3 Muslim students shot in Chapel Hill, NC

Hoop66

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-three-young-muslims-gunned-down-in-north-carolina-at-their-family-home-10037734.html

Is this an act of terrorism? Of course not, he was just crazy. Because reasons...

Grayson

Hoop66 wrote: »

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-three-young-muslims-gunned-down-in-north-carolina-at-their-family-home-10037734.html

Is this an act of terrorism? Of course not, he was just crazy. Because reasons...

I have no idea why it happened so i really can't say.

BeerWolf

You'll be getting people saying the shooter is a hero.

Timberrrrrrrr

If the story read 3 men killed and then named the shooter as Mustapha Ali whatshiface the headline would scream

Three men killed in terrorist attack

The Backwards Man

Very worrying development, how long until it happens here?

Dravokivich

Nothing in that article states the suspects motive for the killings. Was there something somewhere else that stated it was due to them being Muslim?

Pedro K

Hoop66 wrote: »

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-three-young-muslims-gunned-down-in-north-carolina-at-their-family-home-10037734.html

Is this an act of terrorism? Of course not, he was just crazy. Because reasons...

Possibly not. Terrorism is defined as the use of violence to achieve political goals.

Is there anything to suggest he was politically or religiously motivated or was he just nuts?

Grayson

Dravokivich wrote: »

Nothing in that article states the suspects motive for the killings. Was there something somewhere else that stated it was due to them being Muslim?

Not that i saw. It could have been a meth head robbing a house for all we know.

Hoop66

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

If the story read 3 men killed and then named the shooter as Mustapha Ali whatshiface the headline would scream

Three men killed in terrorist attack

This is the point I was, rather clumsily, trying to make.

Dog of Tears

We should carpet bomb Chapel Hill.
It's the only way to stamp out this kind of extremism.

Duggy747

A bit much people putting this on the same level as the Paris shootings / calling for Obama to make some sort of statement, especially when the motive hasn't even been made clear.

Realt Dearg Sec

Dravokivich wrote: »

Nothing in that article states the suspects motive for the killings. Was there something somewhere else that stated it was due to them being Muslim?

I'd imagine the op has an issue with the fact that this level of circumspection and care not to rush to judgment wouldn't be applied if it was a killing of white people by a Muslim, and the right wing of after hours would be screaming for the murder of every Muslim first born and decrying the "PC brigade" for wanting to hold back, be circumspect and not rush to judgment.

shrewd

RIP, very sad. condolences to their family and relatives.
This is not the way to go, we should be showing them the right way.

on the other hand, Fox news is going bonkers on this. The anchors are saying that Muslims should be killed and their anti-islamic rhetoric surely leads to this type of action.
How are these people allowed to broadcast :eek:

GAAman

Does it bother anyone else that the article states he was a fan of American sports almost as if there's a need to say he was one of the "Good guys"

I know it's an indo article but you know damn well it's just been lifted from an American source.

shruikan2553

GAAman wrote: »

Does it bother anyone else that the article states he was a fan of American sports almost as if there's a need to say he was one of the "Good guys"

I know it's an indo article but you know damn well it's just been lifted from an American source.

I'm not sure why it doesn't say Christian man killed 3 Muslims. I'm sure its just 1 crazy person and in no way to do with his religion or culture.

He seems like the anti PC brigade Christian type we get on here who has some notion that they are an ISIS infiltration team setting up plans to take over in 5 years.

Gatling

Just another day in the US not terrorist related just another daily shooting

Egginacup

Pedro K wrote: »

Possibly not. Terrorism is defined as the use of violence AGAINST CIVILIANS to achieve political goals.

Is there anything to suggest he was politically or religiously motivated or was he just nuts?

FYP

conorhal

Disgusting. I hope the local communitiy rally around the family as much as I hope this was the actions of a lone tin foil hat wearing nutter and not some organized action against inocent muslims.

Egginacup

Why do these redneck nutters always have 3 names?
Is it because they are so utterly useless in every aspect of life that they must make themselves sound slightly less unimportant by adding an extra name to themselves?

Egginacup

conorhal wrote: »

Disgusting. I hope the local communitiy rally around the family as much as I hope this was the actions of a lone tin foil hat wearing nutter and not some organized action against inocent muslims.

Oh I'd be very surprised if this nut wasn't a lone actor but you can bet the farm he's not "alone". There are millions like this clown and not all of them in trailer parks either but in the higher echelons of the print and broadcast media and they believe that every Muslim is going to decapitate or set fire to them.

Karl Stein

It'll be interesting to see how certain 'news' outlets will treat this. When the guy in Sydney took hostages Fox 'News' was unequivocal about his motivations:

There should be no doubt that this was a pure act of Islamic terrorism despite ludicrous assertions by some commentators that his “motivations” were unknown.

foxnews.com

wes

The fact that isn't being called terrorism is another example of the utter hypocrisy with the media with stuff like this. Same thing happened when a White Supremacist terrorist (something that the US has a long history of with the KKK) murdered all those people in a Sikh temple.

Now, I know we don't have any idea of the man motives etc yet, but seeing as that doesn't matter a damn in other cases, then they media should be consistent, and call it terrorism.

However, we all know even if it he has a political motive, it will not be called terrorism, just like the attack on the Sikh temple wasn't called terrorism either.

Doubt it will get much play on the US media either way.

DavidRamsay99

The three young people were the type of Muslim we need more of in the world. They were dentists and architects, who loved to play sports and enjoyed their young lives. Exactly the same kind of young people are being slaughtered by ISIS or oppressed by the Iranian government.

bjork

shruikan2553 wrote: »

I'm not sure why it doesn't say Christian man killed 3 Muslims. I'm sure its just 1 crazy person and in no way to do with his religion or culture.

He seems like the anti PC brigade Christian type we get on here who has some notion that they are an ISIS infiltration team setting up plans to take over in 5 years.

It doesn't say Christian man, maybe because he wasn't Christian??
It states in the article:

A 46-year-old man, named by police as Craig Stephen Hicks, has been arrested on suspicion of three counts of first-degree murder.

Hicks described himself as an atheist on Facebook and posted regular images and text condemning all religions. Police said he handed himself in last night.

speedboatchase

Very tragic incident. Could be a hate crime, might not be - let's wait for more details before rushing to manufactured outrage.

shruikan2553

bjork wrote: »

It doesn't say Christian man, maybe because he wasn't Christian??
It states in the article:

Fair enough, still doesnt state atheist man in the headline.

This might take off in America. If theres one thing worse than a Muslim there its an atheist.

Hoop66

speedboatchase wrote: »

Very tragic incident. Could be a hate crime, might not be - let's wait for more details before rushing to manufactured outrage.

And there we have it...

DavidRamsay99

Lest me forget the overwhelming majority of the victims of jihadists around the world are Muslims and the Syrian and Iraqis and Kurds and Nigerians and Afghans and Pakistanis who are fighting and dying in the battle against Islamic extremists are Muslims.
Muslim Americans are serving the US armed forces to defend the free world from terrorism, Muslim Americans are involved in intelligence and law enforcement and millions of Muslim Americans are proud patriotic Americans like everyone else.

DavidRamsay99

Lest we forget the overwhelming majority of the victims of jihadists around the world are Muslims and the Syrian and Iraqis and Kurds and Nigerians and Afghans and Pakistanis who are fighting and dying in the battle against Islamic extremists are Muslims.
Muslim Americans are serving the US armed forces to defend the free world from terrorism, Muslim Americans are involved in intelligence and law enforcement and millions of Muslim Americans are proud patriotic Americans like everyone else.

bjork

This is updated http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-craig-stephen-hicks-condemned-all-religions-on-facebook-prior-to-muslim-massmurder-arrest-10038126.html

The man arrested on suspicion of killing three young Muslims in North Carolina described himself as an “anti-theist” and criticised all religions online.

Police said 46-year-old Craig Stephen Hicks handed himself in to officers in Chapel Hill overnight in the wake of the deaths of 23-year-old Deah Shaddy Barakat, his wife Yusor Mohammad, 21, and her sister, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, 19.

He has been arrested and charged with three counts of first-degree murder.


Prominent atheist Richard Dawkins has condemned the attack

wes

So its starting to look like the man had an Anti-thesit political motivation, so I expect to start seeing head lines referring to this as terrorism. I doubt that will happen.

The Backwards Man

He can describe himself however he likes, I'd call someone who murders people because of their religion a bigot

DavidRamsay99

Let's reverse the usual rubbish spouted by anti-Muslims haters who label all Muslims as terrorists:

"It is time for moderate atheists to stand up but why are they keeping silent? Atheists like Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris have to come out publicly and condemn this. Why haven't they? Of course atheism is the peace right? Who let these freakin atheists into Murica?"

This is the kind of thinking that probably drove this nut. He murdered. But millions of other people would happily oppress millions of innocent Muslims in America, Muslims who are probably more opposed to ISIS and Al-Qaeda than they every would be.

bjork

DavidRamsay99 wrote: »

Let's reverse the usual rubbish spouted by anti-Muslims haters who label all Muslims as terrorists:

"It is time for moderate atheists to stand up but why are they keeping silent? Atheists like Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris have to come out publicly and condemn this. Why haven't they? Of course atheism is the peace right? Who let these freakin atheists into Murica?"

This is the kind of thinking that probably drove this nut. He murdered. But millions of other people would happily oppress millions of innocent Muslims in America, Muslims who are probably more opposed to ISIS and Al-Qaeda than they every would be.

Eh, Dawkins has condemned it, see link above

shruikan2553

AI havent said anything about it. Lets assume all Irish atheists support the killing of muslims.

bjork wrote: »

Eh, Dawkins has condemned it, see link above

Thats what he said.

DavidRamsay99

bjork wrote: »

Eh, Dawkins has condemned it, see link above

Of course he has. What I was pointing out is that the condemnations of leading Muslims of terrorism are consistently ignored.

bjork

DavidRamsay99 wrote: »

Of course he has. What I was pointing out is that the condemnations of leading Muslims of terrorism are consistently ignored.

Do you think we'll see 100,000 atheists come out in UK to support the shooters motivations?


Everyone should condemn it, not just atheists

Realt Dearg Sec

Fox: Until the atheist community demonstrates its opposition to this kind of action, they are proving themselves enemies of freedom.

Boards: These atheists only understand one thing: we should carpet bomb every hideout they have until they are exterminated like the scum that they are. If a few innocent women and children are killed in the process, that's unfortunate but necessary to rid the world of this.

I'm sure some atheists are fine, and good people, but atheism itself is inherently a violent ideology that seeks to destroy Western values. If they want to live here, they have to assimilate to our way of life, or else they can fcuk off back to the cave they came from.

(Wow. I can see why some of these right-wingers like this way of thinking. Everything is so simple and reduced to black and white when you think this way. You never have to encounter things like nuance or complications.)

bjork

blatantrereg wrote: »

What is the evidence that he did it? I can't actually find it mentioned. The articles are mainly just blahblahblah about what he and the victims were like. They write with an assumption that he did it which they don't actually justify beyond saying he was arrested. Unless he was caught in the act or something like that he's supposed to be assumed innocent until and unless convicted.

He handed himself in

blatantrereg

bjork wrote: »

He handed himself in

Yep I spotted that earlier in the thread and deleted my post before I saw your response.

bjork

blatantrereg wrote: »

Yep I spotted that earlier in the thread and deleted my post before I saw your response.

I wondered where it had gone, then I thought I was going a bit mad, but I had the quote.....


Thanks for solving that one for me!!

conorhal

DavidRamsay99 wrote: »

Let's reverse the usual rubbish spouted by anti-Muslims haters who label all Muslims as terrorists:

"It is time for moderate atheists to stand up but why are they keeping silent? Atheists like Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris have to come out publicly and condemn this. Why haven't they? Of course atheism is the peace right? Who let these freakin atheists into Murica?"

This is the kind of thinking that probably drove this nut. He murdered. But millions of other people would happily oppress millions of innocent Muslims in America, Muslims who are probably more opposed to ISIS and Al-Qaeda than they every would be.

Richard Dawkings has come out publically to condemn it. Are we happy now?

Timberrrrrrrr

conorhal wrote: »

Richard Dawkings has come out publically to condemn it. Are we happy now?

No


They should nuke Dublin because there are Atheists hiding there among the population.

Hoop66

conorhal wrote: »

Richard Dawkings has come out publically to condemn it. Are we happy now?

You don't get it do you. That's not the point.

The point is that were the situation that an apparently Muslim man had murdered three,for example, Christian people the media would be full of demands for Muslim leaders to condemn the killings. This didn't really happen, certainly not to the extent it would if the situation were as described above.

Roger Hassenforder

All mountain bikers and Friends afficionados should condemn this as well.

TommyKnocker

conorhal wrote: »

Richard Dawkings has come out publically to condemn it. Are we happy now?

No, we call for every atheist in the world to come out and publicly condemn it. After all that seems to be the call every time a Muslim commits an act of aggression.

RobertKK

A radicalised atheist who is so anti-religion that he went too far.

Hicks is being held on three counts of first-degree murder.
In one post widely shared online, Hicks, who claimed he is an atheist, allegedly wrote: "When it comes to insults, your religion started this, not me. If your religion kept its big mouth shut, so would I."

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/02/11/us/chapel-hill-shooting/index.html

There are some people who are atheist who are more obsessed with religion than someone who has a religion might be.

NoCrackHaving

Seems odd he went after Muslims specifically, particularly living in the South of the US I would have thought Christianity would interfere/annoy/angry an atheist far more than Islam. Also, picking Chapel Hill which is known for how liberal it is compared to the rest of North Carolina.

Hoop66 wrote: »

You don't get it do you. That's not the point.

The point is that were the situation that an apparently Muslim man had murdered three,for example, Christian people the media would be full of demands for Muslim leaders to condemn the killings. This didn't really happen, certainly not to the extent it would if the situation were as described above.

To be fair atheists aren't a grouping in the same way that Muslims or Christian area. They have no ideology/no religion etc. You might as well say all people should condemn this attack.

Who's a leader of atheism? The very idea is a contradiction.

RobertKK

NoCrackHaving wrote: »

To be fair atheists aren't a grouping in the same way that Muslims or Christian area. They have no ideology/no religion etc. You might as well say all people should condemn this attack.

Who's a leader of atheism? The very idea is a contradiction.

Everyone is a leader of themselves when it comes to their own actions. Anything else is a cop out.

Grayson

bjork wrote: »

This is updated http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/chapel-hill-shooting-craig-stephen-hicks-condemned-all-religions-on-facebook-prior-to-muslim-massmurder-arrest-10038126.html

The man arrested on suspicion of killing three young Muslims in North Carolina described himself as an “anti-theist” and criticised all religions online.

Police said 46-year-old Craig Stephen Hicks handed himself in to officers in Chapel Hill overnight in the wake of the deaths of 23-year-old Deah Shaddy Barakat, his wife Yusor Mohammad, 21, and her sister, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, 19.

He has been arrested and charged with three counts of first-degree murder.


Prominent atheist Richard Dawkins has condemned the attack

That is such a terrible article.

A regular social media user, his last three posts were a cute dog video about the Pavlov effect, a viral advert for Air New Zealand involving mountain bikes, and a picture from United Atheists of America asking “why radical Christians and radical Muslims are so opposed to each others’ influence when they agree about so many ideological issues”.

TV programmes liked by Hicks include The Atheist Experience, Criminal Minds and Friends, while he describes himself as a fan of Thomas Paine’s The Age of Reason and Richard Dawkins’ The God Delusion.

the whole article is just listing off his FB profile.

RobertKK

It is not surprising given the amount of hate that is allowed from people who are anti-religion towards religion, and how it is tolerated.
They are human too and open to radicalisation.