Alcohol-free pub

The Moldy Gowl

Zippie84 wrote: »

I don't really see how the issue of driving comes into it. I didn't read the information on it as the target audience being people who drink and who want to drink but have to drive.

The target audience was described as non-drinkers / people who specifically want a non-drinking environment, so I don't see how the driving vs public transport comes into it, since the target audience seems to be people who wouldn't be drinking anyhow, no matter what establishment they go to...

And how big is that target audience?? Very small compared to people who like having a few cans and going to a gig and going home but don't want to pay 20 euro for a taxi so drive instead.
I know a lot more of them than non drinkers

Lapin

Trigger Happy wrote: »

But I would have thought that for this to work you would need a sizable population of non-drinkers.........

Is there enough of that target audience to make this a success?

Not in Glasgow.

Shenshen

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

And how big is that target audience?? Very small compared to people who like having a few cans and going to a gig and going home but don't want to pay 20 euro for a taxi so drive instead.
I know a lot more of them than non drinkers

Wouldn't those guys be more likely to simply have a designated driver? So you'd have a group of 20, 19 of whom will want alcohol, and one guy who doesn't get a choice.

I think the demographic in a city will be more likely to support a niche place like this. There simply is a much greater absolute number of people, so the small percentage of those who would be interested in an alcohol free pub will translate in a higher number overall.
I don't know enough about Glasgow to predict success of failure of this venture, but as I said before, it would be nice if there were a few such places around.

Zippie84

Seems there's an alcohol-free nightclub in Templebar called Flux

https://www.facebook.com/fluxdublin

Not sure if anyone knows much about it, but seems it's been on the go since at least early 2013.

rubadub

Duckworth_Luas wrote: »

We had one of those in my home town

It was called a cafe

and so is this...

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

So it's a cafe with late opening hours?? Why dosent she just stop being so pretentious and just open a cafe until late.

She calls it a cafe, the name of the place even has cafe in the title, Cafe GRO. The only person who called it a pub was the journalist.

They have had this here near me, pubs opening on good friday and serving no drink.

Zippie84

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

And how big is that target audience?? Very small compared to people who like having a few cans and going to a gig and going home but don't want to pay 20 euro for a taxi so drive instead.
I know a lot more of them than non drinkers

I'm obviously not gonna be in a position to know much about their target audience, not being the one who's set it up (I doubt either of our opinions would be hugely well informed compared to those behind it) - but I'd obviously hope that like any sensible business person they've done plenty of market research before going into it.

Zippie84

Slightly old article, but this gives a bit more of a background to it

http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/donna-wants-to-open-scotlands-first-dry-bar-in-glasgow-134501n.21973506

The 52-year-old, from the Gorbals, said: "There are between 15,000 and 20,000 people in Glasgow alone who are in recovery from addictions and they have got nowhere to go and socialise.

"There is nowhere for them to go that is free from alcohol. There is nothing like this in Scotland.

"There is alcohol everywhere, and for a lot of people, first it could be a temptation for them going out where there is alcohol, but also, it is really boring going out with people who are drinking because you are not on the same level as them."

Glasgow's dry bar - which Donna is thinking of calling The Next Step after the well known 12-step addiction recovery programme - will follow in the footsteps of The Brink in Liverpool.

That dry bar opened two years ago and has attracted top acts and Donna hopes similar big names will perform music, theatre and spoken word at her club.

She says her venue will serve alcohol-free fruit juices and cocktails, good food, and will be open from 8am until 10pm during the week and from 8am until 3am at weekends.

Betty Bloggs

I think it's a great idea. I drink and will often get drunk too when I do, but usually only go out drinking a few times a year. So don't mind drink really, have a good bit of craic and all when I do have a few. However have no interest anymore in drinking every single week. One night out every 2-3 months is ok for me.

I would however go out more often socially if there was a place like this nearby me. It would be a nice place to go after late cinema, or after a meal where you don't feel like going home but don't fancy going to a regular pub where everybody is pissed either. They could broadcast the sporting events too for people who were interested. I also like thee idea of the quizzes and music and and a good non alcohol menu like another poster suggested and maybe some light bite meals or snacks would be good too.

I wouldn't see it the same as a regular cafe or restaurant if it had late opening hours, music sessions, quizzes, aired sporting events, and had a menu with interesting non alcohol drinks.
Pool table and darts too and I'd be quite happy.

mickstupp

I'd love a place like that near me. Cafes round here shut at 6.30 at the latest, which is utterly useless to me. Never heard of a cafe in Ireland that had live gigs or events either. I'd love to see some live music in town without having to be surrounded drink and people drinking. Or even just to get home from work and feel like I could go out for a while without it being in a pub.

Can't see that there'd be enough of a regular clientele though. Not in this country.

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

She is gonna have gigs there too?? Yeah, cafés do that as well.

Where? I'd love to go to a cafe that put on live gigs from local bands, no booze involved. That'd be brilliant.

Egginacup

Why does there have to be no alcohol in the place?

Why not serve low-alcohol beer as well? Not the alcohol free shit like Kaliber or Buckler but stuff that has maybe 1.5-2% instead of 5%. I have tried the alcohol free stuff and it's appalling. But the low-grade pish isn't bad and I'd happily guzzle down 7 pints of the stuff and only have the effects of 2 regular pints.

Mint Aero

Utterly stupid idea.

Zippie84

Egginacup wrote: »

Why does there have to be no alcohol in the place?

Why not serve low-alcohol beer as well? Not the alcohol free shit like Kaliber or Buckler but stuff that has maybe 1.5-2% instead of 5%. I have tried the alcohol free stuff and it's appalling. But the low-grade pish isn't bad and I'd happily guzzle down 7 pints of the stuff and only have the effects of 2 regular pints.

Well if a big part of their target market is recovering alcoholics then I guess there's part of your answer right there.

wretcheddomain

A pub is not a pub unless it has alcohol.

You can call it any of the following:

• A Pioneers Parlour
• A Late Night Café

But you may not call it:

• A Pub

bb1234567

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

So it's a cafe with late opening hours?? Why dosent she just stop being so pretentious and just open a cafe until late. Nothing stopping her, except her holier than thou attitude

There is a very different atmosphere in a late night cafe to a pub. Why do you think start bucks in stephens green isn't thought of as a fun nightlife place for pioneers seeing as its open 24 hours a day?

bb1234567

bb1234567 wrote: »

There is a very different atmosphere in a late night cafe to a pub. Why do you think start bucks in stephens green isn't thought of as a fun nightlife place for pioneers seeing as its open 24 hours a day?

And the reason for the different atmosphere is mostly due to people drinking so an alcohol free bar will just feel like a cafe.

Zippie84

Giuliana Limited Soap wrote: »

And the reason for the different atmosphere is mostly due to people drinking so an alcohol free bar will just feel like a cafe.

I personally don't get why. When I'm with groups of people in pubs but who aren't drinking alcohol it doesn't feel anything like a cafe.

humanji

Egginacup wrote: »

Why does there have to be no alcohol in the place?

Why not serve low-alcohol beer as well? Not the alcohol free shit like Kaliber or Buckler but stuff that has maybe 1.5-2% instead of 5%. I have tried the alcohol free stuff and it's appalling. But the low-grade pish isn't bad and I'd happily guzzle down 7 pints of the stuff and only have the effects of 2 regular pints.

You've to buy a very expensive license to sell alcohol, so that's one very good reason. And there'd be plenty of people who don't drink or don't want to a place full of drunks on a night out, that there might be a viable market for it. I can't see it lasting as an idea in Ireland, but I'd definitely give it a chance if there was one near to me.

wretcheddomain

Why don't people who don't want to drink alcohol in pubs just not drink alcohol in pubs!? Nobody is compelling them to drink alcohol, and they can enjoy all the benefits of a real pub.

humanji

wretcheddomain wrote: »

Why don't people who don't want to drink alcohol in pubs just not drink alcohol in pubs!? Nobody is compelling them to drink alcohol, and they can enjoy all the benefits of a real pub.

Because it's not always fun being sober and surrounded by drunks.

wretcheddomain

humanji wrote: »

Because it's not always fun being sober and surrounded by drunks.

There are many places in Dublin where you're not surrounded by drunks.

That's just a cheap universal slur against pubs in general.

Zippie84

wretcheddomain wrote: »

There are many places in Dublin where you're not surrounded by drunks.

That's just a cheap universal slur against pubs in general.

how can it be a universal slur ('universal' meaning 'applicable to all cases') against something in general?

Especially when they have said 'it's not always fun'.

It's not like they said 'it's never fun being sober and surrounded by drunks.'

Wompa1

Over in this part of the world, they do have Cafes that stay open pretty late and they do have live music at night and they get a good crowd too.

But Alcohol isn't as big of a deal over here. It's not the cornerstone of socializing and having fun.

Also, didn't somebody open a juice bar in Dublin a few years ago and it closed within a few months. Hopefully Glasgow is a little different.

TheLastMohican

humanji wrote: »

Because it's not always fun being sober and surrounded by drunks.

Ask anyone that is enjoying a night out about the bunch of non-drinkers that sit, stare and carry stories the following day. Non drinkers should stay out of pubs - just the same as drinkers should stay out of that pretentious joint in Glasgow. Robbie Burns would have nightmares.
Lonnie Donegan did a song on that in days gone by, THE PUB WITH NO BEER.

Wompa1

wretcheddomain wrote: »

There are many places in Dublin where you're not surrounded by drunks.

That's just a cheap universal slur against pubs in general.

Well then maybe some sober people don't want to be surrounded by people who are drinking. Tipsy people can be loud, annoying feckers too

humanji

wretcheddomain wrote: »

There are many places in Dublin where you're not surrounded by drunks.

That's just a cheap universal slur against pubs in general.

No, it's what happens in plenty of bars on a weekend night. There's no point pretending it doesn't happen, we all know it does. Not every place has people falling all over themselves, but some people would still prefer a place where there's no alcohol at all. There's nothing wrong with wanting that. And it's a bit odd that some people seem to see it as being so alien a concept.

Wompa1

TheLastMohican wrote: »

Ask anyone that is enjoying a night out about the bunch of non-drinkers that sit, stare and carry stories the following day. Non drinkers should stay out of pubs - just the same as drinkers should stay out of that pretentious joint in Glasgow. Robbie Burns would have nightmares.
Lonnie Donegan did a song on that in days gone by, THE PUB WITH NO BEER.

Ironically, labelling patrons of a place that you haven't been to and likely never will as pretentious....is pretty pretentious.

humanji

TheLastMohican wrote: »

Ask anyone that is enjoying a night out about the bunch of non-drinkers that sit, stare and carry stories the following day. Non drinkers should stay out of pubs - just the same as drinkers should stay out of that pretentious joint in Glasgow. Robbie Burns would have nightmares.
Lonnie Donegan did a song on that in days gone by, THE PUB WITH NO BEER.

You mean non-drinkers should go to some sort of place that's a pub that doesn't sell alcohol? That's an genius idea. Someone should start a thread on it. :P

Zippie84

I don't get why several people feel the need to label a place pretentious that they've never been in, and hasn't even opened yet.

Very, very judgmental attitude in my opinion.

When I go to a pub and my friend and I aren't drinking, and it's good craic, and we have a laugh, and there's good music, and we're potentially doing stuff, like participating in a quiz etc, it's really enjoyable. It just so happens that none of the drinks we are drinking have alcohol in them. But there's nothing pretentious about the environment. It's down to earth and easy going, and we have a good time.

I see no reason why this place should be similar, and sometimes I might go to it, sometimes I might go to my usual places. I'd hopefully have just as good a night either way.

I think the many labelling a place pretentious just cos it happens not to serve alcohol and aims to cater for those who would like a non-alcohol-serving venue really smacks of being unable to see beyond our own needs and wants, and see how others may just have fancy something different. But nah, they must be pretentious if so

TheLastMohican

Wompa1 wrote: »

Ironically, labelling patrons of a place that you haven't been to and likely never will as pretentious....is pretty pretentious.

I meant the idea is pretentious. It's a cultural thing. You can have groups of people playing cards, mah jong, dominoes etc in a dry cafe in mainland Europe and eastwards but not in Ireland or perfidious Albion. It won't fly. But if it keeps non-drinkers out of pubs then it has to be a good thing. Robbie Burns will be turning in his grave.

Wompa1

TheLastMohican wrote: »

I meant the idea is pretentious. It's a cultural thing. You can have groups of people playing cards, mah jong, dominoes etc in a dry cafe in mainland Europe and eastwards but not in Ireland or perfidious Albion. It won't fly. But if it keeps non-drinkers out of pubs then it has to be a good thing. Robbie Burns will be turning in his grave.

In most places the bar staff themselves are sober...

What's your hang up with sober people going into pubs? How do you even notice them in there?

Maybe the problem isn't the non-drinkers, it's you...