Lambing in or out?

drive it

Would it make much sense to house ewe's say from end of dec and let out to lamb a few days before lambing starts ( with me mid march) . By housing them give land a chance and ewes a break from standing around in muck and from hovering up fluke.
Lambing out with less diseases , mismothering ect.
Has anyone tried it or would there be any down sides to it?

Future Farmer

drive it wrote: »

Would it make much sense to house ewe's say from end of dec and let out to lamb a few days before lambing starts ( with me mid march) . By housing them give land a chance and ewes a break from standing around in muck and from hovering up fluke.
Lambing out with less diseases , mismothering ect.
Has anyone tried it or would there be any down sides to it?

Doesn't really make sense, why go through all the hassle of bringing them in just to let them out again?

For me, think your best lambing twins and triplets in (although if you want real ease of management sell your triplets scanned) - feed late so as to reduce night lambings & leave singles out.

Have you not got a bit of dry ground?

Cran

Future Farmer wrote: »

Doesn't really make sense, why go through all the hassle of bringing them in just to let them out again?

For me, think your best lambing twins and triplets in (although if you want real ease of management sell your triplets scanned) - feed late so as to reduce night lambings & leave singles out.

Have you not got a bit of dry ground?

I think it might make more sense if going to do it lamb the twins out, and singles inside with triplets. Would make management lot easier I would think.

Future Farmer

Cran wrote: »

I think it might make more sense if going to do it lamb the twins out, and singles inside with triplets. Would make management lot easier I would think.

Worked on a farm with Belclares (high cost system) - ewes scanned 2.34 1st year, 2.42 the second, total nightmare IMO, good single lambs taken off ewes, and triplets & quins put on them. Singles not getting meal and lacked milk, lots of pets.

The boss there thought it was great "lots of lambs" BUT most weren't sold think September, and no money made from early singles.


Father bought 400 broken mouthed hornys off the mountains, couple of years ago, killed the worst of them, put the ram out, scanned - killed empties, sold triplets & weaker twins (as scanned ewes), kept solid twins & singles, lambed all out, killed ewes as lambs went, kept the best ewe lambs of them - MULES - a system that worked for us.


Think 1.8 scanned, 1.6 reared is acceptable, bit lower even in low input system.

drive it

Future Farmer wrote: »

Doesn't really make sense, why go through all the hassle of bringing them in just to let them out again?

For me, think your best lambing twins and triplets in (although if you want real ease of management sell your triplets scanned) - feed late so as to reduce night lambings & leave singles out.

Have you not got a bit of dry ground?

The sheep would be In for the guts of 2 1/2 months . Triplets aren't a problem usually 1 or 2 sets .The place is very exposed and wet.
It's just when your feeding them out they are ploughing around the feeders and it got me thinking would it be worth a try as I am about 8 miles from the place it would be easier to lamb out than in

Cran

drive it wrote: »

The sheep would be In for the guts of 2 1/2 months . Triplets aren't a problem usually 1 or 2 sets .The place is very exposed and wet.
It's just when your feeding them out they are ploughing around the feeders and it got me thinking would it be worth a try as I am about 8 miles from the place it would be easier to lamb out than in

I'd personally think it would work, might want to consider how to manage diet from inside to out. You wouldnt want them having huge change in diet over lambing, might be an idea to have them on all concentrate diet before letting out and keep them on it outside till they lambed.

drive it

Cran wrote: »

I'd personally think it would work, might want to consider how to manage diet from inside to out. You wouldnt want them having huge change in diet over lambing, might be an idea to have them on all concentrate diet before letting out and keep them on it outside till they lambed.

Diet would properly be the biggest thing to manage

paddysdream

Sheep housed for a long time are "harder" to lamb.
Less exercise plus more knocks when feeding(well more than if fed outside) all are drawbacks to your idea.

Shed is for the shepherd not the sheep in most cases.If you are lambing any amount before late March then the shed is essential in case of bad weather unless you have very hardy sheep in small batches in sheltered fields with grass cover
.
Trying to lamb a lot of ewes outside in bad weather is NOT FUN.This I know from experience.

Knockbeg lambed ewes outside.Think it was just doubles with singles and triples as Cran said,left inside to aid both difficult lambing plus fostering.Remember this was in a well set up paddock system with no real problems with labour.
Know that it was thought to be a good idea but only with suitable sheep plus paddocks and good grass essential.

serfspup

have lambed singles outside for a few years,very frustrating to find big lambs dead in the morning and a pain trying to get ewe in to set lambs on.

older ewes finding it tough inside have responded well to getting out before lambing and getting to early grass
(also notorious for mismothering so double bonus getting them out of the shed)

this year ended up lambing allmost all outside worked out ok,but THIS YEAR april was lovely
saved a packet on meal straw and silage.

will chance more twins out in the future may keep singles in

broke up the flock 20/30 ewes per field.

checked quickly with quad couple of times a day(vital to be out at first light)

have pen for catching ewe in the field
(will have a small roofed pen for the future as well)

should have castrated more lambs.

essential to have hardy smart ewes(not lazy suffolks, tight ass texels etc)
and have culled all mastitis,proplapse big tits etc.

ram choice also important.hardy lively lambs that are easily born the key so think vendeen,lleyn,cheviot, kerry hill etc

vermin control important

Birdnuts

Its good to have the option of being able to lamb inside or at least bring them in if conditions deteriate substantially in the lambing paddocks. Young lambs will need a lot of care and attention in the current spell of weather if left outside with prolonged periods of cold driving rain/sleet/snow likely to affect many parts of the country between now and the end of the month at least according to the Met people.

Nekarsulm

Birdnuts wrote: »

Its good to have the option of being able to lamb inside or at least bring them in if conditions deteriate substantially in the lambing paddocks. Young lambs will need a lot of care and attention in the current spell of weather if left outside with prolonged periods of cold driving rain/sleet/snow likely to affect many parts of the country between now and the end of the month at least according to the Met people.

Quite right, Birdnuts,
Wouldn't like to be lambing Charolais X lambs outside these days. .....

Bullocks

My ewes are coming tomorrow and are lambing in the next 2/3 weeks. I had planned to lamb them out but and use the cattle box for any weak lad's as they were coming but if this weather keeps up I'm afraid they will have to go in .
How much shed space will I need for 8/10 ewes ? I have a cattle pen about 16' × 12 that I can throw a quick roof on , would that be a bit tight ?
How old would the lambs need to be before I turn them out again if this weather is still bad ?

Connemara Farmer

I think about 14 square foot per ewe and 18 inches feed space. Longer narrower pens are best.

Galways?

rangler1

Bullocks wrote: »

My ewes are coming tomorrow and are lambing in the next 2/3 weeks. I had planned to lamb them out but and use the cattle box for any weak lad's as they were coming but if this weather keeps up I'm afraid they will have to go in .
How much shed space will I need for 8/10 ewes ? I have a cattle pen about 16' × 12 that I can throw a quick roof on , would that be a bit tight ?
How old would the lambs need to be before I turn them out again if this weather is still bad ?

You have loads of room in 16ft by 12,
Make sure that they're used to eating their indoor ration before you put them in, any little stress this near lambing could cause twin lamb disease.
Also have somewhere to put the ewes on their own with their lambs after lambing for 24hrs, they should be fit to go out to a sheltered paddock at 48hrs

Bullocks

Connemara Farmer wrote: »

I think about 14 square foot per ewe and 18 inches feed space. Longer narrower pens are best.

Galways?

rangler1 wrote: »

You have loads of room in 16ft by 12,
Make sure that they're used to eating their indoor ration before you put them in, any little stress this near lambing could cause twin lamb disease.
Also have somewhere to put the ewes on their own with their lambs after lambing for 24hrs, they should be fit to go out to a sheltered paddock at 48hrs

Thanks lads , Galway, Suffolk and maybe a texel.
I was thinking the 12×6 trailer split in two would do me because I have only a few but I wasn't thinking of weather this rough hopefully it will improve before they start lambing .
I have the baler left in the last bay of slats I could take that out either if I'm stuck
I'm a terrible flute for leaving things to the last minute .
They aren't getting fed yet but I'll start as soon as they come , can I do damage with over feeding ? I have a few bags of ewe and lamb nut and picked up a tonne of rolled barley yesterday. How much is too much too feed ?

rangler1

Bullocks wrote: »

Thanks lads , Galway, Suffolk and maybe a texel.
I was thinking the 12×6 trailer split in two would do me because I have only a few but I wasn't thinking of weather this rough hopefully it will improve before they start lambing .
I have the baler left in the last bay of slats I could take that out either if I'm stuck
I'm a terrible flute for leaving things to the last minute .
They aren't getting fed yet but I'll start as soon as they come , can I do damage with over feeding ? I have a few bags of ewe and lamb nut and picked up a tonne of rolled barley yesterday. How much is too much too feed ?

Depends whether they're carrying doubles or singles, they need more protein for milk than is in barley if they have doubles.
Start them on half a pound twice a day, with hay /silage. increasing slowly after that,...... if they aren't scanned, three quarters of a pound twice a day is probably enough in case of big singles.

Bullocks

rangler1 wrote: »

Depends whether they're carrying doubles or singles, they need more protein for milk than is in barley if they have doubles.
Start them on half a pound twice a day, with hay /silage. increasing slowly after that,...... if they aren't scanned, three quarters of a pound twice a day is probably enough in case of big singles.

They are scanned , 4 are carrying triplets and four singles . I'm hoping to foster them around a bit or else the young lads can bottle feed the pet lambs . Speaking of bottle fed lambs , I have a good supply of baby milk already in bottles that they use in the hospital for newborns , would it be alright to feed them that ? It would be fierce handy as it's already in bottles with the right sized teats ready to feed so to speak .

Is that a half pound of barley or the lamb and ewe nut ?

rangler1

Bullocks wrote: »

They are scanned , 4 are carrying triplets and four singles . I'm hoping to foster them around a bit or else the young lads can bottle feed the pet lambs . Speaking of bottle fed lambs , I have a good supply of baby milk already in bottles that they use in the hospital for newborns , would it be alright to feed them that ? It would be fierce handy as it's already in bottles with the right sized teats ready to feed so to speak .

Is that a half pound of barley or the lamb and ewe nut ?

Get the triplet ewes up to 1lb twice a day and the singles half a pound twice a day with hay or silage.
I know nothing about baby milk, but it used to be very hard to rear pet lambs on cows milk and keep them alive,
Also try to get cow colostrum from a dairy farmer in case some of the ewes with triplets don't have enough, put it into little bottles and freeze it, thaw it in warm water if the newborns need some, don't boil it. you can buy powdered colostrum either, it's vital that they get enough colostrum in the first 12 hrs so if they lamb at 8oc at night there's no point in looking for it the next morning
Barley or nuts? you get what you pay for, nuts have enough protein for milk production and minerals and vitamins that barley doesn't have.
I'd be feeding nuts any way

orm0nd

the bags for making ice cubes are good for freezing the colostrum,
enables small amounts to thawed quickly without overheating

Bullocks

rangler1 wrote: »

Get the triplet ewes up to 1lb twice a day and the singles half a pound twice a day with hay or silage.
I know nothing about baby milk, but it used to be very hard to rear pet lambs on cows milk and keep them alive,
Also try to get cow colostrum from a dairy farmer in case some of the ewes with triplets don't have enough, put it into little bottles and freeze it, thaw it in warm water if the newborns need some, don't boil it. you can buy powdered colostrum either, it's vital that they get enough colostrum in the first 12 hrs so if they lamb at 8oc at night there's no point in looking for it the next morning
Barley or nuts? you get what you pay for, nuts have enough protein for milk production and minerals and vitamins that barley doesn't have.
I'd be feeding nuts any way

I have the nuts so I'll give them that , I have a few liters of biestings in the freezer from our own cows so hopefully I won't be stuck . Hopefully the SMA will be good though .

Bullocks

orm0nd wrote: »

the bags for making ice cubes are good for freezing the colostrum,
enables small amounts to thawed quickly without overheating

Yup or even sandwich bags

Connemara Farmer

Bullocks wrote: »

Hopefully the SMA will be good though .

I don't know anything about it, I wouldn't chance it myself without knowing. Karl has good milk replacer if you get stuck, think Coyles make it, in a white bucket with green label if I remember right.

ihatewinter

A local farmer near me, uses SMA on all lambs in need of colostrum and he says it's brilliant. He has 250 ewes so have a few lambs and most survive.

rangler1

Connemara Farmer wrote: »

I don't know anything about it, I wouldn't chance it myself without knowing. Karl has good milk replacer if you get stuck, think Coyles make it, in a white bucket with green label if I remember right.

and for some reason baby teats don't work too well with lambs either, I think they suck too fast and don't give the teats a chance to fill

ihatewinter

Does anyone feed barley to single ewes for an extra bit of supplement with forage. If so how much

Connemara Farmer

rangler1 wrote: »

and for some reason baby teats don't work too well with lambs either, I think they suck too fast and don't give the teats a chance to fill

Pet lambs never done great here, was thinking of getting a heated feeder but not sure it's worth it. I had no pet lambs this year but Dad had five.

ihatewinter

The little plastic lamb teats that screw onto plastic bottles are better. I found they survive rather better than baby bottles as some of the smaller weaker ones can grasp the teat.

yetihead

drive it wrote: »

Would it make much sense to house ewe's say from end of dec and let out to lamb a few days before lambing starts ( with me mid march) . By housing them give land a chance and ewes a break from standing around in muck and from hovering up fluke.
Lambing out with less diseases , mismothering ect.
Has anyone tried it or would there be any down sides to it?

This is exactly what I do - lambing about 320 so do it to give land a rest and make sure of good grass for lambed animals to go onto. I have 2 lambing fields which I close up in October. All twins and triplets (trips maked well so I can keep a special eye on them) go out of shed a few days prior to lambing start date. Singles stay in - used to put them out too into a third field but had too much heartache and losses from big lambs not lambing on their own. Having the singles in also makes fostering lambs onto them easier. I carry on feeding 2lbs of meal a day to twins and trips after they go out to grass using a quad snacker and hill nut. When a ewe lambs down I mark her lambs and then after a day move them on to other fields using trailer and quad. Any ewes (a minority) that I can't get into trailer stays put. Any thing that needs attention comes into yard.
System works for me. Tough going for me for a few weeks but less overall labour required compared to lambing on slats. Much healthier for animals and lambs get up and sucking much earlier than in doors. Down side is mainly the weather of course which can certainly cause extra losses at times.

Country lad

I myself lamb ewes outside during the day and bring them in at night and find this works very well .no problem with diet as they are fed outside and put a round bale of hay in shed at night so they have something to pick at

ganmo

Country lad wrote: »

I myself lamb ewes outside during the day and bring them in at night and find this works very well .no problem with diet as they are fed outside and put a round bale of hay in shed at night so they have something to pick at

Do the ewes that lambed that day come in too?

Country lad

The ewes that lamb during the day don't.t come in onless they are week once they suck the ewe they are grand as plenty of shelter under the tall ditches and they are are a lot heal their out .have a paddock beside the house and is great for keeping ewes and lambs their for a day or two if lambs are a bit week

drive it

Country lad wrote: »

I myself lamb ewes outside during the day and bring them in at night and find this works very well .no problem with diet as they are fed outside and put a round bale of hay in shed at night so they have something to pick at

Do many lamb at night or would the most of them lamb during the day when they are out?

orm0nd

finally managed to turn out some lambs this morning, about a week behind schedule

was pleasantly surprised how well they have done indoors ,, ewes have loads of milk,

I got my own formula sheep mix this year & see a huge difference, just makes one think what sh1te is in the commercial mixes,(even the expensive ones)

back on topic, all ewes are lambed indoors here,

the ewe lambs will be brought in when shed space is available,

rangler1

orm0nd wrote: »

finally managed to turn out some lambs this morning, about a week behind schedule

was pleasantly surprised how well they have done indoors ,, ewes have loads of milk,

I got my own formula sheep mix this year & see a huge difference, just makes one think what sh1te is in the commercial mixes,(even the expensive ones)

back on topic, all ewes are lambed indoors here,

the ewe lambs will be brought in when shed space is available,

what's the mix

razor8

orm0nd wrote: »

finally managed to turn out some lambs this morning, about a week behind schedule

was pleasantly surprised how well they have done indoors ,, ewes have loads of milk,

I got my own formula sheep mix this year & see a huge difference, just makes one think what sh1te is in the commercial mixes,(even the expensive ones)

back on topic, all ewes are lambed indoors here,

the ewe lambs will be brought in when shed space is available,

Hi, What mix did you put together and how do you manage storing it? Do you have to spend much time mixing it?

orm0nd

razor8 wrote: »

Hi, What mix did you put together and how do you manage storing it? Do you have to spend much time mixing it?

I priced from 3 suppliers, & bought from the cheapest,
ready mixed & blown in ... in bulk,

I don't have the % s to hand , but in descending order

maize, barley, soya hulls , soya bean meal, rape, molasses , vits./ mins.

(personally I would have preferred beet pulp in lieu of the hulls, but it wasn't cost effective)

razor8

Looks a very good mix, soya bean meal only job for good quality & quantity of milk, prevents a lot of problems

orm0nd

learned one thing over the last 24 hours, ... you can never have enough/too many lambing pens,

any how off duty now until morrow morning ..... junior shepherd is going to have a busy night by the looks of things

& I accidentally forgot to charge my phone , completely dead :D:D

sea12

orm0nd wrote: »

learned one thing over the last 24 hours, ... you can never have enough/too many lambing pens,

any how off duty now until morrow morning ..... junior shepherd is going to have a busy night by the looks of things

& I accidentally forgot to charge my phone , completely dead :D:D

How is it going for you in general.

orm0nd

sea12 wrote: »

How is it going for you in general.

very few lambing issues, but all ewes would be third crop upwards so they just get on with it,

a lot of triplets, (maybe too many)

I only count when I'm selling :rolleyes: but junior says we're very close to 200%,

sea12

orm0nd wrote: »

very few lambing issues, but all ewes would be third crop upwards so they just get on with it,

a lot of triplets, (maybe too many)

I only count when I'm selling :rolleyes: but junior says we're very close to 200%,

Yea u can't beat the experienced ewe compared to shifting around with hoggets or ewe lambs. Definitely makes life easier

Bullocks

I put mine in the last day because the weather was so cold and wet . Just pulled the first of a triplet a few minutes ago (first lamb in about 40 yrs according to the father ) .
Should she have milk straight away ? The teats seem empty even though she is bagged up well

Username John

Bullocks wrote: »

I put mine in the last day because the weather was so cold and wet . Just pulled the first of a triplet a few minutes ago (first lamb in about 40 yrs according to the father ) .
Should she have milk straight away ? The teats seem empty even though she is bagged up well

As in she just lambed a few min ago?
She should have milk straight away yeah. Are you sure the kernel wasn't in the pap stopping you get milk?
sometimes they can be harder than you'd expect to get em out.

whitetail

Lamb everything out from mid March on have good sheltered fields for lambing down and move to grass 24 -36hrs later depending on strength of lamb also have about 30 lambing pens in sheds, we sell all triplets at scanning makes life easier.

Bullocks

Username John wrote: »

As in she just lambed a few min ago?
She should have milk straight away yeah. Are you sure the kernel wasn't in the pap stopping you get milk?
sometimes they can be harder than you'd expect to get em out.

Yup just there awhile ago , got the curd out after the other 2 came out . Its fairly thick milk but they are making attempts at sucking anyhow and I gave them a small bottle each just in case . Ill have a look in at them in awhile to be sure they all look ok.
First time I ever lambed a ewe and the old boy and two of his mates decided to give me an audience at it :rolleyes:

sea12

Bullocks wrote: »

Yup just there awhile ago , got the curd out after the other 2 came out . Its fairly thick milk but they are making attempts at sucking anyhow and I gave them a small bottle each just in case . Ill have a look in at them in awhile to be sure they all look ok.
First time I ever lambed a ewe and the old boy and two of his mates decided to give me an audience at it :rolleyes:

Yep the milk should be thick as it's colostrum. Turn the ewe over on her back, put the lamb onto the teat and it should suck away.