Peculiar new ICU website

brilliantboy

http://www.irishchessunion.net/

Why the need for a new website? And why does it seem to be doubling as the personal blog of the PRO?

Can somebody clear this up? The "old" website is down at the moment and I gather there has been some issues with access to it recently. Does anybody know what the fudge is going on?

mikhail

I heard there were some delays in moving everything over from the previous webmaster's control, but I'd assumed we'd be keeping the site as is. That new site is missing functionality from the old one, and I'd be disappointed if it's all we're getting.

brilliantboy

Ok, I hadn't even realized a new website was in the works.

So it's safe to assume that this is an official ICU website and not some dastardly ploy by someone looking to advance their own agenda?

Sparks

You might be assuming a lot by thinking those two things are mutally exclusive.

reunion

brilliantboy wrote: »

Ok, I hadn't even realized a new website was in the works.

So it's safe to assume that this is an official ICU website and not some dastardly ploy by someone looking to advance their own agenda?

IT is not an official ICU website and no new website is in the works.

All we know is that the ICU is looking for a new webmaster.

That website is not condoned/endorse/supported by the ICU and has stolen information from the ICU breaching copyright. Add that website to your blocked list and report the fake website to the ICU via the ICU secretary.

cdeb

Seems to be a curious merger of the ICU website and another - controversial - blog website.

Another normal day in Irish chess so.

ICU.ie is down; I can't get on to ratings.icu.ie either, though downforeveryone says it's up.

Yreval

I'm getting this message when I go on icu.ie:

The old ICU websites (www.icu.ie and ratings.icu.ie) have been retired by order of Mr P. Fitzsimons. Please see the new ICU website controlled by Mr C. Daly.

Looks like it's the real deal, then.

reunion

Yreval wrote: »

I'm getting this message when I go on icu.ie:



Looks like it's the real deal, then.

Where did you find this? it is not appearing on the icu.ie site for me.

The Development officer on facebook has no knowledge of this and Pat has gone mad if he thinks he can just retire a site (which has a value to the ICU - nullifying a large asset to the ICU) without a functioning one to replace it.

The ICU is in shambles this year.

L1m1tless

The old website was perfect, Did exactly what was needed. Wonder what the underlying circumstances are for this big mistake.

checknraise

The new website does not look great but it may not be the finished product. Saying that if it was to resemble the finalised website I don't believe it would be acceptable. A website is so important nowadays that questions will have to be asked.

brilliantboy

I'm getting a lot of conflicting information here

Is it a new official website?
Is it a temporary website while issues with icu.ie are fixed?
Is it some of the usual characters and agitators trying to pull a fast one?

Quite apart from the alarming drop in functionality of the website ,and it does seem a shame to let all the good work on the ratings website go to waste, one can understand why people would be reluctant to use it without some official confirmation (coming from someone other than the PRO)

As I gather from the Irish Chess facebook page neither the Development Officer or the Secretary have any idea what's going on.

Some transparency would be nice so I can get back to playing some bloody chess and not have to worry about whatever soap opera these guys are putting on.

Sparks

brilliantboy wrote: »

Quite apart from the alarming drop in functionality of the website ,and it does seem a shame to let all the good work on the ratings website go to waste, one can understand why people would be reluctant to use it without some official confirmation (coming from someone other than the PRO)

That's okay, there's a page on the new website saying it's official, so all's well.

:rolleyes:

mikhail

CowboyDreams wrote: »

The old website was perfect, Did exactly what was needed. Wonder what the underlying circumstances are for this big mistake.

I don't know the details, but I think the old site required experience with a number of web technologies to operate it and they were struggling to find someone with the skillset to take over the administration. I think this is an attempt to move to a more user-friendly platform. That seems reasonable, but only if the new site actually fits the bill.

Sparks wrote: »

That's okay, there's a page on the new website saying it's official, so all's well.

:rolleyes:

No <snip>, there's a note on the old site saying the new one is official.

Mustafa Chess

"I don't know the details"

Well said!

So essentially nobody actually knows what they are talking about and so this is a "he said" "she said" "they said" but nobody actually knows what "was said" sort of thing, and a lot guessing and second guessing is done while none of us is any the wiser.

How about we consider what has appeared on the ICU website. Does that not tell us more than enough? Storm in a tea cup. Rome was not built in a day so I suppose it might be a while before this new website is able to make my toast and pour my coffee in the mornings. Don't imagine any of us need get our knickers in a twist about any of this.

Sparks

mikhail wrote: »

No <snip>, there's a note on the old site saying the new one is official.

I was talking about this one:
http://www.irishchessunion.net/?p=43

brilliantboy

Mustafa Chess wrote: »

"I don't know the details"

Well said!

So essentially nobody actually knows what they are talking about and so this is a "he said" "she said" "they said" but nobody actually knows what "was said" sort of thing, and a lot guessing and second guessing is done while none of us is any the wiser.

How about we consider what has appeared on the ICU website. Does that not tell us more than enough? Storm in a tea cup. Rome was not built in a day so I suppose it might be a while before this new website is able to make my toast and pour my coffee in the mornings. Don't imagine any of us need get our knickers in a twist about any of this.

The "he said" "she said" gave an indication that there were issues with who did and didn't have access to the website.
Is it wrong to be concerned about who has access to your data, where your membership fee is ending up, what pipeline your news is coming through etc. ?

If nothing else this highlights the need for the ICU to develop another method of interaction with the membership. It doesn't need to be said that a simple tweet or facebook post is cheap, and fast, and can prevent a whole lot of confusion and speculation.

mikhail wrote: »

I think this is an attempt to move to a more user-friendly platform. That seems reasonable, but only if the new site actually fits the bill.

It's not off to a good start. I can't imagine a lot of people will be happy that their main interface with the ICU is also host to the personal opinion pieces of a person who not uncommonly has controversial and unpopular opinions. The news feed of the ICU website should be an objective source and not a soapbox for whoever happens to raise a few hands at an AGM.

mikhail

brilliantboy wrote: »

The "he said" "she said" gave an indication that there were issues with who did and didn't have access to the website.
Is it wrong to be concerned about who has access to your data, where your membership fee is ending up, what pipeline your news is coming through etc. ?

The biggest concern, in my opinion, is whether the automated structures for membership and rating are still in place. If they're gone, and they don't currently seem to be working, it's a huge loss in administrative efficiency for the ICU, and potentially in convenience for the members.

It's not off to a good start. I can't imagine a lot of people will be happy that their main interface with the ICU is also host to the personal opinion pieces of a person who not uncommonly has controversial and unpopular opinions.

I think that site has hosted Colm's blog before, but I don't seen anything on it at the moment that merits concern. His output there right now consists of a simple write-up of an upcomming tournament, a puff piece for Sam Collins' bid for the GM title, and media coverage of Sam - solid PRO output. But I agree, it's also important that this be a simple and uncontroversial news outlet for Irish Chess. I've nothing against Daly, but given his history, people (and not just Peter Cafolla!) are going to have reasonable concerns about whether this is his site or the ICU's in the long run.

Ficheall

Hadn't the previous webmaster recently put a massive amount of work into making the icu website what it was?

Will that old website still be available when/if the current PRO is voted out at the next AGM, or will the new committee have to try to disentangle the new website from Colm's blog?

cdeb

mikhail wrote: »

I don't know the details, but I think the old site required experience with a number of web technologies to operate it and they were struggling to find someone with the skillset to take over the administration.

The ratings site was working with a new ratings officer though - was there a need to discontinue it?

reunion

mikhail wrote: »

I don't know the details, but I think the old site required experience with a number of web technologies to operate it and they were struggling to find someone with the skillset to take over the administration. I think this is an attempt to move to a more user-friendly platform. That seems reasonable, but only if the new site actually fits the bill.


No <snip>, there's a note on the old site saying the new one is official.

I've heard there was people interested in the position. Just some people didn't like the applicants.

The icu.ie now redirects to laughable_decisions.net

ICU.ie wrote:

ICU Websites
The old ICU websites (www.icu.ie and ratings.icu.ie) have been retired by order of Mr P. Fitzsimons. Please see the new ICU website controlled by Mr C. Daly.

By order of Mr Fitzsimons? Wait a second here! Shouldn't that be Committee decision? or New webmaster decision?

Quite frankly this is a joke, an april fools day joke too early.

We've lost years, YEARS of minutes and AGM/EGM agendas, News and tournament results. So instead of publishing minutes (a transparency point by the current chair) he removes these documents? I know less about the ICU now than ever and it seems divided on anything it's done this year! (wait what has the executive done this year?!)



Just another year in Irish Chess where people's personal vandettas hurt Irish Chess as a whole!

reunion

Ficheall wrote: »

Hadn't the previous webmaster recently put a massive amount of work into making the icu website what it was?

Will that old website still be available when/if the current PRO is voted out at the next AGM, or will the new committee have to try to disentangle the new website from Colm's blog?

Yeap. We went from a website with 100's of hours of work which had a roll out plan, testing and notified the members to a website blog a 7 year old could make. Why not host it wordpress.com? why even bother paying for a domain name? Why are we losing icu.ie??! I can't think of a single national organization that uses wordpress. It's not even a website anymore, it's an blog embarrassment.

If you put €10 per hour for 100 hours, the chair has wiped out €1,000 (minimum) worth of an asset to the ICU and set the ICU back 10 years (no online payments currently).

I wouldn't direct all this mess to Colm, it is our glorious leader that mandated this. Colm is just trying to make his personal blog reach more people.

Littlekittylou

The icu.ie now redirects to laughable_decisions.net

We've lost years, YEARS of minutes and AGM/EGM agendas, News and tournament results. So instead of publishing minutes (a transparency point by the current chair) he removes these documents? I know less about the ICU now than ever and it seems divided on anything it's done this year!

I am someone who has played as a hobby for a while. I am a beginner. I find the whole thing very cliquey. My dad used to be a good rated chess player. He got sick of it.

It's hardly going to be helpful for newer type players. It's not easy to find out what's going in Ireland.

reunion

mikhail wrote: »

whether this is his site or the ICU's in the long run.

The site is hosted in the same place as Colm's.

I hope the ICU are not paying for hosting for this site and, if they are, removing all other domain names from the hosting package.

The domain name AND hosting are currently in the sole control of Colm Daly.

Irish chess union .net wrote:

Welcome to the all new website of the Irish Chess Union. Our website is undergoing maintenance and we are still developing our new website with a view to increasing and improving the functionality and ease of use for this website. We hope this phase of development does not cause too much inconvenience and trust our members will be pleased with the results.

Oh and an FYI, the current secretary (and development officer) had no clue this was happening, however the PRO and Chair had this planned since January. Shocking really.

Sparks

Speaking as someone who did this for a living for the guts of a decade, this is a shambles.
The procedure for upgrading a website is, in simple terms:

1. Get the new website running on your local machine, your laptop or whatever. Load all the data into it. Test it six ways from Sunday until you're okay with it.
2. Transfer the website to the hosting machine but keep it on its own address. Test it again on the new machine to make sure it all works and you didn't break anything in the move.
3. At an announced time, make a one-line change that immediately switches the webserver from showing the old website on the old address to showing the new website on the old address. Immediately test it so you know nothing's broken. And the first story on the new website should be about the new website and its new features and changes. And that stays pinned up for a while.

If you can't do it that way, don't take down a working website that is used for critical functions (like, in this case, taking memberships, managing ratings and so on).

cdeb

Mod edit - Preculiar thread title corrected

Zugszwang

After decades of service to the ICU, Mark Orr has retired. The ICU seems to have been unable to conduct the hand-over in any sort of reasonable manner, so the former icu.ie site is no longer operational. It was built using technology far more sophisticated than Wordpress, with the result that few people would have the skill set to take it over. The cost of getting this developed would be way more than the 1,000 mentioned above btw. The real problem isn’t so much the crappy new ICU website run by an intemperate, it’s the fact that the rating system may not be operational either, unless the ICU have come to some other arrangement for this. For most of us, what we get for our ICU sub is a functional rating system, so if that goes by the wayside, Irish chess is in very serious trouble.

Perhaps the ICU chairman, who seems to be doing a solo run on this critical issue, has some solution up his sleeve. If not, then the only answer I see is to do whatever it takes to liaise with Mark Orr and compete a proper and orderly hand-over of the previous website and rating system.

Tychoo

What a joke. Looks like the ICU has imploded. EGM?

Mustafa Chess

It seems like Word Press is used by some pretty big and small organizations. I wonder why is that.


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www wordpress.com/notable-users/


What is the purpose of a website for a chess federation anyway, maybe we don't need a website or even any ICU executive, perhaps we can just run things from our keyboards in here. I notice we are being moved into the sports section with little or no objections to that.

Sparks

Mustafa Chess wrote: »

It seems like Word Press is used by some pretty big and small organizations. I wonder why is that.

Because it's cheap.
However, rolling custom services into a wordpress blog is a nontrivial task and requires a developer to do it.

Mustafa Chess

So The New York Times can have a Word press site but the ICU can't or should not? I don't know much about these things so I am a bit confused why there is such disdain for Word Press.

cdeb

Mustafa Chess wrote: »

What is the purpose of a website for a chess federation anyway

Seriously?

Allowing people to find their local chess club at the press of a button? I know it's gotten us a fair few new members in the past few years. This alone is enough obviously.

Allowing people pay ICU fees online - a particular boost given the LCU dock points for those who haven't paid fees. The website makes it so easy for a club treasurer to collect fees and pass them on.

ICU.ie was building up an excellent archive of Irish chess history - tournaments, players and clubs. There were regular interesting new articles.

What's happened is a complete shambles.