Giro d'Italia Stage 10 - Civitanova Marche - Forlì *contains unmasked spoilers*

Darkglasses

Sprint stage with a 600m cobble finish. Shouldn't be too divisive; Greipel, Modolo and Viviani remain the favourites.

Pelucchi has abandoned today.

Sean Kelly back with us on Eurosport.

neris

boring so far but 30km left

Inquitus

From twitter:

Here is the bottleneck the riders have to get through with 850m to go today as they exit the Piazza.. should be fun..

dastardly00

Boonen ftw on the cobbles maybe?

dastardly00

Inquitus wrote: »

From twitter:

Here is the bottleneck the riders have to get through with 850m to go today as they exit the Piazza.. should be fun..

I hope Betancur can squeeze through the gap

Darkglasses

dastardly00 wrote: »

Boonen ftw on the cobbles maybe?

It's a possibility, the cobbles aren't really that severe and Sean Kelly doesn't fancy him, but Boonen himself was talking up his chances. Worth a look at 66/1 anyway.

However, the break is looking really dangerous, 1'45 the gap with 13km to go

Darkglasses

Ouch, massive loses for Richie Porte after a mechanical at 5km. Worrying too that he didn't even have the legs for a really good chase back on. Looked like a 40 second loss, give or a take.

Super win for the breakaway, Nicola Boem took a slow-motion sprint. Have to be in it to win it.

Inquitus

Darkglasses wrote: »

Ouch, massive loses for Richie Porte after a mechanical at 5km. Worrying too that he didn't even have the legs for a really good chase back on. Looked like a 40 second loss, give or a take.

Super win for the breakaway, Nicola Boem took a slow-motion sprint. Have to be in it to win it.

No matter how the legs are you have no chance of getting back on in a flat stage when you have problems 5km from the end, you will ship time.

death1234567

disaster for porte, that could cost him the giro. Over a minute down on contador now.

Darkglasses

Inquitus wrote: »

No matter how the legs are you have no chance of getting back on in a flat stage when you have problems 5km from the end, you will ship time.

No, but the chase was poor too. Couldn't hold the wheel in front of him.

dastardly00

Big win for the Bardiani team.

Really unlucky for Porte.

Darkglasses

pelevin

Didn't see any of it but maybe not bad that Porte may have to be that bit more aggressive rather than cagey/conservative as seems to be the thinking so far.

godtabh

Porte in the 60km time trial should better Aru. Possibly Bertie too

dastardly00

godtabh wrote: »

Porte in the 60km time trial should better Aru. Possibly Bertie too

Looking back at Aru's previous ITT results over long distances (here), he could conceivably lose about two minutes to Porte/Contador/Uran.

Aru has specifically worked on his TT ability over the winter though, so it'll be fascinating to see how he will get on during the ITT this Saturday..

“It's clear that Fabio has to improve his time trialling," Astana coach Maurizio Mazzoleni told Gazzetta dello Sport. “His training schedule includes a weekly TT session and not on a recovery day. He's got to do specific, quality work. We've found a circuit in Brianza near his home so he can do time trial motor pacing. “During the Astana camp in Calpe in early December, we'll go on the track in Alicante for more work so that we can combine the data from the wind tunnel work Fabio did in California with Specialized with practical data on the track.

(from cyclingnews)

dastardly00

https://twitter.com/richie_porte/status/600698305744625665

Darkglasses

Well there's something you don't see every day.

18 man Sky team is pretty good marginal gains. Hearing rumours that there's rules against helping someone on a rival team, which seems only right.

Pudsy33

It's cute and all, but is that not cheating? Surely Sky should have to deal with it.

Darkglasses

Pudsy33 wrote: »

It's cute and all, but is that not cheating? Surely Sky should have to deal with it.

Indeed it is. Section 12.1.040, part 8

"Non-regulation assistance to a rider of another team" - 200 Swiss francs and a 2 minute penalty.

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/68/12-DIS-20150101-E_English.pdf

godtabh

Darkglasses wrote: »

Indeed it is. Section 12.1.040, part 8

"Non-regulation assistance to a rider of another team" - 200 Swiss francs and a 2 minute penalty.

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/68/12-DIS-20150101-E_English.pdf

Ouch!

Sky and Orica are very close. Just look at their combined videos

Inquitus

Darkglasses wrote: »

Indeed it is. Section 12.1.040, part 8

"Non-regulation assistance to a rider of another team" - 200 Swiss francs and a 2 minute penalty.

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/68/12-DIS-20150101-E_English.pdf

2 minutes to Clarke means nothing, and whats 200 francs like 200 yoyos? Surely lil Richie has that down the back of the sofa in his RV

Darkglasses

Inquitus wrote: »

2 minutes to Clarke means nothing, and whats 200 francs like 200 yoyos? Surely lil Richie has that down the back of the sofa in his RV

The penalties apply to each rider concerned, so I would say if the Comms decide to do anything, it should be to both of them.

Inrng tweeted this which they say applies to mechanicals in the last 20km

https://twitter.com/inrng/status/600712917659561984

Darkglasses

Porte has been docked the two minutes.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/giro-ditalia-richie-porte-docked-two-minutes

Fair play to the Comms, I didn't really expect them to follow through.

Inquitus

Well he's been hit with the full 2 minutes, way to ruin a race....incidentally contador took his helmet off the other day while moving which requires DSQ if they wish to apply all rules to the letter.

Pudsy33

Two minute penalty for both. Feel for Richie and Clarke but Christ Sky made an absolute balls of it.

Darkglasses

Pudsy33 wrote: »

Two minute penalty for both. Feel for Richie and Clarke but Christ Sky made an absolute balls of it.

I feel like if the Sky riders hadn't all tweeted about it, they may well have gotten away with it.

Inquitus

It's just a shame, the Giro was finely balanced and looking like it would be a decent contest, it's pretty much a foregone conclusion now.

godtabh

Darkglasses wrote: »

I feel like if the Sky riders hadn't all tweeted about it, they may well have gotten away with it.

Yeah the journalists didnt know about it until tweets went up

pelevin

All the stuff about marginal gains & they were that ignorant about the bloody rules?! A shame it's happened but really can only blame themselves. Kind of funny though the Aussie world, which can be a bit self-loving, get hit by this cock-up.

Inquitus

pelevin wrote: »

All the stuff about marginal gains & they were that ignorant about the bloody rules?! A shame it's happened but really can only blame themselves. Kind of funny though the Aussie world, which can be a bit self-loving, get hit by this cock-up.

The real cock up was him not having a teammate nearby, I guess had he not taken a wheel and waited for the car he'd have lost more time perhaps....

pprendeville

That seems an awful shame. One friend helping another and both get punished. Where's the justice in that. He lost plenty of time already, maybe a different story if he was to make gains from it.

Pudsy33

pprendeville wrote: »

That seems an awful shame. One friend helping another and both get punished. Where's the justice in that. He lost plenty of time already, maybe a different story if he was to make gains from it.

He shouldnt have helped his mate though. He wouldn't have helped Aru or Contador. Like sais above, it's the responsibility of team Sky to look after their leader. Not Clarke.

godtabh

where were sky?

godtabh

Inquitus wrote: »

The real cock up was him not having a teammate nearby, I guess had he not taken a wheel and waited for the car he'd have lost more time perhaps....

there was 4 help him pace back up. He may have lost a couple of seconds waiting but not 2 minutes he has lost now

Inquitus

Pudsy33 wrote: »

He shouldnt have helped his mate though. He wouldn't have helped Aru or Contador. Like sais above, it's the responsibility of team Sky to look after their leader. Not Clarke.

I like to see races decided on the road, not by a mistimed puncture just outside 3km to go, or by crashes or rules applied to the letter but to the detriment of the race.

Quintana overtook a motorbike holding out a flag in the heat of the moment and lots of confusion, but common sense was applied and he wasn't DQ.

Porte was already going to lose a minute, no need to ruin the race by piling another 2 on top.

What was going to be an intriguing Giro is now a foregone conclusion, doesn't do anyone any good.

pelevin

Inquitus wrote: »

The real cock up was him not having a teammate nearby, I guess had he not taken a wheel and waited for the car he'd have lost more time perhaps....

Seems real shoddy all right the team leader not looked after right. I genuinely feel for Porte but in a way I'm glad the Aussies shot themselves in the foot. This isn't supposed to be some United Aussie Front where they get to feel good about how good they all are to each other, etc. They're on separate teams. How many team-mates is Porte supposed to have? Maybe though he can get the time back by getting a head start through leaving the motor-home early tomorrow whilst the others are still checking out from their hotels.

pelevin

Inquitus wrote: »

Porte was already going to lose a minute, no need to ruin the race by piling another 2 on top.

I think it's a fairly obvious rule though that should be implemented properly. One team per-cyclist is enough imo.

MPFG

pelevin wrote: »

All the stuff about marginal gains & they were that ignorant about the bloody rules?! A shame it's happened but really can only blame themselves. Kind of funny though the Aussie world, which can be a bit self-loving, get hit by this cock-up.

How has undermining the Australians got anything to do with this and is unnecessary ...

I actually felt it was a sporting gesture ... and tweets from most pros are suggesting the same

As for the 'good enough' for them comments etc ...sounds so prissy

we all know rules are broken on collusion every day with out pay back ..and they do give unfair advantage unlike this occasion

Or other breaches like the level crossing at PR ...that was so dangerous and no rider was DQd or penalized...

As for saying Clarke wouldn't help Aru or Contador ....would An Italian or a Spaniard help Froome or Porte ...that is suggesting that only the Aussies help their mates which is not true either and is bringing race into the equation which is at best unnecessary

But since you have ...think on this ...if it was Aru or even Contador would they have been penalized .....we all know the stories about previous Giros and helicopters for instance

pelevin

MPFG wrote: »

How has undermining the Australians got anything to do with this and is unnecessary ...

I actually felt it was a sporting gesture ... and tweets from most pros are suggesting the same

As for the 'good enough' for them comments etc ...sounds so prissy

we all know rules are broken on collusion every day with out pay back ..and they do give unfair advantage unlike this occasion

Or other breaches like the level crossing at PR ...that was so dangerous and no rider was DQd or penalized...

As for saying Clarke wouldn't help Aru or Contador ....would An Italian or a Spaniard help Froome or Porte ...that is suggesting that only the Aussies help their mates which is not true either and is bringing race into the equation which is at best unnecessary

But since you have ...think on this ...if it was Aru or even Contador would they have been penalized .....we all know the stories about previous Giros and helicopters for instance

God you're taking my very innocuous post very emotionally. They have a thing in cricket that the Aussies are particularly known for called sledging - I'd say they'd consider my post very mild indeed. The relevant cyclists are professionals & were in ignorance of a very basic rule. Their own cock-up. Getting excited about my 'prissy' comment is getting very side-tracked from the fact that through their own amateurish ignorance Porte has probably thrown away any chance of overall victory.

pelevin

pprendeville wrote: »

That seems an awful shame. One friend helping another and both get punished. Where's the justice in that. He lost plenty of time already, maybe a different story if he was to make gains from it.

The justice is that those are the rules. And it seems a pretty obvious rule at that.

To add, on this humble forum pretty much as soon as they were aware of it Pudsy & DarkGlasses pinpointed the wheel change from another team as cheating.

Pudsy33

MPFG wrote: »

How has undermining the Australians got anything to do with this and is unnecessary ...


As for saying Clarke wouldn't help Aru or Contador ....would An Italian or a Spaniard help Froome or Porte ...that is suggesting that only the Aussies help their mates which is not true either and is bringing race into the equation which is at best unnecessary

But since you have ...think on this ...if it was Aru or even Contador would they have been penalized .....we all know the stories about previous Giros and helicopters for instance

No, I dont believe an Italian or Spaniard would have helped Froome or Porte. And I'm sure a Spaniard would help Valverde or and Italian would help Nibali, but thats niether here nor there. Rule was broken, stupidly, and they paid for it. I feel bad for all involved but the rule is one which needs to be in place.

Darkglasses

Pudsy33 wrote: »

No, I dont believe an Italian or Spaniard would have helped Froome or Porte. And I'm sure a Spaniard would help Valverde or and Italian would help Nibali, but thats niether here nor there. Rule was broken, stupidly, and they paid for it. I feel bad for all involved but the rule is one which needs to be in place.

Not a situation we want. If you bring it to it's logical conclusion, it would make a mockery of the race. 27 man team vs. 18 man team. There has to be rules, which in this case are surprisingly explicit about what you can or can't do -



Thanks to inrng for their complete knowledge of the rulebook.

unichall

I don't think the rule needed to be enforced so strictly here. He wasn't going to lose time because he missed a break or some other racing incident, he had a mechanical and a mate helped him out, yes, against the rules but nothing worse than drafting team cars to get back on after a mechanical which is also against the rules but is accepted as the norm and never penalised.

If Nico had stopped and given Dan a wheel in LBL or any of the other one dayers and they were penalised we'd all be up in arms about the injustice

Pudsy33

As I saw someone tweet, Porte has 8 teammates (one of whom watched as Porte took an OGE wheel), 16 wheels to choose from, plus a race radio, a team car, and a neutral service car. It's a nonsense situation!

Darkglasses

Pudsy33 wrote: »

As I saw someone tweet, Porte has 8 teammates (one of whom watched as Porte took an OGE wheel), 16 wheels to choose from, plus a race radio, a team car, and a neutral service car. It's a nonsense situation!

Yep, that's the real calamity of the day for me. He would have legitimately lost more time if he had not broken a very explicit rule. That's why I've got no problem with today's decision. Break the rules to save time - take your punishment when you get caught. Break the rules for no gain - then we can consider discretion.

Inquitus

Darkglasses wrote: »

Yep, that's the real calamity of the day for me. He would have legitimately lost more time if he had not broken a very explicit rule. That's why I've got no problem with today's decision. Break the rules to save time - take your punishment when you get caught. Break the rules for no gain - then we can consider discretion.

There's a teammate of his with a bike with a front wheel in the picture above, had he not taken Clarkes wheel and taken his teammates he would have lost not additional time, its a nonsense.

Darkglasses

Inquitus wrote: »

There's a teammate of his with a bike with a front wheel in the picture above, had he not taken Clarkes wheel and taken his teammates he would have lost not additional time, its a nonsense.

Arrived after the wheel change has taken place. Just makes it even more foolish a thing to do if he was there at the same time.

Inquitus

It's quite clear people's opinion of Sky clouds matters in this regard, I doubt the same indignation would be prevalent in this thread if it was some other team.

Pudsy33

Inquitus wrote: »

There's a teammate of his with a bike with a front wheel in the picture above, had he not taken Clarkes wheel and taken his teammates he would have lost not additional time, its a nonsense.

It's even worse that there's a sky man there! Did Porte want a wheel and a tow!?

Pudsy33

Inquitus wrote: »

It's quite clear people's opinion of Sky clouds matters in this regard, I doubt the same indignation would be prevalent in this thread if it was some other team.

Ah here don't give me that. I would much prefer Porte to win than the other pair. A rule was broken and punishment was employed. It's really that simple.

Inquitus

Pudsy33 wrote: »

Ah here don't give me that. I would much prefer Porte to win than the other pair. A rule was broken and punishment was employed. It's really that simple.

I am not a big fan of punctures 3.1km to 5km from the end of a sprint stage deciding races regardless of who's affected, and in cycling the Comms get to pick and choose when to apply them, so it's not clear cut.