Part-time farming!! Is it worth it.

Feckthis

Farming part-time here and work full time. Is it worth it?? I don't know I can honestly say if the farm was definitely losing money every year id still keep the few sheep and sucklers , which it isn't to be fair as I enjoy it too much. What's your situation and do you think that it's worth it? Financially wise, time wise.

epfff

Feckthis wrote: »

Farming part-time here and work full time. Is it worth it?? I don't know I can honestly say if the farm was definitely losing money every year id still keep the few sheep and sucklers , which it isn't to be fair as I enjoy it too much. What's your situation and do you think that it's worth it? Financially wise, time wise.

Me thinking its near time to give up too

Feckthis

epfff wrote: »

Me thinking its near time to give up too

Ah keep the faith. . Not thinking of giving up. Just looking at what other people think on the matter. Have the oul fella here which is a big help. Couldn't be done here without him.

Kovu

Whatever about the money side of it, it's a lot healthier than sitting in watching the tv. I can honestly say that my father would pine away if we sold the farm. Even if it's just tipping away every day for an hour or so, there's great satisfaction out of it and instills a bit of moxie into you to keep going.

Those with young families though must find it a bit more difficult as it takes time away from the kids.

Miname

It's something I can't see myself not doing anymore. Time wise it can be tough but it has its own merits too.

Reggie.

Part timer here. It's really only a hobby atm unless the main farm comes my way then I might have to look at it more seriously.

Love farming and will continue to farm in whatever scale into the future

grassroot1

If I am going to stay at it there will have to be changes, the work load in spring is becoming oppressive for the return. I have sucklers and sheep, dry cattle might be easier workload wise but I would find it difficult to see a margin there. Keep plugging away I suppose.

C0N0R

Have a manager on the dairy unit here who works Monday to Friday and then dad who worked Full time did the weekend, it's looking like I'll probably so the same thing, sometimes I wonder if it's what I really want. But going forward I hope to employ someone to do some of the Weekend milking especially once dad isn't able to help me as much. While I'm Young and single it's OK but I don't think I'll be allowed get away with it all my life either!

CloughCasey1

What else would we be at! Some of my mates spend money on cars, others on beer. I'll stick to what I'm at

Jb1989

CloughCasey1 wrote: »

What else would we be at! Some of my mates spend money on cars, others on beer. I'll stick to what I'm at

Same as here, just like the farmer who won the million in the lottery , and said he'd farm away till it was all gone.

Timmaay

C0N0R wrote: »

Have a manager on the dairy unit here who works Monday to Friday and then dad who worked Full time did the weekend, it's looking like I'll probably so the same thing, sometimes I wonder if it's what I really want. But going forward I hope to employ someone to do some of the Weekend milking especially once dad isn't able to help me as much. While I'm Young and single it's OK but I don't think I'll be allowed get away with it all my life either!

What do you work at? And what sort of cow numbers? Dropped back to part time only here outside of the spring is my aim moving forward, how achievable that is I don't know yet, something similar like getting in a Milker 1/2 the time will probably be what I'll aim for.

cjpm

Going to keep farming away until all my money is gone....

Bleating Lamb

Biggest problem (apart from lack of profit from PT farming) is that it takes your focus away from the family....at busy times like lambing time I know I'm a grumpy sleep deprived PT farmer! On most typical part time setups if you actually factored in labour costs for your own hours each year the end of year figures would look fairly depressing.

C0N0R

Timmaay wrote: »

What do you work at? And what sort of cow numbers? Dropped back to part time only here outside of the spring is my aim moving forward, how achievable that is I don't know yet, something similar like getting in a Milker 1/2 the time will probably be what I'll aim for.

I'm back in ag college atm but will go back to sales once that's finished. 60 cows liquid milk system

joejobrien

Bleating Lamb wrote: »

Biggest problem (apart from lack of profit from PT farming) is that it takes your focus away from the family....at busy times like lambing time I know I'm a grumpy sleep deprived PT farmer! On most typical part time setups if you actually factored in labour costs for your own hours each year the end of year figures would look fairly depressing.

Fulltime here, but had a part time job . so I can speak with some certainty.
1. kills family life... so much to be done on Saturday and often carries into Sunday.....ah it only a few hours:D
2.Often your so busy , You cant see the woods from the trees.
3.Strictly it should stand up on it own...to incl labour but often doesnt
4. Have anyone ever considered a rental charge to be added? now also new tax incentives arrangements????
5. If those 2 thing were stacked the majority would be in NEG.
6. OFTEN IT IS A WAY OUT/TIME OFF/ RELAXATION FOR MANY. This is a completely different horse now.
7. Most of the posters on this thread are genuine and realalistic but some may offer advice that does not encompass all issues . I sympatise with most concerns, but pay pack on a weekly arrangement outweighs MOST TIMES vs. PT . It become a personel choice

Username John

Part timer with a few sheep here, lambing em at the minute.

Had all the issues described here - biggest one prob time- eating into family time, always feeling like you have too much to do, whilst getting nothing done, plus no real financial return...

This year I let out a good bit of the place on a long term lease. It'll be tax free, and that money won't go near the farm - as tis all too easy to find something to spend money on when farming.

Kept a few acres around the house, and still have a few sheep. But the workload should be less... Still have a few jobs to do, bit reclaiming, etc...

But this should give me a bit more money plus hopefully less time on the farm... And really hoping will give a better work life balance...
We'll see I guess....

onyerbikepat

I was wondering the very same thing myself this weekend. I managed to get away for one night to a stag. It was a two night stag and wasn't sure if I could even make it for a night, with cows calving etc. The morning I was going I had to get up early and get a few hours done before I went. This 7 days a week thing can really drain you. Still it does keep you fit. I had an old relative passed away recently and he was out farming every day till he died and he was well into his eighties.

Belongamick

I would have to agree with all of the above.
I have four kids from seven years old down to two years so time farming part time is difficult.
The biggest plus is the 'clear your head' time that comes from the few hours on the farm. The biggest negative is time away from family.
Profit wise - target is a modest family holiday in summer.
It really annoys me that tax has to be paid on a modest income - if I was to pay myself the minimum hourly rate for the time spent there would be no profit. Part time farmers are essentially 'caretaker' farmers - prevent the countryside from reverting to nature. There should be a part time farmers tax free allowance of 5K per year, over which you pay the normal rate.

Dickie10

what is a "worth it amount of profit to make"? odo lads usually make a profit or just break even.? by this i mean say take away gross money in before tax from expenditure. is that what your income is? or is your income just whatever money you get in before expenditure, in our place expenditure is everything from Tesco to ESB,Phone Car etc is that what most people calculate?

grazeaway

Part time here too and until all the cattle are out full time Tis a slog. Wouldn't be able to it without the boss man. I do the evening shift with the cows and calves so it usually about 7 when I'm back in the door, that's a full 12 hours from when I leave in the moring for work. Saturdays are the same and Sundays I might only "work" for a few hours. That said I couldn't leave the farm.

Once the days get longer and the cattle are out it is a whole lot easier. Not sure what the future holds TBH. Farm dosent make much money once everything is paid ( pay rent to the folks as other then their oap's they have no income).

Have looked at moving from sucklers to dairy as TBH winter and spring work load is the same but for the other 6-7 months there is more time to enjoy the farm and other things. I would need to employ someone to milk the cows and also need more contractors as apart from my 9-5(well 7-4:30ish) I would need to put proper time aside to manage the farm. If the holding was bigger then that might be a runner but I'm not in a position to buy more land. I would be more inclined to invest in what I have 1st then look to expand.

I expect the dairy industry to go mental for a year or 2 before things settle down and the farmers and processors figure out what's what in the open market. I reckon 2017/2018 might be better for looking at milking again. What may be a runner might be share milking but partnership would need to be right for both sides.

case5130

What ever little profit there is still rather see my money in the field than in a pint glass ...

CloughCasey1

Dickie10 wrote: »

what is a "worth it amount of profit to make"? odo lads usually make a profit or just break even.? by this i mean say take away gross money in before tax from expenditure. is that what your income is? or is your income just whatever money you get in before expenditure, in our place expenditure is everything from Tesco to ESB,Phone Car etc is that what most people calculate?

This is the way I look at it. My main job looks after house mortgages car and van.any bit of spare cash is used on farm. If I buy a good continental sucks for 350 and at 16 mts I usually get anywhere between 950 and 1150 depending on animal. As pudsy does always say it costs 350 to rear for year and an extra 50 to bring to 16mts the store route. That leaves on average 650. Now with costs and everything associated like sheds over time, silage, straw, vets, diesel, depreciation of machinery, meal of course and fencing etc. etc. Lets say there is 200 from each animal × 20 is 4000. Output at 850 x 20 is 17000 if my maths are right. What bank will give you 21k back on a 17k investment?? Maybe my views are different as was not born into this place and having worked on uncles and neighbours farms all my youth enjoy the fact I have been let use a corner of land here. Maybe when some lads are looking at it all their lives the find it a burden. For me it's going to replace playing football when the mind finally gives into the body and hopefully with less broken bones.

eoinmk2

anyone know how labour saving the milking robots are? are they labour saving enough to part time farm?

Dickie10

if you had €20,000 profit at the end of the year after tax, that wouldnt be too bad or would that be below average? thats after stuf is paid for

Username John

Dickie10 wrote: »

if you had €20,000 profit at the end of the year after tax, that wouldnt be too bad or would that be below average? thats after stuf is paid for

Have a look here for some info Dickie, it's 2013 data, but it'll give you an idea...
http://www.teagasc.ie/publications/2014/3179/NFS_2013_final.pdf

ravima

I threw in the towel.

Full time farming with a profitable income is worth it, but part time and struggling is a different matter.

larrymiller

Dickie10 wrote: »

if you had €20,000 profit at the end of the year after tax, that wouldnt be too bad or would that be below average? thats after stuf is paid for

You'd be making a lot more than some full time lads

Dickie10

its just that im getting hard to get a picture of what im doing wrong or right , its not a subject you can ask someone about personally, i can do better i know with calf mortality etc but had a bad doind with ecoli on lambs this year. i asked the accountant what he made of the figures and he was kind of, eh meh! i think it was 24,000, but then he condemned me because he said there would be a big tax bill! WTF? what exactly is the aim of this game?!

Muckit

Belongamick wrote: »

There should be a part time farmers tax free allowance of 5K per year, over which you pay the normal rate.

I think this is an excellent idea! But I can never see it happening!

grazeaway

eoinmk2 wrote: »

anyone know how labour saving the milking robots are? are they labour saving enough to part time farm?

Yes and no. They will reduce milking time but are geared to 60-70 cows per robot. However they are robots and will get kicked so will need to be checked and reset from Time to time. It's not really a solution where you can just go away for the day and leave them to their own devices.

Where they will make a difference is where you have a good set up with paddocks and grassland management, and if it's setup well it allows more fixable time for other jobs like calves and school runs.

Former workmate of mine packed in his job to farm full time. Put in robot for his cows and kept the tillage side but main reason was so that he could do the school run and mind the kids while his wife was in work.

Bullocks

I think there will be a different answer for everyone here depending on what they want out of it but if it's taking up every spare hour after work and during family time then it's going to get boring and sickening eventually no matter how much you like it and something will have to give ( the dogs teeth or the tinkers leg ! )
I'll be sticking with it as I enjoy it and the father does alot at the minute anyhow so I don't have to be there every day . If he wasn't around there would be labour saving changes made and I still wouldn't be under pressure part time .
I reckon alot of part timers spend too much on their farms in the line of machinery and sheds that aren't needed and would be better keeping things more extensive and labour free where at all possible . There are much smaller farms than ours around us here that have the finest of new tractors , sheds , jeeps and machinery that couldn't possibly be paid for out of what the farm is turning but they keep at it and will be the first to cry about the bad price for weanlins .....

Sami23

This is a great thread as I often think the same myself. Work full time, farm part time. I've a 13 month old baby and find I am always rushing especially when stock are housed. Get home from work, eat as quick as possible, tear out to feed and check animals, rush back in for bedtime (late for that sometimes).
Did try waiting inside till baby gone to bed so could spend time with them and go out then but that way by time I'm back in its pretty much bed time.
Then try to get all other done on Saturday's meaning I pretty much don't see the baby at all and when I do get in I'm wrecked. Spend Sunday's with the missus and baby alright but as always there's at least an hour's work to be done outside too.
Can understand other halfs frustration at times when I'm 'always' gone out farming or so I'm told.

As matter of interest how does yer wives, girlfriends or partners view the amount of time ye are spending farming for the money ye are making in return part time ????

AntrimGlens

Sami23 wrote: »

As matter of interest how does yer wives, girlfriends or partners view the amount of time ye are spending farming for the money ye are making in return part time ????

I've spent most of the past 3 weeks kipping on the sofa from about 2am to 5am and then back into the lambing shed only seeing the wife when i've to rush back for 7 when she's going out the door to work so i can get the kids their breakfast before i rush to work at 8 usually without breakfast. I'm home for 6 and straight into the sheep house or round the ewes and lambs in the fields and back into the house for dinner for say 7.30, if theres nothing lambing to say goodnight to the kids then back out to get lambs into bonding pens for the morning for turnout.

She's not amused and as a business woman asks what am i thinking working every night, every saturday and ocassional sunday for nothing. I've no answer to the straight economics of it, no matter how much I have a gra for it. I know she's right but shurre:rolleyes:

darragh_haven

Sami23 wrote: »

This is a great thread as I often think the same myself. Work full time, farm part time. I've a 13 month old baby and find I am always rushing especially when stock are housed. Get home from work, eat as quick as possible, tear out to feed and check animals, rush back in for bedtime (late for that sometimes).
Did try waiting inside till baby gone to bed so could spend time with them and go out then but that way by time I'm back in its pretty much bed time.
Then try to get all other done on Saturday's meaning I pretty much don't see the baby at all and when I do get in I'm wrecked. Spend Sunday's with the missus and baby alright but as always there's at least an hour's work to be done outside too.
Can understand other halfs frustration at times when I'm 'always' gone out farming or so I'm told.

As matter of interest how does yer wives, girlfriends or partners view the amount of time ye are spending farming for the money ye are making in return part time ????

just after having our second child here on Patrick's day. My OH more or less told me a few years ago if i do more than a half day on the farm on Saturday (bar the occasional Saturday ) that i could visit my children when the courts dictate. she would understand if it was my full time job and was the main income.... but its neither.

arctictree

AntrimGlens wrote: »

I've spent most of the past 3 weeks kipping on the sofa from about 2am to 5am and then back into the lambing shed only seeing the wife when i've to rush back for 7 when she's going out the door to work so i can get the kids their breakfast before i rush to work at 8 usually without breakfast. I'm home for 6 and straight into the sheep house or round the ewes and lambs in the fields and back into the house for dinner for say 7.30, if theres nothing lambing to say goodnight to the kids then back out to get lambs into bonding pens for the morning for turnout.

She's not amused and as a business woman asks what am i thinking working every night, every saturday and ocassional sunday for nothing. I've no answer to the straight economics of it, no matter how much I have a gra for it. I know she's right but shurre:rolleyes:

Sounds a bit like my life at the moment! But once lambing is done its really just half a day at the weekends and a half hour or so each evening just checking stock. TBH though, if there is no action in the shed, I leave them until the morning. Have had only one loss this year so far due to me not being there. (Some say that's too much but you need a quality of life).

Panch18

Seems to me the problem here is that ye part time lads are doing sucklers, sheep, a combination of both - or even more mental is dairy.

for the love of god - go down the dry stock route will ye

amacca

Also try not to let yere wives tell ye what to do as much if at all possible! :pac::pac:

darragh_haven

amacca wrote: »

Also try not to let yere wives tell ye what to do as much if at all possible! :pac::pac:

My Oh says we are rearing our kids. Not just her.

Mulumpy

I'm one of the few mad ones milking with a full time job. I have a good lad helping me in the spring and 5 to 6 milkings a week but it's still extremely tough going. Have a young family and despite a very understanding wife, it really is a struggle getting time to spend with them.

Bullocks

amacca wrote: »

Also try not to let yere wives tell ye what to do as much if at all possible! :pac::pac:

I used to think like that once .... and then the wife came along !

onyerbikepat

and to think they are well-abled people out there that never worked a day in their lives, even during the boom. They're the first people then to tell you what's wrong with the country.

Reggie.

Bullocks wrote: »

I used to think like that once .... and then the wife came along !

Same as that. Put manners on me

CloughCasey1

Reggie. wrote: »

Same as that. Put manners on me

That's what they do.try to change all the badness out of ya they fell for in first place!! I bring the kids out feeding calves and other small jobs away from stock and machinery as many evenings as I can so gives herself a break and tis nice spending time with them outsidein fresh air rather than glued to tv.

AP2014

Part time farming is def worth it if done right. Claim as many grants as ya can and do as little work as possible. Drystock might be the way forward. If nothing else it will get you out of the house and you won't have to listen to herself and the kids.

A lot of lads here seem to be pussy whipped by the other halves, jaysus lads grow a pair! Rearing kids is womans work.

whelan2

AP2014 wrote: »

Part time farming is def worth it if done right. Claim as many grants as ya can and do as little work as possible. Drystock might be the way forward. If nothing else it will get you out of the house and you won't have to listen to herself and the kids.

A lot of lads here seem to be pussy whipped by the other halves, jaysus lads grow a pair! Rearing kids is womans work.

do you have an other half or kids?

AntrimGlens

AP2014 wrote: »

Part time farming is def worth it if done right. Claim as many grants as ya can and do as little work as possible. Drystock might be the way forward. If nothing else it will get you out of the house and you won't have to listen to herself and the kids.

A lot of lads here seem to be pussy whipped by the other halves, jaysus lads grow a pair! Rearing kids is womans work.

AP - no harm to you son but you really come across on this forum as either a gob****e or a troll? :rolleyes:
You obviously know as much about relationships as you do about farming.

CloughCasey1

whelan2 wrote: »

do you have an other half or kids?

Anyone who spouts s***e like that doesn't have a pair never mind a wife and kids.

AP2014

whelan2 wrote: »

do you have an other half or kids?

AntrimGlens wrote: »

AP - no harm to you son but you really come across on this forum as either a gob****e or a troll? :rolleyes:
You obviously know as much about relationships as you do about farming.

CloughCasey1 wrote: »

Anyone who spouts s***e like that doesn't have a pair never mind a wife and kids.

Too easy lads, happy April fools day.

ihatewinter

AP2014 wrote: »

Part time farming is def worth it if done right. Claim as many grants as ya can and do as little work as possible. Drystock might be the way forward. If nothing else it will get you out of the house and you won't have to listen to herself and the kids.

A lot of lads here seem to be pussy whipped by the other halves, jaysus lads grow a pair! Rearing kids is womans work.

What century do you fecking live in. I suppose farming is man's work and you'll tell Whelan and myself to get back into the kitchen. Just because lads on here care about their other half and children, tells you something of their character.

AP2014

ihatewinter wrote: »

What century do you fecking live in. I suppose farming is man's work and you'll tell Whelan and myself to get back into the kitchen. Just because lads on here care about their other half and children, tells you something of their character.

See post above :P

Kovu

I dunno about where you're from AP, but April Fools day usually involved pranks and funny wind ups to me, not the slagging off of others