Hen Harrier and land-designation conflict

OpenYourEyes

So there's been enough about this in recent weeks/months to justify a thread on it's own I think! For discussion and information, and a repository of information as things develop:

The very very short version of this whole thing is that farmers and farming organisations think farmers should be compensated appropriately for the money they lose out on due to restrictions on protected land/areas - they can't necessarily do everything other farmers in the area can, so to put up with that they want some money so that they can stay in business essentially.

So that's the farming side - what is the conservationist side? What do the conservationists want? They literally want the exact same thing. They want those farmers paid so that they can keep farming but in a way that doesnt damage and maintains habitat, species and ecosystem functions.

Maybe the problem is that the money isn't available for that? Well, yes and no! The EU gave Ireland (via DAFM) €438million for farmers in Natura 2000 (i.e. SPA and SAC sites) in the last RDP - the thing is, nobody knows what happend that money except that those farmers certainly didn't get it. Not only did they not get it, but then the NPWS had to cough up another €13million of taxpayers money for the farmers in Hen Harrier schemes. Supposedly it's not illegal for the DAFM to have switched that money around and used it elsewhere, but given the conflict that would have been completely avoided and the lack of transparency as to where that €438million ended up, it's certainly morally wrong and something they need to be held accountable for!

So that's a quick summary to date. The Irish Raptor Study Group are very on top of this issue, so I recommend following them on Facebook or Twitter if you want to keep up to date. Stay tuned for more links.....

OpenYourEyes

A nice summary of the problems faced by Hen Harriers here was outlined in a guest pieces for the Raptor Persecution Scotland blog - well worth a read if you want to get up to speed on the issue:

https://raptorpersecutionscotland.wordpress.com/2015/01/23/guest-blog-hen-harriers-in-ireland/

Over the last year or so (and especially over the last few months) there has been an increasing amount of media coverage regarding the political and ecological status of hen harriers in the Republic of Ireland. Much of the media coverage has come from one particular Irish newspaper, heavily influenced by political spin doctors (the equivalent of the Telegraph/Daily Mail in the UK). When these newspaper articles are shared with a UK audience on social media, without an accompanying critique or even a vague understanding of the politics behind each story, a one-sided view of the situation can be accepted as being ‘factual’.

To counter this, we’ve invited a guest blog from somebody who understands both the conservation needs of hen harriers in the RoI and the political landscape in which the story is set. The author wishes to remain anonymous, for obvious reasons.

OpenYourEyes

Councillor Johnny Healy-Rae has been speaking out in the media recently, complaining about Hen Harrier designations:

https://www.radiokerry.ie/news/councillors-raise-concern-for-landowners-adversely-affected-by-hen-harrier-conservation-rules/

http://www.independent.ie/regionals/kerryman/news/hen-harrier-spa-crippling-farmers-across-east-kerry-30923486.html

https://www.facebook.com/345679678896374/photos/a.345694388894903.1073741826.345679678896374/605080759622930/?type=1&theater

...saying things such as "Why can't we put the hen harriers into the national park, like the eagles" (answers on a postcard!)

...and "...a farm...is now deemed worthless because of a crowd of heroes who want to protect a hen harrier that may or may not show up for one week in the whole year". Now firstly, biodiversity is integral to ecosystem function, on which agriculture and the rest of human society is completely dependant on. By protecting a species such as the hen harrier you are in fact protecting a lot more - habitats and other species, and the functions they contribute to society and the economy. Second of all, birds of prey are big business in Kerry - the tourist industry was and is delighted to have White-tailed Eagles to draw in tourists. Being able to add hen harrier to that list would be hugely beneficial.

As for the restrictions he suggests farmers are under, he's hugely overexaggerating as can be seen here in schedule 4 of the statutory instrument:

http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishstatutebook.ie%2F2012%2Fen%2Fsi%2F0591.html&h=nAQGAPMkd

OpenYourEyes

An Taisce had this to say in response to Councillor Johnny Healy-Rae's derogatory and uninformed comments:

https://www.facebook.com/AnTaisce/photos/a.307526550456.324114.68916935456/10155178052405457/?type=1&theater

Cllr Johnny Healy Rae has accused An Taisce of designating half of Kerry for Hen Harriers and making farmers lands worthless http://ow.ly/HWwFa

Up to 4,000 farmers have had their land designated since 2007 in order to protect the endangered Hen Harrier. These farmers are entitled to compensation so that they can continue the traditional farming practices which support not only the Hen Harrier but also the rich natural and cultural heritage of our uplands.

Farmers who feel that their land has been rendered “almost worthless” have directed their frustration at the Hen Harriers and environmental groups. What is clear is that these communities have consistently been failed by politicians like the Healy Raes, the IFA and the Department of Agriculture.

Through the Rural Development Programme Ireland had the opportunity to compensate farmers for costs and income loss resulting from designation. In 2013 the Department of Agriculture cut the budget for designated sites by more than 80%, from €528 million to €95 million, and reallocated the money elsewhere. Where these desperately need funds have disappeared to we don’t know.

These farmers have been sold out and the Hen Harrier is being used as a scapegoat. An Taisce will be fighting to ensure that the affected farmers receive the compensation they deserve in the upcoming Hen Harrier Threat Response Plan stakeholder consultation. We are open to working with any groups or individuals who wish to fight to preserve the rich heritage of our uplands.

Capercaille

Farmers in Natura 2000 sites/SPA/SAC will get their GLAS payments capped. A farmer who is farming iñ an intensive way will get no capped payments. It's unfair from the start.
As regards the Healy-Rae's they spout pure populist propaganda. Farmer's land in designated areas are worthless they say??? My farm is in a SPA and it would be near enough in value to comparable to non-designated lands

Uriel.

The problem is rather simple yet complicated. The EU provides significant funds to member states for implementation of nature directives. Unfortunately, the Irish authorities, no doubt led by powerful farming interest groups, spread the money to as many farmers as possible. So a lot get little.

In my view the money should be concentrated on those who dave genuine restrictions in their lands.

OpenYourEyes

Uriel. wrote: »

The problem is rather simple yet complicated. The EU provides significant funds to member states for implementation of nature directives. Unfortunately, the Irish authorities, no doubt led by powerful farming interest groups, spread the money to as many farmers as possible. So a lot get little.

In my view the money should be concentrated on those who dave genuine restrictions in their lands.

Well in this case the money didn't get spread too thin, it disappeared! I'm sure it ended up in farmers pockets in some other way, but not for the reason it was meant! And we have this kind of conflict as a result!

You're right though, it's very much a case of the rich getting richer while the smaller farmers are left to fend for themselves. The Dept of Ag and IFA seem to have a bit of a boys club image, rather than representing the rank and file farmers across the country.

Uriel.

OpenYourEyes wrote: »

Well in this case the money didn't get spread too thin, it disappeared! I'm sure it ended up in farmers pockets in some other way, but not for the reason it was meant! And we have this kind of conflict as a result!

You're right though, it's very much a case of the rich getting richer while the smaller farmers are left to fend for themselves. The Dept of Ag and IFA seem to have a bit of a boys club image, rather than representing the rank and file farmers across the country.

Ag should only be representing the Irish State and ensuring the best policies, not representing big farmers or otherwise. The farming lobby is far too influential. It is interesting though to see a splintering in support for the IFA with the springing up of "splinter" groups.

Kristopherus

On a point of information, has there been a census of the Hen Harrier taken in recent years. Have numbers gone up or down since then?

OpenYourEyes

Last national survey was in 2010, from the previous survey it looked like numbers were more-or-less stable, though there appeared to be a wide margin of error, and field effort in the most recent survey was around twice that of the previous ones - so pairs were probably missed in 2005 but not in 2010. And there were severe regional declines noted in a number of former stronghold areas.

The impression from annual monitoring since is that there has been continued decline, and the ticking timebomb of habitat loss due to maturing forestry is having continued negative effects.

So in summary, numbers were low in the last national survey and appear to be getting lower and lower.

Capercaille

OpenYourEyes wrote: »

Last national survey was in 2010, from the previous survey it looked like numbers were more-or-less stable, though there appeared to be a wide margin of error, and field effort in the most recent survey was around twice that of the previous ones - so pairs were probably missed in 2005 but not in 2010. And there were severe regional declines noted in a number of former stronghold areas.

The impression from annual monitoring since is that there has been continued decline, and the ticking timebomb of habitat loss due to maturing forestry is having continued negative effects.

So in summary, numbers were low in the last national survey and appear to be getting lower and lower.

Most of the SAC's have over 50% alien forestry. THe push by multiple TD's and MEP's for a relaxation of new planting of forestry in SAC will lead to extinction. They couldn't care less though.

djmc

I am a farmer with degesnated spa land for the hen harrier as with most farmers I like having wildlife close by and have often taken a break from work to watch the hen harrier or kestel hunting over my farm I have always liked birds of prey.
My problem is having being lied to by government and npws in 2007 about the degesnated part of my farm
I was told that it would not affect farming practices that I could still plant trees or put up wind turbines and I would be componcated for having it degesnated.
To date I have received nothing and the land has gotten worse every year because I can't plough or reseed it or spray it for weeds etc.
Because its wettish land rushes are taking over and ragwort is also creeping in .
Forestry is seen as a last option if you can't make money from farming as you get a yearly grant for very little work so that's why farmers are asking for it
If the grant for degesnated land matched the forestry grants I'm sure farmers would be happy with that.
The problem is that out of over 4 thousand farmers with degesnated land only around three hundred got any grant before they pulled the plug and left the rest with nothing.
Farmers have been hit by the same tax hikes as every one else property tax universal social charge etc but have also taken cuts to payments like disadvantaged area payment and reps etc and farmers in spas would have worse land and less income than other lowland farmers.
I have seen land near me for sale at a few hundred an acre and nobody would buy it because is in spa that's less than 20 times what it would make if it was outside it on non degesnated land.
Having land you can't farm is like having a house you can't live in which makes it worthless.
I think the best solution to keep everyone happy and increase land value again would be a set grant for every acre of land for every farmer with degesnated land which would give them same return as dairying or forestry or what ever they were making from it before the degesnation
I not here to whine about how bad things are for me or to look for money for nothing just to state the facts as I see them if you agree with me maybe you could send an email to your local TD and tell them if not that's OK too.

OpenYourEyes

That's the point the conservation organisations are trying to make DJMC - if you have a very attractive, unlimited forestry grant, and a less lucrative and capped hen harrier grant, then no farmer in his right mind would pick the harrier one over the forestry one! And nobody would blame them either. They have to make a living, and a lot of conservation work requires the land to be worked like it was traditionally - you need farmers for that, but obviously they need to be paid for that work!

The Dept of Ag was given a huge amount of money to compensate farmers with designated lands for the restrictions they have to deal with, and that's exactly where the money should have gone. But it didn't, and then people like the NPWS get the blame when the Dept of Ag was given the money to sort it out in the first place!

I hope there's a politician out there who takes a proper look at the whole thing and sees that conservationists and farmers want the same thing, and that's what the government should deliver. Unfortunately Johnny Healy-Rae and politicians like him havn't a clue and they just end up making the situation worse when they talk about it then.

Desmo

ok, this is not really about hen harriers and is from a foreign country :- ) but the RSPB in Antrim have gone to great lengths to encourage good farming practices (good from conservation point of view).
e.g.
http://www.farminglife.com/news/farming-news/local-farmer-demonstrates-commitment-to-nature-1-6552808

and

Neal Warnock who is a keen birder in his spare time, works for the RSPB, and is involved in getting Curlews protected on farmland in Glenwherry, with the active co-operation of local farmers.
http://www.rspb.org.uk/community/ourwork/farming/b/farming-blog/archive/2014/05/30/giving-nature-a-home-in-glenwherry-a-good-news-story-to-end-the-week.aspx

djmc

I think the problem with the governments agenda now is they are more interested in agribusinesses production and exports to bring in money
Grants given for dairy expansion young farmers etc. While grants for environment and nature like reps have been cut because its not a money earner
The department of agriculture have a different agenda than npws and are cutting farmers payments for not having ground in good condition eg. Having rushes or heather trees bushes etc. growing on your land.
I think if the money was given to the npws and department of at keeped out of it they would do a better job.

Birdnuts

djmc wrote: »

I think the problem with the governments agenda now is they are more interested in agribusinesses production and exports to bring in money
Grants given for dairy expansion young farmers etc. While grants for environment and nature like reps have been cut because its not a money earner
The department of agriculture have a different agenda than npws and are cutting farmers payments for not having ground in good condition eg. Having rushes or heather trees bushes etc. growing on your land.
I think if the money was given to the npws and department of at keeped out of it they would do a better job.

You are right that the Dept of Agriculture is running an agenda contrary to the preservation of SAC,SPA etc. areas and the interests of farmers in these areas. Indeed they seem to be determined to undermine all small non-intensive producers which actually runs contrary to many of the principles in the New CAP as well as a multitude of EU agri-environmental directives. At least increasing numbers of affected farmers have sussed this and the failure of the IFA to take this issue seriously which has led to the formation of groups like the IFDL, who are are calling the Irish governments bluff on some of the misinformation and scapegoating that various ministers and officials have adempted to put out there to cover their own tracks.
Speaking to some people recently in the loop on this matter it appears that a direct complaint from a number of interested parties on HH matters will be winging its way to Brussels by the summer unless the Irish state fullfills its obligations to properly support traditional farming methods in HH SPA's.

magicbastarder

hen harrier found shot dead in kerry:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0201/677039-hen-harrier-kerry/

Capercaille

magicbastarder wrote: »

hen harrier found shot dead in kerry:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0201/677039-hen-harrier-kerry/

That one was satellite tagged so it was found. I wonder how many more are shot and are never found.

OpenYourEyes

For anyone with an interest, Heathers exploits were documented and discussed here: http://henharrierireland.blogspot.ie/ We essentially know everywhere she's been from the day she left her nest to the day she was shot.

Ove the course of a couple of seasons they put satellite tags on 9 Hen Harrier chicks - Heather was the only one to survive, the others died of starvation etc within a few weeks of fledging.

In her two years Heather has been on the east coast, the west coast, up to Northern Ireland and back home to Kerry - someone commented yesterday that she had been to more counties in Ireland than he had!

She was named by schoolchildren in Kerry, who all eagerly followed her exploits, and she was a great ambassador for wildlife and nature in ireland for the next generation. Unfortunately she is now illustrating a very tough lesson - that there are people out there happy to shoot Hen Harriers and happy to shoot birds of prey. As Capercaillie said, we only know about Heather because she was satellite tagged, how many more Hen Harriers and birds of prey are shot each year?

OpenYourEyes

Irish Times article here: http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/investigation-after-protected-hen-harrier-shot-dead-in-kerry-1.2087061?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0201/677039-hen-harrier-kerry/

I dispair!

fits

Its awful

djmc

Just heard this on the news and thought for feck sake it will do nothing to help farmers in this area.
A lot of farmers feel as if their land has been stolen from them any are very angry about it
Seeing the bird as the problem instead of government policy is just stupid.
Just want to say there is always someone who will not see the bigger picture and take things into their own hands but they do not represent the majority.
I also see that costing people their livelihoods taking money from their pockets and food off their families table and telling them its because of a rear animal of bird nesting on their land is going to do nothing to protect to specie's.
History has shown this with wolves bears ect. Or
Anything that man has seen as a treath to their livelihoods
Sorry if this offended anyone but I feel it needed to be said.

OpenYourEyes

Newstalk piece on it: http://www.newstalk.com/Hen-harrier-bird-shot-Kerry-protected

and Independant: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/rare-bird-and-blog-star-heather-the-harrier-shot-dead-30954300.html

Manach

Perhaps farmers and other rural land owners should better be engaged in partnership to assist in attempts to preserve rural traditions. Give the modernisation agenda of the state and the pursuit of short term gains this leads both to poor policy decision and resentment against perceived impositions, such as the Hen Harrier.

Birdnuts

djmc wrote: »

Just heard this on the news and thought for feck sake it will do nothing to help farmers in this area.
A lot of farmers feel as if their land has been stolen from them any are very angry about it
Seeing the bird as the problem instead of government policy is just stupid.
Just want to say there is always someone who will not see the bigger picture and take things into their own hands but they do not represent the majority.
I also see that costing people their livelihoods taking money from their pockets and food off their families table and telling them its because of a rear animal of bird nesting on their land is going to do nothing to protect to specie's.
History has shown this with wolves bears ect. Or
Anything that man has seen as a treath to their livelihoods
Sorry if this offended anyone but I feel it needed to be said.

It should be pointed out that this crime occured in South Kerry nearly 40 miles from the nearest HH SPA in North Kerry. More than likely it was just a random act of thuggery which this part of Kerry has known in the recent past when it comes to serious wildlife crimes

OpenYourEyes

Birdnuts wrote: »

It should be pointed out that this crime occured in South Kerry nearly 40 miles from the nearest HH SPA in North Kerry. More than likely it was just a random act of thuggery which this part of Kerry has known in the recent past when it comes to serious wildlife crimes

I'd have to look it up, but I think someone said it's an area where some White-tailed Eagles have met their untimely demise in the past too?

I'm sure we all agree that its the work of a particularly bad-minded individual, of which there are many, though they shouldn't be thought of as representative of any of the communities or groups of which they are a part of. That being said, I think the comments of Cllr. Healy-Rae earlier in this thread will increase the likelihood of this kind of terrible act.

The villification of the Hen Harrier is predominantly a result of terrible handling of compensation for farmers with protected land and a fairly useless GLAS scheme for Hen Harriers. Then when populist politicians start mouthing off on something they have no real knowledge of it adds fuel to the fire and polarises the debate.

I've said it here earlier that conservationists and farmers are on the same side here - we definitely have to be careful that the act of an individual in this case doesn't turn us against each other! That won't help any of us, and it definitely won't help the Hen Harrier!

OpenYourEyes

A Birdwatch Ireland piece by Raptor Conservation officer John Lusby about the Hen Harrier - 'Getting to know the bird behind the headlines':

http://www.birdwatchireland.ie/Publications/eWings/eWingsIssue64January2015/GettingtoknowtheHenHarrier/tabid/1433/Default.aspx

Worth a read whether you're familiar with the Hen Harrier or not!

OpenYourEyes

From the Hen Harrier facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/henharrierireland?refid=52&__tn__=C

Thanks to everyone for their support. The support that's out there for Hen Harriers is immense and that has been clear for some time. It's often the minority we hear or see quoted in the press and this cowardly, cruel and illegal act was certainly by an individual who does not represent anyone but those who break the law. The community stands firmly behind our native wildlife, especially species that we could lose in our lifetime.

Capercaille

This was from the Limerick Leader newspaper:

IFA against the Hen Harrier
'Shoot the bastards'
By PATRICIA FEEHILY



Threatened and threatening: the hen harrier

OVER 800 people attended the IFA's public meeting in Templeglantine on the Dúchas hen harrier protection plan.

It was one of the biggest meetings ever held in the area, and seldom was the mood so raptorial or so trigger-happy.

It would have been comic if it weren't so serious--serious for the farmers whose lands and livelihoods are threatened by special designation and for the bird which has been in decline since 1900 and which almost became extinct in 1954, apparently from "persecution", although the farmers claim that they lived in harmony together for generations until Dúchas appeared.

Everything was up in the air at the meeting. An attempt by Dúchas director, John Wilson to put the hen harrier in "its historic, legal and scientific context" left the farmers of West Limerick totally unimpressed.

With no real clarification of anything, they emerged from the Devon Inn threatening to "shoot the bastards".

"The hen harrier will need a rosary beads around his neck from now on," growled one of them ominously.

It seems that you'll never take the gun out of Irish politics. The EU already has the gun to the heads of the Dúchas people over the designation of SPAs . "There's a threat of court action if we don't get on with the job," Mr Wilson pleaded.

And IFA leader, John Dillon was cheered to the rafters when he told the meeting how they used to deal with birds of prey hovering over his mother's chickens in the farmyard at home when he was young.

"When this fellow appeared in the sky, the first thing we got was the gun to sort him out."

The Dúchas officials were horrified.

Mr Dillon was at his fiery best, and has banned Dúchas from the lands of West Limerick, North Cork and North Kerry until the farmers get justice and fair play. The hen harrier may yet be a party to the partnership talks, but as someone remarked at the meeting, the cost of the Government's jet fleet will be peanuts compared to the cost of keeping him in the air.

http://www.independent.ie/regionals/kerryman/news/hen-harrier-was-shot-by-rifle-27369584.html
Remember this from 2003. At a IFA meeting they were discussing designations of land for Hen Harrier. Shortly after the meeting a Hen Harrier was shot and sent to Kerryman Newspaper.

Woodville56

It's quite possible and indeed more than likely that the perpetrator of this criminality is a member of a local gun club. I know that in some quarters the NPWS view is that by keeping the gun clubs and the NARGC informed and onside in the protection and preservation of threatened wildlife, the risk to species such as the Hen Harrier or the White Tailed Eagle or other birds of prey is somewhat reduced. Problem is that there are renegades in some clubs who have scant regard for any protective wildlife legislation and see birds of prey as a target for elimination. While the perpetrator of this mindlessness may have acted alone, there are likely to be others in the know, it being a small rural community. Given the widespread publicity regarding the illegality of killing raptors etc, ignorance of the law is no excuse. It's incumbent on gun clubs and the NARGC to again speak out with force and condemnation and identify those in their midst who would perpetrate such acts - in small rural communities, the "trigger happy" lads are usually well known. The NPWS and the Gardai face an uphill struggle in catching the shooter(s) unless local community support is forthcoming. Otherwise, perhaps it's time to revisit the gun licensing laws and impose more punitive measures on errant licence holders and those clubs who would remain silent about renegades in their midst.

Capercaille

Woodville56 wrote: »

It's quite possible and indeed more than likely that the perpetrator of this criminality is a member of a local gun club. I know that in some quarters the NPWS view is that by keeping the gun clubs and the NARGC informed and onside in the protection and preservation of threatened wildlife, the risk to species such as the Hen Harrier or the White Tailed Eagle or other birds of prey is somewhat reduced. Problem is that there are renegades in some clubs who have scant regard for any protective wildlife legislation and see birds of prey as a target for elimination. While the perpetrator of this mindlessness may have acted alone, there are likely to be others in the know, it being a small rural community. Given the widespread publicity regarding the illegality of killing raptors etc, ignorance of the law is no excuse. It's incumbent on gun clubs and the NARGC to again speak out with force and condemnation and identify those in their midst who would perpetrate such acts - in small rural communities, the "trigger happy" lads are usually well known. The NPWS and the Gardai face an uphill struggle in catching the shooter(s) unless local community support is forthcoming. Otherwise, perhaps it's time to revisit the gun licensing laws and impose more punitive measures on errant licence holders and those clubs who would remain silent about renegades in their midst.

If they has some some of vicarious liability for Gunclubs it would help. Every firearm holder would have to be part of a gunclub. If one person is found guilty the Club would be punished. That would weed out the vermin.

Birdnuts

Woodville56 wrote: »

It's quite possible and indeed more than likely that the perpetrator of this criminality is a member of a local gun club. I know that in some quarters the NPWS view is that by keeping the gun clubs and the NARGC informed and onside in the protection and preservation of threatened wildlife, the risk to species such as the Hen Harrier or the White Tailed Eagle or other birds of prey is somewhat reduced. Problem is that there are renegades in some clubs who have scant regard for any protective wildlife legislation and see birds of prey as a target for elimination. While the perpetrator of this mindlessness may have acted alone, there are likely to be others in the know, it being a small rural community. Given the widespread publicity regarding the illegality of killing raptors etc, ignorance of the law is no excuse. It's incumbent on gun clubs and the NARGC to again speak out with force and condemnation and identify those in their midst who would perpetrate such acts - in small rural communities, the "trigger happy" lads are usually well known. The NPWS and the Gardai face an uphill struggle in catching the shooter(s) unless local community support is forthcoming. Otherwise, perhaps it's time to revisit the gun licensing laws and impose more punitive measures on errant licence holders and those clubs who would remain silent about renegades in their midst.

In fairness the NARGC are allways very quick to condemn these incidents and I expect they'll to do the same this time. They actually have a good working relationship with the Golden Eagle Trust and have worked well together on various upland birds projects like the Ballyboley Grouse project in Leitrim. The vast majority of hunters and shooters will condemn this act as they know well the damage it does to the sports image

Birdnuts

OpenYourEyes wrote: »

For anyone with an interest, Heathers exploits were documented and discussed here: http://henharrierireland.blogspot.ie/ We essentially know everywhere she's been from the day she left her nest to the day she was shot.

Ove the course of a couple of seasons they put satellite tags on 9 Hen Harrier chicks - Heather was the only one to survive, the others died of starvation etc within a few weeks of fledging.

In her two years Heather has been on the east coast, the west coast, up to Northern Ireland and back home to Kerry - someone commented yesterday that she had been to more counties in Ireland than he had!

She was named by schoolchildren in Kerry, who all eagerly followed her exploits, and she was a great ambassador for wildlife and nature in ireland for the next generation. Unfortunately she is now illustrating a very tough lesson - that there are people out there happy to shoot Hen Harriers and happy to shoot birds of prey. As Capercaillie said, we only know about Heather because she was satellite tagged, how many more Hen Harriers and birds of prey are shot each year?

They fact that 9 chicks have died from starvation is even more alarming than this incident. It points to a serious habitat issue that is affecting most declining upland bird species. I was at the conference yesterday in the Green Isle and the chap from the GET doing the habitat mapping in the HH SPA areas really laid bare how poor the quality of habitat is within these areas. Most of the land cover is now a desert of mature conifer plantations, wind farms etc. and what remains isn't in great shape eitheir:(

Capercaille

Birdnuts wrote: »

They fact that 9 chicks have died from starvation is even more alarming than this incident. It points to a serious habitat issue that is affecting most declining upland bird species. I was at the conference yesterday in the Green Isle and the chap from the GET doing the habitat mapping in the HH SPA areas really laid bare how poor the quality of habitat is within these areas. Most of the land cover is now a desert of mature conifer plantations, wind farms etc. and what remains isn't in great shape eitheir:(

IFA, Senior Fine Gael TD/MEP's and vermin like Michael Fitzmaurice TD want an end to restrictions on planting in SPA/SAC , which will lead to the extinction of Hen Harrier.

OpenYourEyes

Birdnuts wrote: »

They fact that 9 chicks have died from starvation is even more alarming than this incident. It points to a serious habitat issue that is affecting most declining upland bird species. I was at the conference yesterday in the Green Isle and the chap from the GET doing the habitat mapping in the HH SPA areas really laid bare how poor the quality of habitat is within these areas. Most of the land cover is now a desert of mature conifer plantations, wind farms etc. and what remains isn't in great shape eitheir:(

That was Ryan Wilson-Parr - I thought it was very interesting alright! Seemed to be death by a thousand cuts in terms of small patches of land-use change all adding up to less than half of the habitat in Hen Harrier SPAs actually being suitable for Hen Harriers! And thats only going to get worse as the forestry matures.

Another important point he made was that the numbers of HH's in SPA's is declining, so managing habitat outside SPA's is very important! And thats only going to happen with suitable agri-environment schemes and financial support for farmers and land-managers!

OpenYourEyes

Here's An Taisce's response to todays news - very well put! :

https://www.facebook.com/AnTaisce/photos/a.10153326974250457.1073741826.68916935456/10155203240085457/?type=1

No other bird has been at the centre of such controversy surrounding its protection, nor been so misrepresented and misunderstood.

Ten years ago this bird didn't even register with many people who sadly now view it in a negative light. The behaviour or ecology of the Hen Harrier hasn't changed at all during that time, but perceptions of it have: regrettably, it is now considered by some to be a threat to farming livelihoods due to the designation of Special Protection Areas (SPAs) for its conservation.

Ignorance about this remarkable bird is the main reason for this, and we would like to set the record straight.

Capercaille

OpenYourEyes wrote: »

That was Ryan Wilson-Parr - I thought it was very interesting alright! Seemed to be death by a thousand cuts in terms of small patches of land-use change all adding up to less than half of the habitat in Hen Harrier SPAs actually being suitable for Hen Harriers! And thats only going to get worse as the forestry matures.

Another important point he made was that the numbers of HH's in SPA's is declining, so managing habitat outside SPA's is very important! And thats only going to happen with suitable agri-environment schemes and financial support for farmers and land-managers!

The GLAS scheme written for Hen Harrier seems to be written by somebody who hasn't a clue. It makes no mention of heather management only grass management.

OpenYourEyes

And Birdwatch Ireland have issued a full press release. It's too long to quote it all here, but it's well worth a read - comments from NPWS, Birdwatch Ireland and NARGC:

http://www.birdwatchireland.ie/News/HenHarriershotdeadinCountyKerry/tabid/1435/Default.aspx

Dr. Barry O'Donoghue of the National Parks & Wildlife Service oversaw the satellite tracking project: “Knowing this bird since she was a tiny chick, and having followed her every movement remotely and in the field was a real privilege, enlightening and indeed humbling. Every time without fail, she lit up my eyes when her tag showed she was alive and well. It was heart-breaking to find this young bird when she had been shot. An individual that gave so much joy to thousands of people that followed her progress, killed in the prime of her health. This was not just one bird, but the hopes and dreams for a species that is vanishing from our country.”

John Lusby, Raptor Conservation Officer with BirdWatch Ireland, commented on the implications of this shooting: “Birds of prey are so important in an healthy countryside, and the lack of education which fuels such incidents of illegal persecution not only affects their vulnerable populations but has much wider implications for our countryside. Fáilte Ireland has shown that visitors to Ireland rate the natural and unspoilt environment as one of the main factors which attract them here. County Kerry is one of our most popular tourist destinations, so imagine how this shooting and the spate of other wildlife crimes reflect on our green image.”

David Scallan, a spokesman for the National Association of Regional Game Councils condemned the shooting: “The shooting of this bird is unacceptable. No right-minded hunter would do something like this."

Capercaille

Have NARGC had any educational programmes to educate hunters? Licencing laws need to be tightened up, any fool can get a licence. A lot of people seem ignorant about prey/protected species.

djmc

Capercaille wrote: »

Have NARGC had any educational programmes to educate hunters? Licencing laws need to be tightened up, any fool can get a licence. A lot of people seem ignorant about prey/protected species.

I don't think a hen harrier could be mistaken for another bird that could be legally shot ie. A pheasant etc. By anyone who knows about birds or shooting
Even an 18 year old Moran that just got a gun should know and if he did not could he get close enough with a shot gun and have the aim to hit it
From the harriers I have seen they are very elusive birds you will not get too close to.
I would think it was shot with intent
I'd be interested to know if it was shot with a shotgun or telescopic rifle

Capercaille

djmc wrote: »

I don't think a hen harrier could be mistaken for another bird that could be legally shot ie. A pheasant etc. By anyone who knows about birds or shooting
Even an 18 year old Moran that just got a gun should know and if he did not could he get close enough with a shot gun and have the aim to hit it
From the harriers I have seen they are very elusive birds you will not get too close to.
I would think it was shot with intent
I'd be interested to know if it was shot with a shotgun or telescopic rifle

You would be surprised by the amount of posts on the Hunting forum with people unaware of shooting season/legal prey species. I agree with the moran point.

Hen harrier fly low/slowly over the ground . They would be easily shot.

homerhop

Capercaille wrote: »

Have NARGC had any educational programmes to educate hunters? Licencing laws need to be tightened up, any fool can get a licence. A lot of people seem ignorant about prey/protected species.

We have the tightest firearms laws in Europe. The licensing is not the problem, it's the mindset of a minority of individuals who have no regard for laws, nature or any form of conversation. The NARGC do run courses that go through everything from the firearms act to the wildlife act. We do not know if it was a farmer or so called hunter who did this. It's all over fb pages for different hunting groups and not one comment in support of what was done. As much as you might dislike us who hunt. We are not all fools who can get a firearm

Capercaille

homerhop wrote: »

We have the tightest firearms laws in Europe. The licensing is not the problem, it's the mindset of a minority of individuals who have no regard for laws, nature or any form of conversation. We do not know if it was a farmer or so called hunter who did this.

Licensing is a problem I would say from the level of Raptor persecution and Deer poaching.

The NARGC do run courses that go through everything from the firearms act to the wildlife act.

That is good to know

It's all over fb pages for different hunting groups and not one comment in support of what was done

It would be foolish for anybody to say otherwise.

As much as you might dislike us who hunt. We are not all fools who can get a firearm

Never said I dislike hunters, as I said on previous threads the majority of shooters are law abiding. There is a significant numbers who are not though judging by the amount of wildlife crime in this Country. Somebody prominent on the Shooting Forum said recently that 99.99% of shooters in the country are law abiding. Given that there is about 240,000 firearm holders in the Country that would equate to about 24 breaking the law. Believe that if you will

homerhop

i could guarantee you right now if I called the ranger that covers here I would have a better chance of speaking to Obama.
Lads are blue in the face down in cork, Kerry and Waterford reporting poachers and nothing being done about it.
If they took a leaf out of the states book and confiscated all gear from transport to clothing and auctioned it off they would be self funded within 6 months.

Capercaille

homerhop wrote: »

i could guarantee you right now if I called the ranger that covers here I would have a better chance of speaking to Obama.
Lads are blue in the face down in cork, Kerry and Waterford reporting poachers and nothing being done about it.
.

Given that ranger numbers are tiny it's amazing they respond at all. A couple of the new rangers are agricultural officers transferred from the DAFM and who would not be top quality.

If they took a leaf out of the states book and confiscated all gear from transport to clothing and auctioned it off they would be self funded within 6 months

That would be a good idea.

Zoo4m8

Every time a thread on illegal shooting starts we hear about licensing morons, the NARGC are not doing enough etc etc etc. there is never any recognition of the fact that there are large numbers of stolen weapons out there used by people who never heard of a gun club, NARGC or the word 'raptor'..
Two weeks ago a neighbours gun case was levered off the wall during a burglary , that's three shotguns and a rifle now floating about destined for goodness knows what..
Two years ago the local gun dealers premises was cleaned out, air rifles, shotguns, ammunition , everything.. This is just in my area, there are guns disappearing on a regular basis countrywide and they are not all destined for the 'sawn off' market....

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Zoo4m8 wrote: »

Every time a thread on illegal shooting starts we hear about licensing morons, the NARGC are not doing enough etc etc etc. there is never any recognition of the fact that there are large numbers of stolen weapons out there used by people who never heard of a gun club, NARGC or the word 'raptor'..
Two weeks ago a neighbours gun case was levered off the wall during a burglary , that's three shotguns and a rifle now floating about destined for goodness knows what..
Two years ago the local gun dealers premises was cleaned out, air rifles, shotguns, ammunition , everything.. This is just in my area, there are guns disappearing on a regular basis countrywide and they are not all destined for the 'sawn off' market....

You can rest assured they are not stealing firearms so they can shoot wildlife!

Zoo4m8

Well of course they are not... they are stealing firearms to sell to whoever will buy them.... And the three gentlemen from a certain section of the community with lurchers and three shotguns on my patch last summer most certainly did not have licences...
As our American friends would say, go figure...

homerhop

Zoo4m8 wrote: »

Well of course they are not... they are stealing firearms to sell to whoever will buy them.... And the three gentlemen from a certain section of the community with lurchers and three shotguns on my patch last summer most certainly did not have licences...
As our American friends would say, go figure...

Did you call the gardai?

OpenYourEyes

Lads - let's not lose sight of what's going on here. Read this thread from the start, and in addition there are several years of similar persecution and politicians sticking their oar in and making things worse. Heather was shot because she was a Hen Harrier. There was no mistake in ID, and while it was possibly shot by someone who just habitually shoots raptors it seems more likely she was shot because of the aforementioned conflict.

Thankfully, though many farmers in Kerry and further afield might not be fans of Hen Harriers, very few are bad-minded enough to actually shoot one. Though with so few Hen Harriers left, very few would have the opportunity. In all likelihood this was a farmer with a gun license - as Srameen said, people don't steal guns to shoot Hen Harriers - but the NARGC are always very quick to condemn these actions! Quicker than even the Minister for Dept of Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht, who's portfolio this is! It's important to not lose sight of the fact that the breed of lunatic who did this isn't representative of all Kerry people, isn't representative of all farmers and isn't representative of all shooters or people who carry a gun license.

I would like to semore workshops/lessons etc for hunters in terms of ID skills, but that is very much a side issue - Hen Harriers are not shot because they are confused with legal quarry. And unlike the UK, Hen Harriers in Ireland are not villified because of their choice of prey. Heather was shot because of the conflict between designated sites and a lack of compensation being paid to landowners. Our rage is best directed at the Department of Agriculture who were given €400+ million to stop that becoming a problem, and didn't do it!