian Brothers did one great life preparation, who ever said life was fair?! If an idea does not stand up to a bit of testing in forums like this, it has no chance in the real world. Put something into the public domain, only the naive would be expect to be showered with posies.

jimmii

I love how this forum doesn't take any crap its one of the best things about it. People come in here with their half arsed ideas hoping the forum users can make a business out of it and then get offended when people tell them not to bother. Anyone who easily gets offended here is going to need much thicker skin if they want to survive out their in the real business world no one there is going to be your friend there either. Criticism of an idea is the best thing you can get at the start as you can take that and fine tune what you have to make it as strong as possible listen to what people are saying and come back with something bigger and better. When people do come here with the right mindset and a good idea people are very supportive people aren't just saying these things for no reason they know from experience what it takes to go it alone.

protelos

I must say I have been somewhat critical in the past of the initial reaction of some posters here about shooting people down in an instant. I was quite surprised by this when I started frequenting this forum many moons ago.

I thought that this forum would be an inspiring place where stupid ideas could be thrown around without initial ridicule, God knows we have enough of that in Ireland in every pub and coffee shop.

It is not naivety that makes me post in a slightly optimistic manner (The Brothers gave me those life lessons too), but that this is an entrepreneurship forum. Everywhere you go you hear people say SME’s are the backbone of the country etc… so places like this should be places for direction for aspiring business folk.

I don’t think anyone on here thinks it will be a walk in the park to do something on their own plus telling someone they are not going to make it/ridiculing them is not really constructive.

Chances are you won’t make it this time, the first business I ran was an embarrassment to commerce, but I learned more there than any of my other vast experiences.

OP, I commend you for taking the steps to go it alone and provide for your family. Many very successful people do say that the drive to provide was one of their biggest reasons for success!!

I do think there is a opening in this area! But I always think there is a way to take other people’s business!! My experience of this business in Asia and the US is that the people that own these places count themselves as engineers and top quality guys! It may not be true but perception is reality!! For example I went into a place to get an Iphone fixed and I was told the certified Iphone 5 guy was off today!

Location in this industry might not be as big a factor that you think! If you are known as the wizz in terms of fixing sh*t, I am sure dudes will go two or three streets to get it done.

In terms of branding I would go for something strong, like you are building a work class retail centre. As much as I am indifferent to Niall O Farrell, I do remember a great story about when he changed his branding: that he was sick of being known as the guy up the road who does suits.

I would go easy on the accessories, the shops in my home town are like a 7/11 they have so much stock. It might be hard to find you balance as these upsells will be important! But good analysis on stock will show you what is selling! The crowd, Gophermods (google it, i can't post links apparently) are my local guys where I now live and you cannot move in their shop on a Saturday morning, and it’s not central or cheap!!


As stated many times it won't be easy and many people wouldn't take it on!

pedronomix

http://www.gophermods.com/ This country is overrun with bods doing this type of service and the OP apparently has bar experience. It would die a death in a small town like Carlow!. All the official lipservice to SMEs being the backbone of the economy is largely political BS and has duped half the nation into thinking they are entrepreneurs. Import from China/sell online or open a coffe shop. Ireland is generally a small oversupplied marketplace with low ability to support the kinds of businesses that prosper in the US, probably due to the huge service demand of the typical American with some disposable income.
This forum is an Enterprise and Business Management not a nursery playground for wannabe business owners, there are plenty of other places to shoot that kind of stuff. Serious interested posters get some great advice, messers get roasted and to be fair, largely to thiri ultimate benefit. Putting a positive spin on dog's doodoo still leaves you with dog's doodoo and perhaps a lot poorer. To fail here still attracts a large stigma and we are rather parochial as a nation.

protelos

I tend not to agree with you on the SME front, there is no doubt that SME’s are an integral part of any economy. Granted to sell the dream to every is not a good idea.

Of course we do not spend like they do in the US but this business exists and someone will open one of these shops in the next 4 months and will survive.

My main points in this post and others is: difference in execution. Be it a coffee shop, a retail store, a pub, a takeaway. There will always be one that will do things a bit different and succeed.

As for this specific business I have never had a pleasent experience in any of these shops. They are poorly furnished, overstocked and have no appeal to be loyal. In other cases they are guys working from their home or a cheap renovated office.

There are many example of people that have done things against conventional wisdom and survived. It may not be this round, but I will keep believing that it can be done and keep supporting anyone who shows initiative to do so!

The OP might not be there now, but I know nothing about his/her drive and determination and expertise so who am I to judge credentials and other aspects of someone’s idea.

I personally would not undertake any business venture without at least doing a water-tight business plan so for sure I see the OP’s operation is up against it!

pedronomix

Without detailed Irish market and demographic knowledge you would "tend" to misunderstand. Missmatched transplants tend to result in fatalities. I have had lots of great service, advice and technical competence in these kind of shops here, so fail to see your point... based on a vision from afar!! the whole mobile phone scene has been and remains way ahead of the US. Why?, lots of real competition in a small market, the weak guy dies fast!!