How to stop under bidder??

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 9:59am #1

We are bidding on a house the last few weeks and the under bidder takes generally a week to counter each time and increases the bid by just a few hundred. It's really really annoying and just seems like messing and that they aren't really serious. How do we put a stop to this? The houses is not cheap either.

Lellostag · 25-04-2015 10:21am

Easyliving wrote: »

We are bidding on a house in Rathfarnham the last few weeks and the under bidder takes generally a week to counter each time and increases the bid by just a few hundred. It's really really annoying and just seems like messing and that they aren't really serious. How do we put a stop to this? The houses is not cheap either.

Hi,

You could of course tell the estate agent that your last bid was final and that you are no longer interested in continuing this nonsense. With a bit of luck the other bidder will withdraw, provided he even exists...

Good luck!

ted1 · 25-04-2015 10:22am

Easyliving wrote: »

We are bidding on a house in Rathfarnham the last few weeks and the under bidder takes generally a week to counter each time and increases the bid by just a few hundred. It's really really annoying and just seems like messing and that they aren't really serious. How do we put a stop to this? The houses is not cheap either.

It's a game of hopscotch, every second bid received makes you the other bidder. Or underbidder.

Tell the Estate agent you'd like a desicion made with the next offer as your interested in another place and don't want to lose it because the vendors are dragging out the process

Geniass · 25-04-2015 10:25am

I see nothing wrong with what the other person is doing. Each of ye is the "under bidder" at some point if it's dragging out.

Asmooh · 25-04-2015 10:29am

i guess you are just asking way too much otherwise they would not underbid.

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 11:00am

We've tried all of the above before and lost out on other houses. If we say this is our last bid as we've done before they just have to ask the other bidder to just add a few quid and it's there's. I might try the "I'm interested in other places" on this but have done that before. We've bid on other houses before but never at such a slow speed from the other bidder with small amounts.

Geniass · 25-04-2015 11:15am

Easyliving wrote: »

We've tried all of the above before and lost out on other houses. If we say this is our last bid as we've done before they just have to ask the other bidder to just add a few quid and it's there's. I might try the "I'm interested in other places" on this but have done that before. We've bid on other houses before but never at such a slow speed from the other bidder with small amounts.

Both you and the other bidder (if they exist) are using a strategy to see if they can get the the property they want at the lowest price possible. Nothing wrong with that.

There is one way to bring this to a head. Offer the maximum you are willing to pay for the property. If they other person then offers €1 more than that then leave them have it. Nothing personal, they are just willing to pay more.

goz83 · 25-04-2015 11:27am

Just bid by an extra €100 each time, waiting a week before bidding. I think stealth bids should be outlawed. It allows EAs to inflate the prices with false interest. Each bidder should be a registered and credited bidder, tied into each bid.

davo10 · 25-04-2015 12:29pm

Op what you are experiencing is exactly what happens in all cases where there is more than one bidder. The other bidder is not the "underbidder", that title alternates between the two of you as long as you are both increasing your offer. Don't go with the advice above (€100), in most cases the minimum increase accepted is between €2-5k each time. If you want to end it one way or the other, either up the bid by €10k or bid whatever you are willing to pay for it. If that doesn't work then walk away.

By the way, if you want a quick bidding process, go to an auction like Allsops or Ganlys, the bidding process is over in minutes.

Idioteque · 25-04-2015 1:13pm

How much money are you going up in bids by each time?

galljga1 · 25-04-2015 1:16pm

Asmooh wrote: »

i guess you are just asking way too much otherwise they would not underbid.

What?

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 1:21pm

I was intially increasing by 1k but now it's at 500 each time and I think this may drop again but they are taking a week and I'm countering in a day. I'm thinking its some kind of delay tactics as we're coming to the end of the month and maybe they are paid and will have a few extra grand.

galljga1 · 25-04-2015 1:24pm

davo10 wrote: »

Op what you are experiencing is exactly what happens in all cases where there is more than one bidder. The other bidder is not the "underbidder", that title alternates between the two of you as long as you are both increasing your offer. Don't go with the advice above (€100), in most cases the minimum increase accepted is between €2-5k each time. If you want to end it one way or the other, either up the bid by €10k or bid whatever you are willing to pay for it. If that doesn't work then walk away.

By the way, if you want a quick bidding process, go to an auction like Allsops or Ganlys, the bidding process is over in minutes.

I did the 'blow them out of the water' bit. I increased the bid by 20K and that was it. It was back when we were all millionaires and the house we were selling was also going up in crazy leaps so it did not really matter. It depends on circumstances.

I would have a chat with the EA and push the final bid routine. You may have to go in with a strong bid. I would say the EA would just like to finalise the sale. The bulk of what he/she gets is already out there. Increasing the sale price by a couple of thou is not going to make that much of a difference to the EA. Dragging this out at this stage could actually be costing money.

Idioteque · 25-04-2015 1:29pm

Think about it this way...

lets say I'm the counter bidder and I have circa 10K left to bid. If you're going up in €1K and me €100, you're going to be waiting 10 weeks at least.

If you go €3 - 5K, at least you'll know where you stand with them much quicker - that'd be my tactic.

I suppose it's a trade-off between paying a few extra €K vs waiting it out much longer and getting it for as low as possible. One thing to consider though, is that the longer it's on the market, the increased risk of a new buyer coming along.

How much do you want the house and do you think you are at a 'fair' price for in in your opinion?

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 1:39pm

Idioteque wrote: »

Think about it this way...

How much do you want the house and do you think you are at a 'fair' price for in in your opinion?

I think it's at the maximum that it's worth now plus We're also pretty much at our limit. I'd have to borrow from someone to jump it up but I am considering this.

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 1:44pm

galljga1 wrote: »

I would have a chat with the EA and push the final bid routine. You may have to go in with a strong bid. I would say the EA would just like to finalise the sale. The bulk of what he/she gets is already out there. Increasing the sale price by a couple of thou is not going to make that much of a difference to the EA. Dragging this out at this stage could actually be costing money.

I'm going to the EA on Monday and will try turn the screws. Maybe say our offer is only on the table x amount of time. But I don't want to do this and then back track. We didn't really want to borrow from anyone else but may try put a shock bid in to close it.

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 1:49pm

I am also thinking about using the same tactic as the other bidder and doing the 100 quid jump and extending our response time if it feels more and more like a fake bidder.

Idioteque · 25-04-2015 1:50pm

Easyliving wrote: »

I think it's at the maximum that it's worth now plus We're also pretty much at our limit. I'd have to borrow from someone to jump it up but I am considering this.

Fair enough...it's a tough one when you like the place.

In my experience, it's best to walk away once you've already hit your 'prepared to pay' limit. I think you're better off just thinking about it from your perspective and not worrying about how much the other bidder has left.

If it's any help, I just went through a bidding war last week but despite the offer of additional money from family, we pulled out as we went to the max of what we though the place was worth and we would be happy to have paid.

Interestingly enough, since then, there's been a good few price drops in the area and some other houses have come up that make the property we were bidding on look way overpriced!

25-04-2015 1:53pm

The other bidder may be aware that you are in a hurry and is playing this against you. Thus he waits as long as he can and then ups the bid by a small amount.
One sugestion which might work is to ask the EA to get you both on the phones at the same time and do a mini auction to finalise the sale. This may suit the vendor as they may also be in a hurry.

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 1:57pm

Idioteque wrote: »

Interestingly enough, since then, there's been a good few price drops in the area and some other houses have come up that make the property we were bidding on look way overpriced!

Good advice, I've been waiting for the new rules to bite but so far I'm not seeing that happening in the houses we are interested in. We have approval under the new rules which I've mentioned to the EA but that doesn't seem to have had any impact.

davo10 · 25-04-2015 2:08pm

Easyliving wrote: »

I was intially increasing by 1k but now it's at 500 each time and I think this may drop again but they are taking a week and I'm countering in a day. I'm thinking its some kind of delay tactics as we're coming to the end of the month and maybe they are paid and will have a few extra grand.

No wonder this is going on so long, you haven't been able to kill off the other bidder with €1k bids but now you are going to try with bids of less than €500? All that is going to happen now is that the other bidder will see that you have reached your limit, are showing a weakening position so he/she will know one more big bid will see you off. You sound like you have not done this before whereas that other bidder is showing experience just waiting for you to burn out, either you go with a last bid for as much as you are willing to pay or walk away, going up now in hundreds is a waste of your time.

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 2:15pm

davo10 wrote: »

No wonder this is going on so long, you haven't been able to kill off the other bidder with €1k bids but now you are going to try with bids of less than €500? All that is going to happen now is that the other bidder will see that you have reached your limit, are showing a weakening position so he/she will know one more big bid will see you off. You sound like you have not done this before whereas that other bidder is showing experience just waiting for you to burn out, either you go with a last bid for as much as you are willing to pay or walk away, going up now in hundreds is a waste of your time.

No it's the opposite. They have lowered their bids to 500s and are taking 7days to counter. Where our bids have been strong and we have countered within one day. We'd be considered the more agressive bidder.

BabySlam · 25-04-2015 2:18pm

walk away much wiser.

next time write the EA a first and final offer with 48 hours to accept or reject; acceptance means no new viewers, it comes off the market. Be perfectly ready to walk away - there are few unique houses.

James 007 · 25-04-2015 2:20pm

davo10 wrote: »

...........going up now in hundreds is a waste of your time.

Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
..............:)

cpoh1 · 25-04-2015 2:21pm

The reason the other bidder is going up in small bids is more than likely because they know they can afford the house and are prepared to pay above what the current bids are at. They are thinking why bid more than we have to when we know we can burn these people off regardless.

You seem to be at your limit so unfortunately it looks like ye are out with this house. Just go to your maximum bid and then walk away.

davo10 · 25-04-2015 2:21pm

Easyliving wrote: »

No it's the opposite. They have lowered their bids to 500s and are taking 7days to counter. Where our bids have been strong and we have countered within one day. We'd be considered the more agressive bidder.

Except you are now reducing yours and they keep coming back. Have either of you upped the bid by a sizeable amount (€10k+) at any stage?

mikom · 25-04-2015 2:22pm

Is there no "Buy it Now" option?

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 2:24pm

James 007 wrote: »

Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
..............:)

Hahaha

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 2:27pm

I'm going to wrap it up from my side Monday. I'll talk to the EA get the vibe and put an ultimatum that they except my offer now or I'm walking.

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 2:30pm

davo10 wrote: »

Except you are now reducing yours and they keep coming back. Have either of you upped the bid by a sizeable amount (€10k+) at any stage?

I think a 10k jump is stupid as we are past the asking and the new rules are starting to bite. This is the first house we've been on with just us and one other bidder and it's in a more desirable area than other houses we've bid on in the past.

cpoh1 · 25-04-2015 2:39pm

Easyliving wrote: »

I'm going to wrap it up from my side Monday. I'll talk to the EA get the vibe and put an ultimatum that they except my offer now or I'm walking.

That wont work. The house is going to go to the person who is willing to pay the most, they will just go back to the other bidder with an offer to increas.

My advice: try to convince the EA that you are the better prospect as a buyer. Have approval, engineer and solicitor lined up, know the issues with the house so unlikely to have any survey issues or reductions. This may be a factor if there is nothing between bids...

davo10 · 25-04-2015 2:41pm

Easyliving wrote: »

I think a 10k jump is stupid as we are past the asking and the new rules are starting to bite. This is the first house we've been on with just us and one other bidder and it's in a more desirable area than other houses we've bid on in the past.

Asking price has nothing to do with purchase price, it is just the "sticker" the EA puts on the property, the actual price is what the highest bidder is willing to pay for it. Many vendors (including myself) will put a property on the market for less than we know it will sell for just to get buyers interested in the properties. Forget the rules, you have another bidder involved in this so the new rules do not apply here. Bidding €10k more is not stupid provided you can afford to do it, expecting any other result than you getting at the moment by going up in €500s is stupid, an extra €500 on a €250k house is nothing, each time it happens both parties think "ah sure it's only €500" whereas €5k focuses the mind.

James 007 · 25-04-2015 2:44pm

Easyliving wrote: »

I'm going to wrap it up from my side Monday. I'll talk to the EA get the vibe and put an ultimatum that they except my offer now or I'm walking.

No, I would throw an extra €10 grand on the house, let the other bidder out bid you and then walk away. Even if they walk away, you just put some thought into it, and then walk away. Just tell the estate agent that another property has taken your interest.

davo10 · 25-04-2015 2:48pm

James 007 wrote: »

No, I would throw an extra €10 grand on the house, let the other bidder out bid you and then walk away. Even if they walk away, you just put some thought into it, and then walk away. Just tell the estate agent that another property has taken your interest.

And then the EA goes back to the underbidder at their last offer and if OP likes another house in that area with the same EA office, the op will not be take seriously. Great advice.

Mezcita · 25-04-2015 2:57pm

James 007 wrote: »

Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
Other bidder: + €100
One week passes
You: + €1
..............:)

That's actually a good idea though.

You have to presume that the people who own the house actually want to sell it. Therefore if they just see incremental bids over the course of a few weeks they might ask for best and final offers to get the place sold.

ted1 · 25-04-2015 3:02pm

Easyliving wrote: »

I am also thinking about using the same tactic as the other bidder and doing the 100 quid jump and extending our response time if it feels more and more like a fake bidder.

A couple of hundred isn't a fake bidder, the commission at that stage is neglible. It's a prudent buyer, I went up in hundreds buying my house. Tricked the estate agent into thinking I was at the top of my budget and was getting the extra bits of friends and family

Emsloe · 25-04-2015 3:24pm

OP what position is the seller in, as in have they somewhere to go? When I was selling it would have driven me stir crazy to have two bidders constantly coming in with counter offers with only a few hundred euro between them and then dragging it out 7+ days at a time. Unless you're buying from a deceased's estate or someone who has time and money to burn the whole thing sounds a little suspicious to me.

davo10 · 25-04-2015 3:41pm

Emsloe wrote: »

OP what position is the seller in, as in have they somewhere to go? When I was selling it would have driven me stir crazy to have two bidders constantly coming in with counter offers with only a few hundred euro between them and then dragging it out 7+ days at a time. Unless you're buying from a deceased's estate or someone who has time and money to burn the whole thing sounds a little suspicious to me.

Why does it sound suspicious to you? This sounds typical of how most bidding processes go, experienced bidders would have realised that if the bids are going up in hundreds, a bid of thousands would draw it to a hasty conclusion.

James 007 · 25-04-2015 4:08pm

davo10 wrote: »

And then the EA goes back to the underbidder at their last offer and if OP likes another house in that area with the same EA office, the op will not be take seriously. Great advice.

I don't believe so. The OP could easily say that they were out bid on that property too. However the only thing that it is doing, it is actually showing your hand plus another €10 grand to the Estate Agent. Agents will always take up a higher offer I would think. An updated mortgage approval letter would be a serious enough card to show the Agent prior to the bidding process.

CIARAN_BOYLE · 25-04-2015 5:08pm

There is numerous things that the ea could do to bring this to a quick close, the fact that he hasn't suggests the seller is in no hurry to move

Geniass · 25-04-2015 5:46pm

OP,

This is being dragged out. It sounds like you are near your limit (borrowing more that you had hopped)

It seems to me the other bidder is just keeping the bidding process ticking over. They expect to get it, but want to keep it as low as possible.

Keep looking at other houses in the mean time.

Sala · 25-04-2015 5:49pm

If you are very near your limit decide on the max you can and want to pay, offer it as your final bid, if they counterbid you can't afford it anyway, and if you're already near your limit you won't be spending much more than you would if you got it at the current bid

davo10 · 25-04-2015 6:01pm

James 007 wrote: »

I don't believe so. The OP could easily say that they were out bid on that property too. However the only thing that it is doing, it is actually showing your hand plus another €10 grand to the Estate Agent. Agents will always take up a higher offer I would think. An updated mortgage approval letter would be a serious enough card to show the Agent prior to the bidding process.

Ah, of course it shows your hand, it also forces the other bidder to show his/hers. The €10k doesn't go to the estate agent. An updated letter certainly helps but money talks and at the moment every time op makes a small increased bid, the other bidder just adds another small bit on, and on, and on......

Emsloe · 25-04-2015 8:42pm

davo10 wrote: »

Why does it sound suspicious to you? This sounds typical of how most bidding processes go, experienced bidders would have realised that if the bids are going up in hundreds, a bid of thousands would draw it to a hasty conclusion.

Suspicious in so much as if the seller had somewhere to go, and the bids are being dragged out as the OP says for a week or so by the other side each time, and only for a few hundred euro at a time, they (they seller) would grow tired of it and go to final bids. The fact that they're happy enough to let it drag on for what sounds like weeks and really be only a couple of grand further along sounds odd, unless the OP is buying from the parties I mentioned. That's why it sounds suspicious to me.

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 11:43pm

I'm not sure of the sellers position, I did ask the other week if they would be happy to close as we have passed the asking and the EA said yes. I did also think our approval under the new rules was a strong card but has seemed to have no impact on things. I think we will jump it by a a few grand again and then leave it at that. I just want to see where the other bidder is at after our last offer. Good advice though everyone thanks, a lot to consider.

MarkAnthony · 25-04-2015 11:48pm

TBH you first mistake was coming back faster than the other bidder. If it takes them 7 days, take 10 yourself.

pablo128 · 25-04-2015 11:49pm

How about trying to find the other bidder, and offering them 2k to basically f. off? They have 2k more for their deposit, and you get the house. Win win.

Easyliving · 25-04-2015 11:52pm

pablo128 wrote: »

How about trying to find the other bidder, and offering them 2k to basically f. off? They have 2k more for their deposit, and you get the house. Win win.

Not sure how I'd go about this?

And coming back in ten days it would even be more painfully slow

MarkAnthony · 25-04-2015 11:54pm

Easyliving wrote: »

Not sure how I'd go about this?

And coming back in ten days it would even be more painfully slow

Pain is a relative concept. If I had a bidder that kept coming back I'd be very tempted to see how far I could push it. In all honesty I think you're bidding against yourself. If you want a fast process go in with 50K more.

Eugene Norman · 25-04-2015 11:56pm

davo10 wrote: »

Ah, of course it shows your hand, it also forces the other bidder to show his/hers. The €10k doesn't go to the estate agent. An updated letter certainly helps but money talks and at the moment every time op makes a small increased bid, the other bidder just adds another small bit on, and on, and on......

You are basically suggesting as a smart buyer he should max out. That's paying more than he wants.

mad m · 25-04-2015 11:58pm

pablo128 wrote: »

How about trying to find the other bidder, and offering them 2k to basically f. off? They have 2k more for their deposit, and you get the house. Win win.

What a completely stupid idea......

OP do as others suggested, take your time. Counter offer by a little as possible. The EA knows he is in a win win situation. They love a bidding war.

How to stop under bidder??

Comments