Dating someone 'Out of your League'?

LegacyUser

This post is going to make me sound full of myself, but I promise I'm not.

There's a guy I fancy. He works in the same place as me - now this isn't a conventional workspace - I don't want to go into too many details but it's a once a week job.

Anyway he's not what you would consider conventionally good looking. But I really fancy him, he's cool, he's very passionate at what he does, he's independent, he has a nice body.
I would be considered an attractive girl, I'm definitely not drop-dead gorgeous, but I've been called a catch and men tell me I'm a 'fine looking woman', 'a model' (I'm tall and long limbed) that kind of thing (not drunk men).

Looks are important but I consider my personality more important and I'm a kind person, passionate about what I do, adventurous, playful, thoughtful.

I'm shy around guys I like but I plucked up the courage and approached this guy about something. It went ok, he seemed friendly but not very chatty.
I thought it was good that at least I got the ball rolling, the next time I see him at least we could start friendly banter, see where it went.

Now he hasnt been in this workplace for the past few weeks so I haven't been able to have this friendly banter!
But anyway besides that - what are people's thoughts on this?

Would a guy pursue a girl he thought was better looking than him?
I've heard guys say before that they wouldn't risk it.
Am I the one who has to 'chase' this guy? Now I'm not arrogant enough to think that every guy fancies me, they certainly don't. And for the record I don't think this guy has a girlfriend.
Thanks for reading.

retro:electro

What makes you think he thinks you're better looking than him? Maybe he thinks he's better looking than you? Or maybe he places value in what is actually important like personality/ambition/independence and considers himself quite a catch and doesnt place too much value on superficialities.

HalloweenJack

Hopefully, he doesn't think that you're out of his league. It's a dangerous mindset to be in as he will inevitably put you on a pedestal and then stress himself out trying to please you and hold onto you.

If you are interested in him, go for it. Don't get bogged down by it not being the norm for girls to approach guys (I get this a small vibe of this from your post). I'd be flattered if a girl approached me and the confidence shown would attract me to her.

Tokyo

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

he's cool, he's very passionate at what he does, he's independent, he has a nice body.

All of these seem to be pretty admirable and attractive traits - what makes you think that you would be 'dating down'??

The long and the short of it is that you are attracted to this guy, he's single, and as such there's nothing to prevent you from following up on it if you want to. As for 'who chases who' - it doesn't have to be a chase per se - if you want to see where it could lead, see if he would be interested in catching up sometime for a coffee or a drink or similar. See where it goes from there.

LegacyUser

Op here. Thanks for replies.

I don't think looks are superficial. In a lot of cases these are what attract us to our partner and what keep us physically attracted.
How many posts on boards have there been where one partner puts on weight and the other doesn't find them physically attractive anymore?

I've said before that personality is more important but looks aren't meaningless.
I'm sure if most guys are given the choice, they would like a nice looking girl on their arm?

I don't really want to chase this guy. I believe if someone likes you, they'll make an effort. I'd hate to think he was only going along with it, because he was being pursued. How would I know if he liked me, if he doesn't pursue me?

I think this guy is great, I don't think I'm 'trading down' at all. I just know there is this thing that generally you end up with someone that matches looks-wise, and I do admit that I usually go for 'better looking' guys.

I know this post must sound awful but I'm trying to look at the subject objectively.
I don't mind making an effort to show this guy I'm interested but surely if a guy has some interest, he'd make an effort?

You think if someone likes you they'll put in an effort except you don't want to put in an effort? How is he to know you like him? It cuts both ways

Virgil°

I think you shouldn't go for it.

Reverse the roles here. Some guy thinks you're not great looking and he usually dates women who are much more attractive. He decides to go for it anyway.

If you knew what he thought and had a shred of esteem you'd probably give this person a wide berth no?

Not trying to have a go at you here but if hes as nice a guy as you say he is, then he deserves a girl who'll fancy the bones of him.

The Dark Side

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

I don't mind making an effort to show this guy I'm interested but surely if a guy has some interest, he'd make an effort?

But what 'effort' have you made. You mention approaching him about something in work one time, but you haven't seen him since.

People get approached all the time by other people in work. Most of the time you're not thinking 'I wonder does this person want something more from this conversation'.

I'd agree if he doesn't show any interest in you after you've made an effort then let it go, but you haven't made much of an effort so far.

I also wouldn't have mentioned the 'out of my league' line in the OP, as most respondents to your thread will prefer to take the opportunity to try to bring you down a peg or two rather than actually offer any advise.

ElizaBennett

I think the op's concerns are valid. But a lot depends on the guy's confidence levels.
From what I've read on the subject, men tend to imagine themselves to be better looking than they are, women the reverse. (speaking in generalities here.) If he's confident in himself and his attributes and attractiveness, and he likes and fancies you, then he'll be in a place where he can recognise that you like him and are interested in trying things out. If he's got low self esteem he might not even imagine for one moment that you're coming on to him. He sounds like he's got plenty going for him so hopefully he's also confident with it.

A reasonable level of banter / flirting should make it an easy and organic transition to the notion of a date:)
I agree that most people end up with someone of a similar level of physical attractiveness - it seems to be one of the laws of nature. But rules are made to be broken and you can balance each other out. And we all have our off days;)
Best of luck OP. For what it's worth, I don't think you're shallow to think about this. It's perfectly valid. Wish you well and hope it turns into a great romance

nc19

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote:

......I believe if someone likes you, they'll make an effort.....

But, but, but this is you in this situation!?!?

You are the one that likes him so you should make the effort.

LegacyUser

The Dark Side wrote: »

I also wouldn't have mentioned the 'out of my league' line in the OP, as most respondents to your thread will prefer to take the opportunity to try to bring you down a peg or two rather than actually offer any advise.

I am prepared for that, if it happens. Thank you. In Ireland, it doesn't seem acceptable to admit that you think you're attractive. I'm a confident woman who believes in her own self worth and I'm ok with that.
I put Out of your League in inverted commas because it is a somewhat odd thing but I know people do tend to adhere to it.

You're right, I haven't made much effort so far, but other posters suggested asking this guy out and I don't think I could do that. I'd like to chat with him, hoping he'll stop and chat too and see where things go. But I don't want to initiate every conversation or meeting.
If I have to, then I'll take it that he's not that interested if he doesn't reciprocate.

For the record I do 'fancy the bones' off him! I do feel bad discussing him publically but it's all anonymous with no details, so if he ever reads this, then I don't think he'd know he was the subject.

Maybe this thing isnt an issue at all. Maybe I'm blowing things out of proportion?
Has anyone had any experience of this? Would you like the girl to make it obvious they are interested? What could I do to show this?

There is a chance that he has no interest whatsoever but I'm going in with a positive attitude and assuming he likes me. I have nothing to lose.

iusedtoknow

All I could of when I read this was "Uptown Girl".

You know what, you may have to come round to the idea that you're not his type or you simply haven't registered on his radar. He maybe is just being pleasant to you because he's a nice guy and doesn't want to be unfriendly with people that he periodically works with and sees once every few weeks.

If you're interested in him, stop playing games (banter etc) and be more direct, especially as you only see him periodically - your answer will be there. Funnily enough, most guy's don't worry about "punching above their weight". Relationships, especially adult ones, tend to develop naturally regardless of looks (i.e. personality, interests and ultimately...attraction).

Mr. Incognito

This is the weirdest over thinking I have ever seen.

There's this guy I see very irregularly, that have barely interacted with once who I fancy because he has admirable traits but I am afraid if I ask him out I will be too good looking for him.

Well, his coolness, independence and passion will be there long long after your looks fade.

Maybe he sees someone who is shallow in selecting partners and retaining them as trading down also.

Not trying to be harsh but seriously. Looks are great for one night stands. Attraction is what keeps you together when life throws curveballs.

If you like him, ask him for a beer / coffee at your next irregular meeting. Take if from there.

Be prepared for rejection though.

Rekop dog

Irish woman usually have a far higher opinion of their looks than is realistic, especially when compared to many foreign woman living in this country who usually eclipse them on looks and more importantly modesty.

Think you're coming across poorly in this thread OP. Not particularly sure what advice you're actually looking for here. Some guys will approach better looking woman than them some won't, nobody here can tell you whether this guy will.

retro:electro

Op who's to say he isn't good looking? Beauty in the eye of the beholder. You're basing your own looks and how attractive you are on what other people have told you, they've said youre a "fine looking girl" and a "model" etc. Well maybe he gets compliments all the time too? Maybe girls throw themselves at him. I wouldn't be so quick to call yourself out of his league just yet and especially since your "league" seems to be purely based on looks.

ElizaBennett

My reading of her issue is that she's shy and is wondering how he'll ever know she's interested because she can't be quit forward enough to spell it out - and doesn't want to be - but he may not twig it on his own as she's 'out of his league' looks wise.
I think this could well be the case. If she's far better looking than him - leaving aside any notions of an ideal world where this doesn't matter - if indeed that would be an ideal world - then he may never realise she's interested as it might not cross his mind that someone as hot as her would even notice him. That could well happen in the real world.

So I think she needs to be far more flirty and take it from there. Hopefully he'll take the bait

iusedtoknow

ElizaBennett wrote: »

So I think she needs to be far more flirty and take it from there. Hopefully he'll take the bait

or she needs to go out of her comfort zone (for all we know he could be equally shy when it comes to asking women out), and ask him out for a coffee and be prepared for what follows.

Flippyfloppy

Tbh I don't think that him being 'out of your league' is the issue here. There's another thread on here about a lady who fancies a work guy and is wondering how to approach the situation. Wouldn't that be a better angle to approach this situation seeing as you have no idea at all if he fancies you/ if you're his type/ if there's any chemistry?

And yes, to answer your question plenty of men and women go for people who are considered conventionally better looking than them.

njs030

Wow this post makes me feel a bit sad op.
If you like him ask him out, hopefully he will be interested.

Stop thinking you're better than other people, we all have different things we find attractive but being too into your own looks generally isn't attractive.

Also op most tall slim women (who are leggy because of being tall) are told by men they look like models, most semi-attractive women are told they are gorgeous by men on a regular basis. It doesn't mean anything, it's just words.

Jan Laco

If you are as good a catch as you may be or think you are, he will be flattered. I would be.

You should suggest to him to meet up outside of work as you don't get to talk that much in work.

Your head may be analysing why you would like him but your gut us telling you that you like him? Logic rarely works with love anyway.

ElizaBennett

Also op most tall slim women (who are leggy because of being tall) are told by men they look like models, most semi-attractive women are told they are gorgeous by men on a regular basis. It doesn't mean anything, it's just words.[/QUOTE]

But isn't it also possible that she is beautiful? Why couldn't that be the case? That can be very intimidating - to men and women alike.

Taboola

Just because other men think you're attractive doesn't mean THIS man thinks you're attractive.

njs030

ElizaBennett wrote: »

But isn't it also possible that she is beautiful? Why couldn't that be the case? That can be very intimidating - to men and women alike.

I didn't say she wasn't beautiful, I was pointing out that the same things are heard by women all over the world not just her. From her first post she seems to put a lot of stock into men thinking she's attractive and for that reason she's "better" than the man she likes.

LegacyUser

Op here. My other reply hasn't been approved yet but I thought I might add other things.

Eliza Bennett you seem to actually see what my issue is. A girl who is more attractive (not the most attractive in the world) than a guy she wants to pursue. It's relatively speaking. I want to know if it could be an issue?

I don't think I'm beautiful. I see stunning women all the time. Some Spanish women are so gorgeous. I don't think I'm in their 'league' at all.
I don't place a huge emphasis on my looks and I'm modest.
It's just I'm on a message board, trying to paint a picture of the situation. I'm being objective as I can and I think I'm realistic about how I 'see' myself, from my own experience and how others 'see' me (I was meant to say that women and men say nice things to me regarding looks).
I don't go around thinking I'm God's gift but how else am I supposed to paint this picture without mentioning this?

I went out with a guy in the past and I'll hold up my hand and say he was much better looking than me. At the time I was very insecure about myself and wondered what he ever saw in me.
Looking back I know I just had terrible self esteem, but I will still say he was better looking. But a persons 'worth' is a package deal of personality, achievements, interests and looks.
I don't think I'm better than anyone else.

LegacyUser

Op here again.
Just want to address other things mentioned. Yes I am shy and by approaching him, have gone out of my comfort zone! I usually avoid guys I like!

LegacyUser

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

I don't place a huge emphasis on my looks and I'm modest.

Really? Because you have a thread on the internet describing a potentially good relationship with a guy who has a lot going for him and who you've clearly thought about as a date or boyfriend, but your only reservation about making an attempt to move things along is that you're better looking, in your own head at least. That makes a total lie of the part of your post I've quoted above.

I think you need to roll back a long way from where you are now. Start by either copping on to the proper value of looks in a relationship and if you can't do that, don't start anything with a fella you see as cosmetically inferior to you so you can spare him ever coming to see that in you.

As to the idea of "leagues"....just, jaysis.

OneOfThem

Don't mind the less than friendly comments Ruby. Always a risky thing for a woman to do to suggest she's good looking - suggesting she's better looking that someone else - capital crime right there, especially on the internet, so don't take it to heart.

To your question - are some men put off pursuing a woman if they feel she is 'out of their league'? Yeah it can happen. Rejection can be tough and some guys are a little gin shy of it and it can mean the more attractive the girl, the less forward they will be. Some guys. Not all or most.

Some guys also just don't hit on every attractive woman that chats to them for ten minutes. Has nothing to do with thinking they are 'out of their league', or fear of rejection or anything else. Sometimes they are just selective. Or sometimes their interest in someone is only peaked if they have the looks and the personality, and it can take a while to get to know someone's personality. Or sometimes they just have trouble reading signals (and it sounds like any, if you've tried to give off any at all, have been very subtle) and don't want to make a girl feel uncomfortable by making advances that may be unwelcome. Or sometimes they, like myself, find a woman having the bravery to be the one to make the initial moves the most attractive thing in the world, and as they aren't exactly hard up for female attention, tend to mainly respond to these girls.

So if he doesn't pursue you, it could be for one of dozens of reasons, from him simply not finding you attractive, to him preferring women that are a bit more forward and less of 'The Rules' school of male female interactions, to him not having the slightest clue you have any interest, to him having been cursed by a sorcerer with immortality when he was a 16th century knight and not being able to live with seeing the women he loves age and die while he doesn't.

I know what you are saying about not being the one to 'make a move' for him because you'd worry he'd just go along with it even if he wasn't that interested because... well... I don't know what motivation some women think some men would have for doing that. But to be honest love, the same could apply if he did pursue you. I said above that not all men just hit on any attractive woman that crosses their path, well that's true. There are also men that will pursue any woman that crosses their path, whether they are attractive or not, whether they have any real interest in them or not.

I'm guessing you're early to mid twenties? Genuinely, your life will be so so such easier from here on in if you can shake this thing in your head that men will just go along with it if a woman pursues them, if they are interested or not, and also shake this idea that if a guy pursues you it's some kind of proof that they are really interested. Neither is true.

Could I also suggest you have quite a fear of rejection yourself? Maybe a hangover from the previous low self esteem you mentioned? And that this idea that he may not pursue you due to what may be a belief in you being 'out of his league' as well as this thing about the guy should be the one to pursue you, are just projections of that? With the first thing you are able to tell yourself that if he doesn't pursue you, it's not that he didn't like you, it's just that he thought he wouldn't get you if he did. And with the second thing, it allows you to make an excuse in your own head for never outing yourself forward and leaving a possibility of their being some kind of rejection?

Lots of men say women are too subtle with their signalling of interest, I've never thought so myself, I think it stands out like a bonfire at night personally, but that's not the case for a lot of guys. So don't be subtle. And don't expect him to just go for you like a dog after a hare because you chatted a couple of times. This goes for other men too, not just this guy. Take a risk. Take some control of situations like this. Let him know you're interested in him and he will let you know of he is interested in you and then oh sweet Jesus isn't it nice when their isn't this uncertainty and this second guessing and over thinking and waiting around every time you like a guy. Be brave. It's sexy.

Take care. And go bag that non-conventially 9 out of ten hunk.

heretochat

Just my two cents worth but in my opinion there is a huge difference between someone being "attractive" and someone being "good looking". For me to find a girl attractive they would have to have a lot more about them than just a pretty face. After all, all looks fade and if there is nothing of substance behind that person, all that is left is an empty shell.

I am in two minds as to how to respond to the OP's posts. I can't ascertain whether she is nervous and saying things that she doesn't mean or whether she actually does present as someone whose interactions with guys are dictated solely by how they look.

If it is the latter, I would think the guy in question will work that out pretty quickly. If he is happy to be placed in a "league" well then work on OP and all the best to you.

Wouldn't be for me though so be careful how you present yourself to him.

nc19

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote:

You're right, I haven't made much effort so far, but other posters suggested asking this guy out and I don't think I could do that. I'd like to chat with him, hoping he'll stop and chat too and see where things go. But I don't want to initiate every conversation or meeting. If I have to, then I'll take it that he's not that interested if he doesn't reciprocate.

This right here is what pisses men off in my experience. Men are simple creatures. Just fuggin ask him out. If he likes you he'll say yes if not he'll say no. Simpl35

ElizaBennett

Great post by OneOfThem - lots of good insight and advice.

I have had two different men I've been in dysfunctional relationships with (at a young age) tell me that they stayed against their better judgement because of my looks. So it does happen. People go out with people because of how they look sometimes. The op is right to question the disparity and wonder if it will cause an issue. It may well not if both parties are happy in themselves and with who they are

beks101

I actually think this might be your own insecurities and fear of rejection playing out in a rather weird way. You've stated from the offset that you don't approach men, don't want to be the one to chase - so it seems you'll tell yourself anything to get out of having to do that.

So a few things.

1. Any woman I've heard describe this "I don't chase men!" thing and "if they like you enough, they'll approach themselves!" have been the staunchly single ones who think the men around them haven't enough balls to bother going near them.

We're in the 21st century now and very few men are going to walk right up out of the blue - especially if you have that sort of a defiant attitude - and ask you on a date. I wouldn't do it; I don't know why there is this expectation that a man will. My OH asked for my number after a long night of ridiculous flirting and intimate conversation - and even now he tells me he almost didn't. Wasn't quite sure. Men are human too. They have the same fears and worries and insecurities as you do. Reconsider your attitude on this one.

2. Unless you're some larger-than-life Jessica Rabbit sex appeal style uber hot woman, I don't think your attractiveness is going to prevent some guy who fancies you from approaching. A far greater obstacle would be that he just doesn't fancy you or has a girlfriend or the work-thing is a deterrent.

Regardless, if you're just standing back in the corner and waiting for him to approach based on you being pretty, I think your success rate with any lad is going to be pretty low. A lot of guys will look, stare, smile maybe, think "she's hot", but most guys (bar the wolf whistling beer-swilling types) who have approached me, have done so after I gave them some kind of green light. Smiling a lot, stopping to chat, a bit of physical contact.

Hombre Lobo

Hey OP.

There's a chance he could just be a bit shy around an attractive woman and hasn't approached you.
But it's unclear how long you two have chatted. Has it just been a once off thing for a few minutes or has it been on more than one occasion?
If it's only been once or twice for a few minutes then he probably doesn't even know anything about you.

One possible reason is that he could indeed find you very attractive and could just be telling himself there's no way a girl this good looking is single so he might not even try. I've been guilty of this on several occasions. If I seen a really good looking woman I would sometimes just assume she's probably not single as 10 other guys probably chase her every week.

LegacyUser

oP here again. Yes I am very fearful of rejection.
In the past I approached /initiated contact with men and they usually ended badly - not outright rejection but just dead end relationships, one sided affairs - it always seemed to be me that was more into the guy.

I've read lots of dating manuals to try to 'educate' myself on how to make these things work and the consensus was that a man should pursue a woman. And they weren't The Rules type manuals at all - really dislike that old fashioned book.
It's ok to flirt with a man, show interest, etc but the man should pursue the woman.
It does make sense - it's inbuilt in a man's psyche to be the pursuer.
These books were mostly US based and maybe men are more forward over there than here, but surely it can't be up to the woman to ask a guy out?

I don't have a problem with the looks thing at all. I just thought it might be an issue with this guy. Judging by the posts it probably isn't an issue.
Regarding the 'thinking women are already attached' - I get that a lot, as do lots of women (not singling myself out) from men and women. In fact I know lots of women who are catches that are single. It would be easier if we had signs on our heads showing status!

Rock77

This happened me a lot in night clubs a few years ago. Nobody ever chatted me up cos I was out of everybody's league and they were afraid to approach me!!
Do u really think he hasn't asked you out cos you are better looking than him?

OneOfThem

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

I've read lots of dating manuals to try to 'educate' myself on how to make these things work and the consensus was that a man should pursue a woman. And they weren't The Rules type manuals at all - really dislike that old fashioned book.
It's ok to flirt with a man, show interest, etc but the man should pursue the woman.
It does make sense - it's inbuilt in a man's psyche to be the pursuer.

Ok, you've read all these dating manuals to educate yourself. So time for the final exam. You'll like it, it's only one question long. You ready? OK. What's your boyfriends middle name?

Here sweetheart, they're written to make money. You know what makes a lot of money? Telling people what they want to hear. You know what doesn't? "If you like a guy, let him know, if he likes you back you can get something going on". Shortest book ever. Only one person will buy it because it can fit in a text and people will just pass it around like that. And no repeat business from perpetually and/or repeatedly single women. You say you really don't like "The Rules" and that it's old fashioned, well it's entire thing is "wait for men to pursue you it's part of their psyche".

I'm not saying their aren't a subset of men who "love the chase", there are. But honestly sweetheart, and trust me on this, you don't want them to catch you. What do you think happens when a pianist that loves to learn pieces of music learns one off? They're satisfied and never try to learn another piece as long as they live? Nope. What do you think a guy that loves the chase does when he catches you and the chase is over? Stops chasing women? Nope.

The only guys that love the chase are the guys that love the chase for the chases sake (the particular woman is entirely incidental). And guys that have a deep seated insecurities.

God, it doesn't have to be this hard. Life doesn't have to be this complicated. You don't have to read dating manuals.

If you like someone, let them know. If they like you, then something will happen. If they don't, it won't.

ibarelycare

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

oP here again. Yes I am very fearful of rejection.
In the past I approached /initiated contact with men and they usually ended badly - not outright rejection but just dead end relationships, one sided affairs - it always seemed to be me that was more into the guy.

I've read lots of dating manuals to try to 'educate' myself on how to make these things work and the consensus was that a man should pursue a woman. And they weren't The Rules type manuals at all - really dislike that old fashioned book.
It's ok to flirt with a man, show interest, etc but the man should pursue the woman.
It does make sense - it's inbuilt in a man's psyche to be the pursuer.
These books were mostly US based and maybe men are more forward over there than here, but surely it can't be up to the woman to ask a guy out?

I don't have a problem with the looks thing at all. I just thought it might be an issue with this guy. Judging by the posts it probably isn't an issue.
Regarding the 'thinking women are already attached' - I get that a lot, as do lots of women (not singling myself out) from men and women. In fact I know lots of women who are catches that are single. It would be easier if we had signs on our heads showing status!

Dear lord.



Well if that's your attitude then you better just sit back and hope the guy asks you out. Don't think there's much more you can do...

LegacyUser

As a man I have had women in America and in Ireland ask me out. My current girlfriend of 5 years asked me out because i had no idea she was interested in me, Despite her subtle hints and flirting. I thought she was just being nice.

If he thinks you're out of his league why would he bother? He would just think, she'll probably just say no. I know I would.

Just ask him out. Save everybody all the drama and just find out. If a beautiful woman asked me out while i was single I would definitely say yes. It's not uncommon for women to do the chasing every now and again.

The good things in life are free, but sometimes a little bit of work is required, remember you're just asking him out for a drink, it's not a marriage proposal. Don't be worried.

osarusan

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

It's ok to flirt with a man, show interest, etc but the man should pursue the woman.
It does make sense - it's inbuilt in a man's psyche to be the pursuer.
These books were mostly US based and maybe men are more forward over there than here, but surely it can't be up to the woman to ask a guy out?

All of this complete nonsense is going to cause you a lot of loneliness in life.

If you like the guy, ask him out.

If the fear of rejection is too much, then don't.

But for the love of god, don't pretend that your refusal to take that chance is somehow his responsibility.

MrWalsh

The thing about beauty and attractiveness is that they are completely subjective. You might think you are better looking than him, I might think the opposite. Even if you are, he might not go for someone like you, for a 100 different reasons.

You seem to have a bit of a princess complex - and I dont mean that in relation to you thinking you are beautiful. I mean that you think you sit back and men do all the running. Well you can do that but then you only get to date the ones that choose you, not the ones that you choose.

Lagraso

OP what do you think will happen if he rejects you? Nothing will actually change, you will still be the same person except with the knowledge that you had the balls to go after what you want and the world didn't end.

LegacyUser

You seem to have a bit of a princess complex - and I dont mean that in relation to you thinking you are beautiful. I mean that you think you sit back and men do all the running. Well you can do that but then you only get to date the ones that choose you, not the ones that you choose.

I really don't know where you're getting this from. Have you read my posts?
I've already said I DON'T think I'm beautiful and in the past I've pursued men but it all lead to disaster, so I don't know where you're seeing this princess thing?

I find it hard to believe that women do all the asking nowadays? None of my friends asked out their current boyfriends.
People say 'Ask him out' like it's the easiest thing in the world.
To be honest I am very scarred from past rejections and just the thought of this is upsetting.
To be honest I came on here looking for constructive advice but I've been set upon with sarcasm and posts that just want to knock my confidence.
It took me years to build up my confidence and sometimes it can be a little shaky and to be honest I'm finding the negativity in this thread upsetting. I'm actually crying writing this.

People should be careful what you say to strangers on message boards.

Maybe he's scarred from past rejections too but secretly likes you
So now you have two people who are interested but don't want to make a move
It's not really any way to find happiness?


That poster made a good point that you'll only ever have the option of someone who chose you rather than someone you chose, if you refuse to make a move. It's your choice if you want to risk losing out on the chance at someone you like because of it, but not his responsibility or anyone else's

kiva989

I think people are being quite hard on you OP. What I'm getting from your posts is that your shy, prehaps a bit introverted and afraid of rejection. Recognising/believing you're a pretty girl isn't a bad thing nor does it make you a have princess complex like some people on here are implying.

Sometimes shyness can be taken for standoff-ness, especially when the situation involves someone you like romantically. Is there a chance the guy could have perceived you to be like this during your interaction?

I think you have three options here:
1) do nothing. He might ask you out but equally he might not
2) just start being more friendly to him to open the lines of communication and get to know him a bit better
3) bite the bullet and ask him out for a drink/coffee. At the end of the day, (as long as the person does it in a non-creepy way!) most people would be flattered to be asked out by anyone, regardless of whether they think the person is hot or not. It doesn't have to be a big romantic gesture, you could just say "hey X, I know this might sound a bit mad but would you be interested in getting a coffee sometime? You seem like a cool guy and was just wondering if you fancied meeting up outside of work sometime?" If he says no, no biggie! Your life will still continue exactly as normal!

LegacyUser

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

I really don't know where you're getting this from. Have you read my posts?
I've already said I DON'T think I'm beautiful and in the past I've pursued men but it all lead to disaster, so I don't know where you're seeing this princess thing?

I find it hard to believe that women do all the asking nowadays? None of my friends asked out their current boyfriends.
People say 'Ask him out' like it's the easiest thing in the world.
To be honest I am very scarred from past rejections and just the thought of this is upsetting.
To be honest I came on here looking for constructive advice but I've been set upon with sarcasm and posts that just want to knock my confidence.
It took me years to build up my confidence and sometimes it can be a little shaky and to be honest I'm finding the negativity in this thread upsetting. I'm actually crying writing this.

People should be careful what you say to strangers on message boards.

OP I think you've taken the above comment totally out of context. You started this post with saying you felt this guy wouldn't ask you out because he might think your 'out of his league' due to looks so of course people are going to comment about how looks aren't everything and clearly you do think you've got some level of attractiveness or you would never have posted this in the first place. Many suggested asking the guy out yourself to which you've replied with comments that sound very dated about how it's the guys job and he should want to pursue women cus that's what men do etc etc hence the princess comment.

This thread has nothing to do with looks so you've prob done yourself a disservice with your first post. It boils down to two things OP 1. you fear refection so won't ask this guy out and 2. you've got some bad advice/views on dating from these rubbish dating books. Great some of your friends got asked out by their boyfriends but it's not set in stone, my husband and I didn't ask each other out we just saw one say we spent so much time together we might as well be dating, it was very much a mutual thing between us, as was the choice to get married. Ask yourself this OP were any of your friends partners work colleagues they only saw on the odd occasion? You've got both the situation and your own self confidence at play here. If you were talking about someone you saw/interacted with on a daily bases then yeah it's easier to flirt/test waters etc etc but you only see this guy the odd time and your interaction is limited so trying the subtle approach just isn't going to work but on the up side you don't see him much so if you do ask and he says no your not stuck looking at him every day.

I'm not sure what advice you want people to give if your not willing to be direct. Do you want some cheesy flirting tips??? We don't know you or this guy so we can't tell you why he hasn't ask you or if flirting with him will have the effect you want. Some people are thick and can't tell people are flirting

iusedtoknow

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

I find it hard to believe that women do all the asking nowadays? None of my friends asked out their current boyfriends.

To be honest I came on here looking for constructive advice but I've been set upon with sarcasm and posts that just want to knock my confidence.
It took me years to build up my confidence and sometimes it can be a little shaky and to be honest I'm finding the negativity in this thread upsetting.

Women don't "do all the asking out". Some do, others don't. My wife asked me out - 10 years ago, in a pub - in Ireland. 2 weeks before she moved back to Spain. She always said she felt it was "now or never". She took the chance, and said she felt it was 75% possible that I would say yes. I didn't do it because I was 75% sure the answer would be no. I didn't because she was moving back to Spain, and thought that she wouldn't want a LDR (not because I didn't like her). We went out for 6 years and then got married.

As for the advice - it has been universal - get out of your comfort zone again, and ask him out. Just because it is not the advise you want to hear does not mean it is not constructive. If you wanted the advice you wanted to hear, perhaps you have asked your close friends, none of whom did the asking.

Sometimes it's pays to ask strangers outside of an echo chamber, it makes you really look at the issue objectively, even if it isn't what you wanted.

beks101

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

I really don't know where you're getting this from. Have you read my posts?
I've already said I DON'T think I'm beautiful and in the past I've pursued men but it all lead to disaster, so I don't know where you're seeing this princess thing?

I find it hard to believe that women do all the asking nowadays? None of my friends asked out their current boyfriends.
People say 'Ask him out' like it's the easiest thing in the world.
To be honest I am very scarred from past rejections and just the thought of this is upsetting.
To be honest I came on here looking for constructive advice but I've been set upon with sarcasm and posts that just want to knock my confidence.
It took me years to build up my confidence and sometimes it can be a little shaky and to be honest I'm finding the negativity in this thread upsetting. I'm actually crying writing this.

People should be careful what you say to strangers on message boards.

Woah woah woah. This is a major overreaction. You posted a thread titled 'Dating someone 'Out of your League' " - where you are the so-called 'Out of his League' party - on an anonymous advice board that is heavily moderated, and got a few replies you didn't like. Maybe the real issue here is that your confidence is so fragile it could be knocked by a few anonymous posts like this.

I think most posts have been pretty fair, they've just called into question some of these beliefs you have that appear to be holding you back - that the man must chase while the woman sits back and waits; that this 'leagues' thing exists in the first place and you are unquestionably more attractive/appealing to the opposite sex than this fella is. Why must it be so?

Listen, I've no doubt you're a pretty woman, but you seem to have built this up in your head to the point where you've come to validate yourself on it, perhaps because of your problems with low confidence and insecurity. A few male comments have determined your self-image, as opposed to your own inner confidence and self belief.

Sure, looks are what draws someone in, but where do you go from there? Say this guy does find you attractive. What does he have to work with here, if you're determined to just sit back and let him do all the work? You have to be prepared to put yourself out there, to get the things that you want. No-one is telling you to bulldoze in there and ask the guy to marry you - just to be a bit more forward.

Not a single person on this thread, or in your every day life, can tell you what this chap is thinking. What kind of women he's into, if he's even into dating right now, if he's the type that would approach. Every man is different. Literally. Every single one of them. Different tastes, different turnons, different personalities, different approaches.

I've been shocked and wildly amused by the types of men that have been interested in me over the years. How one lad will pass you by without a second glance and the next will think you're the most heavenly creature to walk this earth. It's totally unpredictable. Someone could even fancy you and you could fancy them and whether or not you'll be romantically compatible is still anyone's guess.

Dating is a clusterfcuk of guessing games and luck and chance and circumstance and timing and will-he-won't-hes and you are seriously cutting yourself off from so many potential partners with your current attitude.

Have a chat with the lad the next time he's in. Smile, make eye contact, establish a rapport as you would a new friend. Once you feel a bit more comfortable around him, ask him if he'd fancy grabbing some lunch. Or "I'm gonna get some coffee, wanna come?"

Heat_Wave

notjustsweet wrote: »

Also op most tall slim women (who are leggy because of being tall) are told by men they look like models, most semi-attractive women are told they are gorgeous by men on a regular basis. It doesn't mean anything, it's just words.

This OP.

When I see a tall girl with long legs I turn to the person next to me and say 'she looks like a model'. I don't even look at her face. I'm saying she's a model because of her height.

I was walking into a garage the other day to pay for petrol and there was a man standing outside the entrance busking for a charity and everyone was ignoring him. I smiled at him and told him I would get him on the way out. When I came out of the shop I gave him another smile, I asked what charity it was for and I gave him a couple of euro. He turned to me and said 'you're a beautiful girl'. I was chuffed with myself. He wasn't referring to my looks, he was calling me a beautiful person because I was nice and chatty to him.

It's not all about looks.

Est28

You know... I can sort of feel for OP here as she's just being trolled as usual by the moral police.

Ok, so she's an attractive woman who knows she's attractive. That's a crime? I mean, of course it is because nobody who is perceived as "having anything" in Ireland is allowed to acknowledge it or have confidence about it.

Would ye all cop on! The OP did nothing wrong, if she's attractive, she's attractive and if she's aware of it, as long as she's not an ass about it, leave her alone.

Now all the insecure people who don't make an effort on themselves and like to complain because they are the one who's usually "not up to the others league" have to come out and disparage the OP, who of course is now trying to defend herself and making everyone attack her worse.

OP, good on you for having some confidence about yourself and appearance and still not letting it go to your head. Idiots everywhere to drag everyone else down.

The rest of ye....
What if this was the person saying she thinks she ugly and can't get the guy? You'd molly coddle her. Bceause you can look down on her in sympathy then. But the other way around, that green eyed monster comes knocking :rolleyes:

Raminahobbin

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

in the past I've pursued men but it all lead to disaster

They're ALL the wrong ones, until it's the right one. A friend said this to me a while back and I think it's very important to understand. We always feel at fault when the dating world doesn't go according to plan, but just remember- it will never go according to plan, until it DOES. Just because your putting yourself out there has ended in 'disaster' before, doesn't mean it always will. People are different. I'm sure you're a different person to who you were 5 years ago. Things change.

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

I find it hard to believe that women do all the asking nowadays? None of my friends asked out their current boyfriends.

Women don't 'do all the asking,' but it's a sign of the times that women are starting to actively put themselves out there more. Nobody wants to sit on the sidelines, waiting to be asked to dance. You're in charge of your own life and the decisions you make, why on earth would you want to pass up an opportunity and regret not having the ladyballs to just make a little effort??

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

People say 'Ask him out' like it's the easiest thing in the world.

It's NOT easy, everybody understands that. It's not easy for women, OR men. For anyone that DOES find it easy, it's usually because they have such a thick skin from being rejected that they don't really care anymore. People here are advising you to 'feel the fear and do it anyway,' essentially. Don't let your fears rule you, they are there to be overcome.

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

To be honest I am very scarred from past rejections and just the thought of this is upsetting.
To be honest I came on here looking for constructive advice but I've been set upon with sarcasm and posts that just want to knock my confidence.
It took me years to build up my confidence and sometimes it can be a little shaky and to be honest I'm finding the negativity in this thread upsetting. I'm actually crying writing this.

People should be careful what you say to strangers on message boards.

The whole time I was reading this thread, right up until this paragraph, I was in the 'push you to be brave' camp, but considering your overreaction here I actually think you shouldn't ask him out. If your confidence is this fragile, then I think you should spend a bit of time working on yourself, how you see yourself, and your past issues- get counselling if you're not sure how to do that.

You've said before here that if you ask a guy out you won't know if they like you or not- I suspect you doubt your own value and don't feel you have anything to bring to the table in a relationship. The fact that you started this thread based on a comparison between physical appearances supports this. I don't mean this as any sort of a dig at you, or in any sort of sarky way, I just genuinely think people should be constantly aiming to improve themselves and right now you seem to need to work on yourself and your confidence levels before you try to enter a relationship with anyone. A relationship is only as good as the people in it, and if one is not okay then the relationship can't be okay.

Augme

Rubytuesdaywednesday wrote: »

Would a guy pursue a girl he thought was better looking than him?
I've heard guys say before that they wouldn't risk it.

If you have heard guys say this then I'm not sure why you are so insistent that the guy has to be the one to pursue you. You seem to think you are conventionally better looking than him so surely yu must accept that by being better looking than it's far less likely he will be the one to ask you out because he might not think he has much of a chance.

Alf Veedersane

It's all gone a bit silly season.

I think what the OP kicked off with is being blown out of proportion.

Anyway, OP, you don't have to do the asking out, per se, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't make an effort to facilitate the guy asking you out, should he be interested.

Guys don't always feel confident in a positive response should they 'make a move' and avoid the knock back, regardless of whether or not it's their role to do the chasing.