Rogue cyclists set to face on-the-spot fines MOD WARNING in first post

odyssey06 · 06-01-2015 1:15pm

07Lapierre wrote: »

Although a lot of people seem to think that wearing a hi viz vest is a suitable alternative to lights! I think those people should be fined.

Totally agree... car headlights are directed to the left hand side, this means a cyclist in a high-vis vest with no lights has a poor visibility profile if the car takes a right turn and the cyclist is travelling straight on the other side of the road. Lights are more important for sure.

Skatedude · 06-01-2015 1:18pm

havent seen any mention on how they are planning to deal with kids? motorists are almost exclusively adults. huge proportion of cyclists are under age.

Lumen · 06-01-2015 1:18pm

Skrynesaver wrote: »

Because in that instance you may have to get out of the lit vehicle and walk without lights on a motorway, if my bike is no longer viable I become a pedestrian on a standard road.

Sure, but I was addressing "it's also virtually impossible to legislate for". If it is possible to describe in legislation a hi-vis vest for storing in a vehicle, it is possible to describe in legislation a hi-vis vest for wearing whilst riding a bicycle.

For instance, there is EU Directive 89/686/EEC covering the marketing and supply of high visibility clothing for occupational use.

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/PDF/?uri=CELEX:01989L0686-20130101&from=EN

...which I have no intention of reading.

tomasrojo · 06-01-2015 1:31pm

The Independent ran a story a few years ago on how An Post was going to force its postmen on bikes to comply with the law and wear helmets. I don't believe the details of anything they publish about cycling, so I doubt there is any move afoot to make hiviz apparel mandatory (the bikeshare schemes rule that out anyway, though not as comprehensively as they rule out adult mandatory helmet laws).

I get the impression that there are elements within the RSA that think mandatory hiviz and helmets are always one media push away and go to the press in that spirit (see the cast-iron certain stories of imminent mandatory helmets for children about three years ago), so there might be that too.

logically · 06-01-2015 1:33pm

Skatedude wrote: »

havent seen any mention on how they are planning to deal with kids? motorists are almost exclusively adults. huge proportion of cyclists are under age.

Hopefully all kids with bikes will be chipped so that their owners can be traced and the owner of the kid can then be fined for the errant behaviour.

Zyzz · 06-01-2015 1:34pm

Hi-vis does nothing for aerodynamics though, thats my argument if I get stopped.

ED E · 06-01-2015 1:36pm

Lads lads lads, calm down. Doesnt matter. The gardai wouldnt know enforcement if it smacked them in the face!

I cycle into college and work 6 days a week passing a myriad of minor offences often in traffic with garda cars that ignore them. If they arent gonna do taxis for parking on a double yellow on a traffic island blocking a ped crossing are they really gonna do a cyclist for a missing rear light?

Stop trying to fix the law, fix the traffic corps.

Falcon L · 06-01-2015 1:40pm

Just on the clothing issue: I came across 2 cyclists in Dublin the other day. They were dressed entirely in black from their helmets to their shoes. Even their bikes were entirely black. Now, these guys were probably part of a club or something as they were identical.

Are there clubs that have entirely black garb? If so, isn't this being irresponsible?

While it was daytime, it was a very dull day and visibility was poor.

RacoonQueen · 06-01-2015 1:43pm

Do we have to have lights on during the day? I'm not putting lights on my training/race bikes... :pac:

Chips Lovell · 06-01-2015 1:43pm

Falcon L wrote: »

If so, isn't this being irresponsible?

No

Jawgap · 06-01-2015 1:43pm

Falcon L wrote: »

Just on the clothing issue: I came across 2 cyclists in Dublin the other day. They were dressed entirely in black from their helmets to their shoes. Even their bikes were entirely black. Now, these guys were probably part of a club or something as they were identical.

Are there clubs that have entirely black garb? If so, isn't this being irresponsible?

While it was daytime, it was a very dull day and visibility was poor.

Yes, Gotham CC wear black.......

......or they could've been from Grim Reaper CC looking to harvest the souls of the unworthy.....

.....or they could've been two guys just out for a spin.

Falcon L · 06-01-2015 1:46pm

Jep Gambardella wrote: »

No

OK. Would it be irresponsible if a pedestrian did the same, or is it only OK for cyclists?

tomasrojo · 06-01-2015 1:47pm

Jawgap wrote: »

.....or they could've been two guys just out for a spin.

Venom and Zorro, perhaps.

Jawgap · 06-01-2015 1:47pm

Falcon L wrote: »

OK. Would it be irresponsible if a pedestrian did the same, or is it only OK for cyclists?

How is it being irresponsible?

Greenmachine · 06-01-2015 1:50pm

Somehow doubt there will be any enforcement of any of these new paltry fines.

Jawgap · 06-01-2015 1:50pm

tomasrojo wrote: »

Venom and Zorro, perhaps.

I just have a vision of a bunch of black clad cyclists on black bikes coming hammering down a hill screaming......

Yippie i ohhh ohh ohh
Yippie i aye ye ye

Were their faces gaunt? their eyes blurred? or their shirts all soaked with sweat?

Chips Lovell · 06-01-2015 1:50pm

Falcon L wrote: »

Would it be irresponsible if a pedestrian did the same?

Of course not.

Falcon L · 06-01-2015 1:52pm

Jawgap wrote: »

How is it being irresponsible?

I would consider it the responsibility of any road user to make themselves as visible as possible. I would consider myself irresponsible if I walked on the side of a road dressed entirely in black, especially on a day with poor visibility.

When I drive my car on a dull day, I feel it is my responsibility to have it as visible as possible, with headlights on etc.

Maybe it's just me.

check_six · 06-01-2015 1:52pm

ED E wrote: »

Stop trying to fix the law, fix the traffic corps.

The plan with the on the spot fines is not to create or fix laws. The fines will be for breaches of existing laws.

Currently, the format is as follows:
- You are stopped for some transgression.
- The guard may or may not send you a summons. This could take many months. You won't know it's coming till it comes into your letterbox.
- Day in court. Day off work. Guard has day off the street.
- €200-€300 fine depending on the mood of the judge.

New format:
- You are stopped for the same transgression as above.
- Guard fines you.
- €50 fine. End of story.

Much neater. And you get much better value for money on your rampage!

odyssey06 · 06-01-2015 1:53pm

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Do we have to have lights on during the day? I'm not putting lights on my training/race bikes... :pac:

It's a good idea if you are going to be on public roads, especially with the low winter sun we have right now... You see a lot of cars with lights on during daylight at this time of year because of it.

ted1 · 06-01-2015 1:53pm

How about they allow camera footage be used for issuing fines etc, we could drop up the station on Fridays and show them a weeks worth of fine material. Running lights, talking on phones, driving in bus lanes etc parking in cycle paths

Chips Lovell · 06-01-2015 1:55pm

Falcon L wrote: »

I would consider it the responsibility of any road user to make themselves as visible as possible.

...

Maybe it's just me.

It's not just you. There's plenty who take the victim blaming approach.

If I'm driving in daylight and I fail to spot another road user, be it a car, bicycle or pedestrian, then I'm either not paying attention or I'm driving too fast for the road conditions.

My car is black BTW. Nobody has ever told me I'm being irresponsible.

ROK ON · 06-01-2015 1:56pm

Where can I buy te hi-viz cufflinks that Seamus referred to.

Also from now on my kids will be tied down with bailing twine - might just prevent all of the fights that currently take place in the back seat of our car.

Jabel · 06-01-2015 1:58pm

Well Holy God…I turn my back for 5 minutes and there's a lights/hi-vis/pedestrians/rules/laws/enforcement/no I'm right, you're wrong/well if that's the way you're gonna type I'll.../I didn't say that, I said this/what? he wore black on a bike? tut tut..
debate going on… it must be 2015!
Happy new year folks

seamus · 06-01-2015 1:59pm

Falcon L wrote: »

I would consider it the responsibility of any road user to make themselves as visible as possible. I would consider myself irresponsible if I walked on the side of a road dressed entirely in black, especially on a day with poor visibility.

When I drive my car on a dull day, I feel it is my responsibility to have it as visible as possible, with headlights on etc.

Maybe it's just me.

What colour is your car, as a matter of interest?

Falcon L · 06-01-2015 1:59pm

Jep Gambardella wrote: »

It's not just you. There's plenty who take the victim blaming approach.

If I'm driving in daylight and I fail to spot another road user, be it a car, bicycle or pedestrian, then I'm either not paying attention or I'm driving too fast for the road conditions.

My car is black BTW. Nobody has ever told me I'm being irresponsible.

I'm not blaming anybody for anything. I didn't mention victims at all. I was merely making an observation. I'll bow out here, as I seem to be rising hackles. Not my intention, I assure you.

Falcon L · 06-01-2015 2:00pm

seamus wrote: »

What colour is your car, as a matter of interest?

Silver. Not the best colour for visibility, I know. But during winter, I keep it well lit.

check_six · 06-01-2015 2:01pm

ted1 wrote: »

How about they allow camera footage be used for issuing fines etc, we could drop up the station on Fridays and show them a weeks worth of fine material. Running lights, talking on phones, driving in bus lanes etc parking in cycle paths

My favourite variation on this theme was a Council CCTV camera mounted near a newly installed bus lane in the UK. There was a business premises that had its employee car park off the road beside the bus lane. The employees would have to drive cross the bus lane to get into the car park every day. As there was no dashed lines installed to allow them to legally cross the bus lane, the council sent them a fine for every car for every day. Not a great use of the system.

tunney · 06-01-2015 2:01pm

PaddyFagan wrote: »

For me - it is all about that 100kg @ 20kph and the risk they pose to a pedestrian/child.

Depending on the time, I'm a motorist, a cyclist and a pedestrian all in the same day. For me road safety is all about me acting safely (for myself and others) in each role. Each role has a different risk profile for me, and I pose different risks to other road users - but at no point can I put my desire to make progress ahead of the safety of other (more vulnerable) road users.

Paddy

Bet as a motorist you complain about "cyclists not using the bike lanes". you know the ones that are on shared footpaths? that vunerable, less aware, pedestrians are on?

The whole crack down on cyclists is populist bull. An attempt to soothe the anger of the motorists, to distract them from the fact the roads are clogged, and that they waste huge proportions of their lifes in cars, they their commute is never ever going to get any better and to pretend that the problem with the roads is someone other than the planners.

tunney · 06-01-2015 2:02pm

Falcon L wrote: »

Just on the clothing issue: I came across 2 cyclists in Dublin the other day. They were dressed entirely in black from their helmets to their shoes. Even their bikes were entirely black. Now, these guys were probably part of a club or something as they were identical.

Are there clubs that have entirely black garb? If so, isn't this being irresponsible?

While it was daytime, it was a very dull day and visibility was poor.

Yet you saw them..................

Rogue cyclists set to face on-the-spot fines MOD WARNING in first post

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