Scotland vs Italy, Match Thread.

Losty Dublin

Note. As nobody else has taken this on, I'll miss out on Barnhall-Clontarf Metro 11's and do this one to ensure that it's covered. On that basis, please excuse it's brief nature as the cat is sleeping on my lap and I'm trying to watch three other games at the same time.


Scotland play Italy in rugby tomorrow. The match kicks off at 2:30PM and is live on BBC and RTE

What? You need more?




Scotland: 15-Stuart Hogg, 14-Tommy Seymour, 13-Mark Bennett, 12-Alex Dunbar, 11-Sean Lamont, 10-Peter Horne, 9-Greig Laidlaw (capt); 8-Johnnie Beattie, 7-Blair Cowan, 6-Rob Harley, 5-Jonny Gray, 4-Tim Swinson, 3-Euan Murray, 2-Ross Ford, 1-Alasdair Dickinson.

Replacements: 16-Fraser Brown, 17-Ryan Grant, 18 Geoff Cross, 19-Ben Toolis, 20-Hamish Watson, 21-Sam Hidalgo-Clyne, 22-Greig Tonks, 23-Matt Scott.

Italy: 15-Luke McLean, 14-Michele Visentin, 13-Luca Morisi, 12-Enrico Bacchin, 11-Giovambattista Venditti, 10-Kelly Haimona, 9-Edoardo Gori, 8-Sergio Parisse (capt), 7-Simone Favaro, 6-Francesco Minto, 5-Joshua Furno, 4-George Fabio Biagi, 3-Dario Chistolini, 2-Leondardo Ghiraldini, 1-Matias Aguero

Replacements: 16-Andrea Manici, 17-Alberto De Marchi, 18-Lorenzo Cittadini, 19-Marco Fuser, 20-Samuela Vunisa, 21-Guglielmo Palazzani, 22-Tommaso Allan, 23-Giulio Bisegni

Preview. Jokes aside, this game is often seen as the wooden spoon decider, regardless of when it is played. This season plays up to the stereotype and its a fixture that I find hard to take it seriously. Much of it stems from the fact that its two unions who are relying on two clubs to hold up their international game and a few exiles to fill in the gaps if possible.

2015's Scotland are vastly improved from the shambles of the last 2 seasons and are playing some relatively good football, something that results from the bleeding in of young talent and a more stable squad system. Full back Stuart Hogg is a stand out talent this season, Ross Ford is scrumming well and Greg Laidlaw is showing form as well, albeit in patches.

Italy on the other hand are regressing and, relying on the same old tired shoulders, are a far cry from the team that the IRB want them to be. Captain, Sergio Parisse makes his 111th cap but Masi and Leonardo Sarto are missing from the backs through injury, two of six changes for the visitors.



Spotlight. This game will go down to which pack can dictate the speed and flow of the game. The scrum is about the old area where Italy look for dominance. However, they will do it without two iconic players. Castrogiavanni misses out after being the 14 stitch victim of a dog bite while Bergamasco is dropped. On the other hand, Scotland welcome back Euan Murray while second row Tim Swinson should do well pilfering the poor Italian line out.



Verdict. Based on the way both teams are playing this season, logic says that you simply can't bet on the Italians this weekend. They are playing their worst football in years and their league club are struggling in the Pro 12 as well; Scotland have the core of Glasgow in theirs and have begun to turn their recent form around. As a squad Italy are rugged and physical and they know how to fight when they really need to. For all their positive football, Scotland don't not know what to do with the ball when they do get it other than pass it to Hogg. On this occasion it will be more than enough but given their ability to make silly mistakes, it will just about be enough.

I saw Scotland to win by a late try that will render George Clancy in Portrane for 2 months from Knock-on It is.

Oh what? You want a song as well? Ah, you all drive a hard bargain...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqIbmu0ZO7E

vienne86

Have to fancy Scotland here. I didn't see their last match, but on the basis of what I saw of them v France, I reckoned they could prove to be a banana skin for someone (please not us though!).

Swiwi.

Where do people reckon Italy would finish in the Pro 12? I agree with Losty that the Italy experiment is failing badly. Someone posted in another thread that Georgia ranked higher now?

19543261

I dont think we have a resident Italian, do we? We need the low-down on the domestic league. Surely there's more Campagnaro's hiding out there, I cant stomach the thought of watching Italy carry on like this for much longer (for their own sake).

stephen_n

Italy were starting to do reasonably well up till a couple of seasons ago, the transition from the old guard seems to be affecting them badly though. However if you looked at Ireland's performances in the 90's we probably weren't 5 nations standard. They have some good young players but really need a few more to come through, possibly require a few "project" players though.

Swiwi.

stephen_n wrote: »

Italy were starting to do reasonably well up till a couple of seasons ago, the transition from the old guard seems to be affecting them badly though. However if you looked at Ireland's performances in the 90's we probably weren't 5 nations standard. They have some good young players but really need a few more to come through, possibly require a few "project" players though.

Creaming off the ITM cup players who don't get Super Rugby contracts. Sadly, that would still probably improve Italy.

I shouldn't be so down on them I know, but it's depressing. Won't be long before Georgia will be pleading their case for a game v Italy to prove they could do better in the 6N.

stephen_n

Swiwi. wrote: »

Creaming off the ITM cup players who don't get Super Rugby contracts. Sadly, that would still probably improve Italy.

I shouldn't be so down on them I know, but it's depressing. Won't be long before Georgia will be pleading their case for a game v Italy to prove they could do better in the 6N.

Georgia look good against weaker opposition, Italy gave a far better account of themselves against our test side, than Georgia mansged against a weakened side in the AI's. That said, I really think a play off for the 6th spot would help both Georgia and Italy in the long run.

Losty Dublin

Swiwi. wrote: »

Where do people reckon Italy would finish in the Pro 12? I agree with Losty that the Italy experiment is failing badly. Someone posted in another thread that Georgia ranked higher now?

To me, the only chief of Italy in the 6N has been extra games for TV. While they have had patches of form it needs to be said that their big results are akin to FA Cup upsets and less about their rising as a rugby nation. I mentioned in my write up about their reliance on the same old names and it appears that they are losing the way as the old guard slow down or retire. New players are coming through but there appears to be nobody of world class breaking through and this is a huge worry for World Rugby.

Their one saving grace from a demotion out of 6N is that Georgia are a long way off the next step. Regardless of this, there are serious questions to ask on what the long term direction for Italy and wether or not they can recover and improve the game at the pace that their fellow nations are.

But to answer your question, Italy as a Pro 12 team would be no better than Treviso or Zebre

vienne86

Is it true that they don't play rugby in schools in Italy?

CatFromHue

For the first 3 years Italy were in the 6N they only won 1 game and averaged a -113 or so points difference.

For their last 3 years in the 6N they've won 3 games and averaged a -71 points difference (with last year being their worst season since 2009 as they'd been winning at least a game a season and had kept their points difference relatively down since then).

They have been a much more competitive team, bar 2 games last season against Ire (even then it was something like 10-7 at halftime in that game) and Eng, than they were when they came into the comp.

Italy are doing far better than Georgia would in the 6N.

What has happened to Treviso, in them losing some of their big players last season, is pretty worrying though.

bilston

Swiwi. wrote: »

Where do people reckon Italy would finish in the Pro 12? I agree with Losty that the Italy experiment is failing badly. Someone posted in another thread that Georgia ranked higher now?

It's not an experiment though. Italy are firmly part of the Six Nations family. Ireland were as bad, if not worse from the late 80s until the turn of the century. Dumping Italy would be akin to what the ICC want to do with the Cricket World Cup which anyone with even a passing interest in Cricket in Ireland is up in arms about.

Tristram

Scotland to win big today!

In fairness the popularity of the sport is growing all the time in Italy. Its only a couple of years since they beat us and France and I think they add to the 6 nations but I haven't really seen Italy produce any kind of half decent underage side in recent years. It'll be tough for them to bridge the gap but don't think they should be cut adrift. However, like others I think a pathway should be opened for the likes of Georgia / Romania etc. to play off over two legs with the bottom side in the 6 nations to at least keep them on their toes.

I'd be surprised if Scotland don't win this one relatively comfortably. 15+ points.

Bridge93

Total rubbish to say Italy wouldn't do any better than Treviso or Zebre in the Pro12.
They would do comfortably better. I'd have them just in the top 6 if not maybe 5th or 4th.
They haven't progressed as maybe they could've but they aren't going anywhere.

irishbucsfan

It would be an absolute travesty and outrage if Italy were moved out of the 6 Nations UNLESS there was somewhere for them to be moved to.

CatFromHue

irishbucsfan wrote: »

It would be an absolute travesty and outrage if Italy were moved out of the 6 Nations UNLESS there was somewhere for them to be moved to.

Yeah especially when you look at where they've finished

2011: last on points different
2012: 5th
2013: 4th
2014: last
2015: Today's game will be key here but Italy host France and Wales in their next two games whereas Scotland host Ire and are away to Eng. Far better chance of Ita picking up a win in their last 2 games than Scotland.

mfceiling

George Hamilton...

*switches to BBC1*

vienne86

Good Italian crowd there.

vienne86

Easy penalty for Laidlaw in the second minute....3-0 already.

Tristram

What did the ref signal when blowing up that penalty?

Dave_The_Sheep

Ah, Scotland. Made good ground with a break, then pass slow and deep and lose 10 metres as the next ruck formed.

That being said, they are making decent ground. Started well.

vienne86

Tristram wrote: »

What did the ref signal when blowing up that penalty?

In from the side I think.

Backs ready to run this for Scotland.....really running at the Italians. I've not seen Scotland start like this before.

thomond2006

Two minutes of talking from Clancy....leads to a free kick.

thomond2006

That's truly awful from Haimona.

LuckyGent88

That was just awful. Easiest intercept ever.

vienne86

That breakaway try was too easy for Scotland. Poor passing from Italy.

Tristram

Shocking,

dtpc191991

That was sicknely bad from Italy there.

Lapin

It's going to be a long afternoon in Edinburgh.

Kanrith

That was absolutely terrible. Looked like he saw him there as well.

BunkMoreland

Brutal. Take that number 10 off and never to be seen again.

mr. pleasant

looks like he's not the answer at OH for italy. not kicking his points and now this.

sydthebeat

Excellent try! !!

Italy going to have to keep it tight today

Bridge93

That was excellent

Lapin

Great response.

thomond2006

Wow that turned out to be a costly error from Sean Lamont at the restart. Game on now.

vienne86

Some bloody maul from the Italians.....over the line. That'll shut us up!

LuckyGent88

Great response from Italy. Nice drive

Lapin

..... the hell is the TV editor at?

Bridge93

Is that an assist for Parisse?

vienne86

George doing a lot of preaching.

Christ, that music!!!

thomond2006

George doing his best to jinx Haimona.

mr. pleasant

a miracle.

BunkMoreland

Why did a place a bet on Italy to win?

vienne86

The whole thing is going a break-neck speed. After 20, more points than minutes on the board. Wasn't expecting this.

thomond2006

Clancy, just penalise them. What the **** are you trying to do here?! :mad:

Lapin

FFS Clancy let them off ta hell. :mad:

Tristram

**** sake

vienne86

Oh Clancy, shut the f*** up and let the game be played. He's really doing my head in. Even Ralph Keyes is giving out about him now.

bilston

Why did Laidlaw take that kick from the 22 when the penalty was conceded 10 metres further up the pitch? Not that it would have mattered obviously.

Dave_The_Sheep

Is it me or does Haimona look like he's carrying a knock (coupled with not looking that interested) ?