National Football League 2015 General Discussion

Fireball07

Probably should have a topic for just general discussion on the league, which kicked off today. Probably should have done it slightly in advance, but I'll give my preview thoughts here regardless.

If I was to pick how I think teams would finish in each division, I'd go for:

Pos|Division 1|Division 2|Division 3|Division 4
1|Dublin|Meath|Armagh|Longford
2|Donegal|Kildare|Tipperary|Wicklow
3|Mayo|Down|Clare|Waterford
4|Tyrone|Roscommon|Fermanagh|Antrim
5|Kerry|Galway|Wexford|Offaly
6|Monaghan|Cavan|Louth|Leitrim
7|Cork|Laois|Limerick|Carlow
8|Derry|Westmeath|Sligo|London



But obviously it's very hard to tell in the league, particularly in the highest division where teams aren't at full-strength. In the other division, it's more of a desperate fight to escape the lower divisions or to stay up and can be easier to predict... although home advantage often plays a big part.

Fireball07

Round One Results

Division 1
Donegal 1-15 Derry 0-12
Tyrone 0-09 Monaghan 1-13
Cork 1-15 Dublin 0-16
Kerry 0-10 Mayo 2-11


Excellent win for Monaghan in Omagh, a good start can be vital in staying in the top division and may encourage them to push for a quarter-final spot, and already puts Tyrone under pressure. You'd imagine Dublin & Kerry will probably be okay in the end, even after losses today. Very good result for Cork, while both Donegal & Mayo also started well. Derry probably never expected much in Ballybofey but will probably need to get home wins against both Munster sides.


Division 2
Galway 2-13 Meath 1-12
Kildare 1-15 Down 3-13
Roscommon 1-11 Cavan 0-14
Westmeath 1-12 Laois 0-10


Interesting set of results in Division 2 which should be very tight... Kildare fall away at the end to drop points at home to Down, which is a great result for Down. The other team I predicted to go up, Meath, lost to Galway by 4 which is a good result for Galway. The two promoted teams got a draw in Kiltoom, thought Roscommon would edge that one, they have some serious firepower. Very good result for Westmeath, which puts Laois under a bit of pressure, that was probably the away game they'd be looking to win.


Division 3
Fermanagh 0-16 Louth 0-07
Clare 1-16 Wexford 0-05
Limerick 0-14 Sligo 1-09
Armagh 2-08 Tipperary 0-13


Four home wins in Division 3 which shows how important home advantage can be in this division. 2 of them were pretty much hammerings, as Fermanagh beat Louth and Clare absolutely thumped Wexford. Colm Collins certainly seems to have them going in the right direction and they must fancy their chances of going up. Great win for Limerick down in Kilmallock, dominated the first half, but had to fight back from a goal down to get a late win against Sligo... although these two sides, along with Louth, are probably favourites to go down. Limerick's other home games are tough. Apparently Tipperary felt they were robbed up in Armagh, 2 late scores for Armagh gave them the win, Tipp had 14 men for quite a while. Still think the two of them are likely to go up although Clare & Fermanagh have laid down markers. Will be tight at the top.


Division 4
Waterford 0-14 Wicklow 0-10
Antrim 1-12 Carlow 0-15
Leitrim 0-15 Longford 1-12
London 1-02 Offaly 0-09


Already looks like this will be a tight division too, with half the first-round games ending in a draw. Same scoreline in both games too, which is interesting. Waterford got a fine win against Wicklow last night, building on their McGrath Cup success and even at this stage, will be hoping to push on for promotion with 2 more home games and an away trip to London, all of which they'll be hoping to nail down 2 points. Offaly beat London, who scored a pitiful 2 points in the whole game... London have generally been better in recent years and will take a scalp, but that's not a good start. Longford will still be favourites to go up, even after a draw against Leitrim.

Fr Tod Umptious

It will be interesting to watch how Galway do in Div II.

They are a team that some believe are ready to challenge for a AI SF spot based on their performances in 2014 at their u21 success.

They play Mayo at home on June 14th, assuming they beat NY and Letrim, if they are going to be serious about winning that game and thus giving Connaught a good go then they will have to be consistent in this league

iDave

Hard to judge too much where teams are after one game but that's a hugely encouraging result for Cork. Is their demise exaggerated?
The two stand out results for me would be Mayo and Monaghan both going away and winning convincingly.
Further down the wins for Down and Clare are serious markers for their intentions. Also looks like Armagh didn't have all their own away against Tipp.

Boom__Boom

iDave wrote: »

Hard to judge too much where teams are after one game but that's a hugely encouraging result for Cork. Is their demise exaggerated?
The two stand out results for me would be Mayo and Monaghan both going away and winning convincingly.
Further down the wins for Down and Clare are serious markers for their intentions. Also looks like Armagh didn't have all their own away against Tipp.

I think if you look at the respective lineups and who Dublin have to come back into their championship 15 versus who Cork have to come back, it's fair to say the 21 players who featured for Cork were a lot closer to their likely championship team, than for Dublin. I'm still of the opinion that Dublin are extremely likely to be involved in the serious business of the championship while Cork are a lot less likely.

I wouldnt be getting carried away with Mayo's win - there was a very very long list of Kerry players missing. Good to get 2 points away from home but against a very rusty Kerry side, I think the result says more about where Kerry are in terms of their pre-season than anything.

As for Monaghan a good win for them and looks like two very valuable points but has to be said Tyrone look to be in a shocking state altogether from the little I saw of that game.

On the basis of what I've seen at the weekend I'd say that Tyrone and Derry are the likeliest relegation candidates, but I wouldnt rule Cork out yet with maybe Monaghan as a possible surprise candidate for one of the semi-final spots.

Clare look intent on business this year - they were even missing a fair few of their better players in the game against Wexford. Really sounds like Armagh stole the win over Tipp in the dying moments. I'd say Geezer is fairly glad that Jamie Clarke changed his mind on going travelling during the league.

manofwisdom

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

It will be interesting to watch how Galway do in Div II.

They are a team that some believe are ready to challenge for a AI SF spot based on their performances in 2014 at their u21 success.

They play Mayo at home on June 14th, assuming they beat NY and Letrim, if they are going to be serious about winning that game and thus giving Connaught a good go then they will have to be consistent in this league

I think Galway will gain promotion to Div 1. I don't think they are ready to challenge for AI semi final spot yet if they reach another QF beating higher ranked sides than Tipp,Sligo along the way then they can consider it a good year.

Mayo will be there or thereabout for the NFL title this April and will win another Connacht title and probably become unstuck in another AI semi final this time against Dublin.

iDave

Are they still persisting with the top 4 getting into a semi?

patmac

Standout result for me was Carlow's draw away to Antrim, fair improvement on last years trimmings for Carlow.

Fireball07

iDave wrote: »

Are they still persisting with the top 4 getting into a semi?

I believe so, yes.

iDave

Fireball07 wrote: »

I believe so, yes.

Ok, never really saw the point of them. Should finishing 4th in a 7 match series be rewarded? Cant help the club side of things either.
If they do persist with it the Croke Park double header is even more pointless. 1st and 2nd should get home advantage for the semi, some reward for finishing higher and better atmosphere in smaller county ground.

Fr Tod Umptious

iDave wrote: »

Ok, never really saw the point of them. Should finishing 4th in a 7 match series be rewarded? Cant help the club side of things either.
If they do persist with it the Croke Park double header is even more pointless. 1st and 2nd should get home advantage for the semi, some reward for finishing higher and better atmosphere in smaller county ground.

I think the real reward to the team of a SF place in Div I is that it gives teams at least one extra (somewhat) competitive game before the championship.

Some teams are known to have a 9 week layoff between league and championship

I agree that the semi finals being played in CP are not a good idea.

The only reason I can think for it is that having Dublin involved makes the double header viable.

If I recall the first time they did it was 2012 and on that ocassion Dublin failed to make the top 4 on the last day and they still dragged Kerry, Mayo, Down and Cork up for the SFs.

All the logistics must have been in place prior to the final round of games.

Fireball07

Great win for Dublin, bouncing back from a defeat last week, to defeat a very strong-looking Donegal side.


In Division 2, both promoted sides, Cavan & Roscommon, got good wins over Laois & Down respectively. Another loss for Kildare too, against Meath. Already looks like it will be a close division. Expect Galway to get the win over Westmeath tomorrow.

feargale

Fireball07 wrote: »

If I was to pick how I think teams would finish in each division, I'd go for: etc. etc..

I would expect Offaly to go up. It's a very sad story if they don't. Also, I think you are ranking Galway too lowly.

Jampip

Fireball07 wrote: »

Great win for Dublin, bouncing back from a defeat last week, to defeat a very strong-looking Donegal side.

In Division 2, both promoted sides, Cavan & Roscommon, got good wins over Laois & Down respectively. Another loss for Kildare too, against Meath. Already looks like it will be a close division. Expect Galway to get the win over Westmeath tomorrow.

Cavan lorded it over Laois this evening. The only thing that kept Laois in touch was Kingston's two first half goals, the second of them a beauty.

Laois only got 3 points in the second half. I'd imagine they and Westmeath will be the two teams for the drop.

Cavan now have two home games against Down and Kildare.

Fireball07

feargale wrote: »

I would expect Offaly to go up. It's a very sad story if they don't. Also, I think you are ranking Galway too lowly.

Possibly. Galway got a good opening-day result and with a bad start for Kildare, Galway probably fancy their chances for promotion now.


Not sure about Offaly though... they haven't impressed me in recent seasons at all.

Dirty Dingus McGee

feargale wrote: »

I would expect Offaly to go up. It's a very sad story if they don't. Also, I think you are ranking Galway too lowly.

The standard of football in Offaly currently is appallingly bad and I'd only be confident of beating Kilkenny these days.

If we go up it would be good for morale but I wouldn't be confident of getting promoted and although its a dreadful thing to say but I sort of hope we don't beat Longford in the first round of the championship as I just couldn't take the beating Dublin would give us probably live on RTE as well.

iDave

If you watched Dublin v Donegal over Meath v Kildare dont worry you didnt miss much. A team that can't kick against a poorly organised blanket.
Still I'll take any win over the flourbags!

Fireball07

Round Two Results

Division 1
Dublin 2-10 Donegal 0-11
Derry 0-13 Kerry 1-17
Mayo 1-07 Tyrone 1-11
Monaghan 1-16 Cork 2-14


It may have been a surprise before the league started, but Cork are the only team to come out of the first two rounds with maximum points and that is a great start for them. I had tipped them for relegation, but 4 points alone could be enough to keep them up. Derry in trouble now as they lost by 7 against a Kerry team still finding their feet. Tyrone & Dublin also pick up their first wins of the campaign. Interesting that there were 3 wins away from home this weekend. Derry look like they might be going down even at this early stage, who will join them though? Monaghan will be gutted they didn't get a win today.


Division 2
Down 1-11 Roscommon 1-15
Laois 2-06 Cavan 0-17
Meath 0-13 Kildare 0-11
Westmeath 2-12 Galway 2-13


Galway the only team in this division to have maximum points thus far. Again, there were three away wins in this division, Meath the only team to win at home. Galway will be making a strong push for promotion at this rate, although Roscommon & Cavan have both started impressively. Laois have got nothing so far and already this is a problem, a home game and a game against probably their biggest rivals, and they weren't impressive either by all accounts. Kildare also on 0 points, and they would have expecting a lot more. Their games against Westmeath & Laois will be crucial.


Division 3
Louth 1-16 Clare 0-13
Sligo 0-12 Fermanagh 0-14
Tipperary 1-14 Limerick 1-02
Wexford 1-08 Armagh 2-13


Some surprises here, Louth finished very strongly to get a win against promotion candidates Clare. With Tipp getting a big win against Limerick and Armagh also winning comfortably, it's a bad loss for Clare, it was one of the away games they'd expect to win tbh. Good stuff for Louth to bounce back. Fermanagh win away and now look to be in a better position than Clare. Awful result for Limerick, only scoring 1-02 is terrible but their only consolation is both Wexford & Sligo lost at home. Limerick will struggle to stay up and there would seem to be a clear divide between the top 4 and bottom 4 teams, even with Louth's win today.


Division 4
Carlow 2-09 London 0-13
Longford 0-14 Antrim 0-13
Offaly 0-13 Waterford 1-04
Wicklow 0-11 Leitrim 0-10


Lots of draws in this division last week, plenty of close games this week. Looks like it will be very tight. Offaly are now 2/2 with a very good win against Waterford. Only conceding 2-06 over two games is hugely impressive from their pov and if they can keep up that defensive record, they will go up. Longford and Carlow are now both on 3, while Leitrim let a lead slip against Wicklow who bounced back from defeat to Waterford. Very hard to say who will go up, but Offaly have given themselves a good shout now.

homeofhurling

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

The standard of football in Offaly currently is appallingly bad and I'd only be confident of beating Kilkenny these days.

If we go up it would be good for morale but I wouldn't be confident of getting promoted and although its a dreadful thing to say but I sort of hope we don't beat Longford in the first round of the championship as I just couldn't take the beating Dublin would give us probably live on RTE as well.

well Rhode got to the leinster club final this year, they beat meath louth,kildare winners handy, fair enough Vincents won the final well but they are going for 2 in-a-row this year and are a powerful team.

Ferbane won the leinster minor club league this year, ST.Marys of edenderry are in the leinster schools finals again this year. the footballers are working hard to come back up the divisions and it will take time, all the talk all week was about waterford and the mcgrath cup they won, offaly walk away from them today in the second half with a lot of frist team players missing.

as for Dublin beating them well but sure they do that to most sides in leinster i tell you something offaly wouldn't have been any worse than meath were in last years leinster final.

its support the team needs now to get them back up to at least division 2 in the next few years not someone like yourself kicking them when they are down.

Dirty Dingus McGee

homeofhurling wrote: »

well Rhode got to the leinster club final this year, they beat meath louth,kildare winners handy, fair enough Vincents won the final well but they are going for 2 in-a-row this year and are a powerful team.

Ferbane won the leinster minor club league this year, ST.Marys of edenderry are in the leinster schools finals again this year. the footballers are working hard to come back up the divisions and it will take time, all the talk all week was about waterford and the mcgrath cup they won, offaly walk away from them today in the second half with a lot of frist team players missing.

as for Dublin beating them well but sure they do that to most sides in leinster i tell you something offaly wouldn't have been any worse than meath were in last years leinster final.

its support the team needs now to get them back up to at least division 2 in the next few years not someone like yourself kicking them when they are down.

I'm not kicking them while they are down just pointing out the truth, me pointing out that the standard of club football is poor in Offaly (regardless of Rhodes's performances) will have no impact on their performances.Rhode doing well in Leinster looks good but Rhode are a one man team basically and when McNamee is stopped the whole team fail to function which is what happened in the Leinster final.

It's a good result today but we have a long way to go before we get back to the 97-06 period when we had a really solid team who could hold their own against anyone in Leinster for a decade.

homeofhurling

but nobody said offaly were going to be pulling up trees this year, if they get out of division 4 and maybe get a win at home again longford that will be a good year, yes they are years behind Dublin, but you must remember offaly football couldn't get any lower after last year, i bet you they will be in division 3 next year with their neighbours laois and kildare joining them tell you theres not alot between them 3 sides at the moment.

iDave

The 3 week break is very frustrating. Just got a taste of football action and now its gone again for a while.

keane2097

This three week break is some ball-ache

Fr Tod Umptious

keane2097 wrote: »

This three week break is some ball-ache

Even worse for you when the rockies steal the football limelight tomorrow.

Fr Tod Umptious

Right football back this weekend.

Tyrone v Derry already finished in a draw.
Some good games in Div I today.

Kerry v Dublin, expecting a handy enough Dublin win.

Mayo v Monaghan , both could do with getting back on track after home losses.
Do not know much about Monaghan, are they as defensive as Tyrone, if so Mayo may struggle.

Cork v Donegal, no idea about this

Kh1993

Some liberal officiating in Killarney. A smack to the face by Stephen O 'Brien effectively ignored. Kerry handling the conditions very well. Sheehan kicking some monsters.

Hammer Archer

Kildare in big trouble in division 2. 3 defeats in a row and still the likes of Galway and Roscommon to play.

Fireball07

Clare were 10 points down at the break, now only a goal down; Podge Collins got a goal.


Bad news for Limerick

Jampip

Huge win for Cavan in Division 2 away to Galway. It's still hugely open in respect to who could go up or down.

Hammer Archer

Division 2
|P|W|D|L|Dif|Pts
Down | 5 |4 |0 |1| +18| 8
Meath |4| 2| 1| 1| +9 |5
Roscommon |4 |2| 1| 1| +3| 5
Cavan |5 |2 |1| 2| -2| 5
Galway| 4| 2| 0 |2 |+2| 4
Westmeath |5| 2| 0| 3 |-17| 4
Laois | 4 |1| 1 |2 |-3| 3
Kildare |5 |1| 0 |4| -10| 2

By the looks of it, Down are all but up. They've both Meath and Laois in Newry to go. The winner of the postponed Roscommon v Meath game next week will probably be favourites to also go up with Galway just behind should they win their game in hand.
On the other hand, pretty much every team other than Down could conceivably go down. As usual, it's a ridiculously tight division. It should become a little clearer after the two outstanding games next week. You'd have to fancy Roscommon and Galway to win though.

Fr Tod Umptious

Interesting looking Div 1 table

Cork 8 (+14)
Mayo 6 (+4)
Monaghan 6 (0)
Kerry 6 (-7)
Dublin 5 (+15)
Donegal 4 (-2)
Tyrone 4 (-4)
Derry 1 (-20)

If its like other years, head to head counts if two teams or tied but it goes to points diff if three or more are tied.

Everyone including Cork can still be relegated, but Cork's 14 pts diff makes that unlikely.

Derry can still survive if they win their next two and if Dublin, and one of Donegal and Tyrone lose their next two.
And next up is Dublin v Derry and Donegal v Tyrone

Edit - Actually Cork are safe, as Tryone and Donegal cannot both finish on 8

Fireball07

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Interesting looking Div 1 table

Cork 8 (+14)
Mayo 6 (+4)
Monaghan 6 (0)
Kerry 6 (-7)
Dublin 5 (+15)
Donegal 4 (-2)
Tyrone 4 (-4)
Derry 1 (-20)

If its like other years, head to head counts if two teams or tied but it goes to points diff if three or more are tied.

Everyone including Cork can still be relegated, but Cork's 14 pts diff makes that unlikely.

Derry can still survive if they win their next two and if Dublin, and one of Donegal and Tyrone lose their next two.
And next up is Dublin v Derry and Donegal v Tyrone

Edit - Actually Cork are safe, as Tryone and Donegal cannot both finish on 8

Hard to see Derry staying up at this stage tbh. Will be very close between the rest though, bar Cork... would be a big blow to whoever does go down though, not much between any of those teams at this time of year. At the same time, how good will Cork be at the business end this year?

Jampip

With Fermanagh and Armagh looking certain to be promoted, Cavan looking like staying in Div 2 and two Ulster teams being likely candidates for relegation from Dov 1, Div 2 is going to be a mini Ulster championship next year with possibly 5 of the 8 teams being from the province.

Fr Tod Umptious

Fireball07 wrote: »

Hard to see Derry staying up at this stage tbh. Will be very close between the rest though, bar Cork... would be a big blow to whoever does go down though, not much between any of those teams at this time of year. At the same time, how good will Cork be at the business end this year?

Yes it looks like Derry and one other from 6.
A bit like 2013 it could go down to the last score in a few games to decide who goes down.

Fireball07

0-5 to 0-3 already, some fantastic scores, Donegal have already missed 2 goal chances but got 2 points from them.

Very open, ,end-to-end stuff so far.

DDC1990

Fireball07 wrote: »

0-5 to 0-3 already, some fantastic scores, Donegal have already missed 2 goal chances but got 2 points from them.

Very open, ,end-to-end stuff so far.

Its a great game so far.

Wouldn't really agree that its open, both sides have lots of men behind the ball, but both sides are counter attacking well.

Great scores, and some very clever ways around the blanket, with hard running through the middle, clever footpassing etc.

6 points to 3 for Donegal, but a very even game.

Fireball07

Great goal, lovely from O'Neill- some of the Donegal players very lazy in getting back into position there and it opened up the space for Clancy.

Lovely pass inside too.

DDC1990

It really is a great game of football.

1-04 to 0-07 now, Cork with the goal.

Shows us that even with good defence great attacking can beat it.

DDC1990

Jaysus some of the players look absolutely out on their feet already. Murphy and Shields especially.

Fierce pace. Donegal's point kicking is top class.

Fireball07

McBrearty is a beautiful striker of the ball, scored some great points already.

thinkstoomuch1

DDC1990 wrote: »

Its a great game so far.

Wouldn't really agree that its open, both sides have lots of men behind the ball, but both sides are counter attacking well.

Great scores, and some very clever ways around the blanket, with hard running through the middle, clever footpassing etc.

6 points to 3 for Donegal, but a very even game.

Donegal are no where near as intensity as they can be so it's open football but I wonder donegal in last quarter really want to win this with trip Portugal and Tyrone looming cork should win
However all this talk cork are blanket effective team is nonsense when said cork thread outside kerry have worst defensive record 7-90 in league and yet in one twenty five minutes conceded ten points to donegal who have few wides and playing in second gear
What cork do they do well running on over lap but what they can't do is bad like win midfield or create half forward line by varying point attack angle kick passing rather than hand passing to runners when in championship with no where near space available today will be around cork will struggle

Fireball07

Another lovely score from McFadden.

Dirty Dingus McGee

Really enjoyable game so far.I don't think I've seen McFadden move around as much in years he's playing very well.

Score of the match so far is Fintan Goold's point just before half time the cross field ball and volleyball type pass that set it up was just beautiful.

Fireball07

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Really enjoyable game so far.I don't think I've seen McFadden move around as much in years he's playing very well.

Score of the match so far is Fintan Goold's point just before half time the cross field ball and volleyball type pass that set it up was just beautiful.

That was class, aye.

Boom__Boom

The intensity of the game is way below championship speed.

No surprise to see some nice points scored when defences are way below usual intensity.

thinkstoomuch1

Boom__Boom wrote: »

The intensity of the game is way below championship speed.

No surprise to see some nice points scored when defences are way below usual intensity.

Absolutely totally agreed
Donegal nine points from play against this defence kerry must be smiling

Fireball07

What a goal! O'Neill is unreal.

DDC1990

2 class goals.

Hurley's finish was brilliant.

Lightning start.

Fireball07

And a brilliant finish from Hurley too. For whatever faults Cork have, they will always have a couple of class inside forwards. Feed them properly and they will score.

DDC1990

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Absolutely totally agreed
Donegal nine points from play against this defence kerry must be smiling

Trust me no one from Kerry is laughing at this.

Cork look awesome.

Slattsy

Donegal are not out of this, 20 mins to get 3 points well within them.

Though they look a bit tired.