Spain's proposed anti protest laws

Terrlock

Please remove this post if there is a thread on this already.

What do people think of Spain's new Anti protest Laws?

From my interpretation from what I read, it means that any protest most be pre approved.

If people are involved in an un-sanctioned protest, they can be fined up too €600,000.

Also if the protest has been approved and someone insults a member of the police they will be fined up too €30,000 euro.

Also you don't get to defend yourself in court.

The prime minster says that the Law is meant to protect citizens and to guarantee the liberty and security of All.

It worries me if this law is passed, what is next on the cards.

To suppress peoples right to protest is completely un democratic in every way.

Here are links to the story, which was initially covered on RT

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/21/spain-government-strict-anti-protest-laws

http://www.thejournal.ie/anti-protest-laws-spain-1847309-Dec2014/


Also will this type of Law move to other nations in Europe?

Donkey Oaty

insulting a police officer during a demonstration could cost up to €30,000.

Y tu Mamá tambien.

Chucken

Things are getting very scary

How long before others follow and voila! We now live in a dictatorship.

Son Of A Vidic

Not so long ago Spain was a fascist dictatorship and looking back at the austerity protests across Europe. The Spanish police seemed the most brutal and enthusiastic in dishing out beatings to peaceful protesters. So the Spanish government wanting to bring in fascist style laws, doesn't surprise me in the least.

anncoates

Might as well get it out of the way.

minidazzler

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Not so long ago Spain was a fascist dictatorship and looking back at the austerity protests across Europe. The Spanish police seemed the most brutal and enthusiastic in dishing out beatings to peaceful protesters. So the Spanish government wanting to bring in fascist style laws, doesn't surprise me in the least.

You said literally exactly what I was about to say.... Protecting the liberty of the people by imprisoning or fining those who don't agree.... Great job PM

Terrlock

If Passed, it's the type of law that could even lead a country to Civil war. Have people not learned from History, there is only so much Suppression a nation will take before rising up.


Although maybe that's what they are looking for, an excuse to bring in military control, or return to facisim.

end of the road

Terrlock wrote: »

Please remove this post if there is a thread on this already.

What do people think of Spain's new Anti protest Laws?

From my interpretation from what I read, it means that any protest most be pre approved.

If people are involved in an un-sanctioned protest, they can be fined up too €600,000.

Also if the protest has been approved and someone insults a member of the police they will be fined up too €30,000 euro.

Also you don't get to defend yourself in court.

The prime minster says that the Law is meant to protect citizens and to guarantee the liberty and security of All.

It worries me if this law is passed, what is next on the cards.

To suppress peoples right to protest is completely un democratic in every way.

Here are links to the story, which was initially covered on RT

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/nov/21/spain-government-strict-anti-protest-laws

http://www.thejournal.ie/anti-protest-laws-spain-1847309-Dec2014/


Also will this type of Law move to other nations in Europe?

its a very dangerous law that should be stopped. it could move to some other european nations i fear, but maybe not.

wendell borton

No one expects the Spanish inquisition!

DeadHand

A dangerous move given Spain's dictatorial history, a history much more recent than in the rest of Europe.

The bitterness caused by the relatively recent civil war still exists as well as various, growing separatist movements. As is always the case, economic turmoil in general and high unemployment (most especially among the young) in particular serves to fuel this dissent.

Modern Spain often strikes me as a bomb waiting to go off. Draconian actions such as these will serve only to shorten the fuse.

Arsemageddon

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

The Spanish police seemed the most brutal and enthusiastic in dishing out beatings to peaceful protesters.

I used to live in Spain and went along to a few protests when I was there. The Spanish coppers love a good baton charge and dishing out skelps to everyone in sight. That said they tend not to arrest many people. Very different to the style of public order policing in Ireland and Britain.

karma_

DeadHand wrote: »

A dangerous move given Spain's dictatorial history, a history much more recent than in the rest of Europe.

The bitterness caused by the relatively recent civil war still exists as well as various, growing separatist movements. As is always the case, economic turmoil in general and high unemployment (most especially among the young) in particular serves to fuel this dissent.

Modern Spain often strikes me as a bomb waiting to go off. Draconian actions such as these will serve only to shorten the fuse.

And to think only a few weeks ago we had hundreds of thousands march in France in solidarity of freedom of speech and so many politicians paying lip service who then turned round, went home and enacted so many contradictory policies. We live in a world of doublespeak.

LeinsterDub

Can we have a no sitting in the middle of O'Connell bridge law?

Egginacup

Arsemageddon wrote: »

I used to live in Spain and went along to a few protests when I was there. The Spanish coppers love a good baton charge and dishing out skelps to everyone in sight. That said they tend not to arrest many people. Very different to the style of public order policing in Ireland and Britain.

I think I'd prefer to be arrested so I could sue them later violating my right to free assembly than getting all my teeth shattered by some dick who enjoys doling out pain.

goose2005

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Can we have a no sitting in the middle of O'Connell bridge law?

If such a law was passed in Ireland, most here would be cheering it to get at AAA and PBP and Palestine Solidarity and all the other headbanger crusties. Kind of like how we call the US prison system a monstrous regime, but the Irish prison system isn't nearly brutal enough:pac:

LostinKildare

Did anyone else notice what the lead story was on tonight's RTE News? The most pressing, important issue today in the Republic?

That 5 days ago, some guy out of a handful of protestors shouted out that Michael D Higgins is a "midget parasite traitor."

Yup, our esteemed govt has grave fears that a schoolyard taunt is a serious threat to our nation! Eeek! Leo Varadkar denounced it as an attack on our Constitution:

"To see him targeted in this way, I think, is an attack on our Constitution and even the kind of language used against him really is beneath common decency."

Labour Senator Lorraine Higgins took to the airwaves to whip up hysteria, too:

She said that never before has the President of Ireland been subjected to this kind of abuse in the history of the State.
Senator Higgins said it was not just an attack on him as the first citizen of this country, but it was also an attack on democracy and called on gardaí to take action over the incident.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0128/676168-president-water-charge-protest/

I'd say our own govt would only LOVE to bring in legislation to limit our freedom of expression here. Certainly they spend a lot of effort demonising protesters already.

PS -- BTW, I love Michael D. I imagine he is far too sophisticated, and also sensitive to the palpable anger of the Irish people, to attach such a lofty threat to a bit of name-calling. Plus, remember when he called that rightwing American radio host a wanker? Loved that.

Greenmachine

Don't you need permission to march here too. Wouldn't an authorized protest here, be classified as an unlawful assembly.

qt3.14

Fairly sure it'd violate several European edicts and the universal Dec on human rights.

lazza14

Not surprised really, Spanish police are free to murder whoever they want to - just a few weeks ago the SS Mossos Thugs murdered some lad in the Raval.

The guardia Urbana are no different either.

Murderers and Thugs.

Manach

Worrying especially where the leftist elements in Spain have traditionally embraced violence, which eased once they could be trusted to be part of the political process instead of undermining the state.

Egginacup

wendell borton wrote: »

No one expects the Spanish inquisition!

No? Nobody expected detention without trial in the land of "liberty" either. Or warrantless surveillance, or roadside strip searches.

lazza14

lazza14 wrote: »

Not surprised really, Spanish police are free to murder whoever they want to - just a few weeks ago the SS Mossos Thugs murdered some lad in the Raval.

The guardia Urbana are no different either.

Murderers and Thugs.

Video has english subtitles - it's worth the watch ...

MRnotlob606

The sooner they get rid of their corrupt anachronistic monarchy the better.

K4t

Terrlock wrote: »

The prime minster says that the Law is meant to protect citizens and to guarantee the liberty and security of All.

Also if the protest has been approved and someone insults a member of the police they will be fined up too €30,000 euro.

Protection for the police, Fines for the people!


The only thing crazier than that would be a fine for insulting an imaginary person, a fine of say €25,000...Oh wait.

KingBrian2

Spain is a large country with many communities. They can't apply a catch 22 for the whole of the country. It is not like Ireland which only has a lánúin milliún daoine. We are talking scale here and the Spanish will have to decentralise power down to the region and maybe give the Catalans more power. That should put an end to the more virulent demonstrations we have seen so far. Not trying to justify this legislation which is crude and driven by emotion and predominantly fear but millions of unemployed Spaniards ranting and raving against the state I would not be surprised if legislation that curbs some of the excess elements of the protests would be introduced.

darkpagandeath

I'm sure these kind of mad laws are against EU laws.

AlekSmart

KingBrian2 wrote: »

Spain is a large country with many communities. They can't apply a catch 22 for the whole of the country. It is not like Ireland which only has a lánúin milliún daoine. We are talking scale here and the Spanish will have to decentralise power down to the region and maybe give the Catalans more power. That should put an end to the more virulent demonstrations we have seen so far. Not trying to justify this legislation which is crude and driven by emotion and predominantly fear but millions of unemployed Spaniards ranting and raving against the state I would not be surprised if legislation that curbs some of the excess elements of the protests would be introduced.

Not to be picky your Majesty,but would you perhaps see some parallels in our current situation ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ry26f4LaWIQ

(Not sure if this translates into Spanish )

KingBrian2

AlekSmart wrote: »

Not to be picky your Majesty,but would you perhaps see some parallels in our current situation ?

(Not sure if this translates into Spanish )

Just to comment on your video but if you keep calling someone a scumbag you are dehumanising them and making it okay to treat that as such. Think of the worst thing someone could call you now imagine if they kept verbally abusing you. Eventually you would stop tolerating them.

Boskowski

Its happening all over the place most of it in the guise of anti-terror laws. A big reactionist right wing surge.
Large scale surveillance of the pesky electorate. Gap between the rich and the poor widens faster than ever. Torture is back in fashion. Civil liberties getting cut left right and centre. Makey uppey wars. Demonisation of an entire religion. Profit over people initiatives like TTIP. The list is endless.
And at the same time we see our 'representatives' standing in a line for Charlie Hebdo and bow their heads to 70 years after Auschwitz. And congratulate ourselves how open, advanced and progressive we are now that we treat gays like normal people. (Like what else would they be?)

Its all so fake and not even sophisticated and still we go along with it, laughing in the face of 'worriers' and 'clueless leftists'. Sure I have nothing to hide so nothing to worry about...

goose2005

She said that never before has the President of Ireland been subjected to this kind of abuse in the history of the State.

Except for the time the Defence Minister called Cearbhall O Dalaigh a "thundering bollocks and a ****ing disgrace", and accused him of disloyalty to the state.

KingBrian2

goose2005 wrote: »

Except for the time the Defence Minister called Cearbhall O Dalaigh a "thundering bollocks and a ****ing disgrace", and accused him of disloyalty to the state.

Now down with that sort of thing.