Rogue cyclists set to face on-the-spot fines MOD WARNING in first post

Pinch Flat

Uno my Uno. wrote: »

I would expect that the most likely outcome of writing to the Local Super is that your letter will find its way into the bin quite rapidly. I'm not saying that is right just that the Super isn't going to give a damn about one irritated cyclist.

As stated, the Ombudsman isn't the correct person to receive a complaint of this nature.

Not sure about that. I had an incident about 10 years ago where I was incorrectly pulled over while driving in a defunct bus lane near my house. The guards made a show of me at the side of the road - blocking my car with theirs, blue lights flashing - and refused to acknowledge their mistake - repeatedly badgering me for personal information, where I was going to/from etc. I refused to take a ticket from them.

A sharply worded letter to the local super was followed by a visit to my home in person and an apology.

Unless people complain, nothing will happen.

Uno my Uno.

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Not sure about that. I had an incident about 10 years ago where I was incorrectly pulled over while driving in a defunct bus lane near my house. The guards made a show of me at the side of the road - blocking my car with theirs, blue lights flashing - and refused to acknowledge their mistake - repeatedly badgering me for personal information, where I was going to/from etc. I refused to take a ticket from them.

A sharply worded letter to the local super was followed by a visit to my home in person and an apology.

Unless people complain, nothing will happen.

Well I think there is a big difference between what happened to you and the poster who got a ticking off on the roadside. What you describe could potentially be described as misconduct and as such I would expect a Super to take it very seriously.

check_six

Pinch Flat wrote: »

A sharply worded letter to the local super was followed by a visit to my home in person and an apology.

The way things are run around here (according to various investigations) a sharply worded letter could wipe the slate clean even if you had done something wrong (and you knew the right people!). Letters for the win, so!

CramCycle

Uno my Uno. wrote: »

Well I think there is a big difference between what happened to you and the poster who got a ticking off on the roadside. What you describe could potentially be described as misconduct and as such I would expect a Super to take it very seriously.

It was misconduct, but in the OPs post, if a Super is consistently getting complaints from people about a specific section eg the traffic corp pulling people up on non issues or non offences or just not warning the at fault party, they will, at the least have a word with the local traffic corp to cop on and not have such a waste of time come across his desk, and at best, pull them in and say, FFS, your the traffic corp, make sure you have these simple regulations and common sense safety rules drilled in to your head because if I have to deal with another complaint over one of you pulling someone over for a non issue or for pulling in the clearly wrong party and then not understanding the regs you thought you were pulling them in under, there will be an almighty b*llicking to the badge number that's flagged.

Either or should have the same result, neither require anyone higher up to waste time, no ones annoyed at anyone else as its a small issue that has been handled at the bottom end as it should be.

If no one says anything though, nothing will change.

Uno my Uno.

CramCycle wrote: »

It was misconduct, but in the OPs post, if a Super is consistently getting complaints from people about a specific section eg the traffic corp pulling people up on non issues or non offences or just not warning the at fault party, they will, at the least have a word with the local traffic corp to cop on and not have such a waste of time come across his desk, and at best, pull them in and say, FFS, your the traffic corp, make sure you have these simple regulations and common sense safety rules drilled in to your head because if I have to deal with another complaint over one of you pulling someone over for a non issue or for pulling in the clearly wrong party and then not understanding the regs you thought you were pulling them in under, there will be an almighty b*llicking to the badge number that's flagged.

Either or should have the same result, neither require anyone higher up to waste time, no ones annoyed at anyone else as its a small issue that has been handled at the bottom end as it should be.

If no one says anything though, nothing will change.

Fair enough, I think you have far greater faith in the Administration of the Gardai than I do!

CramCycle

Uno my Uno. wrote: »

Fair enough, I think you have far greater faith in the Administration of the Gardai than I do!

I have greater faith in the local super having better things to deal with than petty sh*t that should not be coming across his desk in the first place, maybe I am wrong,

Deedsie

CramCycle wrote: »

I have greater faith in the local super having better things to deal with than petty sh*t that should not be coming across his desk in the first place, maybe I am wrong,

In an ideal world of course the super would be the way to go. I personally have lost all faith in our Gardaí in the last year. The corruption is sickening. Do the countless penalty point scandals not just tell you you are wasting your time tying to deal with the Gardaí unless you are connected? They will take care of their own as they always do.

I wouldn't waste my time or energy calling into the station, the more complaints the ombudsman gets the more likely there will eventually be a change.

It actually annoys me so much that a member of the Traffic Corp could get these things wrong. Misconduct was probably too strong a word. Incompetent might suit better.

Eamonnator

Traffic Corps

CramCycle

Eamonnator wrote: »

Traffic Corps

Damn it, it occurred to me that they might not be under the remit of the local super but it never occured to me to check up on it.

Johnny Jukebox

Pinch Flat wrote: »

Not sure about that. I had an incident about 10 years ago where I was incorrectly pulled over while driving in a defunct bus lane near my house. The guards made a show of me at the side of the road - blocking my car with theirs, blue lights flashing - and refused to acknowledge their mistake - repeatedly badgering me for personal information, where I was going to/from etc. I refused to take a ticket from them.

A sharply worded letter to the local super was followed by a visit to my home in person and an apology.

Unless people complain, nothing will happen.

Fair play to you. Frankly though, I would never do that irrespective of how much I thought I was in the right. It'd be yes garda, no garda, 3 bags full garda because I don't trust them not to personalise any incident.

galwaycyclist

maxamillius wrote: »

Cycling home from work today,driver decides to turn left cutting in directly in front of me as I cycle up the bike lane.

The window was down so I told her to use her wing mirrors.

Guard on motorbike pulls me over and proceeds to tell me that she had the right to merge directly in front of me.

I asked him who had right of way and his answer was "its a bit of a grey area" yet I somehow was in the wrong.

Ridiculous.

Irish law does not explicitly recognise cycle lanes as traffic lanes. And the law as written requires drivers to yield to other traffic when moving into traffic lanes.

That said if a cycle lane isn't a traffic lane then perhaps the law on overtaking (safely) applies.

Either way your best bet might be to go to your local TD and ask him to get the Minister to fix the traffic regulations.

Pinch Flat

Johnny Jukebox wrote: »

Fair play to you. Frankly though, I would never do that irrespective of how much I thought I was in the right. It'd be yes garda, no garda, 3 bags full garda because I don't trust them not to personalise any incident.

Well, I never heard anything about it again. I disagree - and I'd do the exact same thing again in the morning should a similar situation arise. What do you think they are going to do - follow me around until I break a red light (which I never?). Or stake my house out?

If you accept this, you are giving the Gardai (or anyone else for that matter) carte blanche to do what they like.

maxamillius

It more annoyed me when he said it was a grey area,if it's a grey area then no one was in the wrong yet he picks on the cyclist. All in all he was a decent enough lad I wouldn't be reporting him, just bugged me that he took easy pickings on cyclists rather than the car who was clearly in the wrong!

Fian

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/rogue-cyclists-facing-50-fine-for-breaking-red-lights-31303040.html

€50 on the spot fines

Apparently these will be introduced by end of summer. I'm not arguing against this, just thought it would be useful to draw it to peoples attention.

Chips Lovell

Threads merged

rubadub

I imagine many of the cyclist hating motorists will think this is great news, and then quickly cop on that its bad news once they realise more cyclists sticking to the rules will be holding them up a hell of a lot more.

Was there any more word on those traffic lights which let cyclist off first? which many cyclists currently do but won't when these fines come.

I will be cycling on the road a lot more, rather than grey area poorly signed cycletracks when some little jobsworth could technically get me.

Grandpa Hassan

rubadub wrote: »

I imagine many of the cyclist hating motorists will think this is great news, and then quickly cop on that its bad news once they realise more cyclists sticking to the rules will be holding them up a hell of a lot more.

.

Indeed. The subject was covered in a UK transport study published in the Guardain, posted in the Cylce theory test thread running at the moment, in which it was illustrated that the behaviour that angers motorists (eg running red lights, weaving in and out of traffic) leads to a small proportion of cycle deaths.

The overwhelming majority are just caused by driver impatience (running into the back of someone going too slow, or trying to pass too close). Hence women are disproportionately killed.

Mororists don't realise that slowing cylists more will slow the motorists more. And make mororists more annoyed. And ultimately lead to solutions being rolled out like traffic lights that give priority to cyclists and make motorists wait longer (being rolled out in London this year and next)

Drivers should be careful what they wish for. Because cycle numbers are only going to go up and up

That said, FPNs for acting a d*ck, like flying down pavements, is welcome

Chips Lovell

1. Motorist overtakes cyclist
2. Motorist stops at lights
3. Cyclist goes up inside motorist at lights, cross stop line, may even cross junction
4. Lights go green, motorist has to overtake cyclist all over again
5. Go back to step one. Wash, rinse, repeat.*

Yep, that really speeds up traffic alright.

*Same applies to the cyclist overtakes cyclist scenario

ted1

What about lights that need a car to trigger? Stuck at a set coming out if honeypark in dun laoighre

Fian

rubadub wrote: »

I imagine many of the cyclist hating motorists will think this is great news, and then quickly cop on that its bad news once they realise more cyclists sticking to the rules will be holding them up a hell of a lot more.

Was there any more word on those traffic lights which let cyclist off first? which many cyclists currently do but won't when these fines come.

I will be cycling on the road a lot more, rather than grey area poorly signed cycletracks when some little jobsworth could technically get me.

Letting cyclists turn left on red lights when safe to do so would also be helpful.

Like they do with cars in the U.S..

Or letting cyclists continue through the top of a T junction on red.

Anyway I guess this will modify behaviour - an on the spot fine is much more likely to be dished out that a court summons, so this will have an impact.

shansey

Danjamin1 wrote: »

I was driving through Harold's Cross yesterday and say a bicycle-mounted Garda cycle onto the footpath and continue cycling along it for a good distance.

Is that allowed under normal circumstances? Can the Gardai flout the law as they please?

I saw a garda car mount the footpath in crumlin once to do a U-turn and just pull into the station..

Kavrocks

ted1 wrote: »

What about lights that need a car to trigger? Stuck at a set coming out if honeypark in dun laoighre

If there are no cars coming cycle in the middle of your lane on approach to the lights.

Macy0161

I personally welcome FPN. It should encourage enforcement, as the costs to the state, and the costs to the cyclist if convicted, were disproportionate. However, I await an actual date rather than another "sometime in the future" bs.

Jep Gambardella wrote: »

1. Motorist overtakes cyclist
2. Motorist stops at lights
3. Cyclist goes up inside motorist at lights, cross stop line, may even cross junction
4. Lights go green, motorist has to overtake cyclist all over again
5. Go back to step one. Wash, rinse, repeat.*

Yep, that really speeds up traffic alright.

*Same applies to the cyclist overtakes cyclist scenario

Rinse and repeat because of the cyclist filtering or because the car keeps getting stuck in more (non cyclist) traffic further up the road? More the latter I'd guess in a city centre environment.

CramCycle

Kavrocks wrote: »

If there are no cars coming cycle in the middle of your lane on approach to the lights.

Alot of bikes still won't trigger them. Look for the black rectangle marking the induction loop and cycle your wheels directly over the corners.

Unfortunately, many bikes simply will not trigger it. There was talk of a failed/stopped signal on here before but I can't remember if anyone found the legislation. I was told by a Garda it was OK to proceed once all reasonable precautions were taken and the sequence had either skipped the lights or had not changed for a reasonable amount of time, although I am not sure how that would hold up in court.

RainyDay

Kavrocks wrote: »

If there are no cars coming cycle in the middle of your lane on approach to the lights.

Doesn't seem to work for me at the new lights at Taylors Three Rock. They don't trigger, regardless of where I position myself.

Chips Lovell

Macy0161 wrote: »

Rinse and repeat because of the cyclist filtering or because the car keeps getting stuck in more (non cyclist) traffic further up the road? More the latter I'd guess in a city centre environment.

If the latter was the case, the cyclist would stay ahead of them.

By overtaking/undertaking only when you're likely to make progress you're a.) not slowing yourself down and b.) improving traffic flow.

Pie Eater

Fian wrote: »

Apparently these will be introduced by end of summer. I'm not arguing against this, just thought it would be useful to draw it to peoples attention.

The poorly written article reference by "Two-thirds of cyclists don't stop at red lights" (sorry, I can't post a link) is now being used as supporting evidence two years later...

1) Observe 30 cyclists over twenty minute period.
2) Count the number that behave in whatever way suits your purpose.
3) Extrapolate whatever you want from this tiny sample. Michael Noonan can end austerity and put an Irishman on Mars if we just something something rogue cyclists.

Excellent. My account doesn't allow me to use smilies, so read what you will from the above. I've also just discovered that I can't even quote URLs posted by someone else.

GrumpyMe

RainyDay wrote: »

Doesn't seem to work for me at the new lights at Taylors Three Rock. They don't trigger, regardless of where I position myself.

Try epoxy a rare earth magnet to your sole - tip toeing it on the loop is supposed to work!

bazermc

Ah those unprincipled, deceitful and unreliable cyclists!!!!!!!!!!!!

tp://www.thefreedictionary.com/rogue

rubadub

CramCycle wrote: »

I was told by a Garda it was OK to proceed once all reasonable precautions were taken and the sequence had either skipped the lights or had not changed for a reasonable amount of time, although I am not sure how that would hold up in court.

If there is no pedestrian light around I guess you just get off your bike and legally walk across, this of course might be far more dangerous. But if these fines do start being handed out I expect to see lots of crazy, yet legal, stuff going on.